820:, we can only give (with any degree of authority) full dates and locations for the entire production of the parent album. So that's an unwieldy set of three possible studio locations and and a vague, six-month timespan for a song like "Awaiting". (Take this to more recent times, I'm sure an album track would require five or six studios.) So I've never done it in the past, but that's not to say I wouldn't. What do you think – add "May–October 1970" and "Abbey Road Studios, London; Trident Studios, London; Apple Studio, London"? Personally, I'd rather not (as you can probably tell!) – because I suspect that nothing was done at Apple on this song, but it's not something I can verify. Similarly, the impression I get is that the basic track was taped in late June 1970 or even later, which would make any mention of May redundant.
972:"It is better to be an outspoken atheist than a hypocrite" - the second source might be problematic. While I'm happy to believe the BBC did indeed broadcast this and people did hear it, if a member of the public cannot access the archives, or watch it on a video or DVD (even if it has gone out of print), it might not necessarily be verifiable by Knowledge (XXG) standards. I've seen arguments from both sides and discussions go round in circles on this. Also, how can somebody who died in 1902 be quoted on television in 1970 - a third party (Harrison?) must be involved somewhere.
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749:." But I think adding anything more than that might be giving this point undue weight in the Lead, don't you? I'm mindful that there's so much to mention regarding the composition and the official studio recording, so I'm loath to clutter up that discussion with detail on the demo/early take, and also that, by comparison with the original release, both the Bangladesh live reading and this version don't really merit too much attention.
609:& Bonnie and Friends, in December 1969, while still officially a member of the Beatles." There's no mention of when exactly he recorded the track, because I guess I didn't feel it necessary to include; we've got just a year appearing for the song's release, 1970, and its recording doesn't differ from that. Talking about a specific tour, on the other hand, does seem to warrant something more detailed – that's my thinking anyway.
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some of the more well-known backing musicians on the track. If sentence length is an issue, then maybe the previous (also lengthy) one could be split into two, because at least
Spector and his Wall of Sound is a major point in the article. I'd prefer not to, of course, because I think people who read these Leads can handle some lengthy sentences. They know they're getting a heavily condensed version of an article.
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1879:. Particularly as your concerns about the Background section have made for a way better, more focused section now. I can see myself revisiting this area, refining it further, hopefully. There's a couple of articles I'm working on that could well take some of the load off this one, as regards background on Harrison's religious beliefs. (That's the plan, at least …) See you around,
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902:…'" And Madinger & Easter (and perhaps Badman, from memory) support the idea that Harrison talks about how he gets inspiration for his songs. He gives the same "Just believe in what we're telling you, and shut up" line in his 1982 interview reproduced on harekrishna.com. So all in all, I'm pretty sure that alternatives
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referring to
Harrison's words from an interview with a Krishna devotee, my understanding is that it's quite acceptable. I'm sure I could replace the cite with one from Dale Allison's book, but this is the authorised version of the interview that authors such as Allison, Tillery, Clayson and Greene all use as their source.
1052:); other times – and I admit I've been angsting over this one for weeks – it seems there's quite a lot of ground to cover beforehand. I take your point that you feel the desired effect hasn't been achieved, though; I'll see what I can do, juggling some of the items around. (But I'm absolutely dreading it!)
1162:" above), there's hardly a Harrison biographer who doesn't jump on this interpretation! Personally, I think the "love-in" reference is more aimed at the hippie movement generally, but on the other hand, I'm always surprised that commentators don't notice the "horoscope" mention as a possible dig at Ono.
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I know what you mean – it feels like the word should appear earlier on – but I think that would give the statement a different meaning. If you're suggesting rewording to "Authors Chip
Madinger and Mark Easter also note the presence of a piano part on the recording", that would imply that Whitlock had
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Well, I agree it would be unreliable as a source to support a comment that the song was about something in particular, or that it was recorded here or there – i.e. anything factual. (On that score, I need to remove it from
Background's final sentence, I've just noticed.) But here, where we're clearly
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desk without asking, I'd be mightly pissed too ;-) ... anyway, I've certainly read that while he was pissed off with Paul more than any other
Beatles for being patronising and condescending, he was also upset that John would just wander off with Yoko and give him the cold shoulder. If all the Beatles
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Given the mentions of
Harrison and Lennon's diverging philosophies over 1968–69, particularly regarding the peace campaign, under Background, and the attention afforded the opening song lyrics here, I'd think it super-relevant actually. I'll reword the caption maybe, to specify that Lennon's pictured
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December 1969 is when he toured with many of the musicians. To me, it's quite clear, through the inclusion of a dash: "Harrison recorded the track in London backed by musicians such as Eric
Clapton, Bobby Whitlock, Klaus Voormann, Jim Gordon and Jim Price – many of whom he had toured with, as Delaney
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site, and (although I realise I hadn't mentioned this before) the 1982 Harrison interview first appeared in a book published by the Trust. Some
Harrison biographers give the book as their source, but mostly it's the website. I think it would add a lot to the article by including it, because readers
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The last sentence in the lead talks about the demo, but to me this sounds a little out of place. This could probably be copyedited earlier up, and expanded to mention when the actual recording that appears on the album took place. Should all fit in a single sentence. The infobox should mention this
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I was a bit confused by this, because there's already mention of the song serving as "a precedent for further statements by
Harrison against organised religion, particularly Catholicism" – so I couldn't see any benefit in your suggested addition. Seemed to be introducing a degree of repetition, in
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cite you're referring to, but again, this relates to the above point about whether the
Freeman radio broadcast and the like are or are not acceptable. The box quote containing a statement Harrison made on a NY radio show in 1970 ("This is really where I disagreed with John … I don't think you get
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Well, it's got my heart a-aching. I've replaced all the Freeman cites with locations in the Scorsese doc. I don't agree with it though – I'll be honest, I skimmed through part of that discussion before glazing over … As I say, I've seen this type of citation in FAs, so I can only assume some other
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Aha! Okay … Must admit, I've only ever included recording date (and location) in an infobox when the article's about a non-album single, because, to my mind, those details belong in the album article's infobox only. Perhaps that logic's a tad shaky: it's influenced by the fact that for any song on
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Even without the dash and change to pluperfect tense, I really don't think it would be a good idea for that info about D&B and Harrison still being a member of the Beatles to sit in a separate sentence. It just doesn't merit that treatment – but it's definitely worth tagging on to a mention of
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was a major commercial success, outselling releases that year by Harrison's former bandmates, and topping albums charts throughout the world." – perhaps even leaving it at "was a major commercial success", without the additional points. But I do think it's important to state how commercially well
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Do you not think that the preceding sentence – "Allison discusses 'Awaiting on You All' as a precedent for further statements by Harrison against organised religion, particularly Catholicism" – invites mention of a few examples? I'd hoped it paved the way, quite naturally, to then single out the
764:, could be more – the issue of a demo version has always been handled the same way. Also, I can't see there's a precedent in song FAs either for the sort of treatment you're suggesting, even when the alt version or demo might be far more notable than is the case with this song. I'm thinking of
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Thanks Ritchie. I now what you mean – focus, and the need for an article covering Harrison's religious beliefs. It would then be so easy to direct readers to the more general piece, at the start of Background. I'd had (and still have) a similar problem with sections in the
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This must be some sort of karmic co-incidence. I was listening to the track when lo and behold it cropped up for GA on my watchlist. On an initial glance, this looks like a good and thorough article on the song, and appears to be well written. Off we go then...
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I went for: "Authors Chip Madinger and Mark Easter note the presence also of a piano part on the recording." But then changed my mind, and now it's: "Authors Chip Madinger and Mark Easter note the presence of a piano part on the recording as well." How's that?
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were still alive and had a serious offer of reforming, I reckon George more than any of the others would say no. Paul would jump at it, Ringo would probably go along with it, John would do a one off if Yoko thought it was a good idea, George ... not likely.
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I have the 30th Anniversary Reissue, but I can't remember where my CD is (since I transferred to mp3 ages ago). I'll dig it out and check the sources - it's nice to get at least a few offline cites verified during a review, which doesn't happen at GAN too
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peace by going around shouting: 'GIVE PEACE A CHANCE, MAN!'") is another. That interview's much discussed in biographies, although I don't recall seeing this quote in full. I think it's important to this song article, so I really hope we can keep it.
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This section gives the impression of being off topic, only mentioning the song right at the end. I think this needs to be moved up to the top, so the reader is aware that the background on Harrison's religious preferences are relevant to the
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Okay, I've checked my CD booklet. The press kit stuff obviously isn't there but I can confirm the facts and quotations cited to the CD booklet are correct. Incidentally, the same booklet mentions "Many of the tracks were virtually live."
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Okay, that answers my question. I guess from doing all the Beatles articles, where specific dates down to the day and sometimes time are well documented, that I assumed it would be the case for solo stuff. Turns out it isn't. No worries.
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I've thought of a way of resolving this. Put this information in a separate paragraph and lead it off with mentioning that "Awaiting on You All" was the first of several Harrison songs (Harrisongs?) to have a pop at organised religion.
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I'd go with using the source from Allison's book. Although it's taking the interview, it's also passing it through an editorial control that has nothing to do with Hare Krishna directly, so is less susceptible to finger pointing.
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I'm sorry, I've got to disagree here. There is no confusion at all, as far as I can see. Having looked at it again, I've even more sure than before – because the change of tense in that phrase following the dash ("many of whom he
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Well, it is titled Background – do you not think readers might expect to approach the subject from a wider, background perspective? Often I will introduce the subject of the article directly at the start (say with a quote from
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As an alternative, I have the whole broadcast on MP3, as it's widely available through, er, unofficial channels. There's a blog site that provides free uploads of interviews such as this; the link from "a lengthy interview"
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Okay, I've gone through the article now. Most of the comments are minor - the main criticism would be that some of the content (but not much) is focused on tangential topics, and might fit better on an article called
772:, particularly, where the demos or unadorned versions get a fair amount of attention from commentators. I admit I've cast my net pretty close to shore, having looked only at a few Beatles song articles and
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Shocking, isn't it … No multiple pianos either, with musicians playing the same part in different octaves; no "felt but not heard" Badfinger acoustic rhythm guitars. What a lightweight track!
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was recorded in December 1969, which is believable and in the right timeframe, but what I think it meant is that Harrison merely met some of the musicians that would later record the track
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commented on the track containing a piano part (when in fact he doesn't). In other words, the meaning of "also" becomes "they too" in that wording. I could be wrong, I don't know …?
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I don't think we're talking about chopping out great swathes of the article. It'll still be of a perfectly acceptable length for this type of article to meet the GA criteria.
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was because he'd been conned out of millions by manager HandMade co-owner Denis O'Brien, according to Doggett and others. Oh, and let's be clear about the biscuits: they were
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contains the Freeman interview, for instance.) The Scorsese documentary includes that quote "I was cleaning my teeth ... and suddenly in my head came this 'You don't need a
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and related topics on Knowledge (XXG). Users who are willing to participate in the project should visit the project page, where they can join and see a list of open tasks.
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I think just copyediting stuff should sort this out - the problem I had when reading this section was "well, this is all well and good, but what's it got to do with the
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Well putting "also" at the end of the sentence definitely sounds wrong. How about "Authors Chip Madinger and Mark Easter note there is also a piano on the recording".
1494:"the Temple devotees could be "the biggest pain in the necks in the world", according to Spector" - source needs further information as to how someone could verify it
1799:), but I'll revisit the Background section now. I'm going to need the proverbial lightbulb moment there – if it doesn't make it at this GAN/GAR, no probs. Cheers,
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I wish. My money's on Klaus, who occasionally played electric guitar on the many London sessions he participated in during the early '70s (eg on one of the ATMP
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be found to the Freeman broadcast, as a source. But I guess it's down to that issue of the same type of citation being acceptable elsewhere … what do you think?
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Reworked the section, cutting out a fair bit of detail and bringing forward a couple of song-specific points from later in the article. See what you think now.
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Yes indeed. There's a contributor here who does a great job of policing these MetroLyrics links, because they don't always carry the all-important LF symbol.
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I think that main area of concern, Background, is way more focused now. (Which is great, because I wasn't too confident about being able to fix it!) Thanks,
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ref below). I'd seen the same type of citation – full details of a radio or TV broadcast, with precise event times – used in a few FAs, most recently in
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I'm not entirely sure what the relevance of the Lennon picture is, other than it happens to be tangentially related to the subject material Harrison is
979:
I'll reword to mention that Harrison frequently quoted Vivekananda's words, which is what Olivia H and other sources say. That'll mean we can ditch the
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1638:"The musicians who performed on "Awaiting on You All" are believed to be as follows" - would probably better to cite Spizer and Deng directly by name.
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toured with") is clearly taking the reader further back in time. And as I've said, the dash serves as a distinct break between the two phrases anyway.
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received this and other spiritually themed songs were, via the parent album's success. What do you think of it now, minus the Scorsese recollection?
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album article; at least there is a relevant article in that instance, on the band's break-up, although it rather glosses over the important details.
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Done – it was all in Allison's book anyway. Have to say, I don't agree that it's not a reliable source for the usage I was suggesting. Looking at
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during his and Yoko's Toronto bed-in or rehearsing his song "Give Peace a Chance", or something. You're not suggesting I ditch the image, I hope?
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Ah no, you've got the wrong end of the stick - I don't mean anything about the demo. I meant add the date (or dates) the version as released on
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to the talk pages of all Beatles-related articles. Send a newsletter to members, canvas for new members and coordinate tasks. Enter articles
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Now reworded to "whose main contention Harrison would often quote: …" to acknowledge, as you say, a third party's involvement.
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1743:, and here I am (and you are). It's just not the talk page (the White Album's) that I had in mind. Thanks for taking this on.
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using the same 1974 Freeman interview. (There's a citation there for George saying Lennon was a "saint" and a "bastard" under
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Well I don't think it matters too much regarding the GA criteria, so we'll just have to agree to disagree for the time being!
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Some of the information, particularly at the end of the section, seems to be more about the album generally than this song.
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The "Freeman" citation is a little vague. If I wanted to verify this quotation was genuine, exactly how would I do it?
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I'm surprised only one drummer is credit. That's not very "Spector-esque" is it - he'd normally use at least 3!
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Okay, I can see this is going to be relevant throughout the article (starting with your concerns about the
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Fair enough. I've cut the 2011 Scorsese quote and I might do the same to one of the three phrases in "
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I was confused by the second to last sentence in the first paragraph. It gave the impression that the
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I think splitting the sentence in question into two should sort out any confusion. Give that a go.
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Fixed. I've given a precise location for this quote and for a later mention of the Scorsese doc.
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I'm not with you on the infobox point either, I'm afraid. From my own experience with song GAs –
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I'm with you on the "karmic coincidence" – I was just returning to the computer, thinking
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does proper attribution and royalties, which means it is a suitable link. Well I never.
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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Do you not think that the preceding sentence ... invites mention of a few examples?
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I'm not sure what relevances the last two sentences have on the song specifically.
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fact. I've taken the text to a new paragraph, which, I agree, is way better.
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onto this list, also list articles needing cleanup and other work here.
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An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.
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I still think the comments I made above need to be borne in mind (
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can pick up more about the song there, and the subject generally.
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I've expanded it slightly to: "Harrison's posthumous compilation
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And don't forget, the only reason George even got involved with
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Well if you came into work and nicked the chocolate biscuits on
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A list of articles needing cleanup associated with this project
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Template:Did you know nominations/Awaiting on You All
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I must write a reply to Ritchie333 on that Talk page
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This Beatles-related article is within the scope of
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1853:Okay, I think we're all done here, so it's a
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816:albums such as ATMP or
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754:Behind That Locked Door
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356:WikiProject The Beatles
229:is available. See also
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136:WikiProject The Beatles
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86:on Knowledge (XXG)'s
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1575:Yes, that's better.
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1158:Incidentally (your "
796:All Things Must Pass
747:All Things Must Pass
444:All Things Must Pass
321:Pics/Graphics wanted
231:the tool's wiki page
155:The Beatles articles
2043:Music good articles
1929:parameter below to
1904:Awaiting on You All
438:Awaiting on You All
409:Awaiting on You All
33:Music good articles
27:Awaiting on You All
2016:Community Tech bot
1875:Thanks very much,
1554:All This Must Pass
1236:a reliable source?
888:end of the article
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1941:Sourcecheck
1695:Metrolyrics
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547:transcluded
423:check views
204:To-do list:
146:The Beatles
141:The Beatles
113:The Beatles
2032:Categories
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290:See also:
37:under the
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1786:McCartney
1633:Personnel
1410:albums).
1400:Apple Jam
1204:Anthology
1050:I Me Mine
766:Something
559:Reviewer:
523:Templates
514:Reviewing
479:GA Review
435:'s song "
413:Main Page
268:). See:
1977:Cheers.—
732:as well.
572:contribs
528:Criteria
449:the Pope
84:GA-class
47:reassess
1987::Online
1927:checked
1908:my edit
1764:on hold
1542:Release
1160:perhaps
1120:perhaps
415:in the
350:Project
325:Kenwood
173:on the
1935:failed
1604:often.
1519:Cool.
1327:– no?
352:: Add
333:Verify
315:Update
278:Expand
90:scale.
54:Review
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904:could
549:from
345:Other
306:See:
301:Stubs
2020:talk
1931:true
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1881:JG66
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768:and
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595:song
585:Lead
566:talk
233:and
211:For
2014:. —
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1933:or
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96::
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