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source for the abundances of 1H and 2H. However in the table List of isotopes, the column decay mode has footnotes which refer to another
Reference 12 in a list just below the table, which is a source for the very short-lived isotopes 6H and 7H. I suspect that 76.24.24.247 may have found that "Reference 12" and wondered why it did not refer to 1H and 2H.
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Yostosecond (ys) will be an unfamiliar unit to most people and should have a verbose note to make clear the usage (especially as some people might mistake it to mean years). Can someone please add this since this is coming from a template? If this can be done in the template, it will fix the usage
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of the article. Therefor it cannot be expected to be complete, precise, or detailed. Incidentally, I cannot find easily what abundance is intended. So the number change you propose may or may not be appropriate. Sure this is worth reseach, and documentation (same for place of this abundance: crust,
604:
I think this editor (and other readers?) may have confused the list of references below the table List of isotopes with the list of references at the end of the article. For 1H and 2H the footnote 12 is supposed to indicate
Reference 12 at the end of the article, which is correct as it is indeed a
286:
section however, the abundances are given as 99.99% and 0.01% (when rounded correctly). There are at least two possible explanations for the apparent inconsistency: (1) Rounding error in the overview table or (2) The overview table gives abundance in terms of mass while the other table gives is as
759:
I do not consider the issue closed at all, and I was very confused for a few moments there when I found the half-life of tritium given in "y" and those of the other isotopes in "ys". Even though the article from which the figures are taken uses the "y" abbreviation to mean "year," the
Knowledge
608:
Is there a way to eliminate this source of possible confusion? Perhaps there should only be one list of references in the article, and the references for the table should just be included in the general list at the end of the article, where they would have their own numbers?
358:
Thanks for pointing this out. In order to initially narrow down the issue: Am I assuming correctly that what is meant in the "abundance" column of the overview section is mole fraction and not mass fraction? If so, we could start by correcting the values to 99.99% and 0.01%,
409:
task. I did not find which
ComplexRational suggestion you mention. As internet and WP go: there is a link provided to the isotope article and of course there is the article itself from where this data is pulled. I strongly conclude against adding uncertainty to this
313:. The problem is that 3 s.f. is not enough precision (it would round to 100% and 0%, which is not exactly an ideal way to present the information) and 4 s.f. is too much (the range of variation is within that), so I wonder what the best way to explain it should be.
419:, and the 'Range of variation'. First, they are not 'Error ranges' as you name them, they are ranges of occurrence. (As in: different sources of material, eg seawater and rocks, can have different isotope proportions). And if I understand this math well, there is
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So I think our isotopes tables should all be consistent with each other as a primary objective, and it seems like "y" is the current site-wide standard both in this specific use-case and per a MOS that has consensus well beyond just chemistry-article editors.
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poisson spread or sigma involved: one must assume that within the range, each value can appear equally, and to there is no 'mid-value' (as there is with common sigma-error-uncertainty). With this math, I am not sure if they must be complementary over the two
334:
Do we know exactly what the uncertainty is? I think it's okay to include it and give the percentages as a ± b, since any additional significant figures are uncertain but we might know how uncertain. We do the same thing for isotopic mass and half-life.
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article for "year" says "The symbol 'a' is more common in scientific literature". Given that, I would suggest never ever using the abbreviation "y" when talking about science matters, but especially not here, where "y" appears to mean "yocto"
779:
That's an important point, but "ys" is a metric-prefixed "s", not a variant of "y", in the same way that "as" is not a variant of "a" (annum). Unfortunately the metric-prefixes and unit-suffixes are not disjoint sets of letters.
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In a similar vein as with
Yostosecond/ys, I think it would be useful to have some sort of explanation for using a parenthetical for measurement uncertainty. I am unsure how best to do this; I suspect linking to
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The article seems to be either inconsistent or at least confusing about what sort of abundance of protium vs. deuterium is meant. The overview table contains values of 99.98% and 0.02%, respectively. In the
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section. Error ranges in the "Normal proportion" and "Range of variation" column do not fully match (this cannot be due to correct rounding because both bounds are off in the same direction).
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Anyway, it is not a matter for us to "fix" this 'inconsistency'. We should not change numbers by ourselves. Our task is: check the source(s), both for values and for their meaning. -
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would be sufficient. For reference, despite having a background in engineering, I don't recall ever seeing this notation before and had to dig around to figure out what it was.
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I agree that this would be helpful, though only for very uncommon abbreviations (shorter than nanoseconds). The alternative would be to use the exponent parameter in
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405:(119). As for adding uncertainties to this infobox: not needed, as it is secondary info at best (secondary to the value) and so not needed for the
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About CR, & noting uncertainty: not in the infobox (too much detail); as for the #List: only when in source (NUBASE, AME). To much OR. -
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Thanks for improving accuracy by pointing out the difference between experimental error and actual spread in this case. I totally agree.
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In a second step we could then contemplate about how to best represent uncertainties, perhaps by implementing the solution suggested by
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mole fraction. I'm not an expert in the field, so I'm hesitating to edit myself in fear of messing things up. Can someone help? --
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interval notation. I don't know yet how this would translate to the spreads here; sure the statiscical background may be alike.
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About the spread & statistics math: working with standarde atomic weights (IUPAC/CIAAW), I found this IUPAC paper on
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We could surely just solve this by using plain seconds and scientific notation rather than yoctoseconds, though.
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reports the mole fraction to have the same values as shown in the verbose table of the WP article. However, the
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The current extended values (in the #List) I could not find in AME2013 nor in NUBASE2016. (from NUBASE2003?
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Thanks, that ought to do it. And as for the math lines, there's already an explanatory note distinguishing
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First of all, my post sounded too pedantic (sad face icon here), sorry for that (open hand icon here).
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The reference numbers for the abundances of 1H and 2H in the table of isotopes are incorrect --
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Thank you, the link to ys should be sufficiently explicit. I think this issue is closed.
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Possolo, Antonio; van der Veen, Adriaan M.H.; Meija, Juris; et al. (4 Jan 2018).
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on
Knowledge. Please participate by editing this article, or visit the
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decay list as is (do we link in a math line anyway?). -
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