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comparison to the criticism. Googling "Jan Wong was right" gives 8 hits, within which are mostly blogger comments which are not useful for citations. So her point seems to be unilaterally condemned in the media and it's I think legitimate then to portray it here as such unless someone can find some support (I couldn't). My own complaint with this article is that there is detail, comprehensive, and then over the top in terms of listing the criticisms. Should every notable
Canadian that spoke on this issue be listed within the article? Where is enough enough and where does it begin detracting from the content of the article and begin instead to be simply burying the journalist? How much is enough to make the point here? We can take any jerk in history and insert a long list of people's comments condemning them and it does not make a wikipedia article.
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cannot be pursuaded to return to the wikiarticle and remove those cricial comments which cannot be substantiated by citation to independent writers, then perhaps the article should simply be deleted. This would be unfortunate as the entire Wong incident proved very insightful vis-à -vis the relationship of Québec to its immigrant populations and the place of Québec in the
Canadian confederation.
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reporting, and I found her work to be of a consistently high standard. Sure, she is provocative. Good for her. It would appear that with this column, she touched a raw nerve indeed. We used to say, "If the shoe fits, wear it." Apparently that rule has changed to, "If the shoe fits, beat up on the cobbler."
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I don't think it's so easy to find anything in print that supports her. As one article put it from
Edmonton (critical of her), she broke a Canadian Taboo. People either pile on in this situation or, seeing the dogpile, slowly step back. That said I would speculate that any support for her is small in
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Those that are the critical viewpoint of the wikiauthor violate
Knowledge policy and need to be excised from the text. Ultimately, only the wikiauthor knows which of the critical viewpoints are his/hers and which are those of independent authors and are merely being reported herein. If the wikiauthor
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I had the same experience reading the article, and the skill with which "those critiques that were published after Wong's article and those criticisms that are actually the product of the
Knowledge author" are confounded in the article leads me to suspect the a professional writer worked very hard to
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section had a statement to the effect that
Montreal has one of the lowest crime rates in North America. The phrase, “in North America,” is misleading since it is a truism that every Canadian metropolitan area has a lower, per capita crime rate than comparable American metropolitan areas. Total bans
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My understanding of the role of
Knowledge as it would relate to the so-called “Jan Wong Controversy” is that the author of an article relating to the matter is supposed to fairly present the two sides of the debate. He is not to use the creation of the Knowledge article for the purposes of producing
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This entry, in its current form, seems almost entirely concerned with painting with Mrs. Wong's article in the worst possible light. I don't have an opinion on Mrs. Wong's article itself (in fact, I haven't read it and didn't even know about the controversy until reading about it here on
Knowledge),
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This article is basically a "Let's dump as much trash on top of this woman" kind of article. It is a very sexist and racist article that gives a lot of undue weight to all these different statements condemning her. It should be trimmed, and there should be enough counter viewpoints in favour of her
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article. Is this allowed at
Knowledge? To just up and delete an entire article without any discussion? Also, the small section of the article of which the Jan Wong Controversy is now a part reads more like an op/ed piece and less like an encyclopedia article than did the larger Jan Wong article it
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This piece is shockingly biased and should be corrected or deleted. There is a valid discussion to be had around the Jan Wong column and the political reaction to it, but this entry constitutes character assassination masquerading as discussion. For the record, I have been the subject of Jan Wong's
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did give rise to controversy in Canada, particularly in the province of Québec where it was especially relevant. However, it is difficult when reading this wikiarticle to discern which of the criticisms and viewpoints in opposition to Ms. Wong are from articles published by other commentators and
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Hi all, I'm not too familiar with this topic, so I wanted to pose an edit request for someone who knows the topic better than myself. Shouldn't the title of the article (Jan Wong controversy) be bolded in the first sentence of the introduction? Right now, the introduction doesn't use that phrase
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Jan Wong lived in Quebec for years and never bothered to learn the language. No wonder she feels discriminated against. If I lived in
Toronto for years and didn't bother to learn english I would feel discirminated against too. But then again, maybe i could learn ? She knows nothing about Quebec
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I agree completely. I don't have an opinion on Wong's opinion piece - I haven't read it - but she is a totally legit journalist. No one seems to be concerned with the absolute chutzpah of Parliament calling on a journalist to waive her free speech. Accordingly, I'm tagging the article.
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Actually, Wong was born and raised in the west end of Montreal during the 1950s and 60s. It was an entirely English-speaking part of town. There was no practical need for anglophones to speak French at the time. I think Wong's analysis was bullshit, but I don't think you can fault her
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Er, who exactly decided "pure laine" was "deprecated"? It may be deeply politically incorrect to use nowadays, rather like the terms "Negro" or "Jewess" in English, but "deprecated" suggests it has been excised from the somehow language, which is obviously false.
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Since there's no evidence of ongoing discussion, I'm removing the tag for now. If discussion is continuing and I've failed to see it, however, please feel free to restore the template and continue to address the issues. Thanks to everybody working on this one! --
948:"However, five Canadian shootings out of eight have actually occurred outside Quebec, according to Bryan's own newspaper." (cites "Quand les fusibles sautent Ă Toronto" by the Saint-Jean-Baptiste Society, CNW Telbec, September 18, 2006.) marked
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However, in Canada itself, Montreal has the fourth highest crime rate, while Canada's largest city, Toronto, bottoms out the list of cities having populations of 500,000 or more. (See: Sauvé, Julie. “Crime Statistics in Canada, 2004.”
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We should be able to say Jan Wong used the term without some mealymouthed qualifier explaining modern Quebecers don't use the term much now. Come to think of it, if it's really that important to mention, then
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I recall "pure laine" being used all the time in Quebec. That's not good enough for wikipedia of course. It comes up more often when the sovereignty movement is strong. Reference google ngrams:
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I think that before anyone can copy edit this article, the origiator of it needs to return to the article and distinguish his critiques from those that can be sourced to publications.
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It is interesting to note that those who reacted so negatively to her article are successful bilingual individuals who would not have had experienced the bias the article speaks of.
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which contains much less detail on this spat. I think this is sufficiently notable for its own article, especially since it's specifically linked from the FA-level article
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I tried to simply copy edit this article, but never got past the “article” section. The problem for me was that many of the sentences read as critiques of Wong’s
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I don't think the removal of these two statements affects the POV of the article in any significant way given that many other sources condemned Wong's article.
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If one is to interview those individuals who are not French bilingual, there would be ample evidence that Jan Wong's observations are highly perceptive.
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added, and yes they are absolutely out there. This has to be one of the most racist and sexist articles I have ever come across. It is very slanderous.
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at the top of the page and await discussion, or should we have discussion first? As a wikinewbie I feel insufficiently experienced to make the call.
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https://web.archive.org/web/20070311075939/http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/story.html?id=7e75959e-b11b-4a7f-865d-2ec86fc78f4d&k=53879
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for not speaking French, especially considering the last time she lived in the city was in the early 1970s. Montreal was very different then. --
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https://web.archive.org/web/20121023005926/http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/story.html?id=7558331f-14b9-4b1a-bfc1-e5a68dbe3999&k=47772
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I agree, this article is just a long list of "OMG, then Billy said he didn't like it. OMG, then Jane said it made her mad. Then..."
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https://web.archive.org/web/20121025040555/http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=68973176-3342-4164-b62c-ed7eb0beaace
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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I don’t know if anyone will ever notice, but the Jan Wong article has completely disappeared and insteads redirects to a
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I've removed an old neutrality tag from this page that appears to have no active discussion per the instructions at
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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verbatim. If no one takes care of this, I'll do my best to give it a stab in the next few days. Thanks.
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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The idea behind this wikiarticle is a good one. The Jan Wong essay published on the front page of the
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This template is not meant to be a permanent resident on any article. Remove this template whenever:
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http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/story.html?id=7558331f-14b9-4b1a-bfc1-e5a68dbe3999&k=47772
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/columnists/story.html?id=6b3b71de-f7b6-442b-83a8-4f6245f23404
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1016:"in favour of her" that are missing? If not, I'm going to suggest we remove your neutrality tag.
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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https://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060915.wxshooting-main16/BNStory/National/
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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The lack of reaction from the rest of Canada should indicate that this entry lacks objectivity.
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It is not clear what the neutrality issue is, and no satisfactory explanation has been given
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You need a source that specifically points out this error in Wong's article. Otherwise it's
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There is consensus on the talkpage or the NPOV Noticeboard that the issue has been resolved
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http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=68973176-3342-4164-b62c-ed7eb0beaace
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902:. Articles like this are usually controversial, but they should still exist. Compare with
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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Volume 25, number 5. Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics. Statistics Canada. 2005.
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pure laine isn't that antiquated - I recall it being used pretty frequently
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https://web.archive.org/web/20120220125124/http://www.davidhayes.ca/wong.htm
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but this entry is definitely not neutral in tone and needs to be fixed. --
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when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information.
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http://www.ottawacitizen.com/entertainment/Wong%2Bblues/6566814/story.html
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In the absence of any discussion, or if the discussion has become dormant.
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http://www.google.ca/blogsearch?hl=fr&q=%22Jan+Wong%22+Quebec&lr=
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My next question is, should I go ahead and place the appropriate tag for
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on handguns will tend to reduce overall crime rates in any country.
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a (self-)published essay in which he also takes Ms. Wong to task.
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http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/MediaNews/2006/09/21/1872721-cp.html
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The subject of Jan Wong's article is a very relevant issue.
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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because she never made the effort to understand anything.
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Edit Request: Bolding Topic in Introduction Paragraph
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which are the critical viewpoints of the wikiauthor.
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900:École_Polytechnique_massacre#Search_for_a_rationale
33:for general discussion of the article's subject.
1060:removing POV tag with no active discussion per
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19:This is the
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769:—Preceding
720:Kilgore MTL
148:free images
31:not a forum
1451:Categories
1438:Report bug
1278:Report bug
716:personally
611:pure laine
600:Deprecated
455:Journalism
446:journalism
402:Journalism
1421:this tool
1414:this tool
1351:dead link
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979:Xasodfuih
935:Npovified
920:Xasodfuih
615:Saforrest
220:citations
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
1427:Cheers.—
1267:Cheers.—
1039:unsigned
804:Juristat
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218:Include
56:get help
29:This is
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1355:tag to
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1097:Khazar2
957:WP:SYNT
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869:of the
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242:B-class
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154:WPÂ refs
142:scholar
1347:Added
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508:Schnee
330:Canada
321:Canada
276:Quebec
271:Canada
248:scale.
126:Google
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999:Laval
953:WP:OR
169:JSTOR
130:books
84:Seek
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162:FENS
136:news
73:and
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