Knowledge (XXG)

:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Henri Coanda/Proposed decision - Knowledge (XXG)

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1551:, determining when consensus has been reached is not always an exact science. Editors should endeavor in good faith to work toward consensus when content disputes arise. Editors are not, in striving for consensus, required to abandon their beliefs about historical or other facts, or to simulate agreement with article content with which they continue to disagree; advocating forcefully, but civilly, for one's view is part of the process that has built some of our strongest articles. However, there comes a point when the existence of consensus becomes clear, so that disagreeing editors must accept that consensus is against them and cease editing against it, 3265:
cases. If this idea has appeal, arbitrators should feel free to propose alternative (narrower or broader) formulations. (For example, I am not sure whether topic-banned editors should be given some leeway to make purely incidental reference to the restricted topic in discussions on policy pages, or whether to include some language calling for common-sense leeway in enforcement in such cases.) Of course, no matter what language we might decide upon as standard, the committee will always have full discretion to tailor the scope of any ban or restriction as appropriate to the evidence and findings in any individual case.
482:, Arbitrators may place proposals which are ready for voting here. Arbitrators should vote for or against each point or abstain. Only items that receive a majority "support" vote will be passed. Conditional votes for or against and abstentions should be explained by the Arbitrator before or after his/her time-stamped signature. For example, an Arbitrator can state that she/he would only favor a particular remedy based on whether or not another remedy/remedies were passed. Only Arbitrators or Clerks should edit this page; non-Arbitrators may comment on the talk page. 144: 3032:. This topic-ban shall be effective indefinitely, but Lsorin may request that it be terminated or modified after at least six months have elapsed. In considering any such request, the Committee will give significant weight to whether Lsorin has established an ability to edit collaboratively and in accordance with Knowledge (XXG) policies and guidelines in other topic-areas of the project. 3264:
There have been a number of recent disagreements concerning the intended scope of topic-bans, which have become a significant time-sink and led to friction on AE. We may wish to use this case to develop agreed language that could become the form of a "standard topic ban" that could be cited in future
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7) The scope of sanctions imposed as remedies in arbitration cases, such as topic-bans, should be clearly defined so as to avoid later misunderstandings and disagreements. A sanction remedy should also clearly specify the duration of the sanction and the procedure, if any, available to the sanctioned
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6) It is not the role of the Arbitration Committee to settle good-faith content disputes among editors. However, an editor's continuing to edit or threaten to edit against a clear consensus—after appropriate discussion, warnings, and the use of applicable dispute resolution methods—may cross the line
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Clerks and Arbitrators should use this section to clarify their understanding of the final decision--at a minimum, a list of items that have passed. Additionally, a list of which remedies are conditional on others (for instance a ban that should only be implemented if a mentorship should fail), and
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Arbitrators may place proposed motions affecting the case in this section for voting. Typical motions might be to close or dismiss a case without a full decision (a reason should normally be given), or to add an additional party (although this can also be done without a formal motion as long as the
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case is the right place to tweak what may be intended to become standard wording (as opposed to a discussion not related to a specific ban). That said, this wording is appropriate for this case even though I wouldn't like to see it become "standard" without some serious study.
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I thought about that, but as I did so, the trade-off between crystal clarity and instruction creep came starkly into view. We can refine this later if we create a standard set of instructions for topic bans (which may have more than one type of them, as I think about it).
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2) Knowledge (XXG) users are expected to behave reasonably, calmly, and courteously in their interactions with other users, and to approach even difficult situations in a dignified fashion and with a constructive and collaborative outlook. Unseemly conduct, such as
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1) Should Lsorin violate the topic-ban or restriction imposed in this decision, he may be briefly blocked by any uninvolved administrator for a period of up to one week. After 5 blocks, the maximum block shall increase to one year. All blocks are to be logged at
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2) The topic-ban imposed in this decision applies to all pages in all namespaces. However, the topic-ban does not preclude Lsorin from (1) responding to good-faith, reasonable inquiries from other editors on his user talkpage seeking information about the
1119:. Where different scholarly viewpoints exist on a topic, those views enjoying a reasonable degree of support should be reflected in article content. An article should fairly represent the weight of authority for each such view, and should not give 1989:
I believe we have always attempted to do this, but in view of concerns expressed in some other cases that our decisions and motions are sometimes imprecise (this includes some drafted by me), it is well to reaffirm our aspiration to be clear.
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Many of the proposed principles are familiar ones. At the outset of the proposed decision, I'd like to thank my colleague Jclemens for his work on co-drafting in this case; anything novel that is adjudged rotten, however, is mine.
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Agreed that this should not be boilerplate for every case that includes a sanction. (No decision includes every past principle that could be relevant, or this proposed principles section would be at least ten paragraphs longer.)
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reflect that while Lsorin appears to be acting in good faith and to have done substantial research on the Coandă-1910, he still does not appreciate the serious concerns that have been expressed about his editing.
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will close the case either immediately, or 24 hours after the fourth net support vote has been cast, depending on whether the arbitrators have voted unanimously on the entirety of the case's proposed decision or
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A temporary injunction is a directive from the Arbitration Committee that parties to the case, or other editors notified of the injunction, do or refrain from doing something while the case is pending.
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1) The purpose of Knowledge (XXG) is to create a high-quality, free-content encyclopedia in an atmosphere of camaraderie and mutual respect among contributors. Use of the site for
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Four net "support" votes needed to close case (each "oppose" vote subtracts a "support"). 24 hours from the first motion is normally the fastest a case will close. The
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The first sentence is familiar. The second is a new wording as far as I recall, but it is inherent in many of our decisions, and I think it is helpful to spell it out.
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Note: All remedies that refer to a period of time, for example to a ban of X months or a revert parole of Y months, are to run concurrently unless otherwise stated.
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I'm open to the idea of formulating standard procedures to cover the details of topic bans, etc., and then including them in individual cases by reference.
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new party is on notice of the case). Suggestions by the parties or other non-arbitrators for motions or other requests should be placed on the
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case no, but it's a concern that's been expressed in response to other decisions, which I took into account in writing this one.
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Fair enough - though we should consider codifying it somewhere rather than repeating it every single time we impose sanctions. –
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Yes, there comes a time where continuing to act against an ongoing content consensus becomes a conduct, not content issues.
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There comes a time when one has to realize that they are being disruptive. That time has well since passed in this case.
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I think it's clear that the primary problem is their inability to see what the problem is — or even that there
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If observing editors notice any discrepancies between the arbitrators' tallies and the final decision or the
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so on. Arbitrators should not pass the motion until they are satisfied with the implementation notes.
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Don't see how this is applicable to this case, but might be sensible for the currently open AE case.
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that constitutes a conduct (rather than exclusively content) issue and may be grounds for sanctions.
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Close afternoon or evening Tuesday, allowing a little more time for anyone else who wishes to vote.
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for the lifting or modification of the topic-ban after the specified time period has elapsed.
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Knowledge (XXG):Arbitration/Requests/Case/Henri Coanda#Log of blocks, bans, and restrictions
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discussion of any allegation that he violated the topic-ban; or (3) posting an authorized
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For this case there are 16 active arbitrators. 9 support or oppose votes are a majority.
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This formulation is novel, though its essence is drawn from the relevant policy pages.
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Per Shell; this is something we should aspire to, but it doesn't seem relevant here.
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through the use of polite discussion—involving the wider community, if necessary—and
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I'm not certain that this is particularly relevant, but it's not controversial. —
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Four net "support" votes needed to pass (each "oppose" vote subtracts a "support")
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aircraft, and in particular, the claim that this aircraft embodied the first
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to views held by a relatively small minority of commentators or scholars.
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before initiating a motion to close, so that the final decision is clear.
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I agree with this, but find it somewhat out of place. (Have there been
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and discussing proposals with other Arbitrators, parties and others at
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user to seek lifting or modification of the sanction in due course.
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Very good start for formulating clearer standard topic ban terms,
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Specific wording of the topic-ban and appeal right taken from the
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Motions have the same majority for passage as the final decision.
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1) The locus of the dispute is editing relating to the
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clearly defined sanctions in regards to this case?) –
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is not an appropriate method of resolving disputes.
3346:"as long as Lsorin does not misuse this permission" 1720:Novel, but should become a new standard, I think. 3169:Unfortunate, but appropriate at this juncture. 2141:Seems uncontentious but mildly irrelevant. -- 455: 8: 1115:3) Article content must be presented from a 2741:Lsorin's evidence in this arbitration case 2631:Like the way the links are set out also -- 617:the fastest an injunction will be imposed. 462: 448: 131: 3882: 3344:We should perhaps refine what we mean by 533: 1553:at least for a reasonable period of time 489: 3806:Passing principles: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 134: 2959:4) {text of proposed finding of fact} 557:page for consideration and discussion. 2902:a problem — is the central cause. — 2526:evidence containing links to examples 1329:4) Knowledge (XXG) works by building 7: 3881:Please ask the case clerk to author 235:Clarification and Amendment requests 1547:5) As reflected in the policy page 3744:2) {text of proposed enforcement} 502:Support votes needed for majority 36: 3815:Passing enforcement provisions: 1 1764:Role of the Arbitration Committee 3839:Failing enforcement provisions: 2248:8) {text of proposed principle} 681:furtherance of outside conflicts 613:24 hours from the first vote is 142: 3431:It's not clear to me that any 2530:further evidence with examples 626:1) {text of proposed orders} 600:Proposed temporary injunctions 569:1) {text of proposed motion} 1: 3493:3) {text of proposed remedy} 2745:the contents of his userpage 366:Conflict of interest reports 3818:Proposals which do not pass 2691:Beyond a reasonable doubt. 195:Search archived proceedings 136:Knowledge (XXG) Arbitration 18:Knowledge (XXG):Arbitration 4061: 683:, publishing or promoting 667:Purpose of Knowledge (XXG) 240:Arbitrator motion requests 4008:03:35, 5 April 2011 (UTC) 3994:02:47, 5 April 2011 (UTC) 3986:00:51, 5 April 2011 (UTC) 3973:22:45, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 3969:Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs 3963:21:16, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 3948:21:14, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 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April 2011 (UTC) 858:00:51, 5 April 2011 (UTC) 845:23:12, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 836:22:59, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 828:22:42, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 824:Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs 817:20:51, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 798:19:32, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 784:13:18, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 769:11:42, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 756:06:55, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 743:03:27, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 730:03:17, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 717:03:10, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 705:01:46, 4 April 2011 (UTC) 3938:no point hanging around 3883:the implementation notes 3028:, or the history of the 2734: 907:assumptions of bad faith 3251:arbitration enforcement 3024:aircraft, its inventor 657:Proposed final decision 3812:Passing remedies: 1, 2 677:advocacy or propaganda 1977:Arbitration sanctions 1117:neutral point of view 1111:Neutral point of view 534:#Implementation notes 436:Track related changes 296:Arbitration Committee 3821:Failing principles: 3803:Proposals which pass 3790:Implementation notes 3529:Enforcement by block 3524:Proposed enforcement 1578:"I didn't hear that" 245:Enforcement requests 173:Guide to arbitration 102:Drafting arbitrators 3002:Lsorin topic-banned 1576:Good exposition of 892:Conduct and decorum 662:Proposed principles 495: 3833:Failing remedies: 3827:Failing findings: 3240:Scope of topic ban 1771:disruptive editing 1335:dispute resolution 905:, and unwarranted 490: 474:After considering 267:Contentious topics 165:Arbitration policy 3940:Elen of the Roads 3639:Elen of the Roads 3382:Elen of the Roads 3138:Elen of the Roads 2998: 2990:Proposed remedies 2849:Elen of the Roads 2735:Lsorin's response 2633:Elen of the Roads 2397:Elen of the Roads 2143:Elen of the Roads 1875:Elen of the Roads 1662:Elen of the Roads 1442:Elen of the Roads 1325:Editorial process 1224:Elen of the Roads 1010:Elen of the Roads 909:, is prohibited. 790:Elen of the Roads 685:original research 618: 530: 529: 472: 471: 439: 407: 277:General sanctions 225:All open requests 155:About arbitration 130: 129: 125: 114: 100: 84: 76:Proposed decision 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1363: 1339:edit-warring 1328: 1243: 1210: 1197: 1145: 1121:undue weight 1114: 1029: 996: 983: 931: 895: 809: 776: 763: 711: 670: 625: 614: 608: 607: 603: 568: 559: 551: 531: 499:Abstentions 484: 473: 101: 87: 86: 75: 41: 30:Henri Coanda 4000:Newyorkbrad 3546:Newyorkbrad 3366:Newyorkbrad 3267:Newyorkbrad 3247:Coandă-1910 3045:Newyorkbrad 3022:Coandă-1910 2756:Newyorkbrad 2540:Newyorkbrad 2522:Coandă-1910 2304:Newyorkbrad 2290:Coandă-1910 2123:Newyorkbrad 2093:Newyorkbrad 1992:Newyorkbrad 1782:Newyorkbrad 1564:Newyorkbrad 1349:Newyorkbrad 1131:Newyorkbrad 917:Newyorkbrad 697:Newyorkbrad 200:Ban appeals 178:Noticeboard 106:Newyorkbrad 3879:Important: 3597:PhilKnight 3319:PhilKnight 3096:PhilKnight 3030:jet engine 2807:PhilKnight 2591:PhilKnight 2355:PhilKnight 2294:jet engine 2043:PhilKnight 1833:PhilKnight 1620:PhilKnight 1400:PhilKnight 1182:PhilKnight 968:PhilKnight 903:incivility 748:PhilKnight 675:, such as 494:reference 406:(pre-2016) 393:Statistics 326:Procedures 88:Case clerk 3978:SirFozzie 3766:Abstain: 3748:Support: 3731:Abstain: 3698:SirFozzie 3610:Cool Hand 3542:Support: 3515:Abstain: 3497:Support: 3480:Abstain: 3446:SirFozzie 3332:Cool Hand 3261:Support: 3231:Abstain: 3198:SirFozzie 3109:Cool Hand 3036:Support: 2981:Abstain: 2963:Support: 2946:Abstain: 2913:SirFozzie 2820:Cool Hand 2752:Support: 2726:Abstain: 2693:SirFozzie 2604:Cool Hand 2536:Support: 2493:Abstain: 2460:SirFozzie 2368:Cool Hand 2300:Support: 2270:Abstain: 2252:Support: 2235:Abstain: 2194:SirFozzie 2056:Cool Hand 1986:Support: 1968:Abstain: 1935:SirFozzie 1846:Cool Hand 1777:Support: 1755:Abstain: 1722:SirFozzie 1633:Cool Hand 1559:Support: 1543:Consensus 1534:Abstain: 1501:SirFozzie 1413:Cool Hand 1345:Support: 1331:consensus 1316:Abstain: 1283:SirFozzie 1195:Cool Hand 1127:Support: 1102:Abstain: 1069:SirFozzie 981:Cool Hand 913:Support: 883:Abstain: 850:SirFozzie 761:Cool Hand 691:Support: 648:Abstain: 630:Support: 591:Abstain: 573:Support: 555:/Workshop 480:/Workshop 476:/Evidence 331:Elections 3918:contribs 3908:Casliber 3757:Oppose: 3740:Template 3722:Oppose: 3662:contribs 3652:Casliber 3584:Jclemens 3506:Oppose: 3489:Template 3471:Oppose: 3433:specific 3405:contribs 3395:Casliber 3306:Jclemens 3222:Oppose: 3161:contribs 3151:Casliber 3083:Jclemens 3018:contribs 2972:Oppose: 2955:Template 2937:Oppose: 2872:contribs 2862:Casliber 2794:Jclemens 2717:Oppose: 2656:contribs 2646:Casliber 2578:Jclemens 2518:contribs 2484:Oppose: 2429:Or is it 2420:contribs 2410:Casliber 2342:Jclemens 2261:Oppose: 2244:Template 2210:Oppose: 2166:contribs 2156:Casliber 2030:Jclemens 1959:Oppose: 1898:contribs 1888:Casliber 1820:Jclemens 1746:Oppose: 1685:contribs 1675:Casliber 1607:Jclemens 1525:Oppose: 1465:contribs 1455:Casliber 1387:Jclemens 1307:Oppose: 1247:contribs 1237:Casliber 1169:Jclemens 1093:Oppose: 1033:contribs 1023:Casliber 955:Jclemens 874:Oppose: 813:contribs 803:Casliber 735:Jclemens 639:Oppose: 622:Template 615:normally 582:Oppose: 565:Template 492:Majority 117:Jclemens 65:Workshop 54:Evidence 28:‎ | 24:‎ | 22:Requests 20:‎ | 4035:Comment 3902:Support 3780:General 3255:request 1660:like -- 540:to the 403:Reports 341:History 321:Members 316:Contact 304:Discuss 168:(CU/OS) 4020:Oppose 3991:Kirill 3892:Clerks 3711:Kirill 3571:Risker 3460:Kirill 3293:Risker 3211:Kirill 3070:Risker 3043:case. 3008:Lsorin 2926:Kirill 2781:Risker 2706:Kirill 2565:Risker 2508:Lsorin 2502:Lsorin 2473:Kirill 2329:Risker 2224:Kirill 2017:Risker 1948:Kirill 1807:Risker 1735:Kirill 1594:Risker 1580:too, 1514:Kirill 1374:Risker 1296:Kirill 1156:Risker 1082:Kirill 942:Risker 863:Kirill 722:Risker 346:Clerks 204:Report 115:& 3690:Coren 3681:Shell 3561:Roger 3438:Coren 3424:Shell 3283:Roger 3190:Coren 3181:Shell 3060:Roger 2904:Coren 2891:Shell 2771:Roger 2684:Coren 2675:Shell 2555:Roger 2452:Coren 2443:Shell 2319:Roger 2215:Shell 2186:Coren 2007:Roger 1926:Coren 1917:Shell 1797:Roger 1769:into 1713:Coren 1704:Shell 1584:Roger 1493:Coren 1484:Shell 1364:Roger 1275:Coren 1266:Shell 1146:Roger 1061:Coren 1052:Shell 932:Roger 842:Coren 833:Shell 712:Roger 380:Audit 16:< 4004:talk 3982:talk 3956:xeno 3944:talk 3912:talk 3895:not. 3873:Vote 3857:Talk 3841:None 3835:None 3829:None 3823:None 3702:talk 3656:talk 3643:talk 3626:xeno 3614:Luke 3601:talk 3588:talk 3575:talk 3550:talk 3450:talk 3399:talk 3386:talk 3370:talk 3352:xeno 3336:Luke 3323:talk 3310:talk 3297:talk 3271:talk 3202:talk 3155:talk 3142:talk 3125:xeno 3113:Luke 3100:talk 3087:talk 3074:talk 3049:talk 3012:talk 2917:talk 2866:talk 2853:talk 2836:xeno 2824:Luke 2811:talk 2798:talk 2785:talk 2760:talk 2743:and 2697:talk 2650:talk 2637:talk 2620:xeno 2608:Luke 2595:talk 2582:talk 2569:talk 2544:talk 2512:talk 2464:talk 2414:talk 2401:talk 2384:xeno 2372:Luke 2359:talk 2346:talk 2333:talk 2308:talk 2198:talk 2160:talk 2147:talk 2127:talk 2109:xeno 2097:talk 2089:this 2076:xeno 2060:Luke 2047:talk 2034:talk 2021:talk 1996:talk 1939:talk 1892:talk 1879:talk 1862:xeno 1850:Luke 1837:talk 1824:talk 1811:talk 1786:talk 1726:talk 1679:talk 1666:talk 1649:xeno 1637:Luke 1624:talk 1611:talk 1598:talk 1568:talk 1505:talk 1459:talk 1446:talk 1429:xeno 1417:Luke 1404:talk 1391:talk 1378:talk 1353:talk 1287:talk 1241:talk 1228:talk 1211:xeno 1199:Luke 1186:talk 1173:talk 1160:talk 1135:talk 1073:talk 1027:talk 1014:talk 997:xeno 985:Luke 972:talk 959:talk 946:talk 921:talk 854:talk 807:talk 794:talk 777:xeno 765:Luke 752:talk 739:talk 726:talk 701:talk 538:post 523:3–4 515:1–2 397:Talk 388:Talk 355:Talk 335:Talk 189:Talk 159:Talk 122:Talk 111:Talk 97:Talk 81:Talk 70:Talk 59:Talk 48:Talk 26:Case 3006:1) 2739:3) 2506:2) 2087:In 1555:. 271:Log 4006:) 3984:) 3946:) 3920:) 3850:NW 3704:) 3688:— 3664:) 3645:) 3637:-- 3603:) 3590:) 3577:) 3552:) 3538:. 3452:) 3436:— 3407:) 3388:) 3380:-- 3372:) 3325:) 3312:) 3299:) 3273:) 3204:) 3188:— 3163:) 3144:) 3102:) 3089:) 3076:) 3051:) 2919:) 2900:is 2874:) 2855:) 2847:-- 2813:) 2800:) 2787:) 2762:) 2699:) 2682:— 2658:) 2639:) 2597:) 2584:) 2571:) 2546:) 2532:. 2528:; 2466:) 2450:— 2431:? 2422:) 2403:) 2395:-- 2361:) 2348:) 2335:) 2310:) 2296:. 2200:) 2168:) 2149:) 2129:) 2099:) 2070:un 2049:) 2036:) 2023:) 1998:) 1941:) 1924:— 1900:) 1881:) 1873:-- 1839:) 1826:) 1813:) 1788:) 1728:) 1711:— 1687:) 1668:) 1626:) 1613:) 1600:) 1570:) 1507:) 1491:— 1467:) 1448:) 1440:-- 1406:) 1393:) 1380:) 1355:) 1289:) 1273:— 1249:) 1230:) 1222:-- 1188:) 1175:) 1162:) 1137:) 1075:) 1059:— 1035:) 1016:) 1008:-- 974:) 961:) 948:) 923:) 901:, 856:) 840:— 815:) 796:) 788:-- 754:) 741:) 728:) 703:) 679:, 526:7 518:8 510:9 507:0 104:: 90:: 74:— 63:— 52:— 4002:( 3980:( 3952:– 3942:( 3915:· 3910:( 3860:) 3854:( 3700:( 3659:· 3654:( 3641:( 3622:– 3599:( 3586:( 3573:( 3548:( 3448:( 3402:· 3397:( 3384:( 3368:( 3321:( 3308:( 3295:( 3269:( 3200:( 3158:· 3153:( 3140:( 3121:– 3098:( 3085:( 3072:( 3047:( 3015:· 3010:( 2915:( 2869:· 2864:( 2851:( 2832:– 2809:( 2796:( 2783:( 2758:( 2695:( 2653:· 2648:( 2635:( 2616:– 2593:( 2580:( 2567:( 2542:( 2515:· 2510:( 2462:( 2417:· 2412:( 2399:( 2380:– 2357:( 2344:( 2331:( 2306:( 2196:( 2163:· 2158:( 2145:( 2125:( 2095:( 2045:( 2032:( 2019:( 1994:( 1937:( 1895:· 1890:( 1877:( 1858:– 1835:( 1822:( 1809:( 1784:( 1724:( 1682:· 1677:( 1664:( 1645:– 1622:( 1609:( 1596:( 1566:( 1503:( 1462:· 1457:( 1444:( 1425:– 1402:( 1389:( 1376:( 1351:( 1285:( 1244:· 1239:( 1226:( 1207:– 1184:( 1171:( 1158:( 1133:( 1071:( 1030:· 1025:( 1012:( 993:– 970:( 957:( 944:( 919:( 852:( 810:· 805:( 792:( 773:– 750:( 737:( 724:( 699:( 463:e 456:t 449:v 351:+ 309:+ 273:) 269:( 185:+ 124:) 120:( 113:) 109:( 99:) 95:( 83:) 79:( 72:) 68:( 61:) 57:( 50:) 46:(

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Arbitration
Requests
Case
Henri Coanda
Main case page
Talk
Evidence
Talk
Workshop
Talk
Proposed decision
Talk
AlexandrDmitri
Talk
Newyorkbrad
Talk
Jclemens
Talk
Knowledge (XXG) Arbitration

About arbitration
Talk
Arbitration policy
(CU/OS)
Guide to arbitration
Noticeboard

+
Talk
Search archived proceedings

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