497:, intentionally standing in your opponent's line of sight, and then suddenly moving when you "realise" you're in the wrong place. - Potter actually cites this several times as an example of what Gamesmanship is -not-. Though he describes a technique similar to this, this example is misleading. To quote Gamesmanship pg. 19 again, "If your adversary is nervy, and put off by the mannerisms of his opponent, it is unsporting, and therefore not gamesmanship, to go in, e.g., for a loud noseblow, say, at billiards, or to chalk your cue squeakingly, when he is either making or considering a shot." The example I replaced this with is from page 24 of Gamesmanship. 6)Soccer- I have a big problem with this paragraph. Not only does Gamesmanship explicitly not apply to sports such as soccer, but the ploy described is incredibly unsportsmanslike. It is simply poor form, not gamesmanship. I have removed it. 7) Potter was being humorous - This line implies Potter thought gamesmanship was humorous, but sportsmanship came first. When in actuality he supports being sportsmanlike only because if you aren't it will upset an opponent. I think it's a minor point though, so I left it.
493:
quote page 40 of
Gamesmanship, in discussing praising one's opponent's golf stroke so he'll over-analyze it and thus perform poorly, he writes, "I often think the possibilities of this gambit alone prove the superiority of games to sports, such as, for instance, rowing, where self-conscious analysis of the stroke can be of actual benefit to the stroke maker." 2) "Gamesmanship is unsportsmanlike conduct" - Maybe. But this statement is misleading, since, to quote page 19 of Gamesmanship, "The good gamesman is the good sportsman." 3) Spondoolicks' summary is basically close to the truth, though with the details off. Potter describes the scenario in the opening of Gamesmanship, and makes reference to it in almost every subsequent work. As Potter tells it though, Joad hit the ball out (the ball had landed six feet behind the back line), and while their opponents were readying their own serve, Joad prompted his famous question. Joad declined having the point replayed. 4) Potter usually writes with derision about the "feigned injury ploy", though it is gamesmanship, albeit sloppy. I touched it up nonetheless. 5)In
746:
backwards and intimate touching. A copy of the famous Paul
Gascoigne / Vinni Jones photograph would illustrate this last example. The interesting point about 'intimate touching' is that a referee could red card a player for it on the grounds of violent conduct and indeed the police could subsequently prosecute them for sexual assault. In practice the people who would dare to do this sort of thing almost certainly need to be friends with the victim in the first place to avoid the likelihood of a much more violent outburst. The victim would also be expected by cultural pressure to view it as only gamesmanship.
679:
use it all the time now who've never read Potter's original book. It could be that Potter-style gamesmanship has died out as an actual practice, and only exists as part of the history of comedy, whereas the word itself is now used by most people to mean just 'distracting, intimidating or otherwise annoying your opponent'. This is undoubtedly a corruption and simplification of the original concept, but that's semantic change for you.
166:
408:
390:
71:
53:
418:
22:
81:
667:
or unsportsmanlike, but is permitted and indeed encouraged to make the opponent feel or look unsportsmanlike (i.e. if your opponent pretends to have a mild knee injury which is giving them a bit of trouble that day, wait a good long time before you reluctantly own up that you have a serious heart defect).
666:
Potter's original book is comic in tone, and he very clearly states that gamesmanship is not cheating, and must always involve good sportsmanship - or at any rate, the appearance of good sportsmanship. In Potter's version of gamesmanship, the gamesman is not permitted to do anything flagrantly wrong
678:
Although I would prefer the original meaning of the term to be the primary one, I recognise that the other uses exist, and perhaps it would be a good idea to reorganise this article on a historical basis, reflecting how the meaning of the word 'gamesmanship' has changed over time. After all, people
548:
against two younger and fitter men who were outplaying them fairly comfortably. On one point the ball went past Joad and clearly landed inside the line. The opponents were already preparing for the next point when Joad queried whether the ball had landed out. The young men were confused and began to
745:
Gamesmanship examples that haven't been covered but are frequent enough in practice might include offensive banter - references to other players girl/boyfriends etc are common, keepers putting spit covered gloves in the vicinity of other players faces, 'accidentally' standing on toes whilst moving
562:
Potter's books on gamesmanship etc. are lightly fictionalised (e.g. they pretend to be brief summaries of the vast existing literature on the subjects in question), but there is no reason for supposing that this story is untrue, except that Potter's original book is the only source for it. Potter
504:
Although I think you're right to point out how the examples you deleted were not true to the spirit of Potter's idea, I think we need to start drawing a distinction between gamesmanship as Potter described it and gamesmanship as most people nowadays seem to understand it - see below. Also, please
492:
I've gone through and edited out a lot of misinformation in this article. 1) "Methods to win a game, often a sport" - Gamesmanship applies almost exclusively to -games- not sports. Potter never wrote about ploys for soccer, rugby, or any other sport, only games, like golf, cricket or tennis. To
670:
However, as we have seen, later uses of the term in the article's history and on this page often refer to a less subtle and more aggressive practice, something very like cheating - for example, standing in your opponent's line of sight, or kicking the ball at opposing players. (In this respect
741:
If I understand correctly, in the last paragraph of the section called
Football/soccer the author implies that it's possible to tackle a player from behind in an effort to deny a goal but only be sanctioned for a foul. This isn't possible for two reasons; firstly a tackle from behind is now
742:
considered to be a serious enough offense to warrant a red card in it's own right and secondly, denying an obvious goalscoring opportunity (DOGSO) is also a sending off offense in it's own right even if it was achieved by a foul that would normally only warrant a free kick.
549:
doubt themselves. A respectable professor surely wouldn't be querying it unless it was really in doubt. The point was replayed and the momentum swung the other way. Joad and Potter went on to win the match and Potter was inspired to write his book.
622:
In real life, examples abound: if you're offered a bonus for fixing bugs, make more bugs to fix. If the goal is to cut down on reported customer complaints, two easy ways are to stop answering the phone, or to have fewer customers.
193:
189:
360:
567:). In the book, the story is retold as a road-to-Damascus moment in which Potter glimpses the possibility of making a coherent theory of gamesmanship out of just such a tactic as Joad employed.
201:
294:
583:
Potter lectured at
Birkbeck College (where teaching took place in the evening) from 1926 to 1936, so he may have met Joad there, after the latter became head of philosophy in 1930.
197:
247:
824:
820:
806:
675:
bowling might be considered gamesmanship.) Jordan Brown, above, uses it to refer to 'playing the rules instead of the game', which is something different again.
643:
This is not gamesmanship as Potter defined it, nor as it's usually understood. However, I think this article needs a major revision which I'll set out below.
901:
464:
470:
341:
the page of sport in each country from corresponding article in other language
Knowledge (XXG) to English Knowledge (XXG) which was marked in red.
792:
185:
753:
906:
891:
440:
267:
103:
500:
As Potter's books are nothing but examples of gamesmanship, I'll replace the removed and erroneous soccer example with one from Potter.
322:
262:* Fix project template and/or "to do list" Current version causes tables of content to be hidden unless/until reader chooses "show."
802:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
896:
886:
619:, I once solved the traffic problem in a city by the simple expedient of cutting the main power to the city, so everybody left.
431:
395:
287:
208:
178:
94:
58:
33:
663:
It seems to me that gamesmanship is now a very broad term with a number of different and sometimes inconsistent meanings.
867:
613:, where the winning strategy is to shoot little ships, rather than the more obvious strategy of shooting asteroids. In
102:-related topics on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
257:
253:
823:
to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
757:
39:
793:
https://web.archive.org/web/20090907172010/http://www.vqronline.org/articles/1993/autumn/lowrey-timelessness/
858:
784:
707:
749:
633:
604:
526:
337:
842:
If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
830:
703:
439:
on
Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
309:
783:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit
535:
It may derive from playing to win the game instead of playing for sport. (18:33, 17 October 2005 (UTC))
345:
796:
607:, where a loophole in the rules allows one to win through an unintended strategy. One example is in
588:
544:
I heard that Potter was inspired by an incident in a tennis match. He was partnering the philosopher
231:
223:
21:
722:
Missing tennis examples. Tennis has a lot of tricks that can be added as examples of gamesmanship.
563:
knew Joad (probably from the BBC, where Potter was a producer and Joad a popular radio pundit, cf.
273:
827:
before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
316:
843:
629:
553:
302:
609:
564:
850:
584:
699:
215:
809:, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by
727:
684:
648:
572:
552:
I would have put this into the article except I don't know if it's true. Shame that. --
510:
279:
165:
849:
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
816:
880:
545:
423:
350:
244:(History section needs sources and accurate information - very vague at the moment.)
86:
776:
241:
214:
newly added and existing articles, maybe nominate some good B-class articles for
815:. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
413:
76:
723:
680:
644:
568:
506:
494:
407:
389:
672:
615:
417:
70:
52:
702:. Either exhaustive referencing or a major rewrite is required here.
436:
872:
761:
731:
711:
688:
652:
637:
592:
576:
556:
529:
514:
797:
http://www.vqronline.org/articles/1993/autumn/lowrey-timelessness/
260:
section is incorrect and unsourced. Reliable data is required.
99:
276:(crucial article explaining the salaried undertaking of sports)
218:; independently assess some as A-class, regardless of GA status.
15:
295:
Category:Knowledge (XXG) requested images of sports and games
603:
I'd always heard of gamesmanship as something of a form of
787:
for additional information. I made the following changes:
780:
154:
149:
144:
139:
435:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
98:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
819:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
469:This article has not yet received a rating on the
248:Category:American college sports infobox templates
626:I can't say that I can cite a reference, though.
194:Requested articles (Association football women)
805:This message was posted before February 2018.
8:
775:I have just modified one external link on
698:This article is riddled with unreferenced
384:
202:Requested articles (Estonian sportspeople)
173:Here are some tasks awaiting attention:
127:
47:
190:Requested articles (Association football)
599:Playing the rules, rather than the game
386:
49:
19:
234:(this should-be-major article is in a
7:
429:This article is within the scope of
92:This article is within the scope of
525:Wouldn't that be the correct term--
353:) sports to be part of this project
250:to use same font size and spacing.
38:It is of interest to the following
902:Unknown-importance Comedy articles
449:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Comedy
323:List of world sports championships
112:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Sports
14:
779:. Please take a moment to review
198:Requested articles (Motor sports)
505:sign posts in future. Thanks.
416:
406:
388:
164:
79:
69:
51:
20:
530:06:17, 23 September 2005 (UTC)
1:
443:and see a list of open tasks.
106:and see a list of open tasks.
873:15:32, 10 October 2017 (UTC)
907:WikiProject Comedy articles
892:WikiProject Sports articles
732:20:04, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
452:Template:WikiProject Comedy
254:Sport in the United Kingdom
186:Requested articles (Sports)
115:Template:WikiProject Sports
923:
836:(last update: 5 June 2024)
772:Hello fellow Wikipedians,
762:13:38, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
638:19:13, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
557:17:22, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
471:project's importance scale
712:17:02, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
593:19:56, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
468:
401:
126:
64:
46:
689:11:40, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
653:11:29, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
577:11:27, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
515:11:46, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
897:C-Class Comedy articles
887:C-Class sports articles
768:External links modified
659:Revise entire article?
605:unintended consequence
282:(currently a sub-stub)
28:This article is rated
310:Category:Sports stubs
32:on Knowledge (XXG)'s
817:regular verification
737:Association Football
361:requests for comment
349:: Gather all (major/
308:work on articles in
293:for pages listed in
232:Sport governing body
807:After February 2018
488:Several Corrections
297:and sub-categories.
274:Professional sports
861:InternetArchiveBot
812:InternetArchiveBot
432:WikiProject Comedy
95:WikiProject Sports
34:content assessment
837:
752:comment added by
700:original research
694:Citations missing
485:
484:
481:
480:
477:
476:
383:
382:
379:
378:
375:
374:
371:
370:
914:
871:
862:
835:
834:
813:
764:
610:Asteroids (game)
565:The Brains Trust
457:
456:
453:
450:
447:
426:
421:
420:
410:
403:
402:
392:
385:
179:Article requests
168:
161:
160:
128:
120:
119:
116:
113:
110:
89:
84:
83:
82:
73:
66:
65:
55:
48:
31:
25:
24:
16:
922:
921:
917:
916:
915:
913:
912:
911:
877:
876:
865:
860:
828:
821:have permission
811:
785:this simple FaQ
770:
754:175.143.197.193
747:
739:
720:
696:
661:
601:
542:
523:
490:
455:Comedy articles
454:
451:
448:
445:
444:
422:
415:
367:
159:
118:sports articles
117:
114:
111:
108:
107:
85:
80:
78:
29:
12:
11:
5:
920:
918:
910:
909:
904:
899:
894:
889:
879:
878:
855:
854:
847:
800:
799:
791:Added archive
769:
766:
738:
735:
719:
716:
695:
692:
660:
657:
656:
655:
600:
597:
596:
595:
580:
579:
541:
538:
537:
536:
527:220.238.130.44
522:
521:Ungamesmanship
519:
518:
517:
489:
486:
483:
482:
479:
478:
475:
474:
467:
461:
460:
458:
441:the discussion
428:
427:
411:
399:
398:
393:
381:
380:
377:
376:
373:
372:
369:
368:
366:
365:
364:
363:
354:
342:
333:
325:
312:
298:
283:
280:Sport industry
277:
263:
261:
251:
246:* Standardize
245:
239:
229:
219:
204:
200:
196:
192:
188:
184:
172:
170:
169:
158:
157:
152:
147:
142:
136:
133:
132:
124:
123:
121:
104:the discussion
91:
90:
74:
62:
61:
56:
44:
43:
37:
26:
13:
10:
9:
6:
4:
3:
2:
919:
908:
905:
903:
900:
898:
895:
893:
890:
888:
885:
884:
882:
875:
874:
869:
864:
863:
852:
848:
845:
841:
840:
839:
832:
826:
822:
818:
814:
808:
803:
798:
794:
790:
789:
788:
786:
782:
778:
773:
767:
765:
763:
759:
755:
751:
743:
736:
734:
733:
729:
725:
718:Tennis tricks
717:
715:
713:
709:
705:
704:SaintedLegion
701:
693:
691:
690:
686:
682:
676:
674:
668:
664:
658:
654:
650:
646:
642:
641:
640:
639:
635:
631:
627:
624:
620:
618:
617:
612:
611:
606:
598:
594:
590:
586:
582:
581:
578:
574:
570:
566:
561:
560:
559:
558:
555:
550:
547:
546:C. E. M. Joad
539:
534:
533:
532:
531:
528:
520:
516:
512:
508:
503:
502:
501:
498:
496:
487:
472:
466:
463:
462:
459:
442:
438:
434:
433:
425:
424:Comedy portal
419:
414:
412:
409:
405:
404:
400:
397:
394:
391:
387:
362:
358:
355:
352:
348:
347:
343:
340:
339:
335:
334:
332:
330:
326:
324:
321:
319:
318:
313:
311:
307:
305:
304:
299:
296:
292:
290:
289:
284:
281:
275:
272:
270:
269:
264:
259:
255:
249:
243:
237:
233:
228:
226:
225:
220:
217:
213:
211:
210:
205:
203:
199:
195:
191:
187:
183:
181:
180:
175:
174:
171:
167:
163:
162:
156:
153:
151:
148:
146:
143:
141:
138:
137:
135:
134:
130:
129:
125:
122:
105:
101:
97:
96:
88:
87:Sports portal
77:
75:
72:
68:
67:
63:
60:
57:
54:
50:
45:
41:
35:
27:
23:
18:
17:
859:
856:
831:source check
810:
804:
801:
777:Gamesmanship
774:
771:
748:— Preceding
744:
740:
721:
697:
677:
669:
665:
662:
630:Jordan Brown
628:
625:
621:
614:
608:
602:
554:Spondoolicks
551:
543:
524:
499:
491:
430:
356:
344:
336:
328:
327:
315:
314:
301:
300:
286:
285:
266:
265:
242:Field hockey
235:
222:
221:
207:
206:
177:
176:
93:
40:WikiProjects
540:Inspiration
131:To-do list:
881:Categories
868:Report bug
585:NRPanikker
346:Categorize
258:Popularity
851:this tool
844:this tool
495:billiards
359:: answer
338:Translate
857:Cheers.—
750:unsigned
673:bodyline
616:Sim City
236:shameful
781:my edit
351:olympic
238:state)
224:Cleanup
145:history
30:C-class
446:Comedy
437:comedy
396:Comedy
317:Update
268:Expand
256:- the
209:Assess
109:Sports
59:Sports
36:scale.
329:Other
303:Stubs
288:Photo
155:purge
150:watch
100:sport
758:talk
728:talk
724:Naki
708:talk
685:talk
681:Lexo
649:talk
645:Lexo
634:talk
589:talk
573:talk
569:Lexo
511:talk
507:Lexo
357:RfCs
140:edit
825:RfC
795:to
465:???
883::
838:.
833:}}
829:{{
760:)
730:)
714:.
710:)
687:)
651:)
636:)
591:)
575:)
513:)
278:*
252:*
240:*
230:*
216:GA
870:)
866:(
853:.
846:.
756:(
726:(
706:(
683:(
647:(
632:(
587:(
571:(
509:(
473:.
331::
320::
306::
291::
271::
227::
212::
182::
42::
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.
