Talk:BTS/Archive 4

1354:" BTS released their tenth Japanese single "Lights" on July 3. Pre-orders for the double A-side single surpassed 1 million copies, breaking a 24-year-old record for foreign artists previously held only by Celine Dion with her 1995 single "To Love You More", and marked the first time a Korean artist achieved a million shipment for a single in Japan. "Lights" went on to sell over 1 million copies and received Million certification by the RIAJ on August 8, the first time a male act achieved this since Masafumi Akikawa's August 2007 single, "A Thousand Winds"." A number of issues. What was the record held by Dion? Did she sell a million pre-orders? If so, I would simply say it. Second what is a "million shipment" Million certification should probably be lower cased, as should "Quadruple Million" later in the article. And lastly, if it pre-sold a million copies, then it's hardly worth saying that it went on to sell over 1 million copies.-- 2534:

collaboration with a Japanese producer when Korean ARMY members deemed his views extreme." There were slight edits made to the BBMAs performance of Fake Love and the US radio version of Fake Love, to change 니가 and 내가 since they "sound like slurs" to some Americans. (Which has been done to other Korean songs in the past.) However, BTS did not change the lyrics outside of these instances, and subsequent songs use both 내가 and 니가. How this is currently written suggests that BTS removed and ceased using the terms due to ARMY's feedback about potential for misunderstanding them as slurs. The article cited to support this statement also uses misleading wording to suggest the same (along with incorrectly calling Fake Love an album.) The implication is more akin to when artists have gone back and removed slurs from digital recordings (ex. Beyonce removing a word from "Heated"), which isn't what happened here.

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the group is to re-unite; even to the point of ignoring the upcoming Grammy awards coming up next year since Jin is no longer an active part of the group; this extreme form of 'hibernation' would also exclude any BTS products, merchandising, and films which might be released by their production agencies while they are under their scheduled separation. (3) Hybe, their managing agents, state the opposite viewpoint, that BTS as a group is still represented by the solo acts of its members and therefor the solo acts of its members represent the promise of the re-union of the group in 2025 as much as anything else. Those seem the be the 3 separate approaches in general terms for discussion.

4867: 4158: 4006: 2848: 2612: 2202: 976: 893: 626: 393: 153: 4647: 3906: 3363: 3263: 2415: 710: 1659:"Anita Elberse and Lizzy Woodham (2020). "Big Hit Entertainment and Blockbuster Band BTS: K-Pop Goes Global". Harvard Business Review. June 8, 2020." This should be in the bibliography in sfn format, not as a source. The entry in the bibliography should include the page numbers for the article. In the text should be a short-form sfn citation, that is, similar to sfn|Elberse & Woodburn|pp=44–45 , with double curly brackets around it. So should Nye's 1990 article. I don't have these so I can't do it.-- 31: 2111: 4902: 4819: 4599: 4317: 4220: 4090: 3958: 3851: 3315: 3213: 3000: 2800: 2708: 2558: 2359: 2154: 2055: 1977: 928: 845: 758: 661: 578: 339: 94: 1384:"In November, BTS became the first K-pop group to win Favorite Duo or Group – Pop/Rock at the 2019 American Music Awards and Favorite Social Artist consecutively (2018 and 2019)." Is K-pop intended to modify the Social Artist information? Are we saying that they are the first K-pop group to win consecutive Favorite Social Artist awards? The sentence may need some rephrasing for clarity.-- 451:

Honestly, Adora comes to mind before anyone else given her heavy involvement in their albums (production and vocals), but also other artists they've worked with who are either personally close with BTS (Halsey, Coldplay) or artists who they have worked with multiple times (Ed Sheeran). I'd like to suggest either removing Steve Aoki or adding in other artists to that section. Thoughts?

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Reagrding Buidhe's previous list on the old FAC, she has already been informed on her Talk page that some of her cited books were only adulatory fan books for teenagers, and therefor not appropriate for an encyclopedia article about BTS. Regarding switching to sfn format, there are only a small handful of books in the article and about BTS, and they can all be converted to sfn.

1324:"With this, they became the first Asian and first non-English speaking artists ever to headline and sell out Wembley Stadium." They were the first Asian group to headline Wembley, the first to sell it out, the first non-English speaking to headline Wembley, the first to sell it out? Unless all four are true, some rephrasing might be in order.-- 4963: 4446: 4286: 2766: 1037: 1287:'Arenas and domes' is used here as a generic description of large space venues which could seat over 10,000 persons; the wording could be equivalently changed to 'Arenas and stadiums'. With reference to the specific venue of Citi Field in Queens, its generic architectural description is to call it a stadium and not an dome. 1414:"In December, they attended both the 2019 Melon Music Awards and 2019 Mnet Asian Music Awards. The group became the first artists in the history of K-pop to receive all grand prizes from both ceremonies; getting four from each awards show" Similar to my Wembley quibble, are they the first artists to receive all prizes from 4371:

2) CURRENT: "Political scientist Joseph Nye developed the concept of soft power in his 2004 book Soft Power: The Means to Success in World Politics, which researchers such as Maud Quessard have applied to BTS and their influence on entertainment diplomacy and international relations. Nye wrote, "when

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BTS name is 'Bulletproof Boy Scouts, as they have experianced bullying and racsim that can reign down on teenagers and young adults like bullets. Thier Music isn't meant to be sad, although many people think it is, it is actually meant to be inspirational, for example thier song 'Let go' is meant to

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I have to agree with kitb here. Since the days of the FAR, something that bothered me was that the section being renamed Endorsements and Awards while containing no information about the latter, except for the link to the Awards page. That makes no sense. Most BLP articles similar to this one either

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I think we should cover continued group activities and honors, cover military service briefly, leaving much of the detail to the individual biographical articles and look to summarize the military matters down the road as it is unlikely to be a major part what is written about the group. Elvis is a

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is that it worth keeping track of the GI issues and to keep a separate section in the article for this information. If the FA for Elvis has such a section then why should the BTS article be without such a section. (2) Another option is to simply hibernate the section and the article until 2025 when

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certifications are supposed to be capitalized. The Awards section already had this consistently done, and the prose of the Career section should have been unified to match this. I don't understand why you reverted my changes. There are FL/FA articles that capitalize them and the article about music

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Currently the article only lists one artist, Steve Aoki, who has done two songs with BTS (in 2017 and 2018) but otherwise has zero involvement with the group. I'm not sure why he's listed specifically, especially when none of the other musical acts BTS has worked with more recently are listed here?

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First, increase the percentage of the article that is cited to journal articles and books, including those cited by Buidhe. Second, insert page numbers for chapters. Third, use sfn formatting for books and journal articles, so that they may be cited in full in the bibliography and in short form in

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Though this is an old conversation, I would like to point out that the certification mentions in the "Career" section should be capitalized. It was stated in an old discussion some time ago on one of the Music-project related pages that certifications should be capitalized. I consistently did this

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They took place in few tv shows like BTS Bon voyage sos- 1,2,3,4 aired on vlive since 5th of July 2016- 7th of January 2020. Bon Voyage is a reality show about members of South Korean boy band BTS (Bangtan Sonyeondan) travelling. It shows them in everyday situations that every traveller encounters

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is a solo artist who previously was one of their long-term producers at BigHit. She's credited as a writer/composer/producer on at least 14 BTS tracks that I know of, and was a background vocalist on many of their songs. I also agree about Halsey/Sheeran/Coldplay not being listed - I just meant to

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If you've linked it there, then there should be at the very least a modicum of prose in the section making a connection to something to do with their Awards. I maintain it was a very odd choice (in the FAR as I commented above) to practically erase all mention of the Awards&Noms, when such is

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without even introducing the latter. Idk if the trim for the GAR was the cause, but whatever's missing needs to be restored for it to make sense chronogically. The release date for Wings, or which # album it is, isn't even mentioned either. I'll replace the now-irrelevant sources shortly, but the

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It has come to my attention that in the section that lists BTS positions in the group it states that j-hope is a sub rapper when that is not the case. He is a main rapper just like RM and Suga. There is no such thing as lead or sub rapper in BTS. He is a main dancer, main rapper, a sub vocalist,

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Hi, I would like to request that j-hope's military station location be removed. A lot of Armys discourage spreading the location as it has never been shared by j-hope, the other members, or their company/BigHit/HYBE. I also request that the other members' station information not be added as they

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First glance is that the electronic format books are not providing the page numbers for the chapters. Apparently, changing the font size for reading completely repaginates the electronic books and therefor there are no page numbers for the individual chapters in electronic books which I viewed.

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Joseph Nye developed the concept of a second type of power different from traditional authoritarianism. "This second aspect of power – which occurs when one country gets other countries to want what it wants – might be called co-optive or soft power in contrast with the hard or command power of

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SUGGESTED: "BTS was invited to address the United Nations General Assembly in New York in September 2018. That same year they performed in Paris before an audience of 400, including President Moon Jae-in and other officials, at the 2018 Korea-France Friendship Concert, a summit celebrating the

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That image is marked as Creative Commons, but the license claim has not been reviewed on Commons. I was unable to find a CC declaration on the YouTube page from which that image was taken. As such, I must assume that the requested image is fair use until a free license can be demonstrated. Per

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1) CURRENT: "BTS were invited to address the United Nations General Assembly in September 2018 and perform before 400 officials, including President Moon Jae-in, at the 2018 Korea-France Friendship Concert in Paris, a summit celebrating the friendly relations between France and South Korea."

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Sign me up if there is something that needs to be discussed or commented upon. Regarding general timing issues for BTS, most of the members of the group are getting ready for military service in the South Korean draft service. This type of issue could have an effect upon the best timing for

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There's some misleading info drawn from an equally misleading article in the Fandom section under Impact! This part: "Feedback from ARMY to BTS affects the group's actions and lyrics; BTS has eliminated certain Korean words that sound like American racial slurs from their songs and ended

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It has come to my attention that the editor Lililolol is insistent on removing co-produce on the lead section. I feel like the removal of it needs to be discussed. They want to keep removing without any thought. Regardless of what you tell them, they will revert it. I'm tagging

2256:: "The group won the Special International Music Award at the 62nd Japan Record Awards" - Arama Japan is not a reliable or quality source. It's the equivalent of Soompi/Allkpop/Koreaboo for Japanese-related entertainment news, their About section alone is an easy red flag. The 370:"change The septet—consisting of members Jin, Suga, J-Hope, RM, Jimin, V, and Jungkook—co-writes and co-produces much of their own output] to The septet—consisting of members Jin, Suga, J-Hope, RM, Jimin, V, and Jungkook—co-writes and co-produces much of their own output] 3435:

Endorsements and awards should be segregated. This is based on other GA articles. For example, the endorsement could be under the existing Impact / Other Ventures section, while the awards on the main article could be built into a section called "Achievements and Awards.".

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future events, certainly not in the article itself. If there's any word coming from any of the parties involved regarding enlistment schedules or changes to it, be BH or BTS members, we can add it. I'm sure that if the 2025 schedule is delayed they'll be asked about it. -

1273:"For the final stop of the North American leg, the group performed at Citi Field in Queens, marking the first time a Korean act performed at a US stadium" You've previously stated the band's played "arenas and domes". What is the difference between a dome and a stadium?-- 3515:

I'm generally going with Btspurple on this question. That section is currently written as a short intro to the two sibling articles which it is linked to; its basically already in the form you state, one for endorsements and another sibling article for nominations here:

2250:: "It was supported by two singles: "Danger" and "War of Hormone" (Korean: 호르몬 전쟁; RR: Horeumon Jeonjaeng)..." - the 2nd ref attached to this sentence is from Soompi and should be replaced or removed, esp if the other two refs adequately cover the release of the singles. 2929:

If anyone has done the math on this then all the members would need to enlist by June 2024 of next year if the band is to reunite before the end of 2025 as promised by Hybe (with 18 months minimum service each). Does something like this statement make sense to mention.

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There are still two items from the source review undone. Both involve Naver. Could one of you take care of those? I've done everything else. And as the reviewer noted, after all the effort they put into this one, it would be good if we could review their new FAC,

1201:"In the narrative sequence, the album coincided with the "轉" or "turn" of the series," I don't understand what is meant by "in the narrative sequence". (What I'm really saying when I flag this sort of thing is that I'm hoping you'll edit it to clear things up).-- 1237:" touching on the tortuous enlightenment of loving without being loved and encouragement to those without dreams." I get loving without being loved (I might add a "in return" after "loved" if the source supports it), but what is meant by the last five words?-- 2467:

and I will ask the other TFA coordinators not to schedule it before then. When we do get there, I wonder if the appearance could be publicized through social media to have a run at breaking the record for views of a TFA, which is presently 768,586 for

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Caps are only used in Chart headings and tables. The preference for prose mention of "gold or silver or platinum" certification is to keep it in lower case, for example, as is done at Billboard. In the prose passages, it should be kept in lower case.

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WHY: a) By using only *part* of a sentence from Nye's book you've created a grammatically incorrect sentence that's hard to follow. b) It is, again, factually incorrect - The quote comes from his 1990 article "Soft Power" published in the journal

1493:"BTS held another free online streaming event on their YouTube channel on April 17, this time titled Bang Bang Con 21," You haven't previously mentioned a free streaming event. You've mentioned other streams, but none clearly defined as free.-- 1065:

and offers. BTS run aired on vlive since 1st of august 2015- present. In Run BTS Members play games or participate in a variety of activities. Hwarang: The Poet Warrior Youth, in this series V aka Kim Tae-hyung played role of Han-Sung.

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Producers should not be listed as associated acts. I don't see why Sheeran should be listed. Who is Adora? Not Halsey or Coldplay, because friendship isn't what the instructions talk about. Coldplay just did one collab song; same with

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I don't even listen to their music 😅 but it seems cut and dry top importance to me. Maybe this article can eventually get downgraded if another even more influential band comes along (very very hard to do at this point; BTS is huge)

4368:). c) You need to decide if you're going to treat 'BTS' as a singular or plural noun. In most of the rest of the article you treat it as singular ('As of 2023, BTS is the best-selling...' and 'BTS has also appeared on Time's...') 3559:

for eg.), but this article does none of that (it did prior to the FAR cut). Logically, the section should either be renamed Endorsements alone, or have its prose ammended to mention something about their achievements/awards. --

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I want to add HYBE Corporation page link in the labels column so that the readers would know that K-Pop singers who are in music companies that are part of HYBE should include HYBE Corporation page link to know more about it.

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OK, great. And you see how I've responded to Buidhe re reliability, with books and articles that use those sources as references. Can you deal with the ones that are in Korean characters? I'm not confident of my searching on

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I've added some other scholarly sources for "Diplomacy and BTS" in my Sandbox which might be considered to stand in the BTS Influence section if its usable next to their UN diplomacy and visit to the White House commentary.

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Congrats to all on getting this to FA. The next thing is to consider a date that we would like to see this be Today's Featured Article. A logical date would be the group's tenth anniversary in June. Then we would put it at

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Copy edited to new version: "...It was followed one month later in October by their next studio album Wings which combined the themes of youth presented in their previous "youth trilogy" with temptation and adversity."

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WHY: a) This should not be one long, confusing run-on sentence. b) It contains a factual error: they did not perform in front of 400 officials, they performed in front of 400 people, some of whom were officials

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generally included on BLP articles for musicians/celebrities (FA examples: Minogue, Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Kate Winslett, The Beatles, U2, etc.) or merged into a Legacy or related subsection in some way. --

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Linking the members section is not essential, since the infobox already includes linked pages for each member. The absence of mention regarding "Beyond the Story" is due to its current lack of updates.

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I think it would fine without a timeline. It’s best to keep it limited, as their article is big in size compared to other K-Pop band articles. It would be taking up unnecessary space on their article.

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The article is good enough, hence the FA status, but there's always room for improvement. I just don't see how their endorsements can be related to the accolades they've accumulated over the years.

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ordering others to do what it wants." Researchers such as Maud Quessard have applied the concept of soft power to BTS and their influence on entertainment diplomacy and international relations.

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Hey everyone. The name of their production company, Big Hit Entertainment, is misspelled in the second paragraph ("Entertainment" has an extra "e" in it). Can someone with permissions fix it?

3762:) was published just a few months ago and has at least two chapters devoted to BTS, but likely many mentions in others. Would be a good source to incorporate in this article in the future. 5004:

I understand that they are linked elsewhere on the page, I only ask as I myself usually go to the members section to see a timeline (if applicable) and go to member articles from there.

1688:"In September 2016, BTS released their second Japanese studio album Youth. Wings combined the themes of youth presented in their previous "youth trilogy" with temptation and adversity." 2674:

There is no need to change the image to an older one. Also, the members are listed in order from left to right in the image caption, so that helps the reader to identify the members.

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It doesn't work like that. If we were to allow any new editor who asks to be allowed to edit to do so, it would defeat the whole purpose of protecting the article. Instead, say here

3623:, are we to say "BTS is" or "BTS are"? I'm not certain we're entirely consistent at present. Since the article's TFA in a little over a week, let's try to settle matters like this. 4372:

one country gets other countries to want what it wants might be called co-optive or soft power in contrast with the hard or command power of ordering others to do what it wants."

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what text you would like to put into the article, and what text if any you think it should replace, and an experienced editor will decide whether to make the suggested changes.

5023:. It's unnecessary to include links to their articles within the members section since readers can easily access them either through the introduction sentence or the infobox. 481:

guidelines say professional relationships that are significant to their career - collaborations with multiple occasions for one. This doesn't seem to be significant here.

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It looks OK. The Nye books need page numbers. If you can't get page numbers get chapter numbers and quote the text as part of the reference that you are relying upon.--

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Should we add a Timeline subsection? Just like in other K-pop boy band articles. And also a suggestion to move the last paragraph in lead section to Members section.

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In the History section, a sentence has redundant text. The following sentence reads incorrectly; the phrase "original plans to" is redundant and should be deleted:

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Is there a reason the members section of the article does not link to each of their individual articles? Most group articles link to members pages in that section (

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I request to edit and add additional information that wasn't added beforehand to further make this a more professional article/information page and more specific.

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While I understand the need to cover the enlistment one something of a play-by-play basis, we should plan to greatly consolidate that text at some future date.

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I only restored that version because I was trying to convert something into a sfn format but it had cite errors on it. You can place back whatever I reverted.

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hello i wanted to send you an editing request because i want to fix all the spelling mistakes and make the articles sound more better thank you and good bye.

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Something is missing here. The refs for Youth aren't right either, because they're for the Japanese releases of INU and Run (that were eventually included on

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for the Awards section (and the parts of the Career section regarding certs that I wrote), so it would be good if the rest of the article matched that. --

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Hi, I just bumped up the article's importance rating from high to top. I don't know if I'll encounter pushback, but wanted to explain reasoning why here:

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Make a mention of this not being the same as the original band BTS (built to spill), and provide a link to their wikipedia page early on in this article.

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On the sentence "The comic surpassed 15million views globally in its first two days of availability and became the highest-viewed title ever launched by

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Change this lines: In 2020, BTS became one of the few groups since the Beatles (in 1966–1968) to chart four US number-one albums in less than two years

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J-hope hasn't been officially appointed as a GA for LV. As for the rest, everything is already mentioned in each member's individual article. -

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Jin is the first member set to enlist around his birthday, which is in December. By then, we should also know if the group will go together.

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would be the most ideal. He's worked closely with them since their debut. But as stated by another editor no producers should be listed.

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As Namjoon already had explained that doesn’t mean BTS - BTS meaning it’s only Bulletproof Boys Scout or in Korean Bangtan Sonyeondan

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The article mentions BTS released their debut album on June 12, 2013. I was wondering if we ought to include their televised debut on

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I'm fairly sure all 52 via Naver edits are now in place. I've also done the peer review for his article and answered at FAC as well.

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I would suggest eliminating the domes then since the best-known domes (say, Superdome, Tokyo Dome, SkyDome) are stadium-size spaces.

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section, link text "防彈|少年|團" should not have vertical bars? Can't make this edit as I don't have extended-confirmed access. Thanks!

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Reason: The current sentences are both inaccurate and not supported by any articles linked on the page. Also, which other groups?

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I corrected all and finished editing the page, so you can go back in now and retry fixing what you were attempting to before. --

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Can you please change their profile picture.It has been there for a long time now.Can you please put a recent picture with them?

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is placed at the top of the page and any reader looking for something different is referred to other uses that can be found at

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it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a

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Somewhat related, that second to last paragraph for the history section needs to be reorganized - it goes from Oct 2022 -: -->

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OK. I don't see any major issues. I'd be happy to join as a co-nominator of a renewed FAC and do my best to get it through.--

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that support the change you want to be made. You haven't provided any sources that the group won't continue to be active. ―

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Wehwalt's wording should do the trick. If they come back again, and you have to deal w/ more reverts, just report them. --

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Again, any individual ambassadorship or achievement is mentioned in their individual articles. It doesn't belong here. -

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Consistency is important in capitalization, but the article says "certified Gold" but also "certified double platinum".--

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To this lines: In 2020, BTS became the fastest group to earn four number one albums since the Beatles in 1966–1968.

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Changing 'narrative sequence' to 'themes explored in the album relating to the pains and sorrows of separation...".

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You can upload anything to Commons, it still needs to be reviewed for acceptable licensing per what Jonesey95 said.

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This article is twice as long as it needs to be, with far too much pointless trivia and long-winded descriptions.

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Silver, gold and platinum 'certifies' should all be in lower case. Current article version all in lower case now.

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What's wanted is each genre of music that's cited should have one or more citations. I'm out of time for today.--

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That way it is easier to tell the members apart, since in the current one they are all wearing the same outfit.

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It was both at MAMA and the Melon Music Awards that they won four Daesangs, amounting to a total of 8 Daesangs.

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Rewrite sentences on Lights release by adapting Commercial release section on Knowledge Lights article for BTS.

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enlist; this will make everything very cluttered in an already very long article. The enlistment date is fine.

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subheads are so large my browser freezes while editing, hence it's taking me a while to make all the fixes. --

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Please add the recently ended Permission to Dance On Stage Tour in the BTS section ‘Concert Tours’. Thank you!

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I think it will be better to add the timeline section after all of them have finished their military service.

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I believe my edit makes more sense grammaticlaly, as the sentence is too complex without a full stop divider

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I've updated the genres based on what the sources said about each review. Allocate genres to each citation.

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point out that even they are more affiliated than Aoki was, so for him to be listed and no one else is odd.

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Jimin - Dior - Tiffany & Co. Suga - Valentino Jhope - Louis Vuitton Jimin - Collaboration with Taeyang

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Meanwhile, the replacement sentences taken from the history section and supported by the linked source.

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I'd argue they're probably the biggest positive thing to happen to SK's PR in history, even bigger than

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I think it's fine as it is. The article went through major changes not that long ago. The article is of

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https://www.wilsoncenter.org/sites/default/files/media/documents/page/joseph_nye_soft_power_journal.pdf

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have an Awards and achievements/Legacy section that mentions accolades and achievements in some way (

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has an Oricon News ref that can replace it. Someone just needs to add a transl for the ref title. --

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I renamed the section to Endorsements alone and moved the link to the awards to the Impact section.

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There are three approaches which can be taken for this general issue: (1) The example of the FA for

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If the requested image is indeed freely licensed, please provide some evidence of its licensing. –

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I'd like each genre of music supported by a ref, rather than have a string of four as at present.--

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Aoki remixed a song, which isn't so important, and was featured on one song. Not a huge connection.

486: 429: 400: 377: 160: 5112:, so it's classified as a high quality article. It went through a downsizing from previous times. 1587:

Please look over my contributions and see how to deal with chapters like in the Soft Power book.--

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Great! (just don't forget to mark the KH ref for the JRAs win as 'cite news', not 'cite web') --

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Nothing on WP is perfectly fine. Or at least not an article this size At almost 9000 words, the

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References to books should have page numbers is available. ISBNs should be properly hyphenated.

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who uploaded the photo under a CC license doesn't seem to be the legitimate copyright holder.

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I think it's fine as is, for the reasons stated by Btspurplegalaxy and ErnestKrause above.

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My suggestion would be to wait and see what other editors think before making any changes.

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https://time.com/collection/time100-companies-2022/6159410/hybe-bang-si-hyuk-bts-interview/

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