484:- I agree with Hrafn. There are not three articles here. There does seem to be one article with multiple parts describing multiple variations or subsets of this type of counseling. Since "Pastoral counseling" seems to me to be the most general, that would be the title I prefer. (As Timmillr noted, Nouthetic/Biblical Counseling does seem to be a subset of pastoral counseling.) In response to 199.212.150.5, I don't think we have to view the word "Pastoral" as meaning the counseling is being done by an ordained pastor. I would argue that anyone doing "Biblical counseling", "Nouthetic counseling", or "Christian counseling" is doing something "pastoral" in the colloquial sense of the word (which is what WP should use, not whatever definition of "pastoral" 199.212.150.5 might subscribe to for theological reasons) . Any theological, professional, or other distinctions can be addressed in the article. If the article gets too long and covers too much with sources, etc. (obviously not the problem now), it can be split as discussed at
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I would disagree with the proposed merge. As a woman I cannot be a pastoral counselor, but I can certainly be a nouthetic counselor. The Bible speaks of all believers who are walking with the Lord as being 'able to admonish' or competent to counsel. Let's not narrow the category to 'Pastoral' rather
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The article states "Most pastoral counselors hold secular counseling credentials, as opposed to many
Christian Counselors." This statement would not be verifiable, because it is not true. The statement is likely made from a position of bias against Christian Counseling. In most states, there are
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And while I am a student of
Nouthetic counseling and believe it to be unique, it is still a form of Pastoral counseling. I also believe that, only those familiar with Nouthetic counseling will search for it on Knowledge, while those unfamiliar with it will benefit from its presence under Pastoral
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laws governing psychotherapy, and for someone to provide mental health services they must have secular counseling credentials. Pastoral
Counselors are not required to be licensed psychotherapists, so unlike Christian counselors, they do not need secular credentials.
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article defines the subject by saying, "What distinguishes pastoral counseling from other forms of counseling and psychotherapy is the role and accountability of the counselor and his or her understanding and expression of the pastoral relationship." A proponent of
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Why can't a women be a "pastoral counselor"? Many denominations allow women "ministers, rabbis, priests", let alone "other persons", so there would appear to be no hard and fast restriction. And if you disagree with "Pastoral counseling" as the
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would argue that not all
Christian Counseling is Biblical Counseling. Biblical Counseling is the broad grouping of those that counsel with the Bible. Though the extent that one uses the Bible in their counseling and whether integrated with
361:& Nouthetic counseling in the context of Pastoral counseling. Of course care needs to be taken in differentiating between subtypes (and subtypes from wider categories), but I think this task is better performed
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for a brief overview of the differences. However, (and this may be what you're getting at) Nouthetic/Biblical counseling could be made a subset within
Pastoral Counseling. Timmillr 13:42, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
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is a predominantly
Christian term and right off the go in this article we see that rabbis, imams, and other religious leaders are included in this.) This article clearly cannot be merged with
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I would agree 100 percent that
Nouthetic counseling is part of Pastoral counseling. Jay Adams himself says that "a Christian minister is counselor and preacher, par excellence."
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If that's true, then it should be taken out. I am not very knowledgeable of this field, but I tried to incorporate what you said in the main article. Edit at accurate will.
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https://web.archive.org/web/20110615050135/http://www.counselormagazine.com/feature-articles-mainmenu-63/30-spirituality/73-counselors-and-clergy-partners-in-healing
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counseling. In this way, users will have a chance for themselves to evalute and compare the different forms of counseling. Timmillr 13:21, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
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The reason I would oppose this is that
Nouthetic/Biblical Counseling does not condone psychology or its usage within the church. View
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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to "Spiritual
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would totally disagree with this, so the point of it not fitting the definition of "pastoral counseling."
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540:- Good point. What about merging Biblical counseling (which seems to be strictly Christian as used) into
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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be merged here. Both are very short (particularly if the former is shorn of its excessive
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coverage here to support multiple articles. Would you prefer Nouthetic Counseling to be
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since it's inclusive of other religions and for the same reason it wouldn't fit with
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or not will determine if it is of a general Christian nature or Nouthetic nature.
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of the range of counseling techniques, rather than in isolation.
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