313:
88:
64:
301:
33:
150:
225:
198:
353:
235:
162:
527:
with the 1904 date. That's because one of them obtained the last attachment, the record of
Roberts' baptism in Crofton All Saints Parish Church (and everyone agrees he was born in Crofton). Luckily, although the baptism register only required the date of the baptism, they also recorded the birth date in the left margin. Bingo, 27-6-04
98:
586:. Although GoS is technically self-published, I have always found it to be reliable and have cited it in the past, and I believe the above demonstrates a level of research that equals any published source. However, as this goes against a current published source, I wanted to make sure there were no objections.
442:
to put the work into verifying those claims). I have removed it for those reasons, and also because it doesn't fit with what the 2012 edition of the Joyce book states (the citation previously was for the 2004 edition so this has probably been updated). The new date is a different 1906 one. Obviously,
526:
I've an awful lot of for
Roberts - probably 50 and more from 2012 to early 2015, all on the subject of his DoB. Most were a dialogue with two Leeds expert historians (Michael Joyce was kept in touch too), and with the help of these Evening Herald clippings and work that they did, we are very happy
619:
When I wrote the thing in the first place it was clear that Joyce (2004) had to be wrong, so I went with GoS's (then) 1906. The new information makes it clear that that was wrong as well, and there's no problem with the reliability of sourcing (IMO) given the stature of the people you've been in
443:
this is also at odds with the 1904 GoS date. I've always found GoS to be a great source of information, but ultimately it is self-published, so I would always favour a published source unless there are good reasons not to. I've sent GoS an e-mail for clarification though.
514:
I am 100% convinced that both are wrong, and that's because of the first three attachments, which show beyond doubt that he died on 18 May 1968, so he could not have been Joyce's
Bramley or Bromley. It also says he was 63, which places his DoB between May 1904 and May
388:
491:
FreeBMD (also
Ancestry etc) shows just one Henry Bramley, registered in Sheffield in 1906 and died in Sheffield in 1978 (with DoB of 18/6/06). It also shows just one Henry Bromley, registered in Wakefield in 1906 and died in Leeds in 1977 (with a DoB of
703:
658:
180:
503:
So it looks like the
Wakefield registration has led Michael Joyce to change to Henry Bromley rather than Henry Bramley, although why he thought that either of these was our man, I don't know.
653:
688:
331:
326:
208:
693:
683:
175:
74:
465:
I've spoken with the guy that runs GoS and based on that information, I don't now think that Joyce is correct. I've reproduced the key bits of our conversation below:
663:
678:
291:
281:
668:
116:
698:
648:
673:
583:
469:
The 2004 edition says he was Henry
Bramley Roberts (not true), born in Crofton (true) on 27/6/1902 (not true) and died in 1963 (not true).
120:
257:
124:
115:, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Knowledge's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to
426:
The editor that wrote the note doesn't appear to be editing anymore, so it's difficult to confirm what research went into that (
111:
69:
248:
203:
369:
44:
240:
405:
365:
480:
A couple of things have changed . Bramley has become
Bromley and his DoB has changed from 27/6/02 to 12/5/06.
318:
32:
17:
50:
629:
599:
456:
417:
253:
256:
on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
625:
439:
103:
376:
429:
413:
642:
621:
593:
450:
167:
435:
573:
reference proves that Joyce can't be right as it specifically says that he was 63.
149:
87:
63:
308:
300:
230:
157:
93:
409:
614:
588:
582:
I am proposing that the details be changed and that the page be moved to
445:
234:
224:
197:
380:
423:
I have changed this, citing it to Joyce 2012, and removed the note.
123:. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the
347:
26:
351:
299:
148:
434:). I'm not sure it was appropriate (one might consider it
704:
Knowledge requested images of association football people
620:
touch with. Thank you so much for doing this. cheers,
659:
Low-importance biography (sports and games) articles
252:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
654:Stub-Class biography (sports and games) articles
8:
689:Low-importance football in England articles
192:
58:
30:
18:Talk:Harry Roberts (footballer, born 1906)
408:he was born in 1904 and died in 1968. --
379:may be able to locate suitable images on
694:Football in England task force articles
684:Stub-Class football in England articles
194:
60:
584:Harry Roberts (footballer, born 1904)
7:
664:Sports and games work group articles
246:This article is within the scope of
109:This article is within the scope of
49:It is of interest to the following
541:"Death of Former Argyle Captain".
537:The attachments he refers to are:
25:
679:Low-importance football articles
311:
233:
223:
196:
160:
96:
86:
62:
31:
327:the English football task force
286:This article has been rated as
176:the sports and games work group
133:Knowledge:WikiProject Biography
669:WikiProject Biography articles
266:Knowledge:WikiProject Football
136:Template:WikiProject Biography
1:
699:WikiProject Football articles
649:Stub-Class biography articles
457:19:16, 26 December 2017 (UTC)
418:11:16, 18 December 2017 (UTC)
324:This article is supported by
269:Template:WikiProject Football
260:and see a list of open tasks.
173:This article is supported by
674:Stub-Class football articles
121:contribute to the discussion
630:07:22, 5 January 2018 (UTC)
600:05:10, 5 January 2018 (UTC)
241:Association football portal
720:
569:As pointed out above, the
438:, and it also expects the
292:project's importance scale
307:
285:
218:
156:
81:
57:
554:. Plymouth. 20 May 1968.
545:. Plymouth. 18 May 1968.
360:It is requested that a
319:English football portal
356:
304:
153:
39:This article is rated
355:
303:
152:
112:WikiProject Biography
383:and other web sites.
254:Association football
249:WikiProject Football
377:WordPress Openverse
370:improve its quality
368:in this article to
375:The external tool
357:
305:
154:
139:biography articles
45:content assessment
436:original research
397:
396:
384:
346:
345:
342:
341:
338:
337:
272:football articles
191:
190:
187:
186:
16:(Redirected from
711:
618:
598:
596:
591:
555:
546:
455:
453:
448:
433:
393:
391:
374:
354:
348:
321:
316:
315:
314:
274:
273:
270:
267:
264:
243:
238:
237:
227:
220:
219:
214:
211:
200:
193:
170:
165:
164:
163:
141:
140:
137:
134:
131:
117:join the project
106:
104:Biography portal
101:
100:
99:
90:
83:
82:
77:
75:Sports and Games
66:
59:
42:
36:
35:
27:
21:
719:
718:
714:
713:
712:
710:
709:
708:
639:
638:
612:
594:
589:
587:
549:
540:
451:
446:
444:
427:
406:first reference
402:
389:
387:
352:
317:
312:
310:
271:
268:
265:
262:
261:
239:
232:
212:
206:
166:
161:
159:
138:
135:
132:
129:
128:
102:
97:
95:
72:
43:on Knowledge's
40:
23:
22:
15:
12:
11:
5:
717:
715:
707:
706:
701:
696:
691:
686:
681:
676:
671:
666:
661:
656:
651:
641:
640:
637:
636:
635:
634:
633:
632:
605:
604:
603:
602:
577:
576:
575:
574:
571:Evening Herald
564:
563:
562:
561:
560:
559:
558:Baptism record
556:
552:Evening Herald
547:
543:Evening Herald
532:
531:
530:
529:
520:
519:
518:
517:
508:
507:
506:
505:
497:
496:
495:
494:
485:
484:
483:
482:
474:
473:
472:
471:
466:
460:
459:
430:pinging anyway
424:
401:
398:
395:
394:
385:
373:
358:
344:
343:
340:
339:
336:
335:
332:Low-importance
323:
322:
306:
296:
295:
288:Low-importance
284:
278:
277:
275:
258:the discussion
245:
244:
228:
216:
215:
213:Low‑importance
201:
189:
188:
185:
184:
181:Low-importance
172:
171:
155:
145:
144:
142:
108:
107:
91:
79:
78:
67:
55:
54:
48:
37:
24:
14:
13:
10:
9:
6:
4:
3:
2:
716:
705:
702:
700:
697:
695:
692:
690:
687:
685:
682:
680:
677:
675:
672:
670:
667:
665:
662:
660:
657:
655:
652:
650:
647:
646:
644:
631:
627:
623:
616:
611:
610:
609:
608:
607:
606:
601:
597:
592:
585:
581:
580:
579:
578:
572:
568:
567:
566:
565:
557:
553:
548:
544:
539:
538:
536:
535:
534:
533:
528:
524:
523:
522:
521:
516:
512:
511:
510:
509:
504:
501:
500:
499:
498:
493:
489:
488:
487:
486:
481:
478:
477:
476:
475:
470:
467:
464:
463:
462:
461:
458:
454:
449:
441:
437:
431:
425:
422:
421:
420:
419:
415:
411:
407:
399:
392:
386:
382:
378:
371:
367:
363:
359:
350:
349:
333:
330:(assessed as
329:
328:
320:
309:
302:
298:
297:
293:
289:
283:
280:
279:
276:
259:
255:
251:
250:
242:
236:
231:
229:
226:
222:
221:
217:
210:
205:
202:
199:
195:
182:
179:(assessed as
178:
177:
169:
168:Sports portal
158:
151:
147:
146:
143:
126:
125:documentation
122:
118:
114:
113:
105:
94:
92:
89:
85:
84:
80:
76:
71:
68:
65:
61:
56:
52:
46:
38:
34:
29:
28:
19:
570:
551:
542:
525:
513:
502:
490:
479:
468:
403:
361:
325:
287:
247:
174:
110:
51:WikiProjects
643:Categories
550:"Deaths".
362:photograph
41:Stub-class
492:12/5/06).
130:Biography
70:Biography
622:Struway2
366:included
263:Football
204:Football
404:Due to
290:on the
209:England
595:(talk)
452:(talk)
440:reader
390:Upload
381:Flickr
47:scale.
515:1905.
626:talk
414:talk
410:Jesi
400:Data
119:and
615:Nzd
590:Nzd
447:Nzd
372:.
364:be
282:Low
645::
628:)
416:)
334:).
207::
183:).
73::
624:(
617::
613:@
432::
428:@
412:(
294:.
127:.
53::
20:)
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.