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that I am not a realtor). I revised according. I have already stated in another spot that I did not comment on my edits because tech-wise I did not know how. You have repeatedly found something new to address, and while I have made many revisions, you are still not happy. Your editing notes also contradict each other at times, indicating there really is no way to please you. You state that me saying the ABC station is down the block is trivial and you remove it, and then later you want me to add that we have a McDonalds and Dunkin Dounts. Those places are everywhere, ABC is not. It is an interesting fact that ABC is down the street from us. You initially removed all of the Points of
Interest and then recently added in a water treatment plant as one. No one pays admission to see a water treatment plant. It is not a point of interest. You added a Greek picnic event to the page that is absent 364 days of the year, yet if I added the breast cancer walk that goes right through the neighborhood each year, you would have surely removed that as being trivial too.
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job correctly. If you read that 1927 ad for "Bala", you will see (1) that it's the same house from my photo and (2) the "motoring" directions take you BELOW City Ave on the Philly side. Seems like people were trying to upmarket these homes even back in 1927 as McClatchy called them a "suburban property" at "Bala". If you go to the 1910 map on the link, you can see no homes of present day
Belmont Village existed. The 1927 map shows McClatchy having bought the southern side of Conshohocken Ave, and each of these homes have plaques saying John McClatchy built them. The deed to my house even has John McClatchy in it (but that would be original research). Lastly, he didn't build anything in the 1930s because the Depression wiped him out. So, I am undoing what you changed (because I need to see my words back in order to revise) and then revising the phrasing because you are right about some of it. I hope you find the new revision more direct.
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those pages, yet repeatedly pick on this one. Your comments have now highlighted that you clearly are holding a personal grudge, especially in your tone. Details that were totally fine in the entire time are now being attacked, despite me making numerous re-writes to appease you. As a neighborhood, we created this page. We were so happy to have finally made one, and we united behind it. With each of your attacks on the page, another neighbor writes me with sadness to notify me of your most recent caprices. You have singlehandedly killed all of our collective excitement and civic pride. Most neighbors think it's not even worth it anymore. You seem to have no other interest online than this site. I have faith though that you will take your interests elsewhere--perhaps to the neighborhood above--and leave us alone.
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use a map to prove the existence of anything. If you lived in a Civil War era townhouse and showed me a map from 1830 when your block was farmland and then an 1870 map showing your block fully developed, would I question whether your block was torn down in the 1950s and then rebuilt as new homes? No. I would see the pictures you posted on your
Knowledge (XXG) page and see old houses that matched what the map said. Look at the photos. The homes are from the 1920s. The homes along Conshohocken Ave. have plaques built right into them that say Built by John McClathy.
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substantial coverage in reliable sources discussing either in relation to
Belmont Village. As a test case, consider the issue of the McDonalds that opened in Chestnut Hill roughly 7-8 years ago. There was sufficient controversy and challenge to such a "vulgar" business in an exclusive area that it received significant coverage in the Inquy and a few other sources. Without checking, I'm willing to bet it isn't in our article on Chestnut Hill because it is not of enduring significance to Chestnut Hill. Ditto the McDonalds and Saks for Belmont Villiage.
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directory of city neighborhoods she references fails to include numerous neighborhoods, Graduate
Hospital and Fitler Square being two of them. SummerPhD has also repeatedly referenced the inaccuracy of other Wiki sites, yet now she is using one (Wynnefield) to prove her point. She is contradicting her very own principles of good research in an effort to tear down this site.
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Belmont Avenue is our eastern border and their western border. Please re-read their page and you will see you misread. 3. The
Wynnefield page is no longer in conflict. It has been updated to reflect a city map. The Wynnefield page is already cited for missing numerous references, so perhaps you can help them improve their page since they are already factually incorrect.
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633:. If you have reliable sources directly discussing the ages of houses in Belmont Village, you might have something. At present, you do not. I have yet to see individual sources discussing this. Rather, we have ads for houses with a description of their location and maps of the purported location over the years from which we are
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Lastly, we all have a personal interest in the pages we create. Who would create a
Knowledge (XXG) page for a topic that had no interest to them? Knowledge (XXG) lives by people like me... and you... who have a personal interest in topics and want to then factually share this topic with the world.
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You even questioned the maps that I referenced. The maps show McClatchy building the homes and you actually stated these sources are unreliable because there's no way of knowing that the homes on 1927 map are still the same homes standing there today. What?!? With that flawed logic, we could never
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SummerPhd, I have made numerous revisions to this page. Initially, your comments were quite helpful, and while I didn't understand the changes right away, it made for a better article. I had modeled this page after
Chestnut Hill, Mount Airy, and East Falls in terms of style. You comment on none of
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1. See Page 2 of the map referenced. It identifies all of the
Recreational Land bordering the west and south of Belmont Village. The area identified on Page 2 and 5 are exactly the same. That is the golf club and the park. 2. Wynnefield Heights is not in conflict with the Belmont Village page.
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In addition, SummerPhD quotes a map (the InfoResources at UPenn map) where it says directly on the page "The neighborhood boundaries presented here are tentative and only for mapping purposes. InfoR needs users' assistance to redefine these boundaries. Please send your comments to InfoR." And, the
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Additionally, as for the reliability of the Bryn Mawr site, let's be honest here. It does not take a rocket scientist to find
Inquirer ads on microfilm. As two people with a few graduate degrees between us, we know that grad students surely must possess the intellectual capacity to accomplish the
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The boundaries for Belmont Village are currently unsourced. One source, a map with few street names, has been offered as a source. Searching for a source, I am confounded by the numerous sources that consider the area in question to be part of wynnefield. The article, as written, will have none of
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Again, I initially modeled this neighborhood page after the Knowledge (XXG) pages already in existence. I completely agree that the initial tone (while matching many pages already on here, yet not touched by you) was too promotional and could be perceived as being realtor-ism (despite the reality
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I am one of two editors involved in a dispute over the content of this article. (Please note I have indicated the other editor seems to have a conflict of interest and claims to be editing on behalf of a number of people from one account.) As an opening to the disputed content, please review the
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Here's a solid, simple shortcut on the trivia issue. Information that is not discussed in independent reliable sources in relation to the topic of the article is trivial. Yes, we can certainly find numerous sources that mention McDonalds or Saks on City Line Ave. However, we are unlikely to find
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The boundaries of the surrounding neighborhoods are on "incorrect" to the extent that they are at varience with the boundaries used in this article. As other, equally reliable sources confirm the boundaries those pages use, the problem is that the various pages fail to spell out the facts. Some
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Belmont Village is referenced on Page 5 of the OFFICIAL PHILADELPHIA CITY PLANNING COMMISSION MAP that I referenced earlier. SummerPhD unacceptably removed this official reference and then cited the lack of any official government agencies recognizing Belmont Village. There is none because she
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and indeed you are right with some. McDonalds is definitely trivial since they are everywhere. Saks is not as commonplace and could be important to note for a few readers. Ultimately though, while trumping McDonalds, it is not THAT important, and thus you are right. The age of one's home is
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of the houses, ignoring others and, of course, focusing on housing. As for "most" houses having garages and alleyways, it is unsupported by any reliable source having done a count and, more importantly, trivial. The reason we don't discuss Belmont Villages piles of dirty laundry or supposed
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verify the boundaries it is used as a cite for. I am moving the map to an "External links" section so that it will remain attached to the article. From where I'm sitting, the boundaries the map shows do not include the golf club and park. Rather, the boundaries are all roads. As such, the
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important though to many people--many more than those who would be interested in Saks... or McDonalds. According to Knowledge (XXG)'s policy on handling trivia, just because you find the age of your home unimportant doesn't mean you can judge the interests of all readers.
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for the area. The local civic association, in their limited discussion of events in the area, proudly discusses their working with the police regarding the Picnic. The Breast Cancer Walk is not mentioned. Further, you fault me based on your assumption that if you
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Belmont Village is isolated from West Philadelphia due to the natural and man-made barriers surrounding it. Belmont Village is separated from its closest neighbor to the west, Wynnefield, by the grounds of the Bala Golf Club and SEPTA’s Cynwyd Line (formerly the
537:. Their are articles on Knowledge (XXG) about my employer, organizations that have funded grants for projects I am/have been involved it, the neighborhood I live in, my high school, my undergrad school, my grad school schools, several of my colleagues, etc. I do
826:, which rightfully should be removed. Some of the paragraphs are harmless (such as the Demographics section), but sentences like "A few blocks to the east, one will find... Saks Fifth Avenue, Target, and several dining options" make like content sound like a
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I do not have a person grudge against you (I don't know who you are), this neighborhood (I've been through every neighborhood in the city numerous times, I don't have a clear picture of this neighborhood), etc. (I will get back to the disputed info in a
1031:. I point to the Wynnefield page in the interest of avoiding conflicting information. This page says the area in question is not part of Wynnefield and separated from it by the park. The Wynnefield article says it is part of Wynnefield. Additionally
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dates for the current houses there. As for the plaques on the houses, we do not know who placed them there or how they determined the information on them. In any event, they are neither independent nor reliable sources Take a look at
439:. This article will never be "done". If you and I were to finally agree on everything, another editor or editors might come along today, next year or five years from now and find problems. Knowledge (XXG) is a project, not a product.
642:. The article provides a reliable source for her birth date. Later in the article is her grave marker with a different date. The talk page speculates about the contradiction while the article -- as it should -- sticks to what the
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As for the content disputes, Knowledge (XXG) has procedures for that as well. For openers, I will be requesting a third opinion. I will be basing the request for that opinion on the changes you made in mass reverting all of my
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There are several problems with you, "as a neighborhood" creating this page. First, the article was written under one user account. A user account is for one individual user, not groups of people. Next there is the issue of
1079:" The sources, however, do not support this. Per the sources, the water treatment facility (which you have tended to cal the res) is part of Wynnefield Heights, much as the gas station and motel are part of Belmont Village.
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In Belmont Village one can find stone twins, stucco twins, stone row homes, brick row homes, Tudor-inspired row homes, and Spanish-inspired row homes. Most homes have access to a garage behind it via a network of private
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Yes, Knowledge (XXG) has other articles (millions of them, in fact). However, the state of another article (or other articles) is not binding on this article. (If there are problems with other articles, feel free to fix
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Of all the sources cited in the article (census.gov, various historic maps, Bryn Mawr College, City Ave. Business District, etc.) only two mention the neighborhood. The Preservation Alliance gives the name in
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were built before those dates. Maps of the area where my house is show a house here as early as the late 18th century. Our house was built shortly after WWI. The map does not determine the age of my house. We
810:; I think it's very exaggerated to label SummerPhD's edits as "vandalism", I highly doubt any user can have a "personal grudge" over something as minor as a middle class neighborhood. While there are
732:" Belmont Village also has sidewalks, roads, mentally ill people, garbage, air, piles of dirty laundry and millions of other things. Yes, someone selling houses in the area might wish to expound upon
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In any case, the image does not say: 1) these were the first homes of Belmont Villiage 2) they were built in 1924 3) McClatchy was a "popular" builder in the 1920s 4) McClatchy built "fine" homes
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determine the age of this house. The article on the neighborhood that I live in (which I have not edited) does not mention the age of my house or the houses on my block because it is
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is not a rational question. It is not. Ignoring that, the page cited shows one image, apparently an ad, perhaps from the Inquirer, undated. Are ads reliable sources? For
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lists Belmont Ave. as its western boundary. This article, however, says the two neighborhoods are separated by the water treatment facility. I'll add "conflict" tags. -
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Knowledge (XXG) articles must be based on independent reliable sources discussing the topic in question. At present, this article does not meet that standard and is not
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My comments involving McDonalds, et al was related to the inclusion of some chains (Target, Saks) while ignoring more pedestrian chains was selective in a way meant to
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561:, where I live, and more significant edits to some of the events and locations in this city (though none that I have a personal connection to -- I'm not a
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Your recent edits indicate not only contradictions in your previous edits but also display a personal interest in this page that makes it hard for me to
765:. (All of the changes reverted were edits I made, save a minor bot edit dating a template.) Each edit was individually reverted with the edit summary, "
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neighbor than any TV studio. In addition to being far larger that both studios combined and employing more people it is far closer to the neighborhood.
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The original homes of the neighborhood date back to 1924 and were built by John H. McClatchy, a popular builder of fine homes during the 1920s.
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Now, onto the age of the houses. Comparing various ads and maps to current houses and making deductions about locations are the very heart of
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Yes, a third opinion helped. Good call. We still disagree on the matter of homes, however. You repeatedly label various details as
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Belmont Village is separated from its closest neighbor to the east, Wynnefield Heights, by the Belmont Water Treatment Facility...
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Thus, I am undoing your conflict note and restoring the reference since Page 2 and Page 5 support that sentence in the article
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I stated that the maps, showing that some houses existed in some locations by given dates, did not show that the houses there
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351:. Perhaps your attention would be better directed toward building a website for your neighborhood; Knowledge (XXG) is
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with simple facts. Yes, Paris is the capital of France and that is a meaningful fact about France. However, we have "
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neighborhood includes the houses discussed as well as a gas station and a motel, which have not been mentioned. -
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sources consider "Belmont Village" to be a neighborhood. Some sources consider it to be a part of Wynnefield. -
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included edit summaries descriptive of the changes, along with two more in-depth comments on this talk page. -
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articles on all topics it covers. Despite your "collective excitement and civic pride", Knowledge (XXG) is
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source that specify says anything about "Belmont Village" is the Belmont Village Community Association.
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830:. A fair compromise would be to keep some of the content, but remove anything that is unreferenced with
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I have again removed much of the promotional material from the article. Knowledge (XXG) aims to present
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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I stated that a class project talking making assumptions about houses built in the area is not a
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in you recently. I do appreciate that you have stopped the editing and sought a third party.
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Undid revision 394685565 by SummerPhD (talk) Vandalized by SummerPhD--She has personal grudge
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For the moment, I am leaving the article as is. In our future interactions, however, please
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Now that we have a third opinion, let's see what we can do to make this a better (
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Incidentally, they are "houses". Real estate agents call them "homes". -
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None of the sources are perfect, of course. Wiki pages are not valid as
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avoid making the assumption that I am attacking you or your neighborhood
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You've tried to address some of my concerns but I find other problems.
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or promotional in tone, as according to Knowledge (XXG)'s policies on
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Whether or not a student class project (the webpage) citing ads is a
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recognizes the Wynnefield name for the area, starting in the 1920s
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includes this area. Also lumping them in is InfoResources at UPenn
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claims "Inquirer ads referenced are 100% reliable" in support of "
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Yes, I have a "personal interest in the pages (I) create". I do
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You modeled this page after other pages that I have not edited.
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Wow, that's a lot to address. Here are the issues, one by one.
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mentioned are discussed in independent reliable sources, not
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limited information, yes. We could possibly cite an ad for "
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Joe's says their macaroni and cheese is the tastiest
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paint a more flattering picture of the neighborhood
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806:Hi! I'm here to offer a third opinion. Let's all
880:Thanks for the input. I will edit accordingly.
662:"Inquirer ads referenced are 100% reliable"?!?!
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