3347:
these two conditions" likely qualifies an article as notable. My question is this: why do we have subject-specific notability guidelines for websites (or for any subject, for that matter) that state that one of the conditions for establishing notability is meeting the
General Notability Guidelines? Isn't that... Redundant? And arent' there a lot of SSNGs that pretty much say the same thing? "You can either meet the General Notability Guidelines or you can meet these other "special" guidelines..." If a subject meets the GNG, doesn't the conversation end right there? I think that the reason editors come to SSNGs is to see if their subject
419:. By the RS guidelines, I would say Epicurious is reliable. The SlashFood article, upon review, I could agree about. The Fine Cooking article, as mentioned on the discussion page for Foodimentary, is indeed written by an intern. Also as mentioned, I've found nothing in the RS guidelines that should make the fact that it was written by an intern invalidate the article. When an intern submits an article to the company they work for, the company still has to review and approve it. It would seem to me that regardless of the author, the article carries the reliability of the magazine that published it.
727:
information about the literary scene (and other fields too, I expect) in Africa, Canada, and India. For many young people, online reviews are the sole source of information that they use. Indeed in many cases book reviews on litblogs are taking up the space vacated by traditional media as it becomes uneconomic for print to carry them. Like the blogs that are documenting the Arab spring, they are a phenomena that have great cultural significance. But unlike a blog about middle eastern politics, their notability is not easy for an outsider to establish.
2313:
more than a paper encyclopedia normally would, mainly because we can. But I still think a chart-topping musician has a form of lasting historical notability that a
Youtuber doesn't have, even if he does have more fans than the musician. As I said above, this isn't just my personal opinion. The world out there simply has not deemed to Take Note of Youtubers the same way that it Takes Note of musicians. If and when the world decides that Yuotubers have lasting significance, then existing policies will give them articles.
455:
suggests policy is redundant. Besides that, if you Google "foodimentary wins a shorty award", you get 3070 results to peruse through of coverage. Not all of them are very reliable, but it does constitute some argument for how "well-known" the shorty awards are, and it's certainly "independent". Maybe what's in the
Knowledge (XXG) article isn't the best reflection of reliable coverage, but that's something we can change. Choosing a random source from the Google search that seems reliable to me, I found
1736:"Notability" is a defined term of art on Knowledge (XXG); it's not the same as the dictionary definition. It's not the same thing as "popularity" or "interestingness". Hits, likes, comments, and a large fanbase aren't notability; they aren't what makes a subject appropriate for inclusion in Knowledge (XXG). Knowledge (XXG) publishes what reliable sources have already published. That's the kind of encyclopedia we're making here. So we need to wait for those YouTubers to garner the right sort of coverage.
1678:, TmarTn, Sky Does Minecraft, etc. These are all very popular YouTube personalities (YouTubers), but only one of the mentioned personalities has an article due to the current state of our guidelines. Currently guidelines call for significant third party media coverage to establish notability. And I think this works in most cases. However YouTubers, regardless of following and how large the fan base is, receive little to no coverage and current guidelines are not so fair.
715:
featured as a blogger of note in two other lit blogs (one US, one UK), and on the strength of my knowledge about OzLit, I've been an invited guest at two major literary award ceremonies, suggested as a judge for a major award, invited to speak at a writers' festival, and asked to set up a 'shadow' panel for the Miles
Franklin Award (like the shadow Giller Prize panel). (Almost) every Australian publisher of books knows who I am. I have a Google page ranking of 5.
2450:
233:
1900:
regardless of why you might happen to know about the subject. All that matters here (rather than the words you use to describe this condition, like "notability") is the existence of source material. No source material = no article. End of discussion. And we do have YouTube personalities who have
Knowledge (XXG) articles. Those for whom we have enough source material to read through first before we wrote the articles. --
2063:- Interesting question, but no. I sympathize with the intent, but I see three problems. If there's no Reliable Sources then there's just no good way to support the article. The second issue issue is that Knowledge (XXG) doesn't cover News-Of-The-Day. A Youtube clip of a cute cat might get a bazillion views this week, but that doesn't mean it has any lasting notability. Notability implies a permanent status.
2462:
notable, but I'm not sure there's a good way to establish an arbitrary count that would constitute such notability. I also agree that waiting for journalist to write about it (which, like it or not, is the primary focus of those seeking a
Reliable Source) seems that someone could be indeed notable for a long time waiting for such coverage. I'm going to give this some more thought and get back to you.
2992:, yet under the current guidelines, that would most definitely fall under web content! (and therefore be A7 eligible despite being a software product) The only way to obtain it is through the developer's website, and although they used to send a physical copy (I have one), I believe they now send it via email. It's absolutely ridiculous to call it web content purely because that's how it's distributed!
2659:. It's already extremely difficult, if not impossible to get many common programs (such as web browsers) from anywhere but the web, are they classed as web content? I'm also talking about other products that are available primarily/only via the web; it's just that I'm more familiar with computer programs that other types of product. Web content should mean just that; content that is accessed
1945:#1 song on the Billboard American main chart is probably sufficient proof of popularity -- notability if you will -- for us to have an article on that person. But the Billboard chart doesn't mean what it used to. It's like album sales: they mean essentially nothing now. YouTube hits are a better measure of popularity. I'm sorry if the mainstream press is behind the curve on this, but so what?
197:
1759:
environment where you could start reading a review, or just launch yourself right into a video. Not really appealing for many reliable sources. Knowledge (XXG), yes, publishes what other reliable sources have published, and, yes, "Nobility" is very much a defined term for our uses, but this RfC could make a slight effect on editors' understanding of 'Notability'.
1440:
disjointed treatment of someone's works, and I've redirected some stubs like that the past. Alternatively, if the "medium" is notable but the author & work isn't passing GNG, the work could be mentioned in the article on the medium. Assuming
Gervais didn't have an article, his podcast could conceivably be mentioned in the article on the newspaper (site).
2412:, than the subject would be treated like any other potential article subject. I don't believe that a notability guideline that states that if content creator on youtube has X number of hits, that that should be a basis for determining that subject has receive significant coverage. If that were the case than certain internet memes would be article worthy.--
2359:
to change it with the current definition. This discussion was supposed to be about whether YouTubers are famous and worthy of articles in spite of current guidelines, and if so, adapt them. But commenters so far have merely thrown around the term and policies/guidelines as currently defined, which is getting this discussion so far from what I wanted.
1951:"keep" for an article on that person. And so would others. And I think that's reasonable. So since people are going to do that, and it's reasonable, we should consider adding metrics like that to our notability standards. Because our standards are supposed to conform to reality and how reasonable people are going to think here, and not vice versa.
1286:?). There are tons of problematic and obscure websites out there (racist etc.) that describe themselves as something else than what they actually are. Without some independent coverage as to their nature, just copying their self-description to Knowledge (XXG) means transforming Knowledge (XXG) into a free advertisement venue for fringe stuff.
2651:
shops, it won't be that long before pretty much everything is classed as web content, even if it has nothing to do with the world wide web, but merely distributed via it. The web is already the primary, if not sole distribution medium for many products. If it's not actually on the web, it shouldn't come under here, but rather,
2646:
actually is. I simply do not understand footnote #1; is it saying that if it's not available in a shop, then it's web content, regardless of what is it? I've removed several A7 tags from articles about computer programs that are mainly, if not only available via the web, but according to this guideline, I was wrong to do so (
1847:"covered by multiple, independent reliable sources". I've argued for years that we should rename the notability guidelines to "inclusion guidelines" or something that isn't such a loaded term. Regardless, we shouldn't build out a specific guideline that will lead us astray in determining which articles to keep on wikipedia.
351:. The latter of these strikes me as non-notable. There is no reliable independent coverage of the subject. However, Foodimentary has apparently won a Shorty Award, which would satisfy #2 here if the Shorty Awards are "a well-known and independent award from either a publication or organization." Any thoughts?
2540:' Sushi restaruants are among of the most type of eatery in the world. Many customers of them make a career out of sushi. But this does not make even really, really good sushi chefs notable, if they are not the subject of substantial coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources, at least some of them
3213:
Wiki-notable. Which you almost certainly would be, if you had 10 billion subscribers! Make sense?? Having said that, You are more than welcome to propose an alteration/ addition to the subject-specific guidelines for websites that includes numbers of subscribers as a criterion for inclusion. I
2810:
The main idea is ditching "distributed" (digital distribution is not what it was in 2006 and that word opens things up a bit too much now) and focusing on a specific form of interaction (via a web browser) rather than the much-too-broad "Internet". It could go on to specifically exclude certain types
2461:
to include new criteria or considerations. That said, I'm stymied as to what the new criteria would be unless we resorted to popularity or hits on the website neither of which seem to be an unreliable metric alone. Clearly when someone has a following and millions of hits, it does seem that that is
2312:
Notability. I do not see this as a flaw in our current
Notability standards. A lot of people see the term "Notable" and apply a common usage interpretation, thinking that it means "at least somewhat famous". Our usage of Notable is "Does it belong in an Encyclopedia". Our internet encyclopedia covers
2041:
It's quite simple... if independent secondary sources discuss a YouTuber or even a specific youtube video, we can (and should) have an article about it. If not, we shouldn't. The number of hits is a poor metric, since hit counts can be manipulated by a small number of people going repeatedly to the
1991:
is quite clear, a subject is notable for a
Knowledge (XXG) article if it meets the general notability guidelines OR any of the subject specific guidelines. Then after that, it puts the GNG on the same page, so some people just skimming through get confused. They got a large cult following, they are
1062:
Hi Patsw, and thanks for the comments. You said that that criterion #3 "is to allow articles to be created on works (or authors of works) whose narrow audience is so limited as to not attract published analysis, praise, or criticism". I agree that this is what the policy intends - my point was that I
730:
From a personal point of view I don't really care if my blog makes it as notable or not, but I am particularly concerned about the principle of inclusiveness, especially regarding litblogs from Africa which are documenting the highly significant growth of
African literature written by Africans. I am
2915:
Right, you can't use an essay to influence policy debates. But you can use it to start a discussion that will clearly identify a problem and and propose a specific solution. It looks kind of like that's what you wanted to do with this RFC, but they usually propose a specific solution, which people
2719:
This doesn't seem like it requires an RfC at this point, but you do raise a decent point. I don't think I ever stopped to consider the implications of "Any content which is distributed solely on the Internet is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline". So all of the albums that are
2650:
links to this guideline), even though they're not in themselves web content (I'm talking here of things such as Android apps). A computer program is a computer program, regardless of how it's distributed. Under that rule, with the ever-growing use of the web as it slowly but surely replaces physical
2645:
As someone who knows that the world wide web actually is, including its differences from the internet, I am at a loss as to how increasingly many products are technically classed as web content, even if they are not web content at all by definition. As if how it's distributed somehow changes what it
2358:
When people decide they want to comment on what I said, rather than just throwing around "notability" as currently defined, I'll be glad to try my best at rebutting. Until then, there's nothing I can say. Because, as I said, notability as currently defined excludes them and there's nothing I can say
1846:
notes above, the term "notable" on wikipedia is a term of art. I'll go further, it's a very unfortunate misnomer. Back in 2005 we picked the term because it seemed to fit without much thought that a normal human would read it as "important or significant" (which many youtubers certainly are), not as
1716:
This is just one example, but there are dozens of others in the same boat. The point of all this is, I don't believe media coverage is a good barometric measure of a YouTuber's notability. Something needs to change to adapt Knowledge (XXG) to acknowledge the notability of these internet celebrities,
1181:
Pretend it's not a web comic. Pretend it's a comic strip printed in the newspaper, and it happens that the only sources you've been able to find are (1) the comic strip, (2) the comic strip's website, and (3) stuff published by the syndicate. That's zero independent sources. How do you write that
722:
Literary fiction competes with general fiction for media attention and although it has great cultural significance it gets very little airspace. Australian Literature is an even smaller niche. A small team of Aussie litlovers have worked tirelessly to have our notable authors included in Knowledge
2832:
Yes, I think the latter quotation is a more accurate description of "web content", although not everything accessed through a web browser is web content. Some software used to (do they still?) come with HTML help files for instance. And yes, the term "Internet" is indeed far too broad; in fact, the
2456:
I applaud the original question, as a discussion of whether or not the current Notability guidelines sufficiently address the phenomenon of YouTube. All the quotations of current policy and !votes based on those policies aren't really pertinent to the discussion, since the point of the question is
2428:
I don't understand how we could write an encyclopedic article about a subject when the only source available is the information from youtube, which is a primary source of mixed reliability (Thinks like view count are probably reliable, but anything the owner can edit wont be). So lets say I want to
1439:
can be covered in his biography. The only case where a separate article is needed is when substantial independent commentary appears about the podcast itself. Even clarified, the criterion seems to encourage micro-stubs on works of otherwise notable authors. I admit I'm somewhat biased against such
1107:
About patsw's comment: If the web content has never attracted "published analysis, praise, or criticism (what we Wikipedians call "coverage")", then how the heck are we supposed to write an article about it? Just chuck NPOV out the window and write the whole thing from what the content's creators
454:
It seems to me that the statement, "If winning an award does not result in significant coverage in reliable sources, you can be pretty sure that the award is not "a well-known and independent award"." comes from opinion and not policy. In fact, it's almost contradictory to policy, or at the least
3346:
conditions for which it will admit the existence of notability for a website and allow an article on the subject. The first of these appears to be a re-statement of the General Notability Guidelines, and the second is the winning of certain unnamed awards. It then states that meeting "either of
2493:
that it's not just establishing they're notable. I fully agree there are notable youtubers with no RS discussion of them, the potential article also needs to be able to have some encyclopedic content, for which we also kind of need a source to have made the decision which facts are relevant or not
1950:
I'll tell you this: if a person has x million YouTube hits and it can be demonstrated that that puts them at the very highest level of that metric, and assuming that the metric isn't being gamed or is otherwise misleading, then I'd be inclined that that shows notability and I'd be inclined to vote
1841:
to have multiple, independent reliable sources covering them even if a quick google search doesn't unearth any. When a specific notability guideline fails as a heuristic, we should stop using it or update it, because the goal is to have articles which have sufficient sourcing such that they can be
1717:
who, despite their huge followings, don't get the media coverage to warrant an article under the current guidelines. What is the solution? I'm not sure at the moment. All I know is something needs to change because our current system, as stated, is not a fair judgement of notability for YouTubers.
854:
Would having a significant number of notable people being interviewed on a website not confirm notability of that website? Any objection towards that being added to this guideline's page under web content? Just because the mainstream news media doesn't cover certain things, doesn't mean it isn't
718:
But how would anybody assessing the notability of my blog know any of this (except for the page ranking)? The people who have approached me have done it privately. I don't brag about it on my blog, and I have never been mentioned in the national media. (After all, traditional media journalists see
2806:
How about something like this change. Instead of "Any content which is distributed solely on the Internet is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline" we have "Any content accessed and engaged with primarily through a web browser is considered web content for the purposes of this
801:
Knowledge (XXG) needs more fences. It doesn't have anything to do with minorities, it has to do with demonstrated importance. While the description of the small niche success you have had with your blog must be personally satisfying, it's a far cry from something an encyclopedia should recognize.
726:
I'm just a middle sized fish in the small Australian Literature pond that is swamped by oceans of US and UK lit. I'm sure that Knowledge (XXG) wants to ensure that it is inclusive of blogs that matter in countries outside the Big 2. There are excellent, high quality blogs that offer significant
1899:
and no amount of pageviews on a YouTube video will make the source text exist, unless it gets written by reliable sources. Unless and until we have something to read from that we can then use to help us write Knowledge (XXG) articles, there is no point in writing the article in the first place,
3161:
I do not have any YouTuber in particular in mind, but I realize there are a handful of articles of articles on YouTubers. Obviously, merely posting content would not establish notability. While I realize that several factors determine notability, I was wondering how many subscribers (roughly) a
2382:
I think you're ignoring that many people have. To paraphrase what I said above. The current standard is simply the topic being discussed in reliable sources. If we widen the standard from that, what would the article be based on? What would we put in it? Short of a directory stub saying "x is a
1258:
criterion (there are only 4 major labels). So, if being published by a major book publisher or a major film studio is not an indicator of notability, I don't see how the lesser standard of publishing their ebooks or online videos on any "respected and independent website" can be an indicator of
884:
No. Why would it? That in itself doesn't mean anything. I don't know what you have in mind here, but, say, a website for a science fiction convention can post a lot of interviews of famous people, or just some random personal blog can track down a bunch of famous people by email and put up some
714:
With no professional background in books or publishing, I started my blog about Australian literature three years ago. However, In the last twelve months, my blog has been linked to an American university as a resource, my reviews are featured on senior secondary school reading lists, I've been
646:
I semi-object to removal of "our", and think we should go in the other direction (occasionally, but at least once per page) in policy and guideline pages (but not wikiproject advice pages, or in essays), because it has exactly the opposite effect on the former two types of page: It's describing
3204:
This is because Knowledge (XXG) does not consider "number of subscribers" to be a measure of notability. Because right now, it isn't. If your YouTube channel is notable (by Knowledge (XXG) terms) then someone somewhere will have written an article about it in a reliable independent published
2979:
As you can see, my biggest nitpick about this is that it technically makes a lot of things which aren't supposed to be A7 eligible (namely software and games), A7 eligible despite them being explicitly excluded from A7. As others have pointed out, the "Any content that is distributed primarily
2788:
have said, so much software is distributed primarily on the web these days, which means they're classed as web content, and are therefore A7-eligible, despite A7 explicitly excluding software. Albums are also excluded from A7 (though they do come under A9, which does not explicitly include web
2133:
to current guidelines and policy if consensus decides in this discussion that the current policies and guidelines are not suitable to current media coverage of culture, in particular coverage of internet celebrities. Previous commenters are right, notability is not temporary. But I don't think
2916:
then vote to support or oppose. If you listed what you think counts as web content, then I could reply to that with my thoughts. And then, after a few other people have joined in the discussion, we'd have an idea of what possible problems exist and what possible solutions we should propose.
2157:
The people who are "Opposing" are providing good discussion reasons. Consider it a compliment that people are talking your idea more seriously than you intended :) The fact that people treated it more formally than you intended just means that, had things gone the other way, things might have
2022:
Occasionally I hear about youtubers on podcasts or see a story on them on TV. This is the sort of coverage that we would need to see. I don't think there could be any automatic rule based on numbers of views. Otherwise Knowledge (XXG) pages could deserve article when they get enough views.
1969:
doesn't really work. I would consider Billboard American chart to be an ideal third party RS establishing Notability. The world has deemed to Take Note of any chart-topping musician. The fact that there does not exist a comparable chart for Youtubers would suggest the world currently does not
1608:
However, even though these arguments are well-made and supported by clear evidence, other editors are not persuaded. They correctly point out that to relax the guidelines would be to create biographies of living people without third party sources. This is problematic for several reasons and
2841:. Although many things can be downloaded from the web, they are not used on or via the web and instead run on the user's computer. How about "Any content accessed via the internet and engaged with primarily through a web browser is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline"?
1604:
This interesting RfC concerns the question of whether Knowledge (XXG)'s notability guidelines are sufficiently inclusive towards people who are extremely popular on YouTube. The nominator advances a number of ingenious and persuasive arguments. Knowledge (XXG)'s core advantages over other
1758:
It is much more difficult for any Youtuber to gain the coverage that performers of other arts can. Reliable sources that go into detail about the channel/person are very unlikely, probably simply for the fact that YouTube, unlike IRL things, are meant to be viewed over the internet, in an
2071:
think a Youtuber has enough viewers to qualify. Third, if we did decided to do this, who is to decide how many followers is enough to qualify as Notable? Is there anyone here that would even dare to propose a number? Any Youtuber with more than X followers gets a Knowledge (XXG) page??
1605:
information sources include its comprehensive range of content and the fact that articles can be very up-to-date, being editable in real time. The general public might perhaps expect YouTube personalities to be covered here, but our current notability guidelines make this impossible.
2745:
I think it is worth an RfC because it means there is a loophole that makes many products strictly speaking eligible for CSD A7, despite A7 explicitly excluding products of any kind. I propose that all products come under the products guideline, regardless of how they're distributed.
3042:
I'd suggest, as suggested above, changing the wording to "Any content accessed via the internet and engaged with primarily through a web browser is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline", thereby excluding stuff that's merely distributed via the web or internet.
550:
is an official policy" was awkward-sounding, especially in printed versions of this page where there are no wikilinks. Because the policy is not named by its "true name" ("Knowledge (XXG) is not a soapbox"), I preceded the phrase with "the idea that"; thus, it reads, "the idea that
2544:. Most of the best people in the world at most professions, from grocery store clerks to truck drivers, are not notable. That's life. YouTube "stars" will eventually become notable, anyway, as media converge more, and as the nature of celebrity continues to shift. Give it time.
1084:
is good enough for them, then it would be sufficient to use the appearance of a web comic in Keenspot as the threshold for inclusion of that web comic as an article without having to make judgments on each new web comic as it appears. I don't think that consensus is there.
2696:, and many other products would be "web content" since they're all distributed through the internet. At one point, most major software was shipped on disk, but now with increasing bandwidth the vast majority of content is sent through internet regardless of file size.
996:
The line in the policy is to allow articles to be created on works (or authors of works) whose narrow audience is so limited as to not attract published analysis, praise, or criticism (what we Wikipedians call "coverage"). The criterion we use is whether there is not
612:
I "fixed" the spelling of "encyclopedia" in footnote #5 (i.e., "encyclopaedia"). Yes, I know, "encyclopaedia" is a legitimate spelling alternative for the word, but honestly? Like using "lede paragraph" instead of "lead paragraph", it really has no beneficial effect
1762:
Notability does, after all, mean something, be it a person, object, or event, that is worthy of notice, and I personally doubt that YouTubers are going to ever make the cut with current guidelines, even if they are noteworthy enough compared to other performers.
1254:'s "Has released two or more albums on a major label or on one of the more important indie labels (i.e. an independent label with a history of more than a few years, and with a roster of performers, many of whom are notable)." That is much more narrow than this
1237:
contributor; if the notability of Carrie Lukas were discussed, I'd expect it to revolve around being published by The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, and USA Today. Further, I cannot find other notability guidelines as broad or vague as this. Neither
1338:
I can see where you're coming from here, but any confusion about the guideline referring to things as broad as IP protocol and HTTP is mostly because I only quoted the first part of the criterion above. The full version is more specific, and I will include it
2980:
through the internet is considered web content" bit may have made sense 10 years ago, but nowadays, so much stuff is distributed like that that at this rate, pretty much everything will become web content in the not too distant future. One example of this is
3510:
This is a pattern I've noticed with a lot of the SNGs. Their pages are noisy, with the important criteria buried amid a restatement of principles (not inherent, not inherited, GNG, etc.) and buried between rarely used criteria that no longer come up at AFD.
3205:
third-party source. Or (according to these guidelines) your YouTube channel will have won some kind of recognized award (I have no idea what kinds of awards are possible or how recognized they are, but those are the rules). In a nutshell: you can have 10
978:". The webcomic in question doesn't seem notable by any common-sense measure - no hits on Google News or Books, no claim in the article of wider influence - and yet criterion three gives it a claim to notability under our guideline, as argued in the
438:
article that suggests it has received significant coverage in reliable sources, though maybe that information is buried in all the ridiculous trivia about "Had a tweet quoted in the LA Times blog" and "Mentioned in a blog on Cincinnati.com". Thanks,
2429:
right an article about such a person. How will I source it? How will I provide a proper encyclopedic coverage that goes beyond self published information already available at youtube? That is one of the major reasons for the notability guidelines.
1161:
No, my question isn't about how to determine if a topic merits an article. I'm talking about the practical aspect of putting text into the article. If there are actually zero independent sources with any significant coverage, how exactly do you
802:
We're an encyclopedia, first and foremost. If you think you can get listed in any other encyclopedia in the world, start there first and let us know when it happens. Don't just assume that because we're online that our standards should be lower.
2669:, not the internet), otherwise the term "web content" as it's currently used is misleading. To sum up, if something's a product, it should come under the products guideline, regardless of how it's distributed. What are your thoughts on this?
3399:
The "presumption" of notability wasn't my point there. My point was that the SSG seems to be restating the GNG as one of its own requirements, which, if it is true, doesn't seem to warrant the reiteration. Or am I missing something?
982:. Is there any actual need for this criterion? It seems to me that anything worthy of an article would already pass criterion one by being covered in multiple, reliable sources independent of the subject. Let me know your thoughts. —
388:
Eikou please provide the links here. They are not "articles" in my mind. Epicurious is a website known mostly for its user generated content, and I see no indication that conducting and publishing an interview on that website meets
3448:. I find this to be a weird argument to make, since if something passes GNG, it is notable in almost all cases, unless there is an SNG or policy that adds restrictions on top of GNG, such as NCORP or NOT. In general, GNG = Notable. –
1407:
From this version it's quite clear that the "medium" referred to in the guideline must be some kind of online publisher, so we should bear this in mind when debating it. Apologies if I misled anyone with selective quoting. Best —
1927:
Let's do a thought experiment. Suppose a person had several #1 songs on the Billboard main chart, and was the most popular pop act since the Beatles, but -- this is a thought experiment -- there were insufficient sources to meet
1382:
Content that is distributed by independent online sites will almost certainly satisfy the first criterion. However, this criterion ensures that Knowledge (XXG)'s coverage of such content will be complete regardless. For example,
596:
I removed "just as individuals can be notable" from the second paragraph in "No inherent notability", since it seems to be used as a sort of a proof for the idea that "smaller websites can be notable". It's not wholly related or
1001:
exercised by the host of the Web content. For an example not related to the case presented, sites that aggregate political or popular culture opinion that add or remove contributors based on web site's subjective criteria meet
3535:
Maybe just scrap it? If it's just one criteria that I don't imagine is used very often it probably isn't worth having a guideline on, or spending the time working out how to fit an inclusive guideline into an exclusionary SNG.
3355:
to meet the GNG? Why does this need restating here? If it doesn't (and I don't think it does) then shouldn't we just axe it? Or does the whole guideline for websites start to sound kind of stupid if we don't leave it in?
1122:
In theory, Knowledge (XXG) editors in a narrow subject, use the editorial filter of organizations, aggregators, syndicates, etc. to determine if a topic merits an article. To pick one example in an area I am familiar with,
2611:
There was minimal participation in this RfC likely because the opening post asked for thoughts and did not propose a specific wording. I recommend either starting an RfC about the wording proposed late in the discussion or
707:
I think Knowledge (XXG) needs to look at the issue of blog notability differently. We are in uncharted territory, and the rules need to ensure inclusiveness and diversity if WP is to be truly comprehensive in scope.
2940:: I was not previously aware of some web content not necessarily being online, and feel knowing this is beneficial. I'm unsure as to what final decision could be made, but I feel starting an essay, as suggested by
971:
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If someone wanted to create an essay about what they do and don't consider to be "web content", that could work. And after a few rounds of discussion on that page, it would probably result in a solid proposal for
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criteria. I see no indication that SlashFood is more than a food blog. Is it an RS? FInally, the Fine Cooking reference is to an online blurb written by an intern and not an article published in the magazine
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SNGs like this are meant to outline criteria that if a topic meets one of these, there will likely be sufficient coverage (existing or in the future) to allow the article to eventually comply with the GNG.
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When it comes to web comics, I am not a subject matter expert, however, I expect that there's enough experience among Knowledge (XXG) editors now to know what web sites are not mere pass-throughs (i.e.
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People seem to be misunderstanding the discussion at hand. The discussion is not the merits of an article based on current policy and guidelines, thus are irrelevant. This discussion is about possible
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I corrected word meaning in the second bullet in the "except the following" numbered list in criterion #1 by changing the word "or" to "and"—all exceptions apply simultaneously, not just one at a time.
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notability. Similarly, if a band who has just released one album on a major label is not notable, I don't see how they would be notable for releasing mp3s on any "respected and independent website."
568:), I changed "to make other editors aware of the problem" to "to alert other editors to the problem" for concision (the third "C" of copyediting: "clear, correct, concise, complete, and consistent").
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neutral, verifiable and relatively comprehensive without relying on original research. We should never develop a notability guideline with the express purpose of skirting that core requirement. As
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subscribers, but unless having that many subscribers ALSO happens to means that you have acquired the attention of multiple published reliable independent verifiable non-trivial sources, you are
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it as totally useless. It's solely there to come up with lame excuses to include things that do not belong here by any reasonable criteria, either by Knowledge (XXG) standards or the real world.
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The essay you mention is confusing and contradictory. To apply what I believe to the case here, if there's a consensus of Knowledge (XXG) editors that editorial judgment (or quality control) of
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The website or content has won a well-known and independent award from either a publication or organization. Ideally, this award itself is also notable and already has a Knowledge (XXG) article.
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Damn, it was archived? Hmmm. I guess you are in the right place then... have you compared this to the guideline? How does it meet the criteria? Tells us what point is unclear and we can help. --
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I removed various instances of repeated spaces within the code. This has no effect on the article's appearance, but explains the apparent lack of changes in some highlighted regions in the diff.
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notable, simple as that. The SSG were created because you can be notable without meeting the GNG. Anyone claiming otherwise, is just deluding themselves because they personally dislike them.
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If winning an award does not result in significant coverage in reliable sources, you can be pretty sure that the award is not "a well-known and independent award". I don't see anything in the
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The content is distributed via a medium which is both respected and independent of the creators, either through an online newspaper or magazine, an online publisher, or an online broadcaster;
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Per both Protonk and NinjaRobotPirate above, notability only means "Do we have enough reliable, independent source text to use to help us write an article." If the source text doesn't exist
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video, has over 550 thousand hits, nearly 27 thousand likes and has nearly 5,000 comments. All in 17 hours. To me, all these stats would say he's quite notable per his large fanbase. And per
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Unfortunately, I really don't think that would work, unless it's made into a guideline. People will just point out that it's only an essay, as I've seen a alot of people do with regards to
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self-published on the web, all of the books published only on the web, the Adobe Creative Cloud, and every Netflix original series? It looks like that line is more than 10 years old, added
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otherwise a youtubers article will be either a directory entry listing only bare numbers like subscribers and viewcounts and video totals OR it will be a battleground of original research.
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article that seems to be from a major newspaper called "Biotech Week". I thought it may be better than the Knight Foundation article. They're both from the Google search. Much love,
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The original poster has a point. If someone is extremely popular, that makes them notable, period. If our guidelines don't allow for that, there's something wrong with our guidelines.
1707:, he would usually get an article. But since he's a YouTuber and, again, since YouTubers don't usually get media coverage, he doesn't. And, of course, that rings true for SDM as seen
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People prefacing their comments with their stance on whether a change is needed or not, per common forms of RFC's doesn't mean they're not up for discussion and suggestion so isnt'
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slapdash interviews. We let stuff up that isn't particularly notable just because the guidelines here for inclusion are already overly generous, let's not open the door even more.
2336:, viewership numbers can be gamed. Better to stick to the standard of reliable sources per WP:N (which as noted above has allowed some YTers to have articles without problem). --
1772:"Reliable sources that go into detail about the channel/person are very unlikely" -- let me stop you right there. If there are no reliable sources, how can you possibly satisfy
1067:, which says that "notability is not inherited". I know that the link is an essay, not a guideline, but why should we make an exception to this principle for web content? Best —
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article, rather than an unbalanced regurgitation of what the syndicate's marketing department (and your own original research from reading the comic strips) wants you to say?
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Anyway, this SNG with possibly only one unique criteria seems like it might be a good SNG to merge with another page, perhaps NCORP. Thoughts? Am I missing something here? –
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Internet and the web aren't even the same things! It certainly doesn't help that this very guideline doesn't distinguish between the two either (I even launched an RfD on
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Right. Loads and loads and loads of famous people have taken a dump at any particular roadside rest-stop. Notability does not rub off from the notable onto other things.
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If a topic has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject, it is presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list.
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advanced faster than you had expected. The question of how Notability should interact with Youtubers was interesting to analyze, I like that you raised the question.
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That could be made clearer by changing "trivial" to "nonselective". However, it's still unclear why this criterion is needed from the example given. The podcast of
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Imagine that you have to write an article about your blog (not about you). Imagine that the article must be fully sourced, and that every single source must meet
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I don't know what the answer is except to suggest that the rules should be flexible and open-ended rather than creating fences to keep out minorities.
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Any content accessed via the internet and engaged with primarily through a web browser is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline.
1879:, do not indicate notability. Without reliable sources, we really don't have anything say, which is why we have these policies in the first place.
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No. The purpose of specific notability guidelines (entertainer, academic, etc.) is to give editors good heuristics for when a subject will meet the
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2067:. It is the existence of Reliable Sources taking note of it that confer that permanent status. Knowledge (XXG) can't grant Notability just because
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Are our notability guidelines really fair for YouTubers who naturally get little to no coverage, regardless of whether they have a large fan base?
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I've just remembered that there's also the footnote that states products sold primarily on the web count as web content. That needs changing too.
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This isn't about me and my blog, but I'm using myself as an example to illustrate the difficulty of establishing notability under existing rules.
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don't see why topics that have such a narrow audience should have an article in the first place. To put it another way, we often point users to
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It must have a professional structure in place for deciding whether to publish something, such as editorial oversight or peer review processes.
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Let me explain. YouTube has become one of the most popular sites on the internet. Many of their users make a career off of it. YouTubers like
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All websites are distributed via the media of HTTP, which is respected and independent of 99.99% of websites. Are 99.99% of websites notable?
3188:'s YouTube account, and he has around 2 and a quarter million subscribers. Of course, I don't know if that's the norm for notable YouTubers.
2091:: I've yet to see an explanation of how an article lacking reliable sources can possibly satisfy our other inclusion criteria, particularly
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I rephrased the line defining "web concept" in the first paragraph ("any content of this guideline, as web content") to remove awkwardness.
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I'd like to highlight that, as well as winning Shorty Awards, Foodimentary has had 3 articles written where it is the sole subject. One by
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particular clause gives me no impression that sources would immediately follow by meeting this mark. Thus, it is appropriate to delete. --
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How many sources talking about your blog and meeting all of these requirements could you find? How long would the resulting article be?
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form of web-specific content" for precision of meaning and to illustrate (yet again) that the guideline does not apply in every situation.
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what would the next sentence be? If there isn't notable coverage in reliable sources we don't have the information to put in an article.
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To respond to this, what would your article say? "SDM is a youtuber who in september 2014 had over 10 million subscribers. " And without
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I fixed footnote #2 by correcting the meaning of the sentence. The article about the content should be redirected, not the web content!
2408:; if the subject of an article, who happens to by a youtube content creator, has received significant coverage from reliable sources,
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459:. I wouldn't say the article itself is the ultimate reference as to what reliable sources are available for the article. Much love,
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Post-close comment, for when this inevitably comes up again: Aside from what the closer said, the underlying rationale is faulty: '
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Last line, first paragraph "No inherent notability": I made the first letter of "see" lowercase for grammatical/stylistic reasons.
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But that relies on a clear definition of "product"? Is a paid VPN service a product? A digital-only album (free or paid)? ... —
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believe that this very talk page would be the place to do it, and that you would probably need to write up something like a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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People still seem to be misunderstanding, this isn't a vote, or even a !vote. It's not a straw poll. It's a discussion.
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source that is still accessible to the public. (So a speech is useless , but a webpage describing the speech is fine.)
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I'm not disagreeing with the premise, just the proposed fix. I just think saying "products" creates another ambiguity.
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or at least it can be easily interpreted that way ("medium which is both respected and independent of the creators" =
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I looked into this a little deeper. It seems that a workable solution would be to incorporate a short description of
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Since this is far from my area of expertise I'm wondering if anyone can help with the notability of these two entries
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Any content which is distributed solely on the Internet is considered web content for the purposes of this guideline.
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I don't know about those (though I imagine they're products), but I do know software are products. As both me and
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2724:. Looking forward to hearing what others think, but perhaps you'd like to propose a way to clarify the scope? —
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Earlier I opposed, but I would now like to take into account the clarification that this was a discussion about
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I'm not really sure as to what solution can be proposed to this: the current guideline does appear outdated. --
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Let's take the aforementioned Sky Does Minecraft (henceforth referred to as "SDM") as an example. SDM has over
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on the relationship between SNGs and the GNG which might be of interest to editors who watch this page. Best,
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YouTube has become one of the most popular sites on the internet. Many of their users make a career off of it.
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For these reasons, despite the well-reasoned arguments on both sides, I can say that the rough consensus is
2901:. It's the guidelines and policies that need changing; simply writing an essay won't have any impact here.
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the list goes on, I personally think the guidelines are fine & fair & don't need changing at all. –
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qualifies as notable under a certain special guideline. Isn't that because they already know it likely
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for having 1 million subscribers (although significance is lower than notability). I also just checked
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exactly covers this, as well, pretty much word-for-word, other than the quote from the OP in the RFC.
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Knowledge (XXG) talk:Notability (academics)#RfC about independent sources for academic notability
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This guideline covers several related areas. Please see discussions on website sub-types at:
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making the change to the guideline and starting an RfC if an editor objects to the change.
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it. It's pretty clear from the discussion above that this criterion 3 is incompatible with
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1166:? How do you decide what to say after the first half sentence? I know how to get through
1044:. Alas, the article is deleted but I will make my suggestion on that article's talk page.
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worried that these may not meet the notability criteria as they seem to be at the moment.
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have a "respected and independent publisher" criterion. The closest I can find is
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except the comic's own website or other sources very closely related to the comic?
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I reworded the last paragraph (or line) in "No inherited notability" more concise.
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This SNG seems a bit verbose. The meat and potatoes of this SNG/page seems to be
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It must be published by a reputable publishing house (rather than by the author).
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An RfC which might be of interest to watchers of this page has been opened at
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youtube channel which at had over subscribers" what else could we include?
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If anyone has any objections or comments, feel free to discuss them below.
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popularity from YouTube qualifies as "temporary notability" as suggested.
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Agree that web content definition needs revision. Under this definition,
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/No Room for Magic (2nd nomination)
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Comment withdrawn. I shouldn't have been sarcastic in the first place.
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I clarified, slightly, the meaning of various sentences in footnote #5.
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have more weight than coverage of Carrie Lukas in published sources.
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of content covered by other subject-specific notability criteria. —
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The source must have a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy.
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Funny you should mention this now: I've just declined an A7 on
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is not an indicator of notability. For Carrie Lukas, not every
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There is a lot of people opposing a discussion, it seems. —
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bloggers as rivals, and many are scornful about amateurs).
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Late to the discussion, but I was thinking the same thing.
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whether or not we should consider expanding the concept of
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hit... having independent sources discuss a topic can not.
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consider a popular Youtuber to be inherently noteworthy.
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has an article. I conjecture that her connection to the
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I made the final line of the final lead paragraph (about
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RfC: How can non-web content be classed as web content?
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for notability of specific items I'd suggest asking at
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of the following conditions, as substantiated through
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RfC about independent sources for academic biographies
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The latter. Fonts are not websites, but are software.
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OK, so where's the cutoff? The fact is that getting
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In the final lead paragraph (in the part describing
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2179:- There's alot of youtubers who have articles -
532:I clarified the first sentence of the article. "
3298:Editors are welcome to join the discussion. --
3292:Knowledge (XXG):Notability (academics)#Criteria
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2513:Nothing to fix. All is fine the way it is.--
1967:#1 song on the Billboard American main chart
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3066:In that case I support that change. --
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2065:Notability#Notability_is_not_temporary
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1553:Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus
1548:Knowledge (XXG):Notability (software)
1522:Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus
619:Footnote #6 may in fact be redundant.
208:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Webcomics
7:
2984:. That is a video game designed for
2633:The following discussion is closed.
1645:The following discussion is closed.
1207:No, this criterion is not necessary.
961:The following discussion is closed.
944:the idea that C3 should be deleted.
310:Knowledge (XXG):Notability (web)/Old
213:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Blogging
2254:what would we base the article on?
34:for discussing improvements to the
3242:to decide the following question:
2578:There is no objection to changing
1689:over 500 million likes on Facebook
1544:Knowledge (XXG):Notability (fonts)
25:
3290:Shall the wording in the section
3146:The discussion above is closed.
1691:(verified page, by the way), and
980:previous AfD discussion from 2006
933:criterion three really necessary?
671:pages is probably a matter for a
56:New to Knowledge (XXG)? Welcome!
3265:: Academics/professors meeting
3249:: Academics/professors meeting
3218:to see how the cards might fall.
2528:The discussion above is closed.
2448:
1478:The discussion above is closed.
231:
195:
51:Click here to start a new topic.
3321:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Notability
2944:, would be beneficial. Thanks,
523:consistent throughout the text.
511:perspective, which I did so in
505:my recent request for adminship
2523:00:46, 19 September 2014 (UTC)
2504:08:02, 16 September 2014 (UTC)
2479:02:19, 16 September 2014 (UTC)
2443:14:50, 14 September 2014 (UTC)
1637:23:26, 24 September 2014 (UTC)
1550:be a better place for this? --
797:15:59, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
750:15:05, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
339:Shorty Awards and Foodimentary
1:
3439:22:14, 13 February 2022 (UTC)
3198:00:18, 25 February 2017 (UTC)
3175:22:49, 24 February 2017 (UTC)
3162:notable YouTuber would have.
2936:Thanks for starting the RfC,
2872:. Anyway, that's what I do.
2545:
2422:22:40, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
2393:08:08, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
2374:19:37, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
2349:05:08, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
2323:01:24, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
2300:01:08, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
2278:00:29, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
2264:13:03, 4 September 2014 (UTC)
2234:15:05, 3 September 2014 (UTC)
2213:00:15, 1 September 2014 (UTC)
2168:01:24, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
2099:. As such, this is moot. --
1825:13:03, 4 September 2014 (UTC)
1569:
1473:18:21, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
1182:article? How do you write a
954:11:10, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
900:
823:
820:#RfC: Notability of YouTubers
676:
48:Put new text under old text.
18:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Websites
3474:#1 seems identical to GNG. –
3333:21:50, 7 November 2020 (UTC)
1835:general notability guideline
1596:RfC: Notability of YouTubers
1450:19:56, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
1431:06:15, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
1417:06:12, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
1333:04:30, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
1318:03:36, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
1296:16:32, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
1269:18:37, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
1196:21:27, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
1145:13:47, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
1118:01:14, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
1095:18:25, 19 January 2012 (UTC)
1076:14:56, 19 January 2012 (UTC)
1054:13:32, 19 January 2012 (UTC)
1030:13:07, 19 January 2012 (UTC)
991:00:49, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
895:23:31, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
879:04:52, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
812:23:36, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
762:It must be a third-party or
491:15:31, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
469:15:19, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
449:15:52, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
429:17:48, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
404:17:38, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
383:17:18, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
361:16:53, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
2624:) 04:14, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
2334:particularly on Youtube/etc
2149:20:03, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
2120:19:10, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
2082:05:33, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
2052:17:29, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
2033:12:10, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
2016:05:39, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
1980:05:53, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
1961:02:55, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
1916:23:00, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
1889:01:11, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
1857:00:41, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
1797:17:05, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
1768:00:35, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
1746:18:23, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
1732:16:07, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
1705:WP:ENTERTAINER, criterion 2
1669:16:07, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
1563:04:21, 14 August 2014 (UTC)
1532:04:24, 14 August 2014 (UTC)
3562:
3134:15:03, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
3107:14:59, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
3086:14:58, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
3053:14:56, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
3031:14:51, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
3002:14:46, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
2964:12:25, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
2926:23:30, 15 April 2016 (UTC)
2911:22:15, 15 April 2016 (UTC)
2882:05:04, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
555:is an official policy...".
99:
3546:09:18, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
3530:09:02, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
3490:09:07, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
3464:09:07, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
3410:11:18, 3 April 2021 (UTC)
3391:08:44, 3 April 2021 (UTC)
3379:. It's not a guarantuee.
3366:07:30, 3 April 2021 (UTC)
3228:07:43, 3 April 2021 (UTC)
2851:00:41, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
2821:22:46, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2799:22:29, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2770:22:21, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2756:21:56, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2734:21:44, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2706:21:29, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2679:19:38, 3 April 2016 (UTC)
2566:17:21, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
1590:17:14, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
1503:21:44, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
1493:Does it has notability?--
1488:http://www.muturzikin.com
921:17:23, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
844:17:27, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
771:Knowledge (XXG):Published
697:17:34, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
641:11:31, 20 June 2011 (UTC)
86:Be welcoming to newcomers
3496:Web SNG is a bit verbose
3148:Please do not modify it.
2636:Please do not modify it.
2530:Please do not modify it.
1647:Please do not modify it.
1480:Please do not modify it.
1366:, personal blogs, etc.).
1209:The two examples given,
963:Please do not modify it.
3306:23:33, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
818:My post-RfC comment at
759:of these requirements:
3296:
2982:Operation: Inner Space
2628:
2592:
2584:
1685:10 million subscribers
1368:
1235:National Review Online
1223:National Review Online
1133:National Review Online
1004:National Review Online
81:avoid personal attacks
3338:But GNG=Notable, yes?
3186:Angry Video Game Nerd
3157:Notability on YouTube
2588:
2580:
764:WP:Independent source
737:Ok, off my soapbox!
2686:Adobe Creative Cloud
2404:as per reasoning of
1701:Ice Bucket Challenge
651:best practices as a
417:Fine Cooking Article
3216:Request for Comment
3129:I dropped the bass?
3081:I dropped the bass?
3026:I dropped the bass?
2959:I dropped the bass?
2288:assuming good faith
1619:I hope this helps.—
1538:Notability of fonts
1221:being published by
1213:being published by
1129:Goldwater Institute
3283:sources which are
1648:
964:
519:I made the use of
409:Epicurious Article
92:dispute resolution
53:
3528:
3488:
3462:
2718:
2542:secondary sources
2477:
2440:
2414:RightCowLeftCoast
2252:Original Research
1646:
1635:
1211:No Room for Magic
1164:write the article
1038:No Room for Magic
999:editorial control
962:
661:WP:LOCALCONSENSUS
413:SlashFood article
333:
332:
302:
301:
225:
224:
190:
189:
72:Assume good faith
49:
16:(Redirected from
3553:
3522:
3520:
3502:the two criteria
3482:
3480:
3456:
3454:
3428:
3384:
3263:Proposed wording
3258:reliable sources
3117:Rubbish computer
3096:
3093:Rubbish computer
3069:Rubbish computer
3065:
3041:
3038:Rubbish computer
3014:Rubbish computer
2978:
2975:Rubbish computer
2947:Rubbish computer
2942:NinjaRobotPirate
2918:NinjaRobotPirate
2896:
2893:NinjaRobotPirate
2874:NinjaRobotPirate
2831:
2818:
2816:
2787:
2780:
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1897:it doesn't exist
1881:NinjaRobotPirate
1792:
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1722:
1697:his latest video
1695:. Even further,
1667:
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1559:
1528:
1413:
1412:Mr. Stradivarius
1398:
1380:
1310:
1261:Rangoondispenser
1072:
1071:Mr. Stradivarius
987:
986:Mr. Stradivarius
970:A recent AfD at
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36:Notability (web)
27:
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3498:
3476:
3450:
3425:A loose necktie
3422:
3402:A loose necktie
3380:
3371:GNG ≠ Notable:
3358:A loose necktie
3340:
3313:
3247:Current wording
3236:
3220:A loose necktie
3159:
3154:
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2690:OS X El Capitan
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2533:
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2241:Strongly Oppose
2227:
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2025:Graeme Bartlett
2010:
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1676:CaptainSparklez
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1391:distributed by
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1231:National Review
1108:say about it?
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1008:Huffington Post
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3377:to be suitable
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2839:world wide web
2828:Rhododendrites
2815:Rhododendrites
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3518:Novem Linguae
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3478:Novem Linguae
3473:
3470:I agree that
3469:
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3452:Novem Linguae
3447:
3446:GNG ≠ Notable
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1437:Ricky Gervais
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58:Learn to edit
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33:
29:
28:
19:
3538:BilledMammal
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3431:BilledMammal
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3341:
3314:
3311:SNGs and GNG
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3019:
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2988:PCs running
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2657:WP:NSOFTWARE
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1994:
1966:
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1865:Bethany Mota
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1423:Stuartyeates
1409:
1394:The Guardian
1392:
1378:
1351:
1349:
1325:Stuartyeates
1322:
1302:
1275:
1219:Carrie Lukas
1206:
1188:WhatamIdoing
1183:
1176:zero sources
1175:
1167:
1163:
1125:Carrie Lukas
1110:WhatamIdoing
1068:
1065:WP:INHERITED
998:
983:
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857:
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826:
789:WhatamIdoing
756:
742:ANZLitLovers
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537:
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502:
436:Foodimentary
433:
364:
349:Foodimentary
342:
334:
237:
202:
130:
30:This is the
3373:A topic is
3315:There is a
3285:independent
3268:one or more
3114:I agree. --
2990:Windows 3.1
2835:WP:INTERNET
2807:guideline"?
2653:WP:NPRODUCT
2549:SMcCandlish
2515:Mark Miller
2275:Mysterytrey
2089:Firm oppose
1953:Herostratus
1877:big numbers
1873:Pat Condell
1765:Mysterytrey
1573:SMcCandlish
1284:IP protocol
904:SMcCandlish
827:SMcCandlish
680:SMcCandlish
509:copyediting
503:As part of
499:Copyediting
3382:Paradoctor
3317:discussion
3167:HarryOtter
2694:Windows 10
1869:Phil Mason
1623:S Marshall
1558:reply here
1527:reply here
1509:User:Kaiyr
1442:ASCIIn2Bme
1364:Newgrounds
1352:except for
1288:ASCIIn2Bme
1248:WP:NOTFILM
940:Consensus
665:WP:FACTION
597:analogous.
563:notability
367:Epicurious
3325:Barkeep49
3300:Netoholic
3281:secondary
3273:published
2789:content)
2496:SPACKlick
2406:SPACKlick
2385:SPACKlick
2292:SPACKlick
2256:SPACKlick
2189:Pewdiepie
2181:Shaytards
1817:SPACKlick
1240:WP:AUTHOR
1172:web comic
946:Ironholds
855:notable.
669:WP:POLICY
663:-pushing
653:community
584:WP:SPEEDY
513:this edit
396:Griswaldo
353:Griswaldo
297:Archive 9
292:Archive 8
287:Archive 7
280:Archive 6
275:Archive 5
270:Archive 4
263:Archive 3
258:Archive 2
253:Archive 1
102:Shortcuts
94:if needed
77:Be polite
32:talk page
3375:presumed
3277:reliable
3190:Adam9007
3112:Adam9007
3099:Adam9007
3062:Adam9007
3045:Adam9007
3009:Adam9007
2994:Adam9007
2938:Adam9007
2903:Adam9007
2843:Adam9007
2791:Adam9007
2748:Adam9007
2671:Adam9007
2662:and used
2606:contribs
2596:Adam9007
2594:Pinging
2473:and done
2454:Comment:
2356:Comment'
2310:changing
2044:Blueboar
1465:DreamGuy
1360:Facebook
1244:WP:NBOOK
1227:Keenspot
1215:Keenspot
1082:Keenspot
1042:Keenspot
942:supports
929:RfC: Is
887:DreamGuy
804:DreamGuy
673:WP:VPPOL
627:Guoguo12
238:Archives
132:Archives
62:get help
3472:WP:NWEB
3207:billion
3182:442oons
3165:Thanks
2784:Appable
2698:Appable
2489:Vertium
2465:Vertium
2271:Comment
2131:changes
2127:Comment
1849:Protonk
1389:podcast
1356:YouTube
1280:WP:NPOV
1252:WP:BAND
1184:neutral
1010:, etc.)
613:anyway.
580:WP:PROD
394:itself.
117:WT:NWEB
2899:WP:A7M
2870:WP:VPP
2618:Cunard
2614:boldly
2511:Oppose
2459:WP:GNG
2410:WP:GNG
2402:Oppose
2368:Head90
2363:CRRays
2330:Oppose
2228:Head90
2223:CRRays
2208:(talk)
2177:Oppose
2143:Head90
2138:CRRays
2097:WP:NOR
2061:Oppose
1934:WP:BIO
1930:WP:GNG
1903:Jayron
1844:Ntsimp
1839:likely
1738:Ntsimp
1726:Head90
1721:CRRays
1663:Head90
1658:CRRays
1461:Delete
1387:had a
1276:Delete
1256:WP:WEB
931:WP:WEB
657:WP:OWN
634:(Talk)
373:page).
110:WT:WEB
3353:fails
3349:maybe
3123:HALP!
3075:HALP!
3020:HALP!
2986:80386
2953:HALP!
2648:WP:A7
2432:Monty
2315:Alsee
2195:Davey
2160:Alsee
2114:Kevin
2074:Alsee
2011:Focus
1972:Alsee
1813:WP:RS
1791:Kevin
1776:? --
1495:Kaiyr
1339:here:
1170:is a
1137:patsw
1087:patsw
1046:patsw
1022:patsw
1002:(3).(
874:Focus
675:RfC.
588:WP:A7
483:Eikou
461:Eikou
421:Eikou
391:WP:RS
375:Eikou
246:Index
90:Seek
38:page.
3542:talk
3525:talk
3485:talk
3459:talk
3435:talk
3406:talk
3387:talk
3362:talk
3329:talk
3251:any
3224:talk
3194:talk
3171:talk
3103:talk
3049:talk
2998:talk
2922:talk
2907:talk
2878:talk
2847:talk
2795:talk
2752:talk
2722:here
2702:talk
2675:talk
2622:talk
2600:talk
2519:talk
2500:talk
2418:talk
2389:talk
2340:ASEM
2319:talk
2296:talk
2260:talk
2200:2010
2164:talk
2095:and
2093:WP:V
2078:talk
2048:talk
2029:talk
1976:talk
1957:talk
1932:and
1885:talk
1853:talk
1821:talk
1742:talk
1709:here
1499:talk
1469:talk
1446:talk
1427:talk
1329:talk
1309:ASEM
1303:This
1292:talk
1265:talk
1246:nor
1217:and
1192:talk
1168:This
1141:talk
1131:and
1114:talk
1091:talk
1050:talk
1026:talk
950:talk
891:talk
808:talk
793:talk
746:talk
582:and
487:talk
479:this
465:talk
457:this
445:talk
425:talk
400:talk
379:talk
371:talk
357:talk
347:and
79:and
3344:two
3319:at
3253:one
3211:not
2819:\\
2768:\\
2732:\\
2667:web
2655:or
2586:to
2563:ⱷ≼
2559:≽ⱷ҅
2438:845
1943:one
1587:ⱷ≼
1583:≽ⱷ҅
1242:,
918:ⱷ≼
914:≽ⱷ҅
841:ⱷ≼
837:≽ⱷ҅
757:all
694:ⱷ≼
690:≽ⱷ҅
649:our
573:AfD
534:Any
3544:)
3437:)
3408:)
3389:)
3364:)
3331:)
3279:,
3275:,
3226:)
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3126::
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3078::
3051:)
3029:)
3023::
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2962:)
2956::
2924:)
2909:)
2880:)
2849:)
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2754:)
2704:)
2692:,
2688:,
2677:)
2608:).
2546:—
2521:)
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2371:|
2347:)
2321:)
2298:)
2262:)
2231:|
2204:•
2187:,
2183:,
2166:)
2146:|
2080:)
2069:we
2050:)
2031:)
1978:)
1959:)
1910:32
1887:)
1871:,
1867:,
1855:)
1823:)
1763:—
1744:)
1729:|
1666:|
1570:—
1511::
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1471:)
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1429:)
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1294:)
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1194:)
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1093:)
1052:)
1028:)
952:)
901:—
893:)
824:—
810:)
795:)
748:)
740:--
677:—
566:}}
560:{{
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