Talk:National Pacification Army

2203:, were written by the same author, Philip Jowett, and do not reflect the any kind of academic trend in the name's usage (Jowett is a prolific author, and a significant part of English-language books about the Warlord Era which were published in the last two decades belong to him). I do not think one can claim that "Ankuochun" is truly used by a majority of the RS; in fact, none of the names are used by the majority which appears to prefer descriptions to the army's official title. Overall, at least as I see it in the sources, no name is used to such an extent as to warrant a 1218:. At this time, there simply is not enough content to warrant an independent article for the military government, and the Beiyang government article itself is very incomplete, and could use fleshing out in that period. The scope of this article can be defined as the military organisation from 1926-1928, and the Beiyang government article can cover the government. Even the Chinese Knowledge article is clear that the military government was a mere incarnation of the Beiyang government, and not a separate entity. The last thing we want is a situation of 254: 1611:. You call American government documents from 1926 "recent" sources? We know the Ankuochun is used, we also know that National Pacification Army is used, and that Anguojun is used. That doesn't make any of them the common name, and certainly, none of the sources you selected 'specifies' that the common name is anything at all. Clearly you have no idea how Knowledge determines what a 'common name', is, and moreover, being the 'common name' is not the sole determining factor. There are other article title criteria, such as 244: 223: 418: 32: 2750: 2726: 2708: 2676: 2651: 2623: 2609: 2579: 2561: 2547: 2533: 2497: 2463: 181: 87: 1832:, exceptions do exist. That leads us with Ankuochun and National Pacification Army. "Ankuochun" has undoubtedly been a common name for this subject from its inception. However, in the present, Wade-Giles has largely fallen out of use, and Ngrams shows us that Ankuochun, too, has fallen away. When making this decision, I think we should take into account the article title criteria, specifically 129: 2953: 1222:, whereby multiple articles deal with the same subject. You need to understand that Knowledge articles do not exist in a vacuum...they are all connected, and must be considered as a whole rather than as individual, unrelated parts. On the subject of the title, I will reconsider WP guidelines and the relevant sources, but I cannot say that I think Wade-Giles is the best solution at this time. 517: 466: 1824: 2977: 2339: 1836:. Choosing between a rare, modern transliteration, and a formerly common, outdated transliteration, does not seem like a worthwhile enterprise. We'd have no choice if there was no common English name, but this is not the case. "National Pacification Army" has been used since this organisation's inception. It is commonly in modern academic works, including David Bonavia's 143: 118: 2780:

turned against Zhang Zuolin, siding with Feng. In January 1926, Zhang launched an offensive, ordering his troops in Fengtian and Shandong provinces to invade Beijing and Tianjin. In order to achieve peace, Feng expelled Duan Qirui from Beijing, reverting the political situation to what it was like before his coup, and was eventually forced to withdraw from area."

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starts, the reviewer will give feedback on what needs improving. You'll have about a week or so to implement the feedback and work with the reviewer. Unless a serious issue is found, the review will usually pass, but you do need to cooperate with the reviewer. While you wait for review, work on polishing the article up, especially prose and grammar.

356: 328: 2269:, principally use "National Pacification Army", and we can also call it the NPA for short. It's not at all clear if any WP:COMMONNAME exists, as different sources do use different names, but for lack of a common name, English Knowledge should use English words that are easier for our readers to understand. 2234:

As this is the English Knowledge, an English title will always be easier for our readers to understand. When I first approved this out of draft, I thought the name a bit..lacking, as I'd never heard of it before, and couldn't even puzzle out what it was until I'd read a fair chunk of the article. But

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One of the first things we need to do is clarify the timeline of events. I have been fixing a lot of errors, though it is admittedly confusing. When including events in a long article like this, always include the date, with a year. One area that this article is lacking in right now is the details of

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so other sections meet the same quality as the section that is to be split from this article. As a side note, it may be good to request a third opinion on the renaming of the article. Truth be told, I do not want to deal with this article right now as I am not very stoic. I will also rethink the GAN,

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Alternatively, as I believe there is enough information on the government that could be its own article, this article could be split, with the governmental side being made its own article. Parts of it could be shortened and kept to provide context for events in this article, and the new article could

937:. Sources that use 'Ankuochun' cannot be used to justify 'Anguojun'. However, you've now caused a problem, by conflating the NPA and the NPA military government. These are separate topics. The NPA existed as a mere military organisation from 1926. The military government, taking over for the existing 802:

also uses the Wade-Giles version. Sources at the time it was active (e.g. The Week in China (1927), Bulletin of International News (vol. 4 p. 199), The North American Review (vol. 228 p. 144), The Spectator (vol. 139 p. 540), The China Monthly Review (vol. 45 p. 46), The Illustrated London News (vol.

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page and its subpages (ensuring that you know the criteria well), and then nominate the article. It will take a few weeks to a few months for a reviewer to pickup the article. I would review it, but I'm afraid that only editors that haven't significantly edited the page may review it. Once the review

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Thank you, this was greatly appreciated. I've worked to do some copyediting, restructured some of the material, and moved relevant content to the Beiyang article. Hopefully I will be able to bring some new sources to the article in the coming days. The one thing I don't have available is Jowett, and

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of the existing article. Perhaps you were not aware of it existing, as you did not even link to it at the time you launched this article, but in any case, it did exist, and content related to that subject belongs there, not here. In English historiography, a clear distinction is made between the two

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article. I do still suggest that this article be kept as an article for both the army and the government, and for the scope to cover the two organizations in general, as the two were closely interlinked. Both articles will have to mention the same military events (which take up a substantial part of

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one through the use of propaganda. This is contrasted with organizations such as the Kuomintang, in which their military was the National Revolutionary Army. However, the Anguojun and the state itself were not as separate as with the KMT and the NRA. Foreign policy reports at the time refer to it as

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may also be too military-focused, as although the Anguojun/Ankuochun was mostly a military alliance, there was a political aspect to it and it functioned as a government and a military state (some sources, especially Chinese, call this the Anguojun Government, the Peking Government, or the Ankuochun

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I noticed a major problem in the article. This section of text is completely unsourced. "In October 1925, Sun Chuanfang began the invasion of Jiangsu, and Feng began his invasion of Shandong, which was now under the control of Fengtian general Zhang Zongchang. In November 1925, general Guo Songling

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Following that reply, I am now more afraid and also more angry, and I would like to end the discussion on the name soon. You and I are also both very convinced of our arguments, so I suggest to bring in RFC, 3O, or other dispute resolution noticeboards and/or state our simple arguments (without all

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I am not trying to demean your work at all. On the contrary, your contribution is greatly appreciated. All I want is for you to come up to speed on Knowledge policies...and help sort out what issues we have. There is no need for a removal of the GA nomination. I am sure this article can pass such a

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The problem may be that western and Chinese historiography categorise these events in different ways. Notably, the linked Chinese Knowledge article is only about the military government, and not about the military organisation. It explicitly excludes 1926 from its scope. I will leave these comments

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preference here on Knowledge, and thus we should stick to the one title most of our readers directly understand, i.e. an English one. As for the alternate translations - these surely exist, but they are used in such a small number that it would seem sufficient to simple mention them in the article

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I stand by what I said earlier, in that I prefer the title of National Pacification Army. Given the difficulties of transliteration, and the NATURALNESS of the NPA title, and issues on sourcing, I think it the better title. I think MJL was certainly well meaning, but some more discussion is needed

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So I finally managed to consult my sources - and to my surprise, none of the titles are actually used all that often; authors like Diana Lary ("Warlord Soldiers"), Jean Chesneaux ("Popular Movements and Secret Socities in China 1840-1950"), Elizabeth J. Perry ("Rebels and Revolutionaries in North

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It is hard to separate political and military events regarding this without losing context and coverage. The zhwiki article also talks about military events and somewhat touches on the formation of the formal alliance. I would prefer if this article is kept and expanded as a separate article from

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Having taken a bit more of a look, I can say this article is completely problematic at this stage. The first half clearly deals with the military organisation, but the public opinion and relations with the KMT sections refer to it as a government, without ever explaining the process by which this

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As for those books in which the army is named, here an overview from my sources: Philip Jowett generally uses "Ankuochun" in his works (he seems to be the one who most strongly influences the current use of that name). The authors of "China in the 1920s. Nationalism and Revolution" use National

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What on earth? We were in the middle of the discussing the matter, and as of this point, 3 out of 4 contributors favoured the previous title. We also have guidelines that discourage the use of Wade-Giles unless it is absolutely clear that this it is the common name, which is not determined, and

2195:– Per the arguments of RGloucester. I generally think that we should prefer English translations of names on this Knowledge, as it is the English Knowledge, especially if the alternatives are not uniformly used. It should also be noted that several of the more modern books (from 2007) that use 750:

is an exceedingly rare name for this entity in RS, and thus inappropriate, as far as I'm concerned. In any case, English names are preferred where they exist and are commonly used, and given the choice between a rare, but modern tranliteration, a common, but old transliteration, and the common

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I don't think you read my reply at all. I said that the pinyin, Anguojun, was less common than National Pacification Army, and that Ankuochun was more common, and that given the choice between the common English name in RS, a common, but old-fashioned transliteration, and a rare, but modern

1250:) will have to go into the political events in more detail, with military events summarized from this article, and the article for the army would have to go into detail about the army, while political events would have to be summarized from this article too. This would be content forking. 2956:

New GA, neutrally voiced, properly cited, no copyvio detected; both hooks cited (the citation is not immediately after the facts rendered in the DYK, but close enoughș source verifies them); hooks are interesting. One image from the article could be used, such as the Army symbol.

742:, which use 'National Pacification Army'. I am aware of the older army that you refer to, but this is not commonly referred to as the 'National Pacification Army' (or NPA) in RS, whereas this one is commonly referred to as such. In looking at Google Ngrams, it was clear that 2243:

while not very self explanatory is actually already a fairly well known word to many English speakers due to its historical prominence. But in this case, the transliterated titles are not even occasionally used in English. The descriptive English title is our best bet here.

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Finally, any argument about what title is used more often here on Knowledge is void - The current usage of the different titles just stems from this article not existing previously, whereupon people simply used whatever name their primary source provided them with.

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This interests me, actually - I don't have any sources in my personal library or on the Internet that I have seen use a romanization system other than Wade-Giles or Pinyin. What other spellings are presented? For the English name, I have seen multiple translations

702:, results regarding the Chinese army go up to the 2nd page. A search for "National Pacification Army" (quotation marks included) yields 3 results on JSTOR, 2 of which are from books I use as sources in this article that use the Chinese name. However, a search for 1908:(1983) use Pinyin for the name, it is still a rarity among reliable academic sources, as can be seen from Google Ngrams. It can also be seen from Google Ngrams that Ankuochun has been, historically, the most common name. We can see that, throughout the 2000s, 1123:

article. I think all content related with the governmental aspect will need to be removed to the Beiyang article, maybe involving a renaming or reconstruction of that article, with this article focusing solely on the military organisation that exist 1926–28.

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Oh and if possible, finding another quality source would be good. You rely pretty heavily on the one source, so finding another good book would allow for another perspective. If a book can't be found, you might also be able to find a scholarly article.

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a government rather than an army (Political Handbook of the World: Parliaments, Parties and Press (1928) refers to it as Ankuochun (Peking Government)). The US War Department referred to it as either the Ankuochun or the Northern Group

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is a natural way for other articles to link to this one, as many articles that were not changed refer to this army with the transliteration.), precise (It is distinguished from any other army or organization, more so than when using

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for anything else in English sources, although I have heard from an acquaintance that there was an obscure Manchurian army named the same thing (I have not been able to find mentions of it in any sources)), concise (Rather obvious,

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which seems to be roughly everyone's second choice. If there are objections, then I recommend a move request to sort it out. I apologize if my interference causes any unnecessary complications to the article's development. Regards,

1973:(Huguojun/Hukuochun, but the only English sources on Google Books that call it Hukuochun are two mid-late 20th century sources (1967 and 1983) and a few journals from the 1910s and 1920s), used most commonly and in these sources - 1887: 803:

82 p. 230), Papers Relating to the Foreign Relations of the United States (p. 659), Japan: Overseas Travel Magazine (vol. 16 p. 23), Soviet Union Review (vol. 5-7, p. 98), Current History and Forum (vol. 27, p. 450)). The use of

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I want to say that I support the translated name "National Pacification Army". In the scholarly works about the Warlord Era which I have access to, numerous spellings of the Chinese name exist, and none appears to be dominant.

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is what is usually used in English RS even though it is not a translation, and so readers would search for it if they are somewhat familiar/learning about the subject. As for linking from other Knowledge articles, the article

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overtook National Pacification Army and the English translation fell out of use in Google Books sources. However, since 2012, Google Ngrams shows us that no sources on Google Books in 2012 actually referred to the army, and

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is not particularly helpful. What it does show us, however, is that the pinyin transliteration is rare, presumably because this subject was primarily discussed at a time when it did not exist. While we favour pinyin per

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I am fine with retaining contextual political material in this article, as of course, that is necessary. However, I must insist that information on the establishment and operation of the military government be moved to

2166:(as said before, used by a majority of English RS, the only POV here is either some incredibly repressed and in-denial Chinese nationalism or a very well-hidden conflict in English historiography about China), and 1396:

I'm fairly certain he goes more into detail about the structure and composition of the army, which I think we could use more information on. Perhaps also we could place the total number of troops in the infobox.

682:(Surprisingly, it is mentioned in p. 135 that Dr. Sun Yat-sen actually changed the National Protection Army's name to National Pacification Army). Additionally, most RS I have used and seen have used either 1664:

China 1845-1945"), and Tai Hsüan-chih ("The Red Spears, 1916-1949") generally prefer to refer to this united army as alliance, clique, coalition or just army led by Zhang or the northern warlords in general.

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being more precise that is partially true, yet at the same time, the other NPA-like-named military units are vastly less prominent than this one, so I do not think any real risk of confusion truly exists.

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I believe there are enough sources on the politics and governmental aspects, especially relating to foreign policy. I was suggesting that the government be made into its own article, and related to

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Alright then, I concede my argument regarding the scope. You may do what you wish regarding splitting the article. You may want to summarize parts of this article in the article for the

154:. The project works to allow users to contribute quality articles and media files to the encyclopedia and track their progress as they are developed. To participate, please visit the 2762:

Congratulations on making such a good article. There were few issues with the article and offers great coverage of one of the fifteen billion different armies in China at the time.

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article, where there is already a section on that subject. This article is clearly dealing with military organisation, and not the government, and the two should not be conflated.

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on Google Books, there are only 5 results on the first page that actually refer to this army, and mentions of it are scattered in the following pages. However, upon searching for

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This article cannot be an article for both the country and government, because the two are separate entities, and article for the government already exists. You cannot create a

1874:– The Pinyin transliteration is not used much in academic sources, although more recent (late 20th century, starting from the 1980s) sources that touch on the subject such as 3087: 3082: 1269:

subjects, and this must be maintained. An article for a government, for instance, cannot have a military infobox. You would do best to focus on the military aspect here.

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The lead needs expanding. A lead should summarize the article, and ideally present not need citations, as all info would already exist with a citation in the body

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has been the default transliteration, and that this was somewhat frozen in time, despite the move to pinyin in other cases (similar to Kuomintang, I expect).

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review once its issues are sorted out, and that will be entirely down to your effort here. I simply want co-operation in addressing what issues do exist.

2700: 607:, Nicely done! I believe this is now B status. I would say this is probably ready to take to Good Article status too. I suggest you carefully read the 3097: 3052: 2489: 2481: 2158:, but it was more consistent before the page move for a long time, as I explained above. It can also be made more consistent). Ankuochun also fits 2628:

The article covers the National Pacification Army from its foundation, its activities, how it functioned, and propaganda for and against the army.

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While my interference was that of a neutral party, I will say there are multiple and recent sources that specify Ankuochun as the common name. –

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More context in the background would be good. Set the stage: what was the political situation in China? How did that tie into the Warlord Era?

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I understand. Thank you for working with me on determining the article scope and clearing up misunderstandings (that was very nice of you).

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I love the images that you found for this article. You did a really great job image wise. Especially the one in the "Propaganda" section.

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Philip Jowett (20 November 2013). China's Wars: Rousing the Dragon 1894-1949. Bloomsbury Publishing. pp. 121–2. ISBN 978-1-4728-0673-4.

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Philip Jowett (20 November 2013). China's Wars: Rousing the Dragon 1894-1949. Bloomsbury Publishing. pp. 121–2. ISBN 978-1-4728-0673-4.

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meaning of "National Pacification Army" is immediately apparent to our English readers, and makes it clear that it is an armed force.

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Roniius fixed the one major referencing issue in the page. There is no original research in the article and no plagiarism issues.

2525: 2477: 2252: 1683:. Overall, not a strong argument for any title to be used. However, "An-kuo-chun" actually appeared more often than "Ankuochun". 1654: 782: 637: 620: 574: 276: 205: 2637: 2433: 2372: 2174:

is "an alternate form of a word is used by modern reliable secondary sources"). Thus, I propose to keep this article's name as

49: 43: 128: 3037: 3032: 2553: 1054:(or, alternatively, with the umlaut) appears to be dominant in the romanizations, with a few 21st-century sources preferring 2291:

Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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to take into account. This is a gross abuse of Knowledge process, I suggest you refrain from further action in this area.

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Kuomintang section shouldn't consist entirely of a subsection. Remove the subsection, rename the main section, or expand

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only changed from a transliteration (Anguojun, in this case) to the translation after this article's name was changed.

1823:– There are many issues to consider when attempting to refer to historical Chinese subjects, and this is no exception. 1646:

here. We ought build consensus formally on a new title, and then agree what to move it to, or whether to keep it here.

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I would suggest waiting until Applodion provides what sources he has, then proceeding with a formal move discussion.

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the doublespeak meaning of "National Pacification Army" is immediately apparent to our English readers. I think per

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I am currently not at home, but I will list the spellings when I get to my books (probably the day after tomorrow).

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As I said below, I will consult more reliable sources this evening. Ankuochun may well be the best possible title.

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related articles on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

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in the mid-1910s, and claims that the name "would subsequently be reused by other armies in other Chinese wars".

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Pacification Army. David Bonavia ("China's Warlords") also prefers National Pacification Army, and mentions

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stayed at a steady 0.00000000015% until both stopped being used in sources in 2012. The only times usage of

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it makes sense to use the English title. I can see using transliteration for certain more common subjects;

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By what name should we refer to the organisation described in this article? Potential options include:

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this article) and the same political events - However, the article on the government (or the section in

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indeed, following my further review of sources last night, I can say with certainly that I agree with

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was used in only 0.0000000344% of the sources at the time (By plotting percentage over time, usage of

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QPQ now done. Probably shouldn't have been so hasty on this one honestly, but it's a small mistake.

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would think of this move. I am afraid that this may give rise to further debate and complications.

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I noticed you reverted my edit on this article - may I please ask for the rationale behind this?

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is 28 letters and 10 syllables long), and consistent (Not much anymore after the page move from

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can be misunderstood as the abbreviation for the National Protection Army, which fought in the

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Foreign Exchange: Counterculture behind the Walls of St. Hilda's School for Girls, 1929 - 1937

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Going to start the review soon after an initial reading of the page and checking of sources.

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did not even mention this organization until this article's name was changed. The mention of

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I based the move on Google Ngrams, and on definitive high-quality sources, such as Jordan's

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as alternatives. C. Martin Wilbur ("The Nationalist Revolution in China, 1923-1928") uses

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of the fluff in between, simply the logic) in a new section/subsection of this talk page.

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for a day or two before I start reorganising the article in line with Knowledge policies.

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I have added context on the Anti-Fengtian War. Will be working on adding years to dates.

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roughly stayed there in the early 1930s in a plateau, until its use dropped off in 1933.

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was changed 2 minutes before) this article's name was changed, too, by my interlocutor.

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I've changed references to the army in the article in reflection of this. I wonder what

1431:) would, in all likelihood, just be disruptive. Therefore, I have moved this article to 3005: 2988: 2966: 2962: 2941: 2851: 2795: 2420: 2318: 2278: 2255: 2226: 2218: 2187: 2060: 1965:(1976, mentioned in the above argument, but the versions on Google Books and JSTOR use 1864: 1814: 1715: 1692: 1684: 1657: 1629: 1602: 1578: 1565: 1551: 1536: 1521: 1508: 1501: 1483: 1451: 1406: 1390: 1372: 1332: 1318: 1302: 1279: 1259: 1232: 1208: 1185: 1154: 1134: 1088: 1080: 1067: 1032: 1025: 1017: 996: 981: 955: 927: 785: 761: 726: 640: 623: 599: 577: 3021: 2040: 1608: 1594: 1475: 1443: 960:

I have suggested in the subsection below that the name of this article be changed to

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below.

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The Penguin History of Modern China: The Fall and Rise of a Great Power, 1850 - 2009

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that mentions the organization using the English translation. Thus, I believe that

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As a side note, I would also choose to use the Pinyin version of the name due to

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Wikilink, and perhaps give a brief explanation, as to what the Zhili clicque was.

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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as

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was expanded by them, with them adding the mention of this organization in it.

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Command section should either be expanded, or made a subsection of another part

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Good work here! I have a few notes on various improvements that could be made.

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was at its peak in 1931, where it was used in 0.0000013054% of sources, while

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to refer to the armies from Yunnan and Guizhou that opposed the monarchy of

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Arming the Chinese: The Western Armaments Trade in Warlord China, 1920-1928

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English name in academic works, I think the English name clearly wins out.

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is the only article not written by my interlocutor and not changed to use

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plateaued during the same periods, suggesting that it was used much more.

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Additional note after the argument was written - This does not mean that

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was initially undiscussed. However, reverting to the last stable title (

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was so poor that some soldiers were armed with spears instead of guns?

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was somewhat more common, but this stopped towards 2007, when usage of

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is not very self explanatory, and somewhat hard to understand. But the

1925:

was used to refer to the organization at the time, as we can see from

501:

was so poor that some soldiers were armed with spears instead of guns?

2829:), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. 433: 142: 117: 1735:

to refer to this organisation. Editors' primary argument for using

1241:

as an article on a historical government of a country relates to a

355: 327: 272: 1962:

The Northern Expedition: China's National Revolution of 1926–1928

910:

have been from 1950-1969, 1981-1984, and 1992-2006, and usage of

662:

I've noticed that the name of this article has been changed from

2681:

Last edits made before mine were in June and before that in May.

1969:, see Page 148/Chapter 14 and up). NPA may be confused with the 1607:

Absurd, and a direct defiance of the Knowledge gold standard of

1199:

may be too general for all of the information to be put there.

2048: 2044: 717:

if recent RS use other spellings, which I believe they might.

670:. The reason for this was that you believed that more RS used 460: 80: 26: 825:(vol. 207 p. lxxii, 1927). Other sources that primarily use 515: 510:

Template:Did you know nominations/National Pacification Army

432: 416: 179: 2137:) 10:41, 7 February 2020 (UTC)) There is no such use of 1990:- It is recognizable (stated in more sources), natural ( 1119:

occurred, and also causing significant overlap with the

2872: 2863: 1994:

would probably fit this better, as biographies such as

1724:

RfC: By what name should we refer to this organisation?

1427: 847:

Chinese students, the Kuomintang, and the Chang Tso-lin

190: 70: 2110:

refers to it as the same army as the previous source.

1892:(2017, and one of the main sources for this article) 508:. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at 866:

Acording to Google Ngrams for Google Books, Usage of

1511:. On what basis have you intervened in this matter? 271:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 2892:included 2,000 young boys armed with short rifles? 2502:

I made minor edits to make the article flow better.

1048:

Citizens' Army for the Preservation of Tranquillity

886:was at 0.0000004650%. In recent years (2007-2011), 590:I have attempted to address all of these problems. 399: 1905:The Army Quarterly and Defence Journal, Volume 113 1697:Given the merits of the English title in terms of 3063:GA-Class China-related articles of Low-importance 2694:and other media, where possible and appropriate. 56:. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can 2124:is not precise, it simply means that I believe 2018:(expanded by me) use Pinyin. I have shown that 1729: 933:transliteration, the English name wins out per 882:peaked at 0.0000001545% in 1967, whie usage of 2162:(explained above, see Google Ngrams results), 1848:China in the 1920s. Nationalism and Revolution 1556:Good idea. I just want to get this over with. 898:came out of use in 2008 sources, and usage of 2699:(images are tagged and non-free content have 1468:Pinging the article's primary contributors. – 821:also refer to it as the Ankuochun, and so do 808:Regime) and tried to make itself look like a 8: 3093:Chinese military history task force articles 2831:No further edits should be made to this page 1362:and Zhang's assumption of power in Beijing. 1956:The Bitter Peace: Conflict in China 1928-37 1172:, I suggest that the article be renamed to 164:Knowledge:WikiProject Articles for creation 3088:GA-Class Chinese military history articles 3083:Asian military history task force articles 2901::... that the equipment situation for the 2656:I see no bias towards or against the army. 2327: 1944:China’s Wars: Rousing the Dragon 1894-1949 396: 322: 217: 167:Template:WikiProject Articles for creation 148:This article was reviewed by member(s) of 112: 2146:is 9 letters and 3 syllables long, while 1889:War and Geopolitics in Interwar Manchuria 1731:The consensus is to use the English name 835:Revolution and Counterrevolution in China 495:... that the equipment situation for the 489:). The text of the entry was as follows: 3078:GA-Class Asian military history articles 1933:documents on foreign policy, as well as 1293:unless you believe that it can be kept. 972:, using the evidence in my reply above. 674:as a name. However, the abbreviation of 361:This article is within the scope of the 3043:AfC submissions by date/22 January 2020 2358: 2330: 2267:War and Nationalism in China, 1925-1945 2118:to refer to Sun Yat-sen's Jingguojun. ( 890:started out with 0.00000000024% (while 324: 219: 114: 1058:. Google Ngram seems to back this up. 506:Knowledge:Recent additions/2021/August 381:Knowledge:WikiProject Military history 371:. To use this banner, please see the 3058:Low-importance China-related articles 2112:China Monthly Review, vol. 60, p. 334 1950:Journal of arts and history, Issue 22 1615:, and topic specific guidelines like 504:A record of the entry may be seen at 384:Template:WikiProject Military history 7: 1760:The following discussion is closed. 265:This article is within the scope of 86: 84: 2932:Improved to Good Article status by 2396:Talk:National Pacification Army/GA1 2208:itself as alternative translations. 2108:Zhongguo jun yong chao piao shi lüe 442:Chinese military history task force 103:It is of interest to the following 3073:GA-Class military history articles 2265:A ton of great sources, including 550:Downfall section is a bit informal 25: 2287:The discussion above is closed. 1195:. I believe that the article for 516: 426:Asian military history task force 151:WikiProject Articles for creation 52:. If you can improve it further, 2975: 2951: 2748: 2724: 2706: 2674: 2649: 2646:Fair representation without bias 2621: 2607: 2577: 2559: 2545: 2531: 2495: 2461: 2210:As for Roniius' arguments about 2055:was written by my interlocutor, 1790:the Wade-Giles transliteration " 1191:be summarized in its section in 843:Essays on the Manchurian Problem 464: 354: 326: 252: 242: 221: 141: 127: 116: 85: 30: 3098:Knowledge Did you know articles 3053:GA-Class China-related articles 2814:Please do not modify this page. 2436:for what the criteria are, and 1288:. I will think about expanding 819:Soviet foreign policy documents 305:This article has been rated as 194:on 22 January 2020 by reviewer 188:This article was accepted from 2458:(prose, spelling, and grammar) 2298:Edit reversion on this article 1042:seems to be dominant) such as 40:has been listed as one of the 1: 2980:I have still not done a QPQ. 2279:21:13, 27 February 2020 (UTC) 2128:is much more precise than it. 1935:British parliamentary debates 1358:the period at the end of the 823:British parliamentary debates 713:, but it does say to go with 279:and see a list of open tasks. 2749: 2725: 2707: 2675: 2650: 2622: 2608: 2578: 2560: 2546: 2532: 2496: 2462: 2256:16:45, 7 February 2020 (UTC) 2227:13:40, 7 February 2020 (UTC) 2188:10:34, 7 February 2020 (UTC) 2025:Zhili Army (Fengtian clique) 1865:22:52, 6 February 2020 (UTC) 1815:22:38, 6 February 2020 (UTC) 1783:the pinyin transliteration " 1753:) 08:37, 9 March 2020 (UTC) 1716:22:31, 6 February 2020 (UTC) 1693:21:35, 6 February 2020 (UTC) 1658:18:29, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1630:18:08, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1603:15:52, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1566:10:36, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1552:10:35, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1537:10:06, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1522:09:13, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1502:00:56, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1484:00:44, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1452:00:42, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1407:11:07, 5 February 2020 (UTC) 1391:16:11, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1373:14:52, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1333:13:46, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1319:13:41, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1303:13:28, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1280:13:19, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1260:13:09, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1233:12:51, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1209:12:40, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1186:11:51, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1155:11:40, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1135:11:32, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1089:16:40, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1068:16:20, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 1026:15:46, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 997:14:20, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 982:13:46, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 956:11:07, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 928:06:42, 4 February 2020 (UTC) 786:20:58, 3 February 2020 (UTC) 762:20:28, 3 February 2020 (UTC) 727:14:38, 3 February 2020 (UTC) 641:07:08, 22 January 2020 (UTC) 624:07:07, 22 January 2020 (UTC) 600:06:04, 22 January 2020 (UTC) 578:02:22, 22 January 2020 (UTC) 364:Military history WikiProject 2827:Knowledge talk:Did you know 2819:this nomination's talk page 2095:A Guide to Intra-state Wars 1044:National Tranquilizing Army 906:has been over the usage of 566:Please ping me in replies, 285:Knowledge:WikiProject China 3114: 3068:WikiProject China articles 2904:National Pacification Army 2889:National Pacification Army 2852:06:24, 2 August 2021 (UTC) 2443: 2263:National Pacification Army 2232:National Pacification Army 2193:National Pacification Army 2156:National Pacification Army 2148:National Pacification Army 2116:National Pacification Army 2100:National Pacification Army 2090:National Pacification Army 2086:National Pacification Army 2073:National Pacification Army 2033:National Pacification Army 1988:National Pacification Army 1937:. Modern sources that use 1910:National Pacification Army 1852:National Pacification Army 1821:National Pacification Army 1797:the alternative spelling " 1778:National Pacification Army 1737:National Pacification Army 1733:National Pacification Army 1703:National Pacification Army 1040:National Pacification Army 916:National Pacification Army 904:National Pacification Army 896:National Pacification Army 892:National Pacification Army 880:National Pacification Army 876:National Pacification Army 872:National Pacification Army 805:National Pacification Army 672:National Pacification Army 668:National Pacification Army 498:National Pacification Army 473:National Pacification Army 311:project's importance scale 288:Template:WikiProject China 38:National Pacification Army 3006:15:12, 18 July 2021 (UTC) 2989:15:04, 18 July 2021 (UTC) 2967:14:53, 18 July 2021 (UTC) 2942:07:00, 18 July 2021 (UTC) 2882:... that Chinese warlord 2796:10:05, 13 July 2021 (UTC) 2421:15:11, 12 July 2021 (UTC) 2319:12:47, 16 June 2021 (UTC) 1846:, and by the authors of " 485:column on 5 August 2021 ( 440: 424: 395: 387:military history articles 349: 304: 237: 187: 136: 111: 3048:Accepted AfC submissions 2289:Please do not modify it. 2122:National Protection Army 1971:National Protection Army 1763:Please do not modify it. 696:National Protection Army 475:appeared on Knowledge's 3028:Knowledge good articles 2924:A Certain Magical Index 2823:the article's talk page 2804:Did you know nomination 2451:reasonably well written 2071:after the page move to 1978:. Thus, I believe that 1850:". Therefore, I favour 829:are Witold Rodziński's 680:National Protection War 400:Associated task forces: 2440:for what they are not) 1755: 914:spiked while usage of 894:was at 0.000000001%), 766:I have to agree here. 521: 437: 421: 291:China-related articles 184: 93:This article is rated 3038:GA-Class AfC articles 3033:Warfare good articles 2940:). Self-nominated at 2688:It is illustrated by 2638:neutral point of view 2593:broad in its coverage 529:Notes from CaptainEek 519: 436: 420: 183: 161:Articles for creation 158:for more information. 124:Articles for creation 50:good article criteria 44:Warfare good articles 1921:dropped out of use. 1050:. I have noted that 694:. When searching up 2701:fair use rationales 2170:(I have shown that 2053:Northern Expedition 2043:, and the dab page 1844:Northern Expedition 792:Northern Expedition 736:Northern Expedition 706:yields 41 results. 692:National Peace Army 2671:No edit wars, etc. 2511:factually accurate 2199:, as mentioned by 2035:was only added to 2029:Beiyang government 1842:, Donald Jordan's 1290:Beiyang government 1248:Beiyang government 1239:Beiyang government 1216:Beiyang government 1197:Beiyang government 1193:Beiyang government 1162:Beiyang government 1121:Beiyang government 943:Beiyang government 939:Beiyang government 831:A History of China 522: 438: 422: 369:list of open tasks 185: 99:content assessment 68:: July 18, 2021. ( 2945: 2910: 2895: 2719:suitable captions 2526:reference section 2386: 2385: 2002:(created by me), 1984:WP:NAMINGCRITERIA 1360:Anti-Fengtian War 839:New Lamps for Old 526: 525: 459: 458: 455: 454: 451: 450: 447: 446: 373:full instructions 321: 320: 317: 316: 268:WikiProject China 216: 215: 212: 211: 79: 78: 75: 16:(Redirected from 3105: 3004: 3002: 2987: 2985: 2979: 2955: 2931: 2908: 2893: 2838:The result was: 2816: 2794: 2792: 2778: 2761: 2752: 2751: 2728: 2727: 2710: 2709: 2678: 2677: 2653: 2652: 2625: 2624: 2611: 2610: 2581: 2580: 2563: 2562: 2549: 2548: 2540:reliable sources 2535: 2534: 2499: 2498: 2465: 2464: 2340:Copyvio detector 2328: 2317: 2315: 2309: 2250: 2057:User:RGloucester 1858: 1839:China's Warlords 1808: 1765: 1709: 1652: 1623: 1601: 1592: 1586: 1545: 1515: 1490:User:RGloucester 1482: 1473: 1467: 1450: 1441: 1430: 1400: 1366: 1312: 1273: 1226: 1148: 1128: 1078: 1036: 1014: 1007: 990: 949: 780: 755: 740:China's warlords 661: 635: 618: 589: 572: 539: 518: 468: 461: 407: 397: 389: 388: 385: 382: 379: 378:Military history 358: 351: 350: 345: 334:Military history 330: 323: 293: 292: 289: 286: 283: 262: 257: 256: 255: 246: 239: 238: 233: 225: 218: 193: 172: 171: 168: 165: 162: 145: 138: 137: 132: 131: 130: 120: 113: 96: 90: 89: 88: 81: 73: 71:Reviewed version 62: 34: 27: 21: 3113: 3112: 3108: 3107: 3106: 3104: 3103: 3102: 3018: 3017: 3016: 3000: 2998: 2983: 2981: 2879: 2877: 2873:Article history 2812: 2806: 2790: 2788: 2772: 2755: 2715:appropriate use 2635:It follows the 2390:This review is 2382: 2354: 2326: 2313: 2311: 2306:HigherScholar16 2303: 2300: 2295: 2246: 2016:Fengtian clique 1856: 1806: 1761: 1756: 1726: 1707: 1648: 1621: 1590: 1588: 1572: 1543: 1513: 1471: 1469: 1457: 1439: 1437: 1426: 1419: 1398: 1364: 1310: 1286:Fengtian clique 1271: 1224: 1220:content forking 1146: 1126: 1115: 1072: 1030: 1008: 1001: 988: 947: 776: 753: 655: 653: 651:Article moving? 631: 614: 583: 568: 533: 531: 405: 386: 383: 380: 377: 376: 336: 290: 287: 284: 281: 280: 258: 253: 251: 231: 189: 169: 166: 163: 160: 159: 126: 97:on Knowledge's 94: 69: 23: 22: 15: 12: 11: 5: 3111: 3109: 3101: 3100: 3095: 3090: 3085: 3080: 3075: 3070: 3065: 3060: 3055: 3050: 3045: 3040: 3035: 3030: 3020: 3019: 3015: 3014: 3013: 3012: 3011: 3010: 3009: 3008: 2992: 2991: 2970: 2969: 2929: 2928: 2927: 2926: 2914: 2913: 2912: 2911: 2876: 2875: 2870: 2860: 2858: 2854: 2836: 2835: 2807: 2805: 2802: 2801: 2800: 2799: 2798: 2782: 2781: 2768: 2767: 2766: 2765: 2764: 2763: 2736: 2735: 2734: 2733: 2732: 2686: 2685: 2684: 2683: 2682: 2661: 2660: 2659: 2658: 2657: 2633: 2632: 2631: 2630: 2629: 2589: 2588: 2587: 2586: 2585: 2538:(citations to 2507: 2506: 2505: 2504: 2503: 2442: 2441: 2401: 2400: 2384: 2383: 2381: 2380: 2375: 2370: 2364: 2361: 2360: 2356: 2355: 2353: 2352: 2350:External links 2347: 2342: 2336: 2333: 2332: 2325: 2322: 2299: 2296: 2294: 2293: 2283: 2282: 2281: 2259: 2258: 2237:WP:NATURALNESS 2229: 2215: 2209: 2190: 2061:Jinan Incident 1868: 1867: 1834:WP:NATURALNESS 1803: 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Jowell's 772:doublespeak 658:RGloucester 487:check views 3022:Categories 2844:Cwmhiraeth 2572:plagiarism 2516:verifiable 2345:Authorship 2331:GA toolbox 2248:CaptainEek 2241:Kuomintang 2065:Duan Qirui 2012:Wu Zanzhou 2008:He Fenglin 2004:Ni Daolang 2000:Qi Yaoshan 1650:CaptainEek 845:, Knopes' 810:legitimate 778:CaptainEek 633:CaptainEek 616:CaptainEek 586:CaptainEek 570:CaptainEek 196:CaptainEek 191:this draft 48:under the 2745:Pass/Fail 2404:Reviewer: 2368:Templates 2359:Reviewing 2324:GA Review 2219:Applodion 2212:Ankuochun 2197:Ankuochun 2176:Ankuochun 2172:Ankuochun 2168:WP:PINYIN 2144:Ankuochun 2139:Ankuochun 2126:Ankuochun 2077:Ankuochun 2020:Ankuochun 1980:Ankuochun 1967:Ankuochün 1939:Ankuochun 1923:Ankuochun 1919:Ankuochun 1914:Ankuochun 1872:Ankuochun 1830:WP:PINYIN 1792:Ankuochun 1685:Applodion 1617:WP:PINYIN 1579:Applodion 1509:Applodion 1433:Ankuochun 1423:page move 1417:Page move 1174:Ankuochun 1166:WP:PINYIN 1081:Applodion 1052:Ankuochun 1033:Applodion 1018:Applodion 966:WP:PINYIN 962:Ankuochun 912:Ankuochun 908:Ankuochun 900:Ankuochun 888:Ankuochun 884:Ankuochun 868:Ankuochun 827:Ankuochun 796:Ankuochün 790:Jordan's 744:Ankuochun 711:WP:PINYIN 704:Ankuochun 700:Ankuochun 688:Ankuochun 520:Knowledge 477:Main Page 2920:Reviewed 2840:promoted 2417:contribs 2373:Criteria 2152:Anguojun 2059:, while 1996:Hu Yukun 1992:Anguojun 1959:(2017), 1953:(1992), 1947:(2013), 1941:include 1927:American 1898:(1982), 1886:(2011), 1880:(1998), 1785:Anguojun 1681:Ankuchun 1669:Anguojun 1428:Anguojun 1056:Anguojun 935:WP:NDESC 833:, Roy's 768:Anjuojun 748:Anguojun 684:Anguojun 664:Anguojun 206:contribs 95:GA-class 58:reassess 3001:Roniius 2984:Roniius 2934:Roniius 2864:Comment 2791:Roniius 2787:Fixed. 2775:Roniius 2758:Roniius 2739:Overall 2616:focused 2568:copyvio 2486:fiction 2314:Roniius 2205:natural 2201:Roniius 2180:Roniius 2131:Roniius 2047:after ( 1581:, and 1575:Roniius 1558:Roniius 1529:Roniius 1494:Roniius 1464:Roniius 1383:Roniius 1325:Roniius 1295:Roniius 1252:Roniius 1201:Roniius 1178:Roniius 1075:Roniius 1060:Roniius 1011:Roniius 974:Roniius 964:as per 920:Roniius 841:, Xu's 719:Roniius 605:Roniius 592:Roniius 536:Roniius 479:in the 343:Chinese 309:on the 2691:images 2665:stable 2663:It is 2640:policy 2591:It is 2509:It is 2488:, and 2478:layout 2449:It is 2430:review 2407:Jon698 2302:Hello 2010:, and 1982:meets 1931:Soviet 1747:Cunard 1609:WP:BRD 101:scale. 65:Review 2717:with 2490:lists 2432:(see 2394:from 2114:uses 2098:uses 794:uses 609:WP:GA 339:Asian 282:China 273:China 229:China 2963:talk 2959:Dahn 2938:talk 2899:ALT1 2868:view 2848:talk 2771:Hey 2570:and 2513:and 2474:lead 2472:for 2438:here 2434:here 2411:talk 2275:talk 2223:talk 2184:talk 2135:talk 1929:and 1751:talk 1739:was 1689:talk 1597:Talk 1562:talk 1533:talk 1498:talk 1478:Talk 1462:and 1446:Talk 1387:talk 1329:talk 1299:talk 1256:talk 1205:talk 1182:talk 1168:and 1085:talk 1064:talk 1022:talk 978:talk 968:and 924:talk 815:here 723:talk 596:talk 200:talk 2886:'s 2866:or 2842:by 2825:or 2470:MoS 2154:to 2084:or 2082:NPA 2069:NPA 2049:NPA 2045:NPA 1671:or 1591:MJL 1472:MJL 1440:MJL 1046:or 686:or 676:NPA 666:to 301:Low 60:it. 3024:: 2965:) 2922:: 2859:( 2850:) 2821:, 2747:: 2741:: 2723:: 2711:b 2705:: 2697:a 2673:: 2667:. 2648:: 2642:. 2620:: 2612:b 2606:: 2598:a 2595:. 2576:: 2564:d 2558:: 2554:OR 2550:c 2544:: 2536:b 2530:: 2522:a 2519:. 2494:: 2484:, 2480:, 2476:, 2466:b 2460:: 2456:a 2453:. 2428:GA 2419:) 2277:) 2225:) 2186:) 2092:. 2039:, 2006:, 1998:, 1860:— 1810:— 1711:— 1691:) 1625:— 1577:, 1564:) 1547:— 1535:) 1517:— 1500:) 1402:— 1389:) 1368:— 1331:) 1314:— 1301:) 1275:— 1258:) 1228:— 1207:) 1184:) 1176:. 1150:— 1130:— 1087:) 1066:) 1024:) 992:— 980:) 951:— 926:) 817:, 757:— 725:) 598:) 406:/ 341:/ 337:: 208:). 74:). 2961:( 2944:. 2936:( 2878:) 2846:( 2833:. 2777:: 2773:@ 2760:: 2756:@ 2721:) 2713:( 2703:) 2618:) 2614:( 2604:) 2600:( 2574:) 2566:( 2556:) 2552:( 2542:) 2528:) 2524:( 2492:) 2468:( 2414:· 2409:( 2308:: 2304:@ 2273:( 2253:⚓ 2221:( 2182:( 2133:( 1862:☎ 1812:☎ 1801:" 1794:" 1787:" 1780:" 1749:( 1743:. 1713:☎ 1687:( 1655:⚓ 1627:☎ 1599:‐ 1595:‐ 1585:: 1573:@ 1560:( 1549:☎ 1531:( 1519:☎ 1496:( 1480:‐ 1476:‐ 1466:: 1458:@ 1448:‐ 1444:‐ 1436:– 1404:☎ 1385:( 1370:☎ 1327:( 1316:☎ 1297:( 1277:☎ 1254:( 1230:☎ 1203:( 1180:( 1152:☎ 1132:☎ 1083:( 1077:: 1073:@ 1062:( 1038:( 1035:: 1031:@ 1020:( 1013:: 1009:@ 1006:: 1002:@ 994:☎ 976:( 953:☎ 922:( 849:. 783:⚓ 759:☎ 721:( 660:: 656:@ 638:⚓ 621:⚓ 594:( 588:: 584:@ 575:⚓ 538:: 534:@ 512:. 375:. 313:. 203:· 198:( 107:: 20:)

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