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object against such arbitrary naming. It is obvious from the beginning of this conflict that the forces fighting
Gaddafi Loyalists and former Libyan Army are NOT controlled or even fully supporting the NTC. This stinks of PR even though I believe the result was not intentional. If we indeed keep the
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Well, my personal opinion on the naming is far from WP standards ... BUT, we need to avoid WP:OR as much as possible. Thus we shall use the naming used casually in the media BUT we shall under no circumstances follow the propaganda of either side (the naming IS part of it). Summarily naming _all_
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The Fourth opposition attack has, according to the article, been going on from oct 4 and is still on. Its seems the fighting has stopped a few times during this time. At least the attack must have stopped yesterday oct 13 when the NTC-forces were pushed back and they started a siege again.
493:. The first one is more directly linked with the (capture of) Sirte's port, which lies east of the town. The second one is a roundabout linking town with the highway. So, claiming the eastern NTC forces are inside town, based solely upon the roundabout info, would be a bit optimistic.---
595:
How come we claim the NTC "captured" the airport while in the same sentence admitting they are being shelled from the other end of the runway. Since when does not a runway part of an airport constitute? I propose we move the text to one along the lines:
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There is a problem with this, non of the sides are homogeneous. There are plenty of non-Khaddafi-supporters and entities fighting against the rebels/former rebels. Wouldnt it be easier to call the group of fractions who is rebellious for rebels?
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In the article its said that Bani Walid has fallen. The NTC took that back later on oct 18th, saying that they had only entered the city and had taken some ground. That was reported by fighters from
Misrata witch had been transferred from Sirte.
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They are NTC forces, etc., but they also are Rebels. The rebelled against
Gaddafi and losts of sources call them Rebels. I am not saying that "NTC forces" should be changed to "Rebels", but I think it cannot be said they aren`t Rebels.
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renamed to NTC/NTC forces which is factually incorrect. I have nothing against using the "NTC forces" moniker where appropriate. However I am strongly against retroactively replacing all mentions of "rebels/Anti-gaddafi" with "NTC/NTC
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factions fighting the pro-Gaddafi forces "NTC/NTC forces" is WP:OR, unless we consider the NTC spokespeople who were caught lying more that not as authoritative source above all. And it is propaganda on top of it all.
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NTC moniker for all forces fighting the previous regime, then I require all "pro-Gaddafi/Loyalist" monikers should be changed to "Libyan Army" or "Jamahirya forces". This goes for all Libyan War articles, basically.
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Is there any reason we can't just use anti-Gaddafi forces? They might not all be actually part of the NLA or NTC, but the ones fighting against gaddafi are by definition anti-Gaddafi. I think this is a good
1100:; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so.
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I am considering that the fourth attack in essence lasted until 12 October when they managed to bottle up the loyalists in the two districts. Since the 13th in essence is a new siege.
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It's possible there are multiple forces. Al
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There's been a lot of talk about a strategic roundabout. Now, where is it? In the eastern part of the town proper there seems to be no roundabouts, only simple crossings. But
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Red is a color of the Libyan flag flown by the new government. It's fairly typical in the media to use red or burgundy to represent it, and green to represent
Gaddafi. -
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On some picks from Sirte front there were Libyan NTC tanks, should we add information in infobox about that? Now there are only information about technicals.--
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https://web.archive.org/web/20111011125256/http://www.monstersandcritics.com:80/news/africa/news/article_1667602.php/Report-Gaddafi-nephew-arrested-in-Sirte
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NTC forces again entered the military airport proper and engaged the loyalist forces stationed there, the battle was ongoing according to the latest reports
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Fully support this. AFAIR, this was actually a long-term consensus in the articles describing this war. I raised the issue only because the "rebels" were
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I support the proposal for the map but also think a few images of the fighting would come a long way of properly representing the battle in this article.
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https://web.archive.org/web/20111102221907/http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpps/news/libyas-new-regime-fighters-seize-sirte-road-dpgonc-km-20111008_15387290
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X runways and is 3km * 4km big with tens of fortifications. It isn't just a piece of tarmac in the middle of the desert as most other Libyan airports.
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per se, but clarifying a lot, I think. This "rotunda" would mean the northern roundabout in my post above. Still outside of the town proper.--
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https://web.archive.org/web/20111013072512/http://en.news.maktoob.com/20090001133344/Anti-Kadhafi_fighters_seize_Sirte_police_HQ/Article.htm
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But I think that is when the battle finishes. In
Misrata`s and Tripoli`s battles, when they were ongoning, the map was like this. --
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https://web.archive.org/web/20111018090328/http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Libyan-forces-seize-most-of-Bani-Walid-2222137.php
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Now that the battle is over, I would suggest that the map be reverted to show the battle lines as of the start of the conflict. --
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http://inagist.com/Sirte_Feb17/118375049920122881/Confirmed_news_that_Gaddafis_nephew,_AbdelRahman_AbdelHamid,_was_killed_in_Sirte
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https://web.archive.org/web/20130118214527/http://www.thejakartaglobe.com/afp/snipers-halt-ntc-fight-for-kadhafi-hometown/468894
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https://web.archive.org/web/20120122065943/http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/gaddafis-son-mutassim-flees-hometown-of-sirte--tv
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https://web.archive.org/web/20111224002556/http://www.thenewstribune.com/2011/10/16/1866950/sirte-libya-gadhafis-hometown.html
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refers to them as "interim government forces" or other such monikers. And you can't unilaterally "require" anything, FYI. -
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I don't really like the colors. Red is usually associated with danger and evil, so maybe that could change (maybe in blue)?
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It's an excellent start. Can you make it up a bit more like the
Tripoli and Misrata maps, with the dated battle lines? -
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There may have be problem with copyright issues of the second map as it clearly is printscreen from Google Maps. --
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/africa/news/article_1667602.php/Report-Gaddafi-nephew-arrested-in-Sirte
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Is it just me, or do we need a battle map covering the city like the ones we had for
Misrata and Tripoli? -
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should be preserved as it is without any changes so it could show the situation as of 8 October 2011.
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The map's fairly unreliable. I read somewhere that they controlled more than one district.
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http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Libyan-forces-seize-most-of-Bani-Walid-2222137.php
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http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/gaddafis-son-mutassim-flees-hometown-of-sirte--tv/
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http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/shortages-killing-patients-in-libya-siege-hospital
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http://www.thejakartaglobe.com/afp/snipers-halt-ntc-fight-for-kadhafi-hometown/468894
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then you may need to upload it to
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there is a map with the situation of the roundabout ("rotonda" in Spanish).--
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Today reports say that Al-Mu'tasim-Billah al-Gaddaf is not captured.--
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Thanks for the link! Here's a lot of maps with interesting info. Not
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http://www.france24.com/en/20111012-fighters-move-kill-kadhafi-town
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669:Is it OK? --
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51:WikiProjects
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1215:Sourcecheck
1098:Don't panic
745:EllsworthSK
443:section on
440:On this day
334:Structure:
1536:Categories
1523:Report bug
1285:Report bug
1038:Bani Walid
1506:this tool
1499:this tool
1416:dead link
1392:dead link
1268:this tool
1261:this tool
1188:dead link
918:summarily
720:This map
552:Paracel63
495:Paracel63
435:Main Page
39:is rated
1512:Cheers.â
1274:Cheers.â
1106:non-free
1047:unsigned
1006:unsigned
986:Vojvodae
940:unsigned
921:forces".
842:strongly
823:Sacolcor
580:Vojvodae
295:criteria
1420:tag to
1396:tag to
1308:my edit
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1192:tag to
1154:my edit
1025:EkoGraf
904:Jeancey
802:ARKJEDI
760:Jrdplas
730:EkoGraf
646:EkoGraf
591:Airport
483:outside
437:in the
226:African
156:on the
41:B-class
1412:Added
1388:Added
1209:failed
1184:Added
866:Kudzu1
775:Kudzu1
689:Kudzu1
632:Kudzu1
517:Kudzu1
463:, and
129:Africa
120:Africa
70:Africa
47:scale.
862:WP:RS
574:Tanks
548:WP:RS
75:Libya
28:This
1205:true
1128:talk
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489:and
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1480:RfC
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1242:RfC
1219:).
1207:or
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609:two
148:Mid
1538::
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53::
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