Talk:Acid rock - Knowledge

2155:…that is, under the condition that it would only be a re-direct for the title (via disambiguation), not a merge. A merge would necessitate moving large chunks of text to the Garage rock article (which is already discusses a lot of the same issues and is admittedly quite long). Furthermore, I would not want to see any changes happen in the garage rock article that might knock it off its current balance. The GR article currently treats the term “garage punk” as an alternate term for 60s garage rock, not as something distinct or separate (until it gets to the Revivals section in the 1980s). For 60s bands (and garage in sum total), "garage rock" is the official Knowledge category and "garage punk" (along with "60s punk", etc.) are the unofficial/alternate terms that fans (such as me) and commentators often use. 633:

Messenger Service, The Great Society, Stone Garden and the Grateful Dead) are classic bands of psychedelic rock. Definition "Acid rock is a form of psychedelic rock, which is characterized by long instrumental solos, few (if any) lyrics and musical improvisation" is weird to start with because a lot of space rock bands (Hidria Spacefolk, Ozric Tentacles, Øresund Space Collective, Quantum Fantay etc) also play long, often instrumental, psychedelic jams/solos without being labelled with "acid rock". Perhaps only argument for separate genre is that some bands (Cream, Blue Cheer and The Jimi Hendrix Experience) are known for excessive use of wah-wah which produces distinct "acid"(LSD) sound though most psychedelic bands used that pedal as well. Anyway I'm voting for merge. PS sorry for my bad english.

557:

tag "acid rock" may have nothing to do with drugs - however, listeners at large may perceive or associate an artist or song with LSD or drugs or the use there of - and thus the work may be associated with the genre. For example, "Journey To The Center Of The Mind" by the Amboy Dukes might be considered "acid rock" or "Psychedelic", however the lead guitarist Ted Nugent claims to have never done drugs. Still the track was chosen for Rhino's psychedelic anthology "Nuggets". Finally, I'd ultimately argue that "Acid Rock" is a subgenre of "Psychedelic rock" - the more avant-garde, strung out, jams: Pink Floyd's "Interstellar Overdrive" rather than "Arnold Layne", The Doors "The End" rather than "Break On Through", Jimi Hendrix’s "Third Stone From The Sun" rather than "Purple Haze".

822:

psychedelic rock the LOUD and "grating" elements that drove parents crazy were upfront in Acid Rock songs while "druggy" stuff was more in the background. Hendrix and Joplin were the two defining figures of acid rock. Joplins "screaming" vocals style made her acid rock. Psychedelic but not acid Donovan too mellow, Strawberry Alarm Clock vocals a little to trippy a little too many keyboards. Steppenwolf definitely Acid rock, "Ride Captain Ride" (guitar solo), "Spirit in the Sky" and vaguely the first "Venus" (she screamed) was the watered down pop hooked up version of the acid rock (nobody would say "acid pop" or "psychedelic pop") that was acceptable for Top 40 AM radio. Remember in pre multitasking 1970 what was loud and grating in middle America is tame by today's standards.

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some cases, evolving into heavy metal. Apart from a few warranted and rightful mentions of the fact that, yes, the term has sometimes been used interchangeably with "psychedelic rock," nearly the entire article discusses acid rock as a distinct movement or label, with an evolution closely tied to yet different from the more general "psychedelic rock" label. At the end of the day, the article speaks for itself. It is fairly clear by reading the article that, despite frequent overlap, acid rock has often been differentiated from general psychedelic rock, whether as a heavier or more intense subgenre/sub-style or as its own movement or label.

2137:” (both terms are interchangeable when used for 60s bands). While their prescription is still my preference (for the sake of avoiding confusion), Ilovetopaint has come up a possible alternative solution--i.e. to retain saying “garage punk” in the acid rock article, but redirect (via disambiguation) the term to the garage rock article. He has an interesting idea about re-naming the current Garage punk article to more clearly reflect the post-1980s subgenre. It is not for me to decide what terminology ends up getting used in the acid rock article, but apart from that, the re-directs are an interesting thought. 3164:

you, Garagepunk66, about the elaborate form of Pepper, as it's just not something the average musician can think about recreating, not having unlimited studio time and an arranger on hand to write things. Given that much acid rock is synonymous with guitar noise, extended all the way to bands like Sonic Youth, "A Day in the Life" does offer a keyboard player an "in" to the acid rock genre. And the Beatles are a band wherein their psychedelic rock is usually synonymous with acid rock.

1685:

pardon me if I think you could re-think your position on the "garage punk" thing here and elsewhere. So, my debate on the "garage punk" issue is in no way meant to be negative, but just to help readers not get confused. Incidentally, I'd like readers to know more about the 60s roots of punk, but I know the best way to do that is, rather than try to re-frame the way Knowledge categorizes the genres, to just give the background int the articles--and, of course, to refer them to the

2822:.) Shaun, I do see a reason for separate articles – not a very strong reason, but that could be because I found this article pretty confusing. The problem with most articles on musical genres, imo, is that the sources are so subjective, and grand statements can be made about the first, the most influential, the best example, etc. of each genre based on what happens to register on an author's personal radar. Then these claims gain traction and snowball (per 2508:

rock sometimes seen as its subset (so that songs and bands considered acid rock could always also be called psych rock but not vice-versa). If the two articles are kept separated, the distinction between them must be explained very clearly, especially in the lead sections. It should also be addressed in articles that refer to them. Overall, I feel like the separation creates unnecessary confusions and complications for both editors and readers.--

1298:

if "Good Article" is to mean anything – of approaching each nomination with a view to satisfying each and every concern that any GA reviewer might bring. And from all I've seen, many would not consider an article adequately sourced even with just a single ref in need of a page number (or alternatively, linked to a preview), nor would they think it's acceptable to have any tags ("by whom?", "verification needed", "repetition", etc) appearing

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historical perspective. Editors should also de-emphasize sources that are not reflective of the prevailing view. You simply do not have enough sources to justify changing the way Knowledge defines garage punk--and the way you use it here is causing problems for this particular article. I realize that genre definitions are not set in stone. But, it takes a change in public perception, reflected by a

2034:

true, you will need to find more reliable sources that support it. (BTW, I was there when punk rock burst on the scene: "punk" brought forth fresh ideas & attitudes that hadn't been present in rock for a while, if ever; the acid/psychedelic rock genre embraced a very distinct & dissimilar vibe. I may not know all of the story, but I know enough to have a sense what the story is about.)

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Band years before Tom Wolfe (in his book from 1968!) popularized the term Acid Rock. Assigning Acid Rock to the Avantgarde tracks (not bands!?) is a personal point of view which is impossible to confirm with any serious sources. Search the web and you will find out that some people prefer the term Acid Rock while others use Psychedelic Rock for the same bands, tracks, music or whatever.--

236: 3141:. Pepper was just a more elaborate form of what the Beatles and others had already been doing. It was a great extravaganza and signified an incredible moment--it was a culmination of so much that had been building up, no doubt, but it was not as influential, musically, as certain things that preceded it. It was more of a summative than formative event in that regard. 1462:) make it clear that "punk" existed in the '60s, but that the music did not coalesce into a readily-distinguishable style until the mid '70s. We can't really write that acid rock grew from "garage bands" because it would misrepresent the source's use of specific terminology - it would be like writing "doom metal evolved from guitar bands" instead of "heavy metal bands". 3205:

said about "Happenings Ten Years Time Ago" and "Think About It" by the Yardbirds. And the same can be said of early Black Sabbath, such as "Black Sabbath" - they are all three things at once. Heavy psych rock = acid rock = early heavy metal, all the same thing basically -- so the psychedelic rock page should talk about acid rock and heavy metal, and visa versa.

1624:

early Ramones was acid rock, though they may have sound like bad acid rock at some of the early practices. It's so much simpler just to remove "1960s punk" and let "garage rock" suffice, especially considering (I assume) the reference is to garage bands such as ? and the Mysterians (the band first described as "punk") and the Chocolate Watch Band, etc.

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Who and others from the harder wing of British beat (as well as the burgeoning psychedelic rock there). Right now the lead statements make garage rock appear to be too much of a singular influence on acid rock. The 13th Floor Elevators' acid rock came directly out of garage, true, but that was not necessarily the case with all other artists.

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me: either I need to learn much, much more about rock, or it's simply someone's hobby horse that has no value to the rest of us. But the most important part is that I offered some honest criticism & as far as I can see, nothing was done with it. Beyond what I wrote being lightly dismissed after I pushed for a response.

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subset, variation, or subgenre of the the more expansive and more general "psychedelic rock" label. I will agree that, in regards to the second sentence in the lead, perhaps the emphasis should first and foremost be placed on how acid rock has been regarded as a subgenre or variation of the psychedelic rock style,

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Bands like Grateful Dead, Quicksilver Messenger Service, Country Joe & The Fish, Big Brother and The Holding Company, Jefferson Airplane and others never sounded like hard rock, heavy psych bands like Blue Cheer, Iron Butterfly, Vanilla Fudge, Early Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Sir Lord Baltimore,

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They use exactly the same techniques—sped-up bits, slowed-down bits, too much echo, too much reverb, that bit goes backwards. When the generation that grew up on kids' novelty records began making records for themselves, it came out as psychedelia. That genre is just grown-up novelty songs! ... There

2022:

In your initial response, you only touched on the merge issue, the use of the word "punk", & your agreement that it needed more content. I pointed out that the merge proposal was open, & presented a barrier to GA status; I also solicited a third party to close that proposal, so that point was

1469:

is a more comprehensive "Characteristics" section. I recall a book - can't remember which - that discusses what makes sounds "psychedelic" while highlighting both 1960s psychedelic rock and 1980s acid house. I intended on citing it in the article someday; the only reason I haven't yet is because it's

1379:

One detail that needs to be kept in mind is that musicians' styles often change. For example, early Grateful Dead (IMHO, one of the best known acid rock bands -- consider "Anthem of the Sun" & "Aoxomoxoa") is very different from their later work. The same can be said for Pink Floyd: "Piper at the

1019:

When an author makes a statement that seems to be at odds with what numerous others have said, attribution is helpful in acknowledging that it is an outlier opinion. This article should NOT treat "acid rock" primarily as "a heavier subgenre of psyche rock". I understand that it is preferable to think

585:

I wrote the german article about Psychedelic Rock, and still continue working on it. There is no difference between Psychedelic Rock and Acid Rock, neither musically nor cultural. Acid Rock is not the forerunner of Psychedelic Rock because The 13th Floor Elevators were described as a Psychedelic Rock

3163:

Just passing through, yet isn't "A Day in the Life" the acid rock statement on "Pepper"? As such, the music would be of interest to keyboard players in the acid rock genre, and to the musical concepts, such as "the longest recorded note", perhaps the most acid rock thing about the song. I agree with

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from psychedelic rock as a distinct style or subgenre. That way, the reader understands right off the bat that the article is not just a rehash of the "psychedelic rock" article, while mention is still made of the fact that the term "acid rock" is often loosely defined and isn't always used to refer

2707:

it should be mentioned that "acid rock" is sometimes also deployed as a synonym for "psychedelic rock." I suggest this change mostly just to avoid the type of confusion that Mashaunix is experiencing; rather than beginning the second sentence of the lead by talking about how "acid rock" is sometimes

2244:

Statements about where the genre evolved from are central to the article. And IMO statements that "garage punk" (or even punk) significantly existed as a genre in the 60's and that acid rock evolved form it are both patently false. In non-Knowledge terms, this is from a fossil that was immersed in

2033:

While I'm willing to be convinced otherwise, I remain unconvinced that "garage punk" as punk & not garage rock influenced acid rock. I don't care that you have a source that uses the word -- it's just one source, & arrogates acid rock as part of an unrelated genre. To prove that statement is

1538:

When the term "garage punk" is used by commentators to refer to 60s bands, it almost automatically and invariably refers to garage rock. The term "garage punk" is also used by commentators to refer to garage rock as a whole (new and old). While these usages are OK in colloquial terms, at Knowledge

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influence. When used to designate 60s music, the two terms "garage punk" and "garage rock" are interchangeable. So, the term "garage rock" can be substituted here (for what the sources called "garage punk")--it is OK. If we change it to the term "garage rock", it will be blue-linked to the garage

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The problem is that the terms of early 70s critics never caught on in the larger public mind and that, in the mid-to-late 70s, the term "punk" shifted to the music coming out of the New York and London scenes, so in the public mind, "punk rock" was thought of as a new thing and came to be associated

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In which case the reference should carry a link to the preview. Some GA reviewers are tougher than others, or focus on certain aspects of article quality more than on other areas, but overall, the standard of GAs has risen hugely since 2012/13, from my experience. It's a case – well, it should be so

3204:

Isn't heavy psych basically "early heavy metal"? - so the "other" article would be the "early days" section of the heavy metal article. Led Zeppelin was a heavy psych/acid rock band, "Dazed and Confused" one of the ultimate acid rock statements. It's also an early example of metal. The same can be

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I went in and made the necessary corrections to the problem mentioned above. When we speak of 60s garage at Knowledge, we say "garage rock". Furthermore in the lead sentence, we need to say something about British influence, etc. Jimi Hendrix spent time in London, where he was influenced by the

2299:

The main difficulty with the article is that the subject is "loosely defined" and "fairly meaningless" (I quote from the article, both quotes are cited), overlapping largely with other categories. Editors more familiar with the genre may need to take a view on whether the topic is sufficiently well

1401:

I don't mean to be harsh in my criticism; there is a lot of good things in this article, such as the selection of music snippets to illustrate the genre. But unless the merge proposal is rapidly resolved, & all of the tags cleaned up, I'll need to fail this nomination regardless of what I think

984:

You copy and pasted identical sentences from "Definitions" back where they were under "Development and characteristics" - this was totally unnecessary. Just list how "acid rock" relates to the musical traits and history of "psychedelic rock", "hard rock", etc. The reader should already be familiar

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A disambiguation page should not be created just because it is difficult to write an article on a topic that is broad, vague, abstract, or highly conceptual. ... Many definitions of triangle center are used in Euclidean geometry, which coincide only in the special case of equilateral triangles. The

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Almost every single time I read "psychedelic rock" in print, I see it followed by "also known as acid rock", or vice versa. Historically, it has certainly been used more as a synonym than it has been used to describe a substyle of psyche rock. And there is no need to write "harder, heavier, faster,

842:

I haven't read the book but it strikes me odd that Black Sabbath is supposedly mentioned in it. The book was published in 1968 and Black Sabbath released their first single in 1970 (changed their name in 1969). So either Tom Wolfe had an epihany while enjoying some kool-aid, Black Sabbath figured a

556:

Coined by the media or not - "Acid Rock" is a term commonly used to describe a style of music. I think it belongs here as a Knowledge article. Whether or not the artist utilized drugs in the writing and recording process is not necessarily a condition. Many recordings commonly associated with the

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What I'm surprised about, once again, is the way all roads seem to lead to Brian Wilson and the Beach Boys. We get that folksy, "S'a funny thang" recollection from a former music industry exec regarding "Good Vibrations", and in the end note that follows: "Writer Vernon Joyson observed flirtations

2793:

Unfortunately, I see that my corrections just got undone, but that will only lead to confusion on the part of readers, even bewilderment. I'm not sure if most music editors are going to approve of the way the whole "garage punk" statements are framed right now. Actually to think that Hann at the

2702:

Well, yes, the terms have been deployed interchangeably at times; overlap and confusion between labels tend to happen when one attempts to categorize music. However, there are more than enough sources that differentiate between "acid rock" and "psychedelic rock" or regard "acid rock" as a distinct

2375:

The article asserts that acid rock has been defined either as synonymous with psychedelic rock, or as a more intense subgenre. Neither case requires a separate article. Personally, I find the separation extremely confusing; if there is no agreeable definition of the difference between the two, how

2197:

I've been giving this a lot of thought, & I simply can't approve this article as a GA. Part of the reason, of course, is that the citations just don't convince me of some of the points. Part of it is that the language about garage punk/garage rock is part of a dialogue that has no relevance to

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Now please. No one could ever say that terms rock and punk are the same thing, whereas when sources speak of "garage punk" in the 60s, they invariably mean "garage punk" and "garage rock" as interchangeable terms, and you know that--we have ample sources such as Aaron to demonstrate that. So, it

1623:

I would suggest simply removing reference to punk in the opening paragraph unless an editor later in the article fleshes out why the Ramones sound has its roots in the acid rock of Yardbirds/Zeppelin & MC5 & Stooges & VU. But then, one would never say Led Zep I is a punk record or that

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the article beyond the first half of the second sentence will see exactly how "acid rock" has been used in a distinct manner from "psychedelic rock," often being used to refer specifically to a more intense, heavy, or harder subset or subgenre of psychedelic rock evolving from garage rock and, in

2507:

How does the lack of a clear distinction warrant separate articles? The opposite is logical; since there is confusion, it would be better to deal with it in one place. From my reading of the sources, the terms have been used interchangeably, with psychedelic rock the prevalent expression and acid

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I'd also like to recommend Psychotic Reactions and Carburetor Dung, the first collected works of Lester Bangs, edited by Greil Marcus. Bangs and Marsh were compadres in their garage punk - skronk sensibility, though Marsh not so into it as Bangs. I think it would clear up a lot of the issues r.e.

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identify the scope and boundaries of the term. Additional paragraphs can elucidate on more specific, distinct characteristics. The fact that acid rock can be a "heavier, harder, tougher, stronger, faster, meatier, tastier" variant of psyche rock is not worth getting into any more than it is worth

2880:" come to mind) … but it's not like I'm wanting to inflate the Beatles' standing and influence, here or anywhere on Knowledge (as if they need it). I'm just surprised at the sidestep around the Beatles' contribution to the genre, directly in the case of "She Said" and as a major inspiration with 1870:

article, whose primary reason is to describe the post-80s subgenre. Furthermore, you can't just go by what one or two sources say, when you are dealing whole genres. You have to take into account the larger prevailing view, expressed in a multiplicity of sources and over a course of time--in a

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The way they use the term "garage punk" is as garage rock. If we fail to make this necessary transposition of terms, then the readership will get confused. I can guarantee that I have enough experience covering the garage rock topic to say that almost all of the time, if a source uses the term

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Returning to the proposal to merge with article, I believe this touches on an important issue (although as that discussion now stands, the proposal is likely to fail): the article does not make a sufficiently strong argument that acid rock & psychedelic rock are two distinct genres. (For the

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Quick comment as I was invited here to take part in the discussion about a possible merge with Psychedelic rock. While reading this article, I got so distracted by the number of tags, mostly appearing in the references. (From memory, there are 4 or 5 in the Definitions section alone.) This needs

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article has been radically re-defined and re-formulated in similar fashion (in direct opposition to how it has been for over ten years), and it ties in with new problems here. Then notice, here, lead sentence--and a whole section is now based on a nomenclatural misunderstanding of how the term

2578:. The fact that the two terms can overlap, and can be both be used to cover some of the same bands, is no reason not to have two separate articles, with links between them to give as much clarity to the reader as possible. My perception is that "acid rock" is a subset of "psychedelic rock". 2037:

Nevertheless, we both agreed this article needed more content; I specifically pointed out "the absence of any mention of light shows & other theatrics". None of this has been added in the weeks since I took this review on. If you intend on adding this material, I feel the review can proceed

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had greater musical influence on the form. You know that from extensive experience reading and writing about pre-Sgt. Pepper albums, you know that Sgt. Pepper was more of a culmination than an inception. I know that you are eminently knowledgeable about acid rock--that is beyond debate. But,

1672:"garage punk" regarding 60s music, it means garage rock. When referring to a whole genre or subgenre of music, we must take a lot of things into account and look beyond just a few sources. Incidentally, this is why I applaud you for correctly pointing out the over-emphasis on the influence of 1505:

became the preferred terms (even though 60s garage fans and many of its commentators still use "punk" and "garage punk" to refer to 60s groups). Unfortunately, here at Knowledge we have to live with the larger public perception, and so our categories for genres (and references to them) must be

1354:

I haven't dug into the references yet, but I will note that, no matter their form, they should have sufficient detail that someone who does not know the literature can find the reference. By "have sufficient detail", I would expect in this instance page number in every instance -- even one-page

528:

further...I fell this whole article should be folded into the comprehensive list of psychedelic artists because "Acid Rock" was a term proscribed by the media & it didn't last very long once "The Psychedelic Sounds of..." the 13th Floor Elevators came out & the culture at large adopted

632:

IMHO acid rock is just psychedelic rock on hippie's slang. Bands mentioned in article (The Jimi Hendrix Experience, Pink Floyd, The Doors, Iron Butterfly, Big Brother & The Holding Company, Cream, Jefferson Airplane, Ultimate Spinach, New Riders of the Purple Sage, Blue Cheer, Quicksilver

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subgenre (distinct from the rest of garage rock), it refers to bands from the later 80s and beyond who did a louder, updated form of garage that also incorporated 70s punk influences--that was what the garage punk article traditionally focused on as a subgenre (before recent changes). It is

2754:

to refer to 60s garage (and has always been used as an alternate term for it along with "60s punk"), it is not intended to be replacement for the term "garage rock"--garage rock is still the official name of the 60s genre. Whereas, when the term "garage punk" used as to designate an actual

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with post-1975 music. Personally, I think this was a mistake, and, as a result, most people know very little about the actual roots of punk--but that is what became the reality. In light of this, by the late 70s, new terms had to be to be found for the earlier punk music of the 1960s, so

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I came of awareness late in the game say 1969 and 1970 and my memory of it differs in someways and is the same in someways from the reliable sources of today. Yes it was an adult coined catchall term and was a subgenre of psychedelic rock. While the "Trippy" elements were up front in most

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Guardian is trying to define "garage punk" as a genre separate from 60s-derived garage rock is to misrepresent the intent of his writing. When he refers to "garage punk" as 60s genre, what he means is garage rock--he is using "garage punk" as an alternate term for the garage rock genre.

2606:- Acid rock is a hard-edged version of psychedelia with many notable bands that can fall into its range like Iron Butterfly, Country Joe and the Fish, and Jefferson Airplane. Of course there will be overlap, but there is enough of a distinction between the two to warrant seperate articles. 1557:

The sentences at the end of the first paragraph treat "60s punk" and "garage rock" as something not only different from each other and different from the use of "garage punk" at the beginning of the opening paragraph. Terms such as "60s punk", ""garage punk", and "garage rock" are all

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regardless whether we agree on the other points; it is possible that the article can even achieve GA. Otherwise, I can only conclude you aren't interested in getting the article to GA at this time. (PS, you are always empowered to prod a GA reviewer if she/he is not active enough.) --

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I looked at the second opinions, changes made to the article since my last review, & none contradicted the opinions I offered above; I am failing this article. Further, two separate persons offered suggestions that were not acted upon. IMHO, this article suffers from a case of

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I would be open to the possibility of re-naming current Garage punk article something along the lines of what Ilovetpaint has proposed. It could perhaps be re-named as "Garage punk (post-1980s genre)" being that the subgenre reached its peak in the 1990s and stretched into the

1370:

Another issue I have is that the article states acid rock arose from "garage punk". That is a term I found confusing: I associate the musical use of "punk" with the 70s movement (e.g., Sex Pistols, The Ramones, etc.), & I suspect this would confuse many non-experts; even

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rock article, and there readers there can learn about how the background and etymology and how term "garage punk" and "60s punk" can be used alternately for garage rock, etc. But, here, we don't want to pre-suppose/assume that kind of prior knowledge on the readers' part.

1509:

It would be best to use the term "garage rock" in this article (rather than "garage punk) when speaking of garage influence on acid rock. That is perfectly OK--the sources will allow it. The sources cited here mentioning garage punk's influence on acid rock mean that as

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has a point about punk’s 60s foundations. Of course, I recognize that the prevailing public view sees punk as a post-1975 thing--people are generally unaware of the earlier musical background. With this in mind, I understand some people’s concerns about using the term

1981:.) I know I haven't been very active about this review, but I haven't seen any edits in response to my GA review from a month ago. Are you still interested in getting this article promoted to GA? Or should I just fail this, & you can resubmit it at another time? -- 1387:-- is the absence of any mention of light shows & other theatrics. Originally, rock-n-roll bands would simply stand in front of the audience & play their instruments. With the rise of these genres, bands would add light shows (e.g., the rock band in the movie 1375:

is primarily about the music of the 70s & later. Regardless of the accuracy of this label, wouldn't it be more clear to use the label "garage bands"? Parents' garages have been the birth place of countless rock bands, so there is nothing to be ashamed of in these

2293:

The garage rock / punk issue should not be an obstruction to GA for this article. As an outsider, I'd not heard anything in the 1960s called "punk", so I'd have believed the term arose later, but the exact etymology is a matter for experts with reliable sources, not

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style. You absolutely need to acknowledge this in the first sentence as concisely as possible, otherwise people (me included) are going to wonder what the hell "Good Vibrations" has to do with Black Sabbath. Furthermore, contradictions are presented by your edit

3018:

was "a major influence on American acid rock groups" – that's more than plausible. It inspired a whole generation, musicians and otherwise. The statement belongs in this article, as does mention of "She Said", and perhaps also the inspiration provided by

2240:

Genres inevitably overlap, and genre articles inevitably need to be also about the genre name itself. And the latter is unique. So I don't consider overlap with other genres to be even the slightest minus for the existence or GA suitabiity of this

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record, I think they are two different genres.) In order to clinch this argument, IMHO there needs to be a recognized example of a band/song that can be considered psychedelic, yet is not acid rock. I'm not sure what example that could be, though --

1912:, where does this review stand? It appears there are major disagreements between the nominator and a commenter, and I can't tell whether the issues you raised in your review have been addressed in the four weeks since you wrote them above. Thanks. 525:...but Psychedelic music is a better label than psychedelic rock because many seminal psychedelic releases fall into different larger genres. Example would be The Chambers Bros. "Time Has Come Today" which is simultaneously psychedelia & soul. 2672:

did you also notice the whole section devoted to the distinction between acid rock and psychedelia? There are plenty of sources that focus exclusively on acid rock; it would be a mistake to merge a topic that, alone, encompasses numerous major

1745:

Yes, but to use the term "garage rock" would not be oversimplifying at all, but rather just using the established Knowledge genre terminology. We don't need to simplify, but rather use the prescribed categories to avoid unnecessary confusion.

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However I do not feel comfortable rejecting this outright. So I am going to ask for a second review, & if one is provided within 30 days, I'll consent to the outcome of the second review; if none is forthcoming, then it will be failed. --

1488:

Note: My remarks here are intended to help move the GA process forward. I agree 100% with Ilovetoaint that punk music existed in the 1960s--in what would now be regarded as "prototypical" form (in the early 1970s it was thought of as

513:

So you're right, it's confusing and inaccurate. You end up going in circles. That may be authentic in a sense considering the subject matter, but this sort of cyberpoetry is not what we seek to create as an encyclopedia! I'll fix it.

1393:), which would be considered now very crude & unimpressive but at the time evoked the altered mental state of being stoned. And then there is Jimi Hendricks' famous response to The Who trashing their instruments on stage at 1602:

We can't really write that acid rock grew from "garage bands" because it would misrepresent the source's use of specific terminology - it would be like writing "doom metal evolved from guitar bands" instead of "heavy metal

1423:

Nobody has presented an argument for why the article should be merged except that the terms may be synonymous and cover some of the same ground - based on that reasoning alone, I don't see anyone suggesting a merge between

1948:, it's been another couple of months, and there have since been two outside opinions added below per your request for a second opinion. It is time and past for you to make a decision regarding this nomination. Thank you. 2628:, that is not what the article asserts. It describes acid rock generally speaking as a synonym of psychedelic rock. If this stays, your arguments have no weight and the separation of the articles cannot be justified.-- 2160:

We know that in the late 1980s a new wave of bands got tagged “garage punk” and the term got christened to designate a new and distinct subgenre apart from the rest of garage rock (with certain 60s bands such as

2997:

article demonstrates, under Release and especially Legacy, that Beatles album resonated with pretty much every Westerner under the age of 30 and provided the soundtrack for the Summer of Love. (It marked the

1572:

Incidentally, I agree with Ilovetopaint that Acid rock should have its own article here, and most editors now agree--I think that debate is settled, so it should not inhibit the GA from going forward on that

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If acid rock is loosely defined, and sources don't agree on whether it's a subgenre of psyche rock or rock in general, then it would be disingenuous to definitively state "...is a form of psychedelic rock"

1236:

Using consistent formatting or including every element of the bibliographic material is not required, although, in practice, enough information must be supplied that the reviewer is able to identify the

2953:

The difference between Nagelberg and the Phillip Rauls quote is that Rauls was actually there as an insider when this music was coming out and is simply recalling his experiences from that time (i.e. "

326: 322: 3010:: "Something enveloped the whole world at that time, and it just exploded into a renaissance." I think it's no exaggeration to say that, certainly over 1964–67, there wasn't a rock/pop act who was 2872:

being on rotation at parties, from one house to another, in Haight Ashbury; and I remember seeing an interview with Phil Lesh who talked about Garcia dragging him into a shop on the Haight as "

2759:(distinct from the rest of garage rock) it refers to a later garage movement starting in the 1980s, which was influenced by 60s garage but combined with later influences such as 70s punk. The 883:

It should establish the context in which the topic is being considered by supplying the set of circumstances or facts that surround it. ... It should also establish the boundaries of the topic.

3189:

Early Grand Funk Railroad, Josefus, Frijid Pink etc. Were distinct to San Francisco, Los Angeles, Texas and Boston that were softer. I Think that heavy psych needs to have other article. --

1234:" number of tags is an immediate failure. Is 7 a large figure? 3 of those are asking for specific page numbers, which can't be fixed unless someone has a physical copy of the cited books. " 3248: 683:

The so-called "acid rocks tracks" listed at the bottom of the article are not acid rock at all... (The Beatles? 13th Floor Elevators? clearly, it was written by a newbie). Just listen to

847:

I think Sabbath turn up more in apocalyptic visions than LSD prompted ones. A classic case of list creep. I have restored an older version of the sentence. Thanks for pointing it out.--

2416:

is one of the best reasons why they warrant independent coverage. It's up to you to decide whether the Byrds and the Zombies played in the same genre as Iron Butterfly and Deep Purple.

2236:

I saw the request for a 2nd opinion at wp:ga nominations. I can give it a more thorough look if desired, but at the moment I'll just reflect on two of the most discussed questions.

1539:

we have to be careful not to pass off "garage punk" as a separate subgenre of 60s garage (it is not) or use it as the official category term for 60s garage rock (and risk confusion).

2095:. Historically, "garage punk" and "garage rock" have almost always been interchangeable, and it's not improper or unusual at all for somebody to locate garage punk to the '60s.-- 2527:"The lack of a clear distinction" — in other words, nobody can say for sure that they're the same thing. So why would they be the same article? Wouldn't be a good idea to merge 1470:

very complicated to summarize. I'd also need to grab some other sources, but it's rare that anybody writes about the subject beyond "distorted guitars and weird tape effects".--

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that music at that time. Or, in Knowledge terms, these statements are implausible and not solidly sourced or sourcable. But this is a fix that would only take a minute to do.

608:

Are you sure there is no difference between Acid and Psychedelic? If that is true, why are there two different articles?? I am having the same discussion in the french page,

313: 272: 3095:

s effect had more to do with culture and ideology than music - Nagelberg (not Browne) is specific on "recording studio techniques". That's a contribution better credited to

1561:

These issues might seem "nitpicky", but they have to be addressed in order to to prevent confusion for readers (for additional discussion on the topic, see the talk page to

2361:

It is clear that there is no consensus to merge. Also, in the future, when you open a merge discussion, it is best to tag the target and source pages to get more input. 🔯

1188:

There's 4 or 5 in the article total. The issues are trivial; GA articles don't need to be perfect, just enough that whatever issues it has could be fixed in five minutes.--

687:

acid rock bands (live shows of the Grateful Dead, Quicksilver Messenger Service an so on) before you start bashing, because you obviously have no idea what acid rock is. --

1340:

The article does not appear to be stable. For one thing, there have been a lot of edits since I took on this review. Another is the proposal to merge this article with

677:

This is the worst description of anything I've ever heard. Few lyrics? How many of the "Notable acid rock tracks and singles" have few lyrics? fuckin' A fix this shit!

1336:

Sorry for disappearing right after I took on the review, but demands of Real Life kept my time for Knowledge to a minimum. But I'm here & I do have some concerns:

1784:

There is no "established Knowledge genre terminology". Editors are instructed to use the same specific terminology that the sources use, as is so clearly outlined in

1112: 147: 1168:(I mean, I thought the whole idea was, expand an article, ensure it's fully sourced, then it qualifies for a B rating, then perhaps it's worthy of GA nomination?) 937:

The only way you can consolidate this is by deriving the lowest common denominator between acid rock and psychedelic rock, which is that they're both rock music.

2075:

punk came on the scene in the mid '70s, some writers who remembered that "punk" had already existed for several years opted to classify the newer groups under "

2063:

I'm in the process of adding more detail about the subject - only have one sentence so far. I'm not sure there's really much to say beyond a couple sentences.

992:. It's already apparent that "acid rock" is a broad concept. There is no reason to clarify to the reader when certain statements appear to contradict others ( 3294: 1102: 441: 2376:

can certain artists be labelled as one over the other, or certain later styles as influenced by one over the other? How is a reader to make sense of this?--

522:

Psychedelic Rock IS a genre of music & is still on going. Acid Rock is significant to Psychedelic Rock only as it's forerunner like Proto-punk to punk.

451: 1546:(distinct from garage rock), it refers to the post-80s bands. It can be used at Knowledge as an official category when referring to the post-80s subgere. 2288:

Refs 41 and 43 give Harv errors, they do not point to any citation, while in the bibliography, Lucky 2003 is not used by any ref; these need to be fixed.

79: 2922:

was what drove the Beach Boys to be experimental in the recording studio. Which is a bizarre, easily disprovable claim. It's even weirder that he cites

2176:

So, I could consider what Ilovetopaint recommended--just as long as those procedures don't involve any additions or changes to the Garage rock article.

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Another issue is, as JG66 pointed out, the number of tags. This directly affects the qualification that a GA article be well-written. There should be

3299: 3046:. Acid rock is harder-edged while psychedelic rock can be lighter, with themes of love and peace. No need to merge, as literature for both abounds. 2079:". And I believe the garage "punk" v. "rock" issue has been more or less resolved - I'm waiting for Garagepunk66 to propose an RfC that would move 3137:

had far more to do in influencing what was happening musically speaking. All of the recording techniques used on Pepper were already employed on

1166:

fixing, obviously – but I'm surprised someone nominates an article with "page needed", "by whom?", "verification needed", "repetition" tags, etc.

674:"Acid rock is a form of psychedelic rock, which is characterized with long instrumental solos, few (if any) lyrics and musical improvisation." 3279: 3274: 417: 85: 2846:" as acid rock (not a flirtation-with). And although Browne & Browne 2001 is used fairly extensively in this article, their point about 3289: 587: 2473: 3190: 2439:. It would be many years before historians and musicologists would look back on these terms and try to make sense of their applications. 748: 730: 640: 221: 2999: 2300:

defined to permit Good Article status, or whether it should be merged. If this issue cannot be resolved then the GA must be failed.

1639:

punk and garage rock. Bangs would agree, fairly certain, that acid rock is something else, pharmaceutically speaking and otherwise.

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Seriously, total vandalism that is. Even on the redirect page, the old content seems to be deleted from the history. *why do that?*

44: 1161:

Been interested in this genre for a long time, although I admittedly know a lot less about it than I should. I'll give this a try.

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You talked about merging (6 of 7 were opposed), cleanup tags (which were resolved), the use of "garage punk" (this is done per

1107: 207: 99: 30: 2764:"garage punk" is supposed to be used at Knowledge. I don't mean badly in pointing this out, but we need to fix the problem. 2486:

was no transition to be made. You go from things like 'Flying Purple People Eater' to 'I Am the Walrus'. They go hand-in-hand.

1866:" and blue-link it to that article, which explains how both of those terms can be used, rather that directing everyone to the 704:

The definition of acid rock is currently something like "ya boi you know what I'm talking about" can someone check the source

2708:

synonymous with "psychedelic rock", perhaps the article should start right away as mentioning how acid rock has instead been

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However, with that said ... all of that is just nitpicking. Regardless of how the second sentence is structured, anyone who

2911:. If you think the article is missing signficiant content pertaining to the Beatles, nobody is stopping you from adding it. 3065:

Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

2955:

back then, we thought the Beach Boys were acid rock; we also thought that acid rock was the same thing as progressive rock

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never happened. This is the only strange claim I can see on that page, so I'm not surprised that it was looked over, per

2031:

not be as stable as it might appear, & I waited to see how that played out, since it touches on a point I brought up.

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is loosely defined - it says so right in the first sentence of the lead. The fact that sources cannot agree on whether

2165:

being invoked as forefathers of that later movement, but not necessary implying any separate subgenre within the 60s).

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The first paragraph should define or identify the topic with a neutral point of view, but without being too specific.

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This subject deserves a much better article. I'll try to improve it and expand as much as I can. Anyone with me? --

3129:

was released, psychedelic had been going on for quite a while and acid rock was already underway. Albums such as

899:

article lists a dozen of these, and also gives a validity criterion applicable to various definitions of "center".

2476:"). Historically, this seems to be how those musical styles have been most consistently (and logically) defined. 1927:

I'm in conversation with the nominator on his Talk page. I hope to get this to the next step in a day or two. --

496:

and its forefunner, as the article on psychedelic music already makes plain IMO. So the redirect I found here to

1578:

So, if we can just get the "garage punk" terminology issue resolved, then the article should move closer to GA.

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use the first sentence to introduce the topic, and then spread the relevant information out over the entire lead

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As a stylistic derivative, "psychedelic rock" can't be listed because, according to some people, "acid rock"

925:

If acid rock is a synonym for psychedelic rock, it can't also be a subgenre of psychedelic rock. It's either

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is completely absent. And if we're going back into influences on these acid rock/San Francisco Sound bands,

2826:, who makes some good points above). In a lot of cases, it can depend on the nationality of the author also. 2556: 2498: 2305: 2226: 2100: 2013: 1978: 1967: 1824: 1785: 1716: 1610: 1475: 1389: 1364: 1284: 1244: 1193: 1048: 1029: 997: 945: 919: 734: 644: 617: 109: 2979:

I don't agree it's "bad info", and it certainly shouldn't be dismissed because the author fails to mention

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of evidence from a plethora of sources, before we re-orient the defining context of a genre at Knowledge.

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article where they will get the most thorough briefing on the matter. It is all just meant for the best.

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way to travel back in time or a different band with the same name was around while Wolfe wrote the book?!

1676:

on acid rock. Just because one or two sources exaggerated its influence, you correctly pointed out that

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influencing American acid rock groups is a weird one, because right after saying that, he suggests that

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Remaining tags such as (near ref 27) and (refs 17, 22) need to be sorted out before GA can be awarded.

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has always been more of a marketing label than a real genre. In that respect, the relationship between

2222: 2121: 2096: 2009: 1820: 1712: 1606: 1471: 1280: 1240: 1189: 1044: 1025: 941: 613: 2876:" was playing, and just being delighted at what they were hearing for the first time. I could go on (" 777: 125: 2873: 2726: 2278:

Changes to other articles do not form any part of a GA process, and should not be considered further.

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interchangeable with each other when referring to 60s bands--they are not three separate subgenres.

988:

Adding words like "often used", "specifically", and "however" that do not appear in the sources is

889:

Try to not overload the first sentence by describing everything notable about the subject. Instead

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Problem is that this is the only article out there that even acknowledges "heavy psych" as a thing

966:, it is better not to get so specific about so-called "acid rock" in the first paragraph. It must 416:

on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

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I wouldn't wish to intrude here, but there are some points that seem clear enough to an outsider.

2001: 1130: 827: 709: 212: 175: 70: 3014:

in some way influenced or inspired by the Beatles. So, to read in Browne & Browne 2001 that

2067:

It's not just one source - numerous authors use the term "garage punk" over "garage rock". Read

3142: 2864:, pp. 88–89, for example. I'm not sure of the page number right now, but in John Kruth's book 2843: 2823: 2795: 2780: 2765: 2330: 2207: 2177: 2043: 2024: 1986: 1932: 1876: 1747: 1690: 1579: 1407: 1145: 1021: 915: 857: 810: 493: 400: 217: 51: 3223: 3047: 2939: 2839: 2548: 2532: 2432: 2424: 2008:

need this). So basically, I've agreed with only 2 of the concerns you've presented so far.--

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state that it is a sub-genre of psychedelic rock, and that is quite hard to argue against.--

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I absolutely agree that both articles are missing big chunks of content. One thing lost on

1380:

Gates of Dawn" is a very different album from either "Dark Side of the Moon" or "The Wall".

3002:, according to some.) Paul Kantner of Jefferson Airplane is quoted (in Robert Rodriguez's 2722: 2362: 993: 963: 723:

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE ACID PUNK PAGE? It was useful! Now it redirects to this garbage!

1279:

Don't know if you noticed but Google Books previews don't always show the page number.--

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stronger, intense, rawer, energetic..." over and over again. Look at the MOS for leads:

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then engaged in an argument over "garage punk", which suggested to me that the article

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of "acid rock" in that light, but that's not how most academia appear to use the term (

537: 141: 2742:: Acid rock has always been a high profile-enough subgenre to merit its own article. 1007:' is a statement that really doesn't need to be used so many times. It's obvious that 3268: 2656: 2625: 2590: 2581: 823: 2446:

is best reserved for bands like Jefferson Airplane and the Jimi Hendrix Experience,

1210:, but also GA criteria point 2a and potentially 2c & d. Anyway, I count 7 tags. 971:

getting into other equally valid, specific descriptions like "garagey psychedelia".

3249:

If interested, please offer support for a WikiProject focused on psychedelic music.

2326: 2203: 2055: 2039: 1982: 1945: 1928: 1909: 1403: 1141: 850: 804: 798: 612:, if you don't speak french you can just read the lists of examples for acid rock. 515: 300: 384: 363: 284: 266: 2993: 2856: 2760: 2751: 2747: 2147: 2143: 2134: 2126: 2092: 2088: 2080: 2068: 1977:(The following section, except for the last two paragraphs, has been moved from 1867: 1863: 1686: 1562: 1519: 1498: 1455: 1372: 318: 1493:

form--certain rock critics then used the term "punk" to designate 60s garage).

1039:

Addendum: if there's a source that says something like "acid rock derived from

2653:

it may also refer to a more musically intense or hard subcategory or variation

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with the definitions of "acid rock" by the time they get to musical specifics.

769:

Acid Rock isn't a real Genre, it's just a term that people would use for it.

413: 390: 290: 3088:. No question about that. But in the context of "American acid rock groups", 2547:

is more often related to garage rock and heavy metal — genres not covered on

3024: 2889: 2428: 2130: 1971: 1459: 1437: 1303: 1262: 1211: 1171: 1043:", I don't believe it would be inappropriate to include it in the infobox.-- 879: 476:

Will someone explain the difference between Acid rock and Psychedelic rock?

307: 24: 1542:

When the term "garage punk" is used by commentators to represent an actual

1133:. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review. 973:

It already says "more musically intense", why the need for more adjectives?

532:

pink floyd never used drugs, therefore thay can't be considred acid rock.

2528: 2436: 1441: 1429: 1425: 1417:

I appreciate the criticism. These are all fair points, for the most part.

2419:

The reason why sources often disagree is because — from its inception —

2000:), mentioning specific bands' styles changing (superfluous, borders on 500:

didn't IMO do the term any justice at all, although the redirect from

1344:. Lack of stability is a major reason to decline this article for GA. 2942:. If he knew what he was talking about, he would have written that 2746:

It is interesting the way we have this whole new thing here about "

2740:

Strongly Opposed to Merge, but that isn't the only thing wrong here

2535:. This article is almost 100% devoted to sources that use the term 2930:

as evidence - almost like he lives in an alternate timeline where

609: 3260: 3235: 3214: 3198: 3173: 3150: 3116: 3055: 3032: 2966: 2897: 2803: 2788: 2773: 2730: 2682: 2664: 2642: 2615: 2598: 2560: 2522: 2502: 2390: 2365: 2334: 2325:, preventing any meaningful criticism from being acted upon. -- 2309: 2262: 2230: 2211: 2185: 2104: 2047: 2017: 1990: 1957: 1936: 1921: 1884: 1828: 1755: 1720: 1698: 1648: 1633: 1614: 1587: 1479: 1411: 1311: 1288: 1270: 1248: 1219: 1197: 1179: 1155: 1052: 1033: 949: 862: 831: 815: 789: 756: 738: 713: 696: 669: 648: 621: 595: 574: 561: 550: 540: 2860:, from 1965, should be mentioned, surely – per James Decker in 2004:), and the omission of the genre's visual aspects (the article 325:

page for ideas on how to structure a genre article and help us

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was the album that influenced American acid rock groups, not

2543:. We can see that there isn't a terrible amount of overlap. 2907:

80% of the article goes to Madreterra, who did a great job

2750:". While the term "garage punk" is indeed used by fans of 1383:

One major omission I noticed -- & it may also apply to

1397:

Monterey: setting his own guitar on fire then playing it.

2908: 2218: 955: 210:

at the time (March 24, 2017). There are suggestions on

1506:

tailored reflect prevailing views--to avoid confusion.

160: 2957:"), whereas Nagelberg is just postulating bad info.-- 2354:

Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

2142:

I could consider the idea of redirecting the title “

570:

You should include that in the article or something

412:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 317:, a user driven attempt to clean up and standardize 2071:. "Punk" was a term invented for '60s groups. When 838:

Black Sabbath & The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test

339:

Knowledge:WikiProject Music/Music genres task force

321:articles on Knowledge. Please visit the task force 3004:Revolver: How the Beatles Reimagined Rock 'n' Roll 342:Template:WikiProject Music/Music genres task force 216:for improving the article. If you can improve it, 3084:Of course everybody everywhere was influenced by 2480:'s quote about psyche rock is very illuminating: 472:Difference between Acid rock and Psychedelic rock 3125:I agree with Ilovetopaint on this. By the time 2852:"a major influence on American acid rock groups" 33:for general discussion of the article's subject. 876: 1596:, my opinion is that they should have written 488:used formally to describe a genre before, but 2357:A summary of the conclusions reached follows. 1815:I'm done going around in these circles. Read 174: 8: 2909:expanding it from where it was two years ago 610:http://fr.wikipedia.org/Discussion:Acid_rock 314:Music genres task force of the Music project 1454:Most punk rock-related articles (including 2399:— "How is a reader to make sense of this?" 2133:article and their preference for saying “ 1062: 996:). Let them figure it out for themselves ( 358: 261: 2914:However, Kenneth Nagelberg's claim about 2830:with acid rock in the Beach Boys' albums 2647:That's not what I read. I see: ".... is 2472:for the campy Beach Boys-soundalikes (" 1093: 1065: 797:I would be inclined to agree, but some 360: 263: 233: 2862:The Cambridge Companion to the Beatles 2484: 1601: 1235: 1229: 878: 2651:a synonym of "psychedelic rock", but 2474:The Rain, the Park & Other Things 189: 7: 2713:to a specific subgenre or variation. 2539:, the other is for sources that use 2348:The following discussion is closed. 406:This article is within the scope of 3295:High-importance Rock music articles 252:It is of interest to the following 23:for discussing improvements to the 14: 2582:the producer of "I Am The Walrus" 3285:Music genres task force articles 3061:The discussion above is closed. 2906:Just as an FYI, credit for : --> 2580:(Interesting quote - of course, 2458:for Pink Floyd and the Beatles ( 426:Knowledge:WikiProject Rock music 393: 383: 362: 293: 283: 265: 234: 188: 45:Click here to start a new topic. 3300:WikiProject Rock music articles 3006:, p. 213) about the release of 2431:is almost totally identical to 2219:Did you not notice these edits? 2069:Garage punk#Etymology and usage 446:This article has been rated as 429:Template:WikiProject Rock music 2868:, a San Fran musician recalls 1600:." Once again, I'll restate: " 933:psyche rock. It can't be both. 1: 3151:06:38, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 2789:05:07, 30 November 2016 (UTC) 2774:04:15, 30 November 2016 (UTC) 2731:01:52, 30 November 2016 (UTC) 2683:17:34, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2665:16:49, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2643:16:47, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2616:15:27, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2599:13:04, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2561:16:51, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2523:14:08, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2503:12:55, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2391:11:50, 29 November 2016 (UTC) 2366:19:36, 21 December 2016 (UTC) 1885:12:10, 29 December 2016 (UTC) 1829:20:04, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 1756:18:16, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 1721:13:32, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 1699:11:25, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 1615:09:32, 27 December 2016 (UTC) 1588:22:07, 26 December 2016 (UTC) 1480:16:40, 19 December 2016 (UTC) 1412:00:52, 19 December 2016 (UTC) 1312:04:35, 18 December 2016 (UTC) 1289:08:24, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1271:08:15, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1249:07:43, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1220:07:19, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1198:07:05, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1156:22:54, 27 November 2016 (UTC) 832:21:04, 6 September 2012 (UTC) 816:10:16, 8 September 2011 (UTC) 790:16:17, 3 September 2011 (UTC) 757:07:42, 18 December 2010 (UTC) 649:11:05, 6 September 2013 (UTC) 575:03:56, 18 February 2007 (UTC) 551:23:41, 19 December 2006 (UTC) 541:08:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC) 536:You've GOT to be kidding me. 420:and see a list of open tasks. 336:Music/Music genres task force 273:Music/Music genres task force 42:Put new text under old text. 3280:B-Class music genre articles 3275:Former good article nominees 3261:01:50, 11 January 2017 (UTC) 3184:Differences with heavy psych 3117:19:29, 4 December 2016 (UTC) 3056:01:53, 3 December 2016 (UTC) 3033:12:46, 4 December 2016 (UTC) 2991:might seem puzzling. As the 2983:or because his reference to 2967:19:51, 2 December 2016 (UTC) 2898:09:56, 2 December 2016 (UTC) 2804:02:48, 1 December 2016 (UTC) 2442:Personally, I've found that 2310:10:10, 7 February 2017 (UTC) 2231:12:43, 25 January 2017 (UTC) 2212:06:05, 25 January 2017 (UTC) 2186:06:16, 18 January 2017 (UTC) 2105:09:34, 17 January 2017 (UTC) 2048:07:30, 17 January 2017 (UTC) 2018:10:36, 15 January 2017 (UTC) 1991:10:16, 15 January 2017 (UTC) 1937:00:07, 17 January 2017 (UTC) 1922:22:42, 16 January 2017 (UTC) 1709:Knowledge:Oversimplification 1180:07:59, 2 December 2016 (UTC) 739:00:46, 11 October 2008 (UTC) 719:Wheres the goddamn Acid punk 596:19:27, 11 January 2008 (UTC) 3290:B-Class Rock music articles 3199:23:14, 3 January 2017 (UTC) 3000:start of the Summer of Love 2624:In reply to you as well as 2340:Merge into psychedelic rock 1402:of the article content. -- 1257:Of course you need to have 958:for the following reasons: 765:Merge with Psychedelic Rock 562:03:57, 4 January 2007 (UTC) 484:. I'd never heard the term 311:is within the scope of the 50:New to Knowledge? Welcome! 3316: 2834:(1966) and the unfinished 2586:children's novelty records 2335:06:29, 24 March 2017 (UTC) 1958:01:19, 23 March 2017 (UTC) 869:"Form of psychedelic rock" 714:18:36, 23 April 2022 (UTC) 697:07:42, 16 April 2008 (UTC) 670:20:11, 15 April 2008 (UTC) 452:project's importance scale 206:, but it did not meet the 3236:13:55, 31 July 2017 (UTC) 3215:06:42, 31 July 2017 (UTC) 3174:06:56, 31 July 2017 (UTC) 2655:....." (my emphasis). 2263:18:17, 6 March 2017 (UTC) 2217:"Nothing was done" — ??? 2085:Garage punk (1980s genre) 2023:moot. However, you & 1649:08:57, 31 July 2017 (UTC) 1634:08:57, 31 July 2017 (UTC) 1522:" is used to designate a 1208:WP:GA?#Immediate failures 1053:00:43, 10 June 2016 (UTC) 863:08:51, 22 June 2013 (UTC) 622:22:26, 6 April 2010 (UTC) 445: 378: 278: 260: 80:Be welcoming to newcomers 3077: 3063:Please do not modify it. 2404:By reading the article. 2351:Please do not modify it. 1862:would be better to say " 1518:However, when the term " 1034:23:42, 9 June 2016 (UTC) 950:20:43, 9 June 2016 (UTC) 518:21:30, 17 Apr 2005 (UTC) 508:is probably fair enough. 1365:Incense and Peppermints 1011:refers to the term and 546:Syd Barret used drugs. 2584:started off producing 1979:User talk:Ilovetopaint 1592:.tl;dr "When they say 1361:Strawberry Alarm Clock 1261:– don't be so stupid. 902: 492:is both a subgenre of 409:WikiProject Rock music 242:This article is rated 75:avoid personal attacks 2744:But, one other issue: 2649:sometimes deployed as 1228:Note that it says a " 498:acid (disambiguation) 208:good article criteria 100:Neutral point of view 3244:WikiProject proposal 3078:Continued from above 2874:Tomorrow Never Knows 2842:terms the Beatles' " 1003:"The term 'acid rock 345:music genre articles 105:No original research 2866:This Bird Has Flown 981:"psychedelic rock". 432:Rock music articles 331:good article status 198:was nominated as a 2452:Psychotic Reaction 2412:is different from 1567:Dispute resolution 1131:Talk:Acid rock/GA1 1041:psychedelic music 329:genre articles to 327:assess and improve 248:content assessment 86:dispute resolution 47: 2878:It's All Too Much 2844:She Said She Said 2818:(Invited here by 2641: 2633: 2589: 2521: 2513: 2450:for Count Five (" 2421:psychedelic music 2389: 2381: 1998:WP:STICKTOSOURCES 1169: 1121: 1120: 990:WP:EDITORIALIZING 793: 776:comment added by 729:comment added by 639:comment added by 506:psychedelic music 494:psychedelic music 466: 465: 462: 461: 458: 457: 401:Rock music portal 357: 356: 353: 352: 228: 227: 220:; it may then be 183: 182: 66:Assume good faith 43: 3307: 3207:Morgan johndavid 3166:Morgan johndavid 3094: 2840:Robert Sheffield 2675:TheGracefulSlick 2637: 2629: 2608:TheGracefulSlick 2579: 2574:. I agree with 2549:Psychedelic rock 2541:psychedelic rock 2533:Progressive rock 2517: 2509: 2456:psychedelic rock 2433:Progressive rock 2425:Psychedelic rock 2414:psychedelic rock 2385: 2377: 2353: 2255: 2065:Garage rock/punk 2059: 1786:WP:STICKTOSOURCE 1641:Morgan johndavid 1626:Morgan johndavid 1467:Psychedelic rock 1446:Progressive rock 1385:psychedelic rock 1342:psychedelic rock 1167: 1075:Copyvio detector 1063: 1006: 998:WP:!TRUTHFINDERS 920:WP:CHERRYPICKING 860: 853: 813: 807: 799:reliable sources 792: 770: 741: 651: 502:psychedelic rock 486:psychedelic rock 434: 433: 430: 427: 424: 403: 398: 397: 396: 387: 380: 379: 374: 366: 359: 347: 346: 343: 340: 337: 303: 298: 297: 296: 287: 280: 279: 269: 262: 245: 239: 238: 230: 192: 191: 185: 179: 178: 164: 95:Article policies 16: 3315: 3314: 3310: 3309: 3308: 3306: 3305: 3304: 3265: 3264: 3246: 3186: 3092: 3074: 3067: 3066: 2470:psychedelic pop 2373: 2349: 2342: 2318: 2270: 2251: 2053: 1975: 1907: 1705:WP:OVERSIMPLIFY 1125:This review is 1117: 1089: 1061: 1015:is the subject. 1004: 929:psyche rock or 906:loosely defined 871: 851: 848: 840: 805: 803: 771: 767: 724: 721: 658: 634: 474: 448:High-importance 431: 428: 425: 422: 421: 399: 394: 392: 373:High‑importance 372: 344: 341: 338: 335: 334: 299: 294: 292: 246:on Knowledge's 243: 213:the review page 121: 116: 115: 114: 91: 61: 12: 11: 5: 3313: 3311: 3303: 3302: 3297: 3292: 3287: 3282: 3277: 3267: 3266: 3245: 3242: 3241: 3240: 3239: 3238: 3218: 3217: 3185: 3182: 3181: 3180: 3179: 3178: 3177: 3176: 3156: 3155: 3154: 3153: 3120: 3119: 3073: 3068: 3060: 3059: 3058: 3040: 3039: 3038: 3037: 3036: 3035: 2972: 2971: 2970: 2969: 2951: 2912: 2901: 2900: 2827: 2813: 2812: 2811: 2810: 2809: 2808: 2807: 2806: 2734: 2733: 2718:actually reads 2714: 2699: 2698: 2692: 2691: 2690: 2689: 2688: 2687: 2686: 2685: 2619: 2618: 2601: 2568: 2567: 2566: 2565: 2564: 2563: 2491: 2490: 2489: 2478:Andy Partridge 2440: 2417: 2401: 2400: 2372: 2371: 2370: 2369: 2368: 2344: 2343: 2341: 2338: 2317: 2314: 2313: 2312: 2296: 2295: 2290: 2289: 2285: 2284: 2280: 2279: 2275: 2274: 2269: 2266: 2247: 2246: 2242: 2234: 2233: 2195: 2194: 2193: 2192: 2191: 2190: 2189: 2188: 2174: 2173: 2172: 2171: 2170: 2166: 2157: 2156: 2152: 2151: 2112: 2111: 2110: 2109: 2108: 2107: 1974: 1970:nomination of 1964: 1963: 1962: 1961: 1960: 1940: 1939: 1906: 1903: 1902: 1901: 1900: 1899: 1898: 1897: 1896: 1895: 1894: 1893: 1892: 1891: 1890: 1889: 1888: 1887: 1844: 1843: 1842: 1841: 1840: 1839: 1838: 1837: 1836: 1835: 1834: 1833: 1832: 1831: 1813: 1810: 1807: 1804: 1801: 1798: 1795: 1792: 1789: 1769: 1768: 1767: 1766: 1765: 1764: 1763: 1762: 1761: 1760: 1759: 1758: 1732: 1731: 1730: 1729: 1728: 1727: 1726: 1725: 1724: 1723: 1662: 1661: 1660: 1659: 1658: 1657: 1656: 1655: 1654: 1653: 1652: 1651: 1636: 1576: 1575: 1574: 1570: 1559: 1554: 1553: 1552: 1551: 1550: 1549: 1548: 1547: 1540: 1529: 1528: 1516: 1507: 1483: 1482: 1463: 1449: 1434:Hypnagogic pop 1418: 1399: 1398: 1381: 1377: 1368: 1356: 1352: 1345: 1334: 1333: 1331: 1330:llywrch writes 1327: 1326: 1325: 1324: 1323: 1322: 1321: 1320: 1319: 1318: 1317: 1316: 1315: 1314: 1292: 1291: 1274: 1273: 1252: 1251: 1223: 1222: 1201: 1200: 1183: 1182: 1160: 1136: 1135: 1119: 1118: 1116: 1115: 1110: 1105: 1099: 1096: 1095: 1091: 1090: 1088: 1087: 1085:External links 1082: 1077: 1071: 1068: 1067: 1060: 1057: 1056: 1055: 1017: 1016: 1001: 986: 982: 975: 935: 934: 923: 870: 867: 866: 865: 839: 836: 835: 834: 819: 766: 763: 762: 761: 760: 759: 720: 717: 702: 701: 700: 699: 657: 654: 653: 652: 629: 628: 627: 626: 625: 624: 601: 600: 599: 598: 588:90.187.102.169 580: 579: 578: 577: 565: 564: 544: 543: 529:'Psychedelic' 520: 519: 510: 509: 482:User:Iwakura42 473: 470: 468: 464: 463: 460: 459: 456: 455: 444: 438: 437: 435: 418:the discussion 405: 404: 388: 376: 375: 367: 355: 354: 351: 350: 348: 305: 304: 288: 276: 275: 270: 258: 257: 251: 240: 226: 225: 193: 181: 180: 118: 117: 113: 112: 107: 102: 93: 92: 90: 89: 82: 77: 68: 62: 60: 59: 48: 39: 38: 35: 34: 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2753: 2749: 2745: 2741: 2738: 2737: 2736: 2735: 2732: 2728: 2724: 2719: 2715: 2711: 2710:distinguished 2706: 2701: 2700: 2697: 2696:Strong oppose 2694: 2693: 2684: 2680: 2676: 2671: 2668: 2667: 2666: 2662: 2658: 2654: 2650: 2646: 2645: 2644: 2640: 2636: 2632: 2627: 2623: 2622: 2621: 2620: 2617: 2613: 2609: 2605: 2602: 2600: 2596: 2592: 2587: 2583: 2577: 2573: 2570: 2569: 2562: 2558: 2554: 2550: 2546: 2542: 2538: 2534: 2530: 2526: 2525: 2524: 2520: 2516: 2512: 2506: 2505: 2504: 2500: 2496: 2492: 2487: 2482: 2481: 2479: 2475: 2471: 2467: 2463: 2462: 2457: 2453: 2449: 2445: 2441: 2438: 2434: 2430: 2426: 2422: 2418: 2415: 2411: 2407: 2403: 2402: 2398: 2397:Strong oppose 2395: 2394: 2393: 2392: 2388: 2384: 2380: 2367: 2364: 2360: 2359: 2358: 2355: 2352: 2346: 2345: 2339: 2337: 2336: 2332: 2328: 2324: 2315: 2311: 2307: 2303: 2302:Chiswick Chap 2298: 2297: 2292: 2291: 2287: 2286: 2282: 2281: 2277: 2276: 2272: 2271: 2268:A few details 2267: 2265: 2264: 2260: 2256: 2254: 2243: 2239: 2238: 2237: 2232: 2228: 2224: 2220: 2216: 2215: 2214: 2213: 2209: 2205: 2199: 2187: 2183: 2179: 2175: 2167: 2164: 2159: 2158: 2154: 2153: 2149: 2145: 2141: 2140: 2139: 2138: 2136: 2132: 2128: 2123: 2120: 2119: 2118: 2117: 2116: 2115: 2114: 2113: 2106: 2102: 2098: 2094: 2090: 2087:and redirect 2086: 2082: 2078: 2074: 2070: 2066: 2062: 2057: 2052: 2051: 2050: 2049: 2045: 2041: 2035: 2030: 2026: 2021: 2020: 2019: 2015: 2011: 2007: 2003: 1999: 1995: 1994: 1993: 1992: 1988: 1984: 1980: 1973: 1969: 1965: 1959: 1955: 1951: 1947: 1944: 1943: 1942: 1941: 1938: 1934: 1930: 1926: 1925: 1924: 1923: 1919: 1915: 1911: 1904: 1886: 1882: 1878: 1874: 1869: 1865: 1860: 1859: 1858: 1857: 1856: 1855: 1854: 1853: 1852: 1851: 1850: 1849: 1848: 1847: 1846: 1845: 1830: 1826: 1822: 1818: 1814: 1811: 1808: 1805: 1802: 1799: 1796: 1793: 1790: 1787: 1783: 1782: 1781: 1780: 1779: 1778: 1777: 1776: 1775: 1774: 1773: 1772: 1771: 1770: 1757: 1753: 1749: 1744: 1743: 1742: 1741: 1740: 1739: 1738: 1737: 1736: 1735: 1734: 1733: 1722: 1718: 1714: 1710: 1706: 1702: 1701: 1700: 1696: 1692: 1688: 1683: 1679: 1675: 1670: 1669: 1668: 1667: 1666: 1665: 1664: 1663: 1650: 1646: 1642: 1637: 1635: 1631: 1627: 1622: 1621: 1620: 1619: 1618: 1617: 1616: 1612: 1608: 1604: 1599: 1595: 1591: 1590: 1589: 1585: 1581: 1577: 1571: 1568: 1565:, as well as 1564: 1560: 1556: 1555: 1545: 1541: 1537: 1536: 1535: 1534: 1533: 1532: 1531: 1530: 1525: 1521: 1517: 1513: 1508: 1504: 1500: 1495: 1494: 1492: 1487: 1486: 1485: 1484: 1481: 1477: 1473: 1468: 1464: 1461: 1457: 1453: 1450: 1447: 1443: 1439: 1435: 1431: 1427: 1422: 1419: 1416: 1415: 1414: 1413: 1409: 1405: 1396: 1392: 1391: 1386: 1382: 1378: 1374: 1369: 1366: 1362: 1357: 1353: 1350: 1346: 1343: 1339: 1338: 1337: 1332: 1329: 1328: 1313: 1309: 1305: 1301: 1296: 1295: 1294: 1293: 1290: 1286: 1282: 1278: 1277: 1276: 1275: 1272: 1268: 1264: 1260: 1256: 1255: 1254: 1253: 1250: 1246: 1242: 1238: 1233: 1232: 1227: 1226: 1225: 1224: 1221: 1217: 1213: 1209: 1206:Rubbish. Per 1205: 1204: 1203: 1202: 1199: 1195: 1191: 1187: 1186: 1185: 1184: 1181: 1177: 1173: 1164: 1163: 1162: 1158: 1157: 1153: 1150: 1147: 1143: 1140: 1134: 1132: 1128: 1123: 1122: 1114: 1111: 1109: 1106: 1104: 1101: 1100: 1098: 1097: 1092: 1086: 1083: 1081: 1078: 1076: 1073: 1072: 1070: 1069: 1064: 1058: 1054: 1050: 1046: 1042: 1038: 1037: 1036: 1035: 1031: 1027: 1023: 1014: 1010: 1002: 999: 995: 991: 987: 983: 980: 976: 974: 969: 965: 961: 960: 959: 957: 952: 951: 947: 943: 938: 932: 928: 924: 921: 917: 912: 911: 910: 907: 901: 900: 895: 894: 892: 886: 885: 884: 882: 875: 868: 864: 859: 855: 854: 846: 845: 844: 837: 833: 829: 825: 820: 818: 817: 812: 808: 800: 796: 795: 794: 791: 787: 783: 779: 775: 764: 758: 754: 750: 749:121.45.247.36 746: 745: 744: 743: 742: 740: 736: 732: 728: 718: 716: 715: 711: 707: 698: 694: 690: 689:~Magnolia Fen 686: 682: 681: 680: 679: 678: 675: 672: 671: 667: 663: 662:~Magnolia Fen 655: 650: 646: 642: 638: 631: 630: 623: 619: 615: 611: 607: 606: 605: 604: 603: 602: 597: 593: 589: 584: 583: 582: 581: 576: 573: 569: 568: 567: 566: 563: 560: 555: 554: 553: 552: 549: 542: 539: 535: 534: 533: 530: 526: 523: 517: 512: 511: 507: 503: 499: 495: 491: 487: 483: 479: 478: 477: 471: 469: 453: 449: 443: 440: 439: 436: 419: 415: 411: 410: 402: 391: 389: 386: 382: 381: 377: 371: 368: 365: 361: 349: 332: 328: 324: 320: 316: 315: 310: 309: 302: 291: 289: 286: 282: 281: 277: 274: 271: 268: 264: 259: 255: 249: 241: 237: 232: 231: 223: 219: 215: 214: 209: 205: 204: 203: 197: 194: 187: 186: 177: 173: 170: 167: 163: 159: 155: 152: 149: 146: 143: 140: 137: 134: 131: 127: 124: 123:Find sources: 120: 119: 111: 110:Verifiability 108: 106: 103: 101: 98: 97: 96: 87: 83: 81: 78: 76: 72: 69: 67: 64: 63: 57: 53: 52:Learn to edit 49: 46: 41: 40: 37: 36: 32: 26: 22: 18: 17: 3253:Ilovetopaint 3247: 3228:Ilovetopaint 3187: 3143:Garagepunk66 3138: 3134: 3130: 3126: 3109:Ilovetopaint 3104: 3100: 3096: 3089: 3085: 3075: 3070: 3062: 3043: 3020: 3015: 3011: 3007: 3003: 2992: 2988: 2984: 2980: 2959:Ilovetopaint 2954: 2947: 2943: 2936:Smiley Smile 2935: 2931: 2927: 2923: 2919: 2915: 2885: 2884:, certainly 2881: 2869: 2865: 2861: 2855: 2847: 2835: 2831: 2824:Garagepunk66 2814: 2796:Garagepunk66 2781:Garagepunk66 2766:Garagepunk66 2756: 2743: 2739: 2717: 2709: 2704: 2695: 2652: 2648: 2603: 2576:Ilovetopaint 2571: 2553:Ilovetopaint 2544: 2540: 2536: 2495:Ilovetopaint 2469: 2459: 2455: 2447: 2443: 2420: 2413: 2409: 2405: 2396: 2374: 2356: 2350: 2347: 2323:WP:OWNERSHIP 2319: 2316:Final review 2252: 2250: 2248: 2235: 2223:Ilovetopaint 2200: 2196: 2178:Garagepunk66 2122:Ilovetopaint 2097:Ilovetopaint 2072: 2064: 2061:Light shows: 2060: 2036: 2032: 2028: 2025:Garagepunk66 2010:Ilovetopaint 2005: 1976: 1908: 1905:Status query 1877:Garagepunk66 1872: 1821:Ilovetopaint 1817:WP:DEADHORSE 1788:. Basically: 1748:Garagepunk66 1713:Ilovetopaint 1691:Garagepunk66 1681: 1677: 1673: 1607:Ilovetopaint 1597: 1593: 1580:Garagepunk66 1543: 1523: 1511: 1490: 1472:Ilovetopaint 1451: 1420: 1400: 1394: 1388: 1348: 1335: 1299: 1281:Ilovetopaint 1259:page numbers 1258: 1241:Ilovetopaint 1230: 1190:Ilovetopaint 1159: 1148: 1138: 1137: 1124: 1113:Instructions 1045:Ilovetopaint 1040: 1026:Ilovetopaint 1018: 1012: 1008: 978: 972: 967: 953: 942:Ilovetopaint 939: 936: 930: 926: 905: 903: 896: 890: 887: 880: 877: 872: 849: 841: 802: 772:— Preceding 768: 731:75.44.38.102 722: 703: 684: 676: 673: 659: 656:Improvement. 641:92.39.81.126 635:— Preceding 614:Colombiano54 545: 531: 527: 524: 521: 505: 501: 489: 475: 467: 447: 407: 312: 306: 301:Music portal 254:WikiProjects 211: 202:good article 200: 199: 195: 171: 165: 157: 150: 144: 138: 132: 122: 94: 19:This is the 3127:Sgt. Pepper 3071:Sgt. Pepper 3048:Binksternet 3021:Rubber Soul 3016:Sgt. Pepper 2994:Sgt. Pepper 2916:Sgt. 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