Talk:Empire State Building/Archive 2

2022:"The area to the south and west features other major Manhattan landmarks as well, including Macy's at Herald Square on Sixth Avenue and 34th Street, Koreatown on 32nd Street between Fifth and Sixth Avenues, Penn Station and Madison Square Garden on Seventh Avenue between 32nd and 34th Streets, and the Flower District on 28th Street between Sixth and Seventh Avenues. The nearest New York City Subway stations are 34th Street–Herald Square at Sixth Avenue and Broadway, one block west, and 33rd Street at Park Avenue, two blocks east. There is also a PATH station at 33rd Street and Sixth Avenue. To the east of the Empire State Building is Murray Hill, a mixed-use neighborhood with residential, commercial, and entertainment uses. One block east of the Empire State Building, on Madison Avenue at 34th Street, is the New York Public Library's Science, Industry and Business Library, which is located on the same block as the CUNY Graduate Center. The library also has its main and Mid-Manhattan branches at Fifth Avenue and 40th Street, six blocks north. The Morgan Library & Museum is located four blocks away, at Madison Avenue and 36th Street." - I found this quite hard to follow, and wasn't entirely sure what it was trying to tell the reader - I can see it is useful to know that the area contains a variety of other landmarks, but are why the details of where a public library has its subsidiary branches etc.? I think you could probably squeeze this down by half and still carry the essential information. 2289:"In 1961, the building was bought by Harry B. Helmsley, Lawrence A. Wien, and Wien's son-in-law Peter L. Malkin, for $ 65 million, which became the new highest price for a single structure. Over 3,000 people paid $ 10,000 for one share each in a company called Empire State Building Associates, that subletted the building to another company headed by Helmsley and Wein, raising $ 33 million of the funds used to pay for the change of ownership. The land itself was sold to Prudential Insurance for $ 29 million." - I couldn't work out quite what this meant. Did Hemlsley, WIen and Malkin buy the building personally and then let it on to the ESBA, and the ESBA subletted it on to Hemlsley and Wein's company? And was the land sold directly to PI, or via the threesome? Couldn't work this out. 3737:. Finally, while the source the editor provided doesn't itself specify it as just the observatory entrance, it alludes to it: "Beginning Thursday, visitors to the 87-year-old building will enter at 20 West 34th St., around the corner from the old 350 Fifth Ave. entrance". It indicates this is the visitor entrance. This would be, presumably, in contrast to the tenant entrance. Malkin said, "Our leadership in innovation continues with this transformative reinforced of our entrance, the first phase of the completely new Observatory experience”, which also seems to imply the entrance relates to the observatory. I'm pretty convinced 350 is still the address of the building. Anyone feel otherwise? 5278:, UK used for some small parts of the Empire State building or is this an urban myth? The Higher Bebington White Freestone Quarry - which closed in 1959 - was the last producer of this fine quality lighter sandstone. This highly regarded stone from the Storeton area had been quarried since the Roman period. Sources state the outside of the Empire State building was clad in Indiana Limestone (which makes commercial sense because it's cheaper to transport overland by rail the majority of building materials than transshipping it across continents), without mention of any Cheshire stone being used (or was the amount so small sources ignore this because it was negligible amount?). 2513:"The lines to enter the observation decks, according to Concierge.com, are "as legendary as the building itself". Concierge.com states that there are five lines: the sidewalk line, the lobby elevator line, the ticket purchase line, the second elevator line, and the line to get off the elevator and onto the observation deck. However, New York City's official tourism website, NYCgo.com, makes note of only three lines: the security check line, the ticket purchase line, and the second elevator line." - the sources for this seem to be six years apart, so presumably things might just have changed? 5441: 5084: 4085: 3186: 963: 2427:"Until the 1960s, the ceilings in the lobby had a shiny art deco mural inspired by both the sky and the Machine Age, until it was covered with ceiling tiles and fluorescent lighting. Because the original murals, designed by an artist named Leif Neandross, were damaged, reproductions were installed. " - the sequence here was unclear. I'm presuming that the ceiling tiles etc. were added in the 1960s? If so, one of the "until"s could go. I couldn't work out when the reproductions were installed though. 2068:"The planned 80-story building, with a height of about 1,000 feet (300 m), would have height limits on nearby buildings ensuring that the top fifty floors would get expansive views of the city" - the structure here is slightly awkward, as the bit running "would have height limits" is attached to the Empire State, not the nearby buildings. How about something like "As nearby buildings were subject to height restrictions, the top fifty floors of the planned 80-story building would get..."? 2392:"but allow the top floors to be both illuminated by sunlight" - subtle, but I wonder if the average reader will read this correctly? It's presumably saying that the light can penetrate to the interior/centre of the higher floor because their size is smaller, but I suspect that some would read this as just meaning that light can reach the outside of the building, particularly given the next sentence. "but allow sunlight to penetrate the interior of the top floors" or something like that? 1960:"As of 2017 the Empire State Building is the fifth-tallest completed skyscraper in the United States and the 28th-tallest in the world. It is also the sixth-tallest freestanding structure in the Americas. When measured by pinnacle height, it is the fifth-tallest building in the United States." - the row of stats so soon into the lead felt a bit jarring/repetitious; I'd have recommended using the 28th-tallest and fifth-tallest building in the US, and leaving it at that. 3092:) reservation also made up a sizable minority of those working on the construction of the Empire State Building. In fact, large portions of Kahnawà:ke Mohawks have practiced ironwork since 1880 and continue into the present . Today, about 200 Mohawk ironworkers are employed in the New York area, out of 2,000 structural ironworkers, according to the union. Most still travel home on weekends to Kahnawà:ke near the border of Canada and New York State by the 888:

For example it's claimed the 103rd floor was for dirigible departures, but 1) there is no evidence that commercial flights were ever going to use the Empire State Building, 2) the source that is cited makes no mention to the purpose of floor 103. Also it conflates the floor itself with the balcony with the machine room - making it sound non-sensical when it states it's a "celebrity hotspot". Buy a properly edited book on the building if you want facts.

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published sources to back up your interpretation of floor counts. However, it is possible that including equivalent height in floor counts may turn out to a legitimate practice; perhaps someone familiar with architectural standards can tell us whether that is so. If it is, than the widely-published number of stories, 102, has not been inflated by false marketing.

1787: 2400:"At the top of each doorway is a bronze motif of three of the "crafts or industries" used in the building's construction—Electricity, Masonry, and Heating from north to south" - I think this should just read "bronze motif of the 'crafts or industries'", otherwise it suggests that that there are three motifs on each door, rather than motifs over three doors? 3811:

way through the mast until it reaches concrete. This is how they change the light bulbs inside that make it glow - walking on the grill. Are these metal grills floors REAL FLOORS? If the answer is yes, then it is right to say that the ESB has 102 floors and that the 1 World Trade Center tower has 104 floors etc....I think that it is an important question.

3460:"The elevators were mechanically operated until 2011, when they were replaced with digital elevators during a $ 550 million elevator replacement project." I think the 550 million figure refers to the overall renovations not just the elevators. I think it should be rephrased. $ 550 million in elevators as a rule of thumb is just too much. Thank you 1708: 804:

at least part of the 21st century) I think the floors in the "pedestal" for the mast are solid (not sure) (86-90?) I'm pretty sure the deck without a terrace is the 101st floor. The floor above with a terrace is the 102nd floor. The tiny floor above that that looks like a hat would be the 103rd floor but I believe it doesn't count according to the

5232:, so they should be treated accordingly. There's no reason why notes, citations, and sources should all have their own header, since they are part of the same thing, like the exterior and interior design sections. (However, I see MOS:NOTES indicates that further reading is indeed not part of references, so I have left that as its own section.) – 5170: 4720: 3664: 1638: 1007: 107: 4934: 4324: 4235: 2841:

pond was polluted near the site in the 1820s?). There's an existing article on the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel as well. I'd strongly advise trimming this down into a single paragraph on the "pre-history" and a single paragraph on the Waldorf-Astoria - you'd then be bringing the reader right into the heart of the action with the next section.

2454:" in what was believed to be the first lawsuit filed by an organization under the then-new ADA law" - "was believed" is ambiguous; have opinions changed, or could this just be "in what was the first..."; you could safely end with "under the new law.", as you've given the 1990 date and title of the the law in the previous sentence. 193: 2711:(b) it provides in-line citations from reliable sources for direct quotations, statistics, published opinion, counter-intuitive or controversial statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged, and contentious material relating to living persons—science-based articles should follow the scientific citation guidelines; 4702:". This however should read either ..."sixth-tallest freestanding structure in the Americas, or "fifth-tallest freestanding structure in the United States", as the CN Tower in Toronto Canada is taller (as shown on the currently linked wiki page) making it the 6th tallest free standing structure in the Americas. 2577:"22-year-old Irma P. Eberhardt " etc. - are the ages of the suicide victims necessary here? Incidentally, the level of detail in this section generally felt a bit uncomfortable to me; quoting the suicide notes and phone calls felt intrusive, for example, and not necessary for telling the story of the ESB. 887:

Yes but 103 is not accessible to the general public. It is no more a "floor" than the access space beneath the communication mast is a floor. In fact the section entitled "Above the 102nd floor" is written to the usual pisspoor standard that Knowledge excels at. It's contradictory and makes stuff up.

803:

The floors in the mast do exist but they're only metal grills. If you drop something it might fall all the way through the mast until it reaches concrete. This is how they change the light bulbs inside that make it glow - walking on the grill. (I can't be sure that hasn't changed but it was like that

4481:

date for the entire World Trade Center complex. However, the height of the first WTC tower passed that of the Empire State Building in 1970, despite not being complete. The roof height of the first WTC tower, at 1,368 feet, is taller than the entirety of the Empire State Building. The other articles

4008:

If there's no clear-cut "identity", then it's based on however the article was first written. Because neither one is "wrong"--just "not what you're used to seeing, depending where you are from"--there could never be a consensus for a universal choice for wikipedia as a whole. So WP has consensus not

3701:

Take note that this aricle is only useful if useful information is provided. Citing other notables leaves little doubt that the article is anywhere near acurate. As for lodging and business done there, be mindful of the stasis at which ownership takes place, then feel free to restablish or establish

3103:

such as the Empire State Building. The role of Mohawk ironworkers from Kahnawà:ke in constructing the post-industrial skyline in New York City and across North America has been romanticized for decades. . Their image as “sky walkers” has lead to the idea that they have assimilated into United States

2840:

History section, "Site" - I thought this went into excessive detail. We've got 900 odd words or so here giving the history of the site before the Empire State building is actually built, much of which doesn't seem to tell us much about what then happens next (e.g. does the reader need to know that a

2292:

Yeah, it's very confusing. Helmsley and Wein owned the building but not the land. PI got the land separately. But I was a bit confused as well: the 2013 NYT article says that the shareholders paid $ 33 million, while the 1961 article omits the shareholders entirely. I just wrote that Helmsley et al.

786:

As you may know, information in WP must be verifiable in reliable and secondary sources. Direct, personal experience does not qualify! The need for verification applies all the more so to controversial information, such as whatever contradicts existing sourced content. Perhaps you can find suitable

5012:"As of 2020, the building is the seventh-tallest building in New York City, . . . and the sixth-tallest freestanding structure in the Americas." I assume that this is due to some mix of measurement criteria (with or without mast, etc.) but it needs explanation in the text or else it is nonsense. 4424:

I found that the years of being the tallest building was different in the english and swedish infobox. I did some reesearch and it seems to me that the problem has to do with the definition wich seems unclear. Is it antenna, no antenna, does only completed buildings count? For instance, here is one

3977:

Ok thanks for the info, I understand, although you really need to pick one style - this might be OK for buildings in America, but how do you determine this for people? If you write an article about an American citizen, then that person moves to the UK and gets British citizenship, do you change the

369:

took place, I mentioned two of the most commonly cited (WP-wide), and presumably most reliable sources, which apply standard definitions of architectural height, only to be told that we don't apply standards, "we let the sources we cite do that." In the lead, currently, three sources in a row, all

3810:

Everyone says that the ESB has 102 floors. The 86th floor is the highest concrete floor in the building, while the interior of the mooring mast contains a long staircase & elevator shaft. The floors in the mast do exist but they're only metal grills. If you drop something it might fall all the

3728:

A series of recent edits modified the building's address from 350 Fifth Avenue, to 20 West 34th. In reviewing the source, as well as several others, I believe the 34th Street address is the observatory entrance only and not the building's official entrance or address. Tenants will still enter at

304:

You are quite correct about the previous discussions regarding the 103rd floor. My own view is that the floor is there and the floor count should be 103, otherwise the paragraph about the 103rd floor looks strange. The references describe the floor and what is was originally intended for. Regards,

3981:

If an American author is writing an article about a Danish soccer player who lives in and plays for a team in Spain? When if a British author adds more info the the article? These are different languages and countries, so if you're describing the colour of his hair do you spell the colour with or

3043:

I want to add more information about the Mohawk Ironworkers that are mentioned in the history/construction section. The two new paragraphs should follow: "The project involved more than 3,500 workers at its peak, including 3,439 on a single day, August 14, 1930. Many of the workers were Irish and

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over the floor count of the Empire State Building. There seemed to be interesting debate from both sides. When the building was erected, a disembarkation floor was built to tether airships to the spire. This is now commonly known as the 103rd floor. As of July 2015, the floor count is officially

194:

http://books.google.com/books?id=sAQOAAAAQAAJ&pg=PT30&lpg=PT30&dq=Elvita+Adams&source=bl&ots=Ap2kHjUeVa&sig=XgIS3PBjTRKa-w7ZJj5oMn5Jtzc&hl=en&ei=5E-kSpi7GZ6ntgeO9vHSDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2#v=onepage&q=Elvita%20Adams&f=false

763:

You're not going to get reliable info from the Empire State Reality Trust, as floor count inflation works wonders for marketing purposes. But I feel this article should be updated to reflect the facts. 1WTC and 2WTC were the first buildings to have over 100+ real floors, and Willis Tower is the

466:

What NinjaRobotPirate said. This is a no-brainer. Too many arguments break out from either/or approaches when the best one in situations like this is a very simple "and". "Some consider the ESB to have 102 floors, others that count the floor formerly used for disembarkation, arrive at 103".

3575:

This text "370 short tons (330 long tons) of steel" is clearly wrong as it contradicts a previous statement that the building was constructed with over 57,000 tons of steel and that the exterior includes 730 tons of aluminum and steel. The word 'tons' only occurs twice in the cited article and

2041:"The Empire State Inc. consortium became public in August 1929" - is there any way to highlight that this about the consortium becoming a publicly listed company? The first time I read this I initially assumed it was about them becoming publicly known/visible etc. (which might just be me...!) 172:

There has been at least one serious fire. And there was a potentially catastrophic incident when a lift-cable sheared, and the lift plummeted down to 200 feet. One safety system after another failed, until the final backup. By chance, there were no tourists on board, but there were two staff.

5285:

for details behind this fact shows it is repeated many times, however, what is never revealed (aside from it being said to have been used) is where it was actually put? Or how much was ordered? I like to think this is true but there is no hard evidence aside from saying it was used, which is

2359:

facts, but not the type of everyday calculations people use for buildings. I don't think a weight of 365,000 tons is going to help the ESB office building worker, but it's interesting for tourists and engineers. That's who these fact sheets are for. I can be wrong about this, though.

3161: 4545:

Should be: "The Empire State Building stood as the world's tallest building until the construction of the World Trade Center in 1970; following its collapse in the September 11, 2001 attacks, the Empire State Building was again the city's tallest skyscraper until 2012.

2764:"He killed one person and wounded six others, supposedly in response to events happening in Palestine and Israel, before committing suicide." - the reference only says that he asked people if they came from Egypt, and doesn't mention anything more about his motivation. 1889:

I'm about to put on hold; should be straightforward to get over the line for GA - nice work! If you're planning to take it onto FAC, let me know. I've some thoughts on the more specialist literature on skyscraper history that you might draw on to reinforce the article.

79:

Someone please fix. Really embarrassing. Ok I fixed some of it, cba to fix the rest. The sidebar trivia stuff comes up as first and foremost on a mobile search by the way. I was curious about how long it's been wrong, and it turns out it's been a month.

2203:"The steelworkers' sheer height enraptured onlookers" - I don't think this is quite right - the height of the steelworkers wouldn't have been much different from any other worker. "The sheer height at which the steelworkers operated enraptured onlookers"? 219: 1976:"beating out the Chrysler Building and 40 Wall Street," - "beating out"; I think this is an informal US English variant, but you could just say "beating the Chrysler..." and you'd have saved a word, and the style would appeal to non-US readers! ;) 4596:

I think that the caption "The building, tallest in New York, from 2001 to 2012, seen here in 2010" is confusing. Could it be changed to "The building, which was the tallest building in New York from 2001 to 2012, is seen here in 2010"? Thanks.

2677:"Meanwhile, BBC News' culture section referred to the building as an "icon of American design"." - rather than focus on the BBC News (who aren't particularly well known as architecture critics) I'd focus on the author, Jonathan Glancey, who is. 4129:"As of 2019, the building is the seventh-tallest building in New York City, the sixth-tallest completed skyscraper in the United States, and the 45th-tallest in the world. It is also the sixth-tallest freestanding structure in the Americas. " 3962:, which says we should use whatever national spellings are appropriate for the article subject. Both spellings are "correct" in certain contexts or nationalities (just like you will find either "color" or "colour" used in different articles). 3162:

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Michael_Elmes/publication/228687046_Resisting_in_High_Places_A_Study_of_First_Nation_Mohawk_Ironworkers/links/0912f5138becb7d3d8000000/Resisting-in-High-Places-A-Study-of-First-Nation-Mohawk-Ironworkers.pdf

2130:"half of the steel skeleton had been completed" - a thought... We're assuming here that the reader understands how a modern skyscraper works in terms of architectural support. Do we need to (briefly) explain the structural concept here? 5223:

top-level headers about notes and references. There was previously 1 top-level header for that topic, in addition to the 9 top-level headers for the rest of the article; these edits created two and three more, respectively. Footnotes

4634:

Even if it is, it's fine. I added the photo to the article to show the building under construction; if proven to be doctored at the time it only adds intrigue to the image, a historic artifact to show what was important at the time.

4789:

33rd and 34th Streets were 2 times districts and 60 and 100 feet wide. Fifth was a 1 and quarter times district and 100 feet wide. So it should be 10 and 10.416 average office floors for 33rd and 5th and 16.6667 on 34th.

4695:

In the first paragraph the article states "As of 2020, the building is the seventh-tallest building in New York City, the ninth-tallest completed skyscraper in the United States, the 48th-tallest in the world, and the

872:

And frankly it seems kind of dumb not to include something that so very, very obviously exists. Just because the average person isn't allowed in the White House Situation Room doesn't suggest that it doesn't exist. -

741:

The 86th floor is the highest concrete floor in the ESB, while the interior of the mooring mast contains a long staircase & elevator shaft. Floors 88 through 100 do not physically exist. Think of it as a mini

4216:

Please add the following to the History - 21st Century section "On 20th July 2014, The Empire State Building was awarded platinum level Wired Certification from WiredScore on account of its digital connectivity."

114:. The remainder are fixed. The article was vandalized on Oct. 2 by an editor (subsequently blocked) who added 100 or 300 feet to each of the height figures, which went uncorrected until now. Good catch; thanks. 816:, the floor above that is about 1224. If you stand on your toes maybe your eyeballs are at 1230. That's it. 20 feet short (1280 feet above sea level) You'd need a source to put something in the article though. 2505:"The 102nd floor observatory is completely enclosed and much smaller than the first one." - if the first one is the 86th, I think you could lose the last four words - the comparator is already pretty clear. 5247:

Agreed that sources, bibliography, and notes are generally placed as subsections of the "References" section on Knowledge, and should be here, while "Further reading" should be placed outside that section.

1139: 2114:"According to historian John Tauranac," - minor, but I know many editors would prefer "According to the historian John Tauranac", as it isn't a formal title. Doesn't bother me, but might come up at FA. 4306:, The building glare a red light for intended to thank emergency workers and people on New York were anxiety and panic when the glaring light appears thinking that the country might be in emergency." 2446:"a work consisting of "15,000 stars and 5,000 circles" superimposed " - I don't think you need the quote marks around this bit (it isn't a creative phrase, and I can't see how it could be rephrased). 750:

I've visited the ESB in person multiple times. When the mooring mast's elevator malfunctioned, visitors got redirected to the stairs, which made it apparent there weren't actual floors in that mast.

4917: 2734:"(equivalent to $ 644,878,000 in 2016)." - You're using the CPI here, which isn't appropriate for skyscrapers. You'll need to reset the US tag to US-NGDPPC, which will give a more accurate result. 420:

If reliable sources disagree, our article should say so - and explain what the disagreement is about. We don't take a vote to ignore legitimate sources just because they contradict other sources.

4838: 4547: 1968:"The Empire State Building, as it was then dubbed, " - the "as it was then dubbed" doesn't quite work as written (it could mean several things); I'd recommend losing the "as it was then dubbed". 5152:

the final specifications of the building, the corridor is surrounded in turn by office space 28 feet (8.5 m) deep, maximizing office space at a time before air conditioning became commonplace.

3576:

neither has this weight of steel attached to it. This claim should be stricken. If the weight of steel is required then perhaps the previous value from earlier in the article should be used?

851:

Previously discussed (see both archives & section above). Statement in lede, with its explanatory note 2, is per editorial consensus. The ambiguity was recognized and has been dealt with.

697:

features one of Santa's elves who learns of his true identity as a human and travels from the North Pole to New York City to meet his biological father, who works at the Empire State Building.

4009:

to take sides (neither a preference overall, nor an allowance for switching once an article exists) for articles that do not have national ties. See that ENGVAR link for the full guideline.

3709: 2855:

I trimmed the "Site" section to 2 paragraphs. The Waldorf-Astoria part is important for the backstory of the Empire State Building. Not sure about the previous land-ownership part, though.

4400:

reference to help us see the significance of this coincidence. Humans are primed to see patterns that are coincidences, but "fun facts trivia" aren't really in scope for an encyclopedia.

4616:

This photo is in the article: File:Zeppelin bij Empire State Building in aanbouw - Zeppelin near the Empire State Building under construction (6943970242).jpg. From Netherlands archive.

5397:

Really? It seemed to have received a substantial media blowup, and it seems appropriate. (I’d add it to the NFL playoff article expect they don’t seem to have an “aftermath” section. --

2529:"The building would also be lit in the colors..." - unclear why this is in the conditional ("The building is also lit in the colors..."? Or "was also lit" if they've stopped doing it?) 1085: 4331:. It's difficult to even decipher what you mean exactly. However, this is just a facet of the current domination of the news cycle and doesn't really belong in the article anyway. – 2620:"Time magazine called the building a way that "you know that you’re in New York City"" - the structure implies this was when it was first built - worth adding the date for the quote 4428: 3327:

When I use inflation calculators, I end up receiving a different value for the inflation adjusted price of the empire state building, usually in the ballpark of $ 500-600 million.

1792: 4837:

North Tower was 1,368 feet/417 meters high as is the new 1 World Trade Center minus its 408 feet antenna/tower. Otherwise, 1 WTC/'Freedom Tower' is symbolically 1,776 feet high.

3764: 3108:). However, Mohawk people from Kahnawà:ke have historically “Insisted on being and acting as peoples who belong to an autonomous nation that is not the United States or Canada” 2545:"Despite the damage and loss of life, the building was open for business on many floors on the following Monday, two days later" - you could lose the "on the following Monday" 3760: 2111:"the Metropolitan Life Insurance Company loaned Empire State Inc. some $ 27.5 million so the group could start construction" - "some" sounded odd; "around"? "approximately"? 808:

as elevator/broadcasting equipment/roof access penthouses don't count (observation deck is an acceptable use) Note that the 1250 feet in the elevator is the height of the

4798:) 05:37, 14 March 2021 (UTC) Or 10 and 16 in whole numbers, maybe 17 if you make them a few inches short. Or 12 and 20 if you make them average residential floor height. 4160:

There is no inconsistency. It's still the sixth tallest completed building in the US. Central Park Tower, 111 West 57th, and One Vanderbilt are still under construction.

3331:

The above site puts the inflation figure at 1377.1% when comparing 1930 prices to 2016 prices, which would put the value of the empire state building at $ 600 million.

1140:

https://web.archive.org/web/20111216191932/http://www.greenbuildingsnyc.com/2011/07/18/reds-go-green-chinese-communist-party-newspaper-signs-empire-state-building-lease/

4091:

That section is only a very brief overview, and I don't think this is significant enough for inclusion in that overview. I see you've already added this information to

4433:

Maybe it is only unclear to me, but it may be worth a mention, or at least a discussion here if there are people more invested and knowlegeble in the subject than me.

2076:"Chrysler's original roof from a stubby Romanesque dome to the narrow steel spire" - we haven't mentioned the spire before, so would advise "to a narrow steel spire" 2262:"By this time, the Empire State had been fully leased "for several years", with a "waiting list" to lease space in the building." - unclear who is being quoted here 1825: 754: 1119: 3402: 3398: 3384: 3269: 3265: 3251: 1527: 1523: 1509: 1417: 1413: 1399: 1301: 1297: 1283: 1191: 1187: 1173: 581: 577: 563: 1143: 196:. This seems to be a grammar book. Not sure if that link was originally to a different book. We need to either find the original book or remove that reference. 2238:"(Technically, it was possible to build a tower of up to 2,000 feet (610 m)," - would "it was believed possible" be better, since no-one had actually done so? 2497:"Eleven television stations and 22 FM stations " - MOS would ask that the comparison numbers are in a consistent style (11 and 22, or eleven and twenty-two). 1815: 2214:

Alfred E. Smith. He was described in the first paragraph of "Planning Process". I just changed all the mentions to "Al Smith" since that's his common name.

2708:(a) it provides references to all sources of information in the section(s) dedicated to the attribution of these sources according to the guide to layout; 1904:

Thanks for finishing this review. I should get through these over the next week, but since it's Christmas, I might need some time to fix all those issues.

1495: 865:

Thanks for responding. I've checked the archived RfC as well as the disucssions from previous concerns regarding the matter. The result of the RfC is that

406:. So, why not just say "102 or 103 floors" and include an explanatory footnote? Obviously, some high quality sources disagree with "skyscraperpage.com". 374:

is indeed confusing and needs to be rewritten to indicate that the 103rd "floor" is not generally included in the floor count, and the reason(s) for that.

2088:

not being in demand (although I could imagine, say, the price of gold, silver or platinum being relatively low); has the phrase captured this correctly?

1797: 1385: 3105: 1086:

https://web.archive.org/web/20101019094149/http://travel.nytimes.com/travel/guides/north-america/united-states/new-york/new-york-city/attractions.html

2122:"Swedish black granite, terracotta, and brick" - I was wondering if this paragraph was underlinked? COuld be useful to link some of these materials. 5361: 4982: 4092: 2561:"The unidentified twin-engine plane had scraped past the observation deck" - you don't need the pluperfect here, and could therefore lose the "had" 4697: 4429:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-worldtradecenter-newyork/empire-state-building-about-to-lose-status-as-tallest-in-nyc-idUSBRE83N1FZ20120424

3927:

As this is an article about an American topic, Knowledge uses American spelling - "stories." An article on a British subject would use "storeys."

3516: 2537:"The building's owners adhere to strict standards in using the lights; for instance, they would not use the lights to play advertisements" -ditto 3370: 5360:

Can someone add, under the light show section, about the controversy about showing Eagles colors after their win the AFC champsionshop? Source:

759:

The 86-102 elevator itself does not show floor numbers, but rather the number of feet above street level, from 1050' to 1250' in 25' increments.

715:

Thanks for the suggestion, but this seems like a trivial passing reference to the building. We don't need to list every film or book that even

448:

I can't believe we need an RfC for this. Wholly support NinjaRobotPirate's comments above. 102 or 103 with a relevant footnote and explanation.

3137: 2352:"Official fact sheets cite building statistics thusly" - do we have reason to suspect the fact sheets? If not, we could just state it as fact. 1129: 1089: 5287: 2925:

File:New York Bldg. Height Comparison.svg needs a source for the heights (either added to the file itself, or as a citation in the article).

2690:

See also section - worth checking that you're not repeating links here that have been used above - the first one certainly has, for example.

1995:" has been featured in dozens of TV shows and movies" - "dozens" can mean almost any number, from 12 to 100 really; can we be more specific? 1159: 370:

major and respected, do just that. And they all say 102 stories. If a consensus is needed, that certainly looks like one to me. The section

3591:

I have fixed it. This was a typo (source does say 730 tons, rather than 370), compounded by a lack of clarity. Thanks for bringing this up.

2521:"As of October 2017, tickets are $ 42 for adults, $ 32 for children, and $ 36 for senior citizens" - perhaps a little too much detail here? 5197: 4598: 4578: 4307: 4145: 3792: 3648: 3519: 2211:"Al Smith shot the final rivet, which was made of solid gold." - who's Al Smith? (he's in the infobox, but not described in the main text) 366: 203: 59: 3787:

It should be pointed out that the height of the Empire State Building of 1,250 feet is converted to 417 yards high. 'Coincidentally', the

3729:

350 Fifth. In support of this proposition: 1) Empire State Realty Trust, which owns the building, still shows the address at 350 Fifth.

637:

The official death count during construction is 5, but I've read in a few sources the actual number is 20-30. Are there any good sources?

4362: 2317:"create an excess of rentable space" - would "a glut of rentable space" read better? ("an excess" read oddly here, but might just be me) 1693: 5306: 4340: 4251: 3841: 1979:

Done. I never really realized that "beating out" was redundant. After all, the builders were quite literally competing with each other.

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The link for citation 42 is broken and needs to be fixed. The correct link cannot be easily found and a new citation is likely needed.

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Page says "The Empire State Building stood as the world's tallest building until the construction of the World Trade Center in 1970;

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

1703:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

1505:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

1395:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

1279:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

1169:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

89: 4303: 2044:

Clarified - I think what you read was actually correct. The building does trade under NYSE, but that's not what I meant initially.

403: 218:

What is the date of that revision? The reference in question does not seem to be anywhere in the article now. However, here's an

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http://www.interestingamerica.com/images/NY_images/Manhattan/Empire_State_Building/Empire_State_Building_Mooring_Mast_412_426.jpg

2992:

I have fixed almost all the issues you outlined above. I have concerns about the "fact sheets" thing so I haven't fixed it yet.

2686:(b) it complies with the manual of style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation. 1269: 1120:

https://web.archive.org/web/20121020012447/http://www.airchina.com.cn/www/en/html/index/customer_service/worldwide_offices/1071/

5470: 5181: 5095: 4803: 4795: 3861: 3820: 3203: 1820: 821: 4068:

The 1767-piece LEGO Architecture Set, Empire State Building (Set Number 21046) is a model of this building, released in 2019.

2153:"with several orders placed within an hour of a plan's being finalized" - "a plan being finalized" or "plans being finalized" 1144:

http://www.greenbuildingsnyc.com/2011/07/18/reds-go-green-chinese-communist-party-newspaper-signs-empire-state-building-lease/

3493:

I have fixed it. The $ 550 million building renovation is mentioned twice in the article. I must have misread it originally.

1864: 1843: 3815:

The 87th is solid because it's the roof of the 86th. All the 80s might be solid, indoor observatory might be 102 after all.

2917:

File:Waldorf Hotel 1893.jpg needs a publication date (i.e. when/where was it originally published?) to justify the US tag.

2470:"this would cause waves from the Empire State Building" - "this caused waves"? (don't think you need the conditional here) 279:

Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

2084:"the granite, precious metals, and wood chips used in the old hotel were not in high demand" - I found it hard to imagine 490:

Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

5460: 5286:

frustrating. Are there any Empire State manifests that could show the ordering details for the building's construction?

5196:

There are two references to 42 deaths. Do both claim the 42 is wrong? Can someone provide copies of the relevant pages?

4916:

The U.S.S. Los Angeles or the ZR-3 was a rigid airship built by the Zeppelin company in Germany it was NOT a blimp.....

4452: 3445: 3312: 2462:"when the FCC ordered the exclusive deal broken" - "to be broken"? I wasn't certain you could "order something broken"? 1745: 1621:

Under the ownership section the word "building" is misspelled as "buildign" it should be fixed to be spelled correctly.

1570: 1496:

https://web.archive.org/web/20101104192053/http://www.nbm.org/exhibitions-collections/exhibitions/lego-architecture.html

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this building, or we'd have a gigantic list of neglibible value. The whole pop culture section is in need of cleanup.

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Empire State Building 417 yards high & 1 World Trade Center 417 meters high Encodes Jesus Birthday of 4/17 (6 BC)

3172:

Simpson, Audra. Mohawk Interruptus: Political Life Across the Border of Settler States. 2014. Duke University Press.

2913:(a) images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content; 4377:

This article should include the Empire State Building's height in yards: 417 (416.66). 'Coincidentally', the former

2408:"one-story tall, similarly-designed rectangular-shaped corridor" - I wasn't sure what it was similarly-designed to. 1386:

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20120422101650/http://stoneorchardsoftware.com/pdf/publications/pub_12.pdf

5466: 5177: 5091: 4799: 4791: 3857: 3816: 2230:"while nearby hotels also released ads that lauded their proximity" - would avoid informal contractions like "ads" 2060:"The group also purchased nearby land plots so they would" - you could easily lose the "plots" here for smoothness 817: 411: 334: 263: 47: 38: 17: 4542:

in the September 11, 2001 attacks, the Empire State Building was again the city's tallest skyscraper until 2012."

4425:

source (at least i regard reuters as a good one) suggenting the final year to be 1972 opposed to wikipedias 1970.

3856:

That may have been the 1930s. It'd be inconvenient to have to climb a ladder to change some of those light bulbs.

5362:

https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/empire-state-building-lights-eagles-green-colors-fans-reaction-new-york-super-bowl

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While that's true, I don't know why this fact should be prioritized over anything else. The article already says

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Nope. This is so stupid. Who cares? A one-night color change in support of the wrong team in a sports game. So?

3401:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

3268:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

1526:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

1499: 1416:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

1300:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

1190:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

580:

to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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https://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC1TKDD_from-storeton-to-new-york?guid=bbd37570-eba2-466b-8b14-ef19338ad7ad

1149: 878: 841: 769: 5305:" ... mechanically operated ... "? Aren't all elevators in bldgs? Should the wordage be 'manually operated'? 5201: 4602: 4582: 4149: 3652: 3523: 3371:

https://web.archive.org/web/20171026054240/http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/the-8th-world-wonder/

2612:"the Empire State Building was immediately an icon of the city " - "immediately became" might be more natural 869:

floor counts should be included int he Lede, and not as a note. I'd suggest an edit to include the difference.

207: 3845: 2161:"Hine's images provided much fodder for the media" - "fodder" felt a bit informal in an encyclopedia article 893: 705: 5453: 5335: 5310: 5121: 5042: 4891: 4852:

You're going to need to provide a source to indicate that it was done on purpose, not by sheer coincidence.

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https://search.proquest.com/openview/a83c4b5ede420255da3ec2553dacae43/1?pq-origsite=gscholar&cbl=1821393

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Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.

2715:"from an airplane up to 100 miles (160 km) away" - is still accurate? (planes now fly higher than in 1930?) 1736: 1685: 1596: 1561: 1487: 1451: 1371: 1335: 1261: 1225: 1065: 921: 667: 453: 289:

listed on the Knowledge page as 102 floors and there is a separate paragraph explaining what is above that.

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3237: 1130:

https://web.archive.org/web/20081014005752/http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3601/is_71_50/ai_n6149482

1090:

http://travel.nytimes.com/travel/guides/north-america/united-states/new-york/new-york-city/attractions.html

252:, seeing as reliable sources seem to disagree, we should include both floor counts. Closing per request at 4707: 4625: 4073: 3515:

The building is partially clad in stone from the Wirral opposite Liverpool. This needs to be mentioned.

3358: 3225: 2478:"The stations' placement in the Empire State Building was considered "problematic" " - considered by who? 2336:"The investment has been described as “an unusual move for a sovereign wealth fund”" - described by whom? 1839: 1681: 1160:

https://web.archive.org/web/20120524040642/http://skyscrapercenter.com/new-york-city/empire-state-building

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Would the cost of construction fit more naturally in the construction section, rather than architecture?

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