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promotionally written. Rather the issue is that one of the company's co-founders created an article on
Knowledge that lacked coverage to show where the service/company is notable. It's possible that DGG may restore the article, especially after you posted potential sourcing on his userpage, but at the same time you still need to understand how you directly editing an article about your business is seen as a conflict of interest. You make your living through start.me and having a page on Knowledge can raise the company's visibility, which means that you stand to earn more money by having an article on here. That's the definition of a conflict of interest on Knowledge. As far as you being an expert in the field, if you were to edit articles on the general topic then that wouldn't be a bad thing as long as you do not insert mentions of your company/service into other articles, do not try to insert your own writings into Knowledge except for very specific circumstances, and do not write disparaging things about competitors. In other words, you can edit on related topics as long as it's not promotional or can be seen as an attack. However being an expert in the field does not automatically mean that things that you write would show notability for start.me - these writings would be seen as
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336:, which means that they were sources released by the company. These sources will never be able to establish notability on Knowledge, which was why the article was deleted. In order to establish notability in an article you need to show where the company/service (since this is a service offered via a company) has received coverage in independent and reliable sources. You listed some of these
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only thing I could make out was something about e-mail in the background with some sparse details about the service like the website and owner/founder names, which lead me to believe that it might be a routine database listing. The default with unverifiable articles is that they are seen as non-notability giving, even if the publication is seen as a RS in most situations.
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409:, given that there appears to be little to no editorial oversight on the page and it appears to be a forum-esque site. I also note that you started the discussion yourself, so this would make it primary at best. Anything that is written by you, the company, or people affiliated with the service would be primary and unable to establish notability.
309:, thank you for your quick reply. I understand it may seem there is a COI here as I have an external relationship to start.me. Still, that does not warrant speedy deletion citing A7. I believe my article about start.me is neutral. I consider myself an expert on the field and have written articles about similar services (e.g.
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Thank you for your thorough review of the sources I provided. And thank your for confirming that the article is, as I intended, indeed "fairly neutral" in tone. Let me not respond to all your remarks on the article (most of which I think are just), but for the following: I believe the mere volume of
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The last link you gave actually required that I download the page. Anything like this will raise red flags because you shouldn't have to download something to verify it. When I did open it in my browser, it didn't contain any information and as such, I cannot say that this would be seen as a RS. The
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is usually seen as a RS, however this runs the same issue as the Denver Post in that it is part of an opinion/advice column. As stated above, these are rarely seen as notability giving sources. I also note that the source only briefly mentions start.me. It does mention iGoogleAlternatives, which can
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can be a reliable source, however this is a question and answer column. These sort of things tend to be greatly depreciated as sources because they're usually the personal opinion/advice of the person who runs the column and it's rare that these would be the type of thing that would show notability.
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talk page, however I will say that they do have some issues, which I'll go into in a bit. The basic gist though is that you created an article that lacked sourcing that would establish notability per
Knowledge's guidelines and the claims in the article were not major enough to where it'd pass speedy
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is a
Blogspot blog. Blogs are seen as self-published sources and per their nature, they almost never go through any sort of editorial oversight. Like sites with a lack of clear editorial oversight like iGoogleAlternatives, a blog can be seen as a RS if it's routinely mentioned as reliable in other
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is something that would be seen as a reliable source. This isn't in
English, which is why I mentioned that sourcing in other languages may exist that I didn't find. My main concern though is that the article is still fairly brief and it looks like it was heavily based on a press release, given the
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at best since it's well within your best interest to write about things in which you stand to gain from financially. As far as you inserting your own writings into
Knowledge, that needs to be done with caution since trying to add a general paper you wrote to Knowledge can be seen as self-promotion
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looks to be a routine database-esque listing, especially as the content in the page is very brief and written like a press release. Most websites that offer free downloads do not write the material themselves and instead rely on the publisher to submit their own prose to accompany the download.
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would not be seen as a RS on
Knowledge since it's a self-published source. They do list their criteria for picking things, but they don't actually have anything to show their editorial oversight. It is mentioned as good in a NYT advice column, but we'd need a lot of coverage to really show that
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As far as the COI goes, you absolutely do have a conflict of interest here. You are one of the co-founders of start.me and as such, you stand to gain something by it having an article on
Knowledge. I do think that the article was fairly neutral, but the main issue here wasn't that it was
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source and would not be able to establish notability. Sources like this tend to be heavily scrutinized and it doesn't help that it doesn't identify who wrote it. This, along with the promotional tone, is usually a big sign that it's based on or is entirely taken from a press
426:. The problem is that some of their articles tend to come across as advertising. However that is somewhat of a moot point since the article in question is just a list of various services and doesn't go into enough depth for this to be a notability-giving source.
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is a major news channel in
Germany and their article was not based on a press-release issued by start.me (start.me hardly ever issues press releases and never in German). It appears N24 used a release from the DPA news agency (the same article is published in
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until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
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would be seen as a primary source because they host your website/service on their domain. It's well within their best interests to not only write about start.me, but to write about it in glowing terms. This would not establish notability on
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Whether it could otherwise be used as a RS is up for debate - this would mostly rely on whether or not the magazine offers people the chance to get more coverage via marketing packages, which is common with many publications nowadays.
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since you would stand to gain a better reputation from being a cited source. There are so many pitfalls with editing about COI topics that it's easy for newer editors to make a fatal mistake, which is why it's frequently discouraged.
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Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.
688:. I am not sure whether the subject satisfies Knowledge's notability guidelines, but having thought about the matter more, I have decided that whether it does or not, I don't see any harm in keeping the article.
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Furhtermore, start.me has a fairly high Alexa ranking, ranking it #11,436 of all websites on the
Internet. SimilarWeb even assigns it rank #6,748. That in its own way should make it notable. For comparison,
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If this was taken to AfD, I can guarantee that this would likely be considered non-usable for notability giving purposes. The service is also fairly briefly mentioned, so that doesn't help much either.
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is highly esteemed and does only post quality content, which is why we were very happy to get coverage. The
Digitaalgids is a printed magazine, which is why I attached a digital copy of the article.
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all these sources does indicate some level of notability. Not too many major sources have written about start.me. Two of them, however, I think you dismissed of too easily: N24 and Consumentenbond (
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854:, I noticed your article was declined at Articles for Creation, and that can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the
1230:, a page you created, has not been edited in 5 months. The Articles for Creation space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for articlespace.
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The reason it was deleted as A7 was because there were no sources in the article to show how the service was notable enough to pass criteria. They were all
571:). Pale Moon, being a major fork of the Firefox browser is considered notable, so it would seem the start page service it uses would be (more) notable, too.
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The end result is that none of these sources firmly establish notability and if this went to AfD with this sourcing, it's very likely that it'd be deleted.
1400:, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply
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help establish that the site may be reliable, but we'd need far more than one newspaper mention in order to really establish this.
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RS, but this needs to be very heavily established. Offhand I don't see where this blog would be one of the exceptions.
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has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Robert McClenon was:
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317:). The field of start pages is rather small and apart from me there are few Wikipedians willing to document.
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Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Knowledge appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited
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has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by In veritas was:
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has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by ToThAc was:
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link's tone. (I viewed it via Google Translate.) If it is based on a press release this would make it a
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would not be considered a reliable source on Knowledge. First is because it's ultimately a
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560:#14,821, both are covered on Knowledge and both seem just as relevant as start.me.
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to the Knowledge article or website of your organization in other articles (see
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Provide multiple independent reliable sources not associated with the company.
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Hello, Michieldewit. It has been over six months since you last edited your
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Hello, Michieldewit. It has been over six months since you last edited the
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Now as far as the sourcing you posted on DGG's page goes, here's a rundown:
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is a major consumer organization in The Netherlands. Their bi-monthly
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for page creation, and may soon be deleted (if it hasn't already).
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There's a page about creating articles you may want to read called
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Thanks for your submission to Knowledge, and happy editing.
46:. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the
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Knowledge:Articles for deletion/List of start page services
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guidelines on the notability of organizations and companies
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No evidence of satisfying Knowledge's notability guidelines
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and worthy of inclusion in an encyclopedia. If additional
1314:, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "
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And finally, about a year ago start.me partnered up with
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If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the
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only briefly mentions the service. This would make it a
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A discussion is taking place as to whether the article
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process can result in deletion without discussion, and
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and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
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and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
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Please contact me on-wiki, on my talk page. Thanks,
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is suitable for inclusion in Knowledge according to
769:, and there is clear evidence of why the subject is
387:source on Knowledge and could not show notability.
220:on the talk pages of affected articles (see the
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757:. Please improve the submission's referencing
206:for more information. In particular, please:
8:
113:or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome!
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546:Digitaalgids
507:Michieldewit
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1026:Your e-mail
968:Web browser
949:(August 29)
747:independent
736:significant
500:Tokyogirl79
481:Tokyogirl79
403:ProductHunt
307:Tokyogirl79
286:Tokyogirl79
239:WP:DISCLOSE
140:Mike Sutton
31:PerfectView
1421:{{db-g13}}
1409:{{db-afc}}
1335:or on the
1252:HasteurBot
1224:HasteurBot
1176:{{db-g13}}
1164:{{db-afc}}
1092:{{db-g13}}
1086:{{db-afc}}
1036:Sandstein
1013:In veritas
994:or on the
805:or on the
767:verifiable
717:(March 14)
440:Knowledge.
396:WP:PRIMARY
385:WP:TRIVIAL
353:WP:PRIMARY
334:WP:PRIMARY
230:template);
160:. Thanks,
103:Wikipedian
91:Help pages
35:guidelines
1429:this link
1398:mainspace
1292:Tab (GUI)
1184:this link
1153:mainspace
1100:this link
1075:mainspace
745:that are
657:consensus
595:has been
565:Pale Moon
437:Domain.me
144:Read the
105:! Please
1391:Start.me
1068:Start.me
970:article.
863:Teahouse
775:reliable
741:reliable
715:Start.me
686:Symbaloo
420:Buzzfeed
399:release.
315:Symbaloo
278:sourcing
235:disclose
216:instead
96:Tutorial
17:Welcome!
1424:code.
1319:db-self
1273:(May 8)
1218:concern
1179:code.
1095:code.
912:deleted
850:Hello!
771:notable
743:sources
558:Itch.io
486:(｡◕‿◕｡)
458:The NYT
368:Sources
301:Re: COI
291:(｡◕‿◕｡)
267:WP:PAID
249:WP:SPAM
186:welcome
162:DPL bot
23:welcome
1436:JMHamo
1354:ToThAc
626:or on
593:IgHome
311:IgHome
136:IgHome
59:helpme
1418:, or
1387:Draft
1173:, or
1142:Draft
1111:baska
759:(see
342:DGG's
121:matic
116:Bongo
1440:talk
1393:".
1358:talk
1256:talk
1148:".
1109:Aru@
1070:".
1017:talk
932:talk
872:talk
828:talk
753:and
700:talk
671:talk
554:Lulu
534:and
511:talk
444:This
338:here
323:talk
313:and
280:and
202:and
166:talk
1089:or
928:noq
698:" (
669:" (
532:HNA
527:N24
391:N24
340:at
305:Hi
269:).
146:FAQ
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