785:... and that's just in print from one vendor. These recordings aren't usually considered "albums" in that what other pieces they are coupled with are changed frequently upon re-issue. So, from a classical music point of view, this particular "album" is most certainly NOT notable. But, if David Bowie fans want to claim ownership and keep the parenthetical "David Bowie album" in the article title, I'll look the other way. Ā :-) We may not link to it though from the main
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before 1978. I would put the year closer to 1968 or maybe even earlier than that. I believe the original work may have stemmed from Walt Disney productions, but I don't have any sources and I could be mistaken. However, I can tell you that I do remember listening to this as a child, on my personal record player, sitting in the corner of a room. It was one of my most cherished albums as a young child. I played it over and over and over again.
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596:āDiscogs is hardly a reliable source (especially as you've discounted the fan sites I mentioned above). I haven't come across the biography you mention, so I will have to accept it says what you say it does. Although you have found one page on allmusic which calls it a Bowie album, I have already given one which doesn't and the main biography page at allmusic for Bowie also describes it as "Eugene Ormandy's version of Peter and the Wolf"
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Peter and the Wolf, as well as someplace in the Bowie article. Unfortunately for IbLeo's effort, I don't feel that the album deserves its own article. Even in popular music, songs have only a single article each, and the various versions are all mentioned there, sometimes with multiple infoboxes, for charting singles. As I said, I don't think this qualifies as a Bowie album, and as such, doesn't qualify for its own article. -
856:(outdented both our comments) Only the first one of those could count. Ecce Cor Meum was written by McCartney himself, so it's both about the music and album. Orchestral Tubular Bells isn't even classical, it's just an orchestral version of non-classical music. But the difference with the Sting album is both that the album has an actual title, and the whole thing is his project as it were, rather than being "just another".
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honestly, I didn't expect it to be controversial. JD554, I respect your reference to Pegg, however your two other references are fan sites and I don't think they should influence our choices here on
Knowledge (XXG). On the other hand, I am not going to insist if you disagree with me. I would however like this album added to the
642:. We don't create articles for "albums" or recordings. There's 58 recordings of this composition available at arkivmusic.com and we're certainly not creating articles for all of them. So, if it turns out that this article does not get classified as a "David Bowie album", then we'd probably nominate the article for deletion.
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in general? As it stands now, there's absolutely no content in the album beyond "David Bowie recorded Peter. It was released on LP and later CD with Young Person's." Again, what makes this album special that it deserves its own article? How it it notable as an album on its own? The sources seem to be
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Thanks for opening a discussion on this. I will be on wikibreak for a couple of days ā I will be back next week and explain my rationale for considering it a studio album. In the mean time, I would be interested to know (1) do you think it belongs in the David Bowie discography at all? (2) If yes, in
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Good that we've got an article on this now, but I also wouldn't call it a David Bowie studio album - as you say, it's just him narrating and it's been recorded many times with many famous voices narrating. As someone who also has an interest in classical music, I'd say this should be categorised like
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I can go along with classifying it in a section for guest appearances, no problem. And well, if somebody puts the article up for AfD and there is consensus to delete it, then be it. Freekee, I agree in principle with your statement that we should only have one article per song in popular music, and
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But that's just it. It IS a classical album. It's a recording of Peter and the Wolf and Young Person's Guide to the
Orchestra. There must be 30 different CDs one can buy with those two pieces on them. Why is this different just because it's Bowie? Or to put it a different way, why should THIS album
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I don't have a source for this yet, but I am checking. This
Knowledge (XXG) entry cites 1978 as a release for this particular album. I believe David Bowie did this recording far earlier than that because I remember listening to it as a child. I was born in 1963. I know I was listening to this long
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In my opinion, this is a guest appearance by Bowie on an album recorded by the Philly
Orchestra. It therefore doesn't belong in Bowie's discography, unless we add a section for guest appearances and collaborations. The album charted, and it certainly deserves a mention in the Recordings section of
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I wouldn't describe this as a David Bowie studio album. His only contribution is the part of the narrator on side one only. I would describe this primarily as a Eugene
Ormandy / Philadelphia Orchestra album for which Bowie provide guest narration. It certainly isn't listed as Bowie studio album in
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Obviously I can't comment on articles that don't existĀ :-) but, as far as I'm aware, if an article meets the general notability guidelines it is considered notable. The article as it stands has at least three citations from notable publications which discuss the topic in depth and there are more
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would fit. Furthermore, "David Bowie" is written on the cover with much larger characters than Eugene
Ormandy / Philadelphia Orchestra, and it's got his face all over it. This goes for all versions of the cover art that I have seen. Hence I concluded that this is a David Bowie studio album, and
837:: "In general, if the musician or ensemble that recorded an album is considered notable, then officially released albums may have sufficient notability to have individual articles on Knowledge (XXG).". In my eyes this justifies perfectly the existence of these articles, and I believe
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ALT1, yours I suppose--OK, I agree with that, as a matter of interest, though fronting the gift and the son might generate more interest. I also think sticking in the son's age is a nice touch; it makes us think of Bowie as the father of a young child.
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No issues at all here. Happy to pass. However, although cited and I think it's interesting, I suggest putting in an ALT1 with another fact about this album. The fact it exists is interesting in itself but good to include something else. Also needs QPQ.
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has no problem governing them. By the way, I would be curious to know where the guideline stating that there should not be separate articles for classical albums is written down (although I perfectly understand the practical reasons behind it). ā
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It contains a detailed discography section, and it stroke me as odd that it was the only item in its list of Bowie albums that didn't yet have its own article here on
Knowledge (XXG). Hence I decided to create one. Furthermore, there is
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Could the album title be shortened some in body? Itās a bit unwieldy with the full eight word title every time itās mentioned. One of the reviews quoted in
Reception shortens it to Peter and the Wolf, so perhaps thatās a viable
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Thatās all I can see on first glance, will check against criteria in the next couple days. (If I donāt get around to it by then please ping me with a strongly worded demand, as there is a 90% chance Iām procrastinating.)
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Iāve put this article on hold so you can satisfy the minor concerns I have. Iām not sure if the bot notifies you of this on your talk page, but if it does Iām sorry for pinging you twice.
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Hi. I just wanted to check in on the progress of these points. I see youāve shortened the name, but nothing else seems to be done. Do you want me to just start the criteria checking?
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Thanks for bringing other people in on this ā even though getting the article nominated for AFD is not exactly what we are trying to achieveĀ :-). Hopefully someone from
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Indeed. If noone else puts this up for AFD, I will later. It's certainly no different than the ones where
Patrick Stewart, Sting, or Bill Clinton read the narration.
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it would be great if it was the reality. Nevertheless, it seems like not all editors agree to this, and I can easily come up with some blatant counterexamples, like
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philadelphia inquirer has a 37.1% similarity (Iām assuming itās just quotes but I want to make sure), but itās under a paywall so unfortunately I canāt check it.
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reissue cover has a notice telling you to add a more detailed non free use rationale, so Iām a little bit concerned by that. Everything else seems fine though.
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I agree it should be in Bowie's discography as an album on which he makes a guest appearance, but it shouldn't appear in the navbox or be called a Bowie album.
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I really don't see why it shouldn't be called a Bowie album. Although it is not one of his major works, in my opinion it is as much a Bowie studio album as
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two general disography refs (which don't make it notable) and an
Allmusic review, not really noting Bowie's involment as anything particularly noteworthy.
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have its own page any more than the 1000s of classical CDs that have gotten reviewed and praised by multiple publications? What makes this one special?
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listed on this talk page that can be added if needs be. This article certainly has the potential to expand way beyond the stub it is at the moment. --
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What Melodia is pointing out is that classical compositions are recorded scores of times. As I said before, 58 recordings of Peter in the Wolf.
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This album is not the only example of a rock musician involved in a recording of a piece of classical music. Besides the already mentioned
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The FU rationale is fine for the reissue cover as everything is already filled out. That notice always appears as a reminder. ā
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To reflect the consensus reached so far, I have moved the reference to this album into a new section "Guest appearances" in the
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136:, an attempt at building a useful resource on recordings from a variety of genres. If you would like to participate, visit the
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Edit: It appears I was listening to the Sterling Holloway audio rendition of Peter and the Wolf, not David Bowie. My mistake.
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I still feel it isn't a Bowie album and should only be included in his discography undeer a "Guest appearances" section. --
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Even though I disagree with the album being described as a David Bowie studio album, I believe the article meets the
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It seems we aren't going to convince each other of our stances regarding this, so I'm going to invite members of
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by Bowie's website describing a reissue by RCA/Music On Vinyl in 2014 so I replaced Classic FM with that. ā
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in that it has "received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". --
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I think we can easily agree that this album is of type "studio". I don't see which other album type in
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My only comment with AFD is that David Bowie fans would need to take ownership of the article because
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will comment on this as well. I am confident we will find a solution to everyones satisfaction. ā
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for writing and maintaining articles. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the
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Template talk:Did you know nominations/David Bowie Narrates Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf
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so you can check it there. For future reference, if you come across a paywalled article (
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That's not really that many compared to other works. There's 247 for Beethoven's Fifth
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All looks good now. Iāll change the remaining parameters of the template and then Iāll
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Is there a source for this or is it cited in the previous citations in the paragraph?
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Template:Did you know nominations/David Bowie Narrates Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf
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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below.
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all looks good here, maybe replace "LPs" with something different in the lede per
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credits it to the Philadelphia Orchestra. I don't know much about Sting, but the
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as
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this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.
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comes to my mind as albums of this kind with their own articles. Quoting from
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441:) is another source which doesn't list the album as a Bowie studio album. --
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In sources: Should "David Bowie All the Songs" have a colon after "Bowie"?
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for their thoughts in an effort to gain consensus one way or the other. --
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Sure. It is mentioned in a recent Bowie biography that I read last month:
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Can you provide a reliable source that credits the album to Bowie? The
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so it's separated from the "regular" Bowie studio albums. Thoughts? ā
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article because we don't want to invite scores of copycat articles.
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Template:Did you know nominations/Look What We Made Taylor Swift Do
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That's my bad I forgot to add this to my watchlist. Doing now. ā
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from the original on 8 November 2020. Retrieved 26 October 2023.
2252:, how about a simple rephrase, "...that as a gift for his son
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Recalling Bowie's 1978 pairing with the Philadelphia Orchestra
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Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
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Talk:David Bowie Narrates Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf/GA1
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That's how it's titled in the book itself (without a colon)
1770:. That always un-paywalls the articles I find compared to
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etc..." The gift for the son is the hook, no? Wait: that
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co-credits it to Bowie and the Philadelphia Orchestra. ā
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and list it in Bowie's discography as a guest appearance
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but itās not bad enough that it needs neutral or fail
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Added an ALT1 and reviewed another nom for QPQĀ :-) ā
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Paraphrased a little. How's the Inquirer look now? ā
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both credit the album to Sting and Edin Karamazov. --
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Strange Fascination: David Bowie the definitive Story
2181:Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
885:, we put it in a "classical albums" section in the
563:who credits it to Bowie and which is listed in his
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David Bowie Narrates Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf
27:
David Bowie Narrates Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf
1175:Later issues were pressed in standard black vinyl.
1335:understandable to an appropriately broad audience
1158:Leonard Cohen had previously narrated a versionā¦
1133:Will probably review this in the next few days.
45:. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
881:as suggested by DavidRF. Then, inspired by the
1750:Just a heads up the full Inquirer article is
603:also describe the album as by various artists
483:credits the album to various artists and the
318:Knowledge (XXG):Recent additions/2024/January
309:in 1978 as a gift for his seven-year-old son
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1917:No further edits should be made to this page
1001:) 17:50, 26 September 2019 (UTC)billbird2111
2059:. Post-promotion hook changes for this nom
238:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Classical music
1988:Source: Dobrin, Peter (17 January 2016). "
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521:(in Danish) (2nd EditionĀ ed.). Gyldendal.
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2364:Knowledge (XXG) Did you know articles
1272:š. I will start crit-checking soon.
316:A record of the entry may be seen at
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2359:WikiProject Classical music articles
1337:; spelling and grammar are correct.
710:has no use for an article like this.
241:Template:WikiProject Classical music
214:This article is within the scope of
130:This article is within the scope of
75:
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2047:Improved to Good Article status by
1333:. the prose is clear, concise, and
779:, 267 for Bach's Toccata and Fugue
754:But do they discuss THIS album, or
92:It is of interest to the following
150:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Albums
14:
2007:: ... that as a gift for his son
1913:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Did you know
518:David Bowie - Station til station
41:. If you can improve it further,
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465:. Or am I missing something? ā
1449:could reasonably be challenged
1026:18:40, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
1011:17:50, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
970:. I hope it stays thereĀ ;-) ā
276:appeared on Knowledge (XXG)'s
29:has been listed as one of the
1:
2339:Knowledge (XXG) good articles
2256:, who was seven at the time,
2011:, who was seven at the time,
1654:valid non-free use rationales
1386:no sign of any problems here
1129:17:21, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
672:general notability guidelines
374:any classical piece. Cheers,
1936:03:33, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
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286:column on 27 JanuaryĀ 2024 (
217:WikiProject Classical music
153:Template:WikiProject Albums
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950:Ragazzo Solo, Ragazza Sola
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883:Paul McCartney discography
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389:which category? Cheers. ā
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368:07:39, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
352:Illustrated db Discography
1994:The Philadelphia Inquirer
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341:David Bowie studio album?
303:a version of Prokofiev's
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818:Songs from the Labyrinth
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348:The Complete David Bowie
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1890:Did you know nomination
1682:to the topic, and have
1359:. it complies with the
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887:David Bowie discography
988:Date of Release Issue?
565:main album discography
515:Poulsen, Jan (2007) .
405:Template:Infobox Album
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209:Classical music portal
82:This article is rated
2055:). Self-nominated at
1510:Broad in its coverage
1250:See replies above. ā
1137:some cursory thoughts
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86:on Knowledge (XXG)'s
39:good article criteria
2152:copyright violations
1600:or content dispute.
1492:copyright violations
1471:no original research
1401:no original research
858:ā« Melodia Chaconne ā«
761:ā« Melodia Chaconne ā«
727:ā« Melodia Chaconne ā«
658:ā« Melodia Chaconne ā«
346:the likes of Pegg's
57:: January 5, 2024. (
2344:Music good articles
1768:https://archive.is/
1764:Wall Street Journal
1527:. it addresses the
1447:. All content that
33:Music good articles
2160:close paraphrasing
2028:Peter and the Wolf
1983:Peter and the Wolf
1705:Overall assessment
1650:copyright statuses
1613:, if possible, by
1381:list incorporation
1219:(cloudy contribsā¦)
879:Peter and the Wolf
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640:Peter and the Wolf
463:Sting studio album
434:by David Buckley (
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2311:great, approved!
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481:MusicBrainz entry
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1978:Sergei Prokofiev
1930:Theleekycauldron
1924:The result was:
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1678:. media are
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1529:main aspects
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1316:Well-written
1315:
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1274:Blueskiesdry
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1211:blueskiesdry
1207:
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1143:alternative.
1132:
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1115:Blueskiesdry
1111:
1110:
1097:
1086:Instructions
1018:Billbird2111
1003:Billbird2111
995:Billbird2111
991:
952:. Cheers. ā
946:Space Oddity
938:Alabama Song
918:
876:
828:
822:
816:
636:WP:CLASSICAL
617:WP:CLASSICAL
600:
595:
531:. Retrieved
517:
496:
456:
431:
347:
344:
304:
301:
294:Did you know
293:
283:Did you know
281:
273:
272:A fact from
230:project page
215:
138:project page
131:
94:WikiProjects
52:
43:please do so
31:
30:
26:
2258:David Bowie
2100:Long enough
2067:; consider
2013:David Bowie
1968:David Bowie
1648:with their
1611:Illustrated
1100:transcluded
414:discography
298:David Bowie
288:check views
2333:Categories
2156:plagiarism
2089:New enough
1496:plagiarism
1396:Verifiable
1053:Authorship
1039:GA toolbox
835:WP:NALBUMS
533:2009-02-16
226:guidelines
142:discussion
37:under the
2263:a version
2260:narrated
2018:a version
2015:narrated
1986:in 1978?
1973:a version
1970:narrated
1966:... that
1844:this post
1303:Attribute
1112:Reviewer:
1076:Templates
1067:Reviewing
1032:GA Review
613:WP:ALBUMS
550:|edition=
542:cite book
300:narrated
296:... that
278:Main Page
2218:: Done.
2150:Free of
2079:General:
2069:watching
2035:Reviewed
2031:in 1978?
1998:Archived
1926:promoted
1680:relevant
1617:such as
1598:edit war
1125:contribs
1081:Criteria
839:WP:ALBUM
690:WP:ALBUM
491:and the
412:and the
376:Ian Rose
84:GA-class
47:reassess
2225:Overall
2140:Neutral
2119:Policy:
1948:Comment
1711:Pending
1572:Neutral
1377:fiction
1342:WP:MTAU
1184:Removed
922:Freekee
821:, also
791:DavidRF
712:DavidRF
644:DavidRF
280:in the
2273:Drmies
2254:Duncan
2158:, and
2009:Duncan
1842:Found
1774::-) ā
1652:, and
1646:tagged
1619:images
1594:Stable
1379:, and
1369:layout
567:. The
410:navbox
311:Duncan
147:Albums
113:Albums
90:scale.
54:Review
2292:zmbro
2189:Cited
2179:Hook:
2049:Zmbro
1849:zmbro
1823:zmbro
1799:zmbro
1777:zmbro
1734:Zmbro
1627:audio
1625:, or
1623:video
1615:media
1399:with
1299:Rate
1253:zmbro
1231:zmbro
1167:Fixed
1150:Fixed
1102:from
972:IbLeo
954:IbLeo
944:, or
906:JD554
891:IbLeo
844:IbLeo
742:JD554
708:WP:CM
694:IbLeo
676:JD554
621:JD554
573:IbLeo
501:JD554
467:IbLeo
461:is a
443:JD554
418:IbLeo
391:IbLeo
360:JD554
2317:talk
2302:cont
2298:talk
2277:talk
2240:talk
2053:talk
2005:ALT1
1952:view
1933:talk
1880:talk
1874:it.
1872:pass
1859:cont
1855:talk
1833:cont
1829:talk
1809:cont
1805:talk
1787:cont
1783:talk
1742:talk
1723:talk
1443:are
1278:talk
1263:cont
1259:talk
1241:cont
1237:talk
1119:talk
1022:talk
1007:talk
999:talk
976:talk
958:talk
948:vs.
940:vs.
926:talk
910:talk
895:talk
862:talk
848:talk
827:and
795:talk
765:talk
746:talk
731:talk
716:talk
698:talk
680:talk
662:talk
648:talk
625:talk
615:and
577:talk
554:help
523:ISBN
505:talk
495:for
471:talk
447:talk
436:ISBN
422:talk
395:talk
380:talk
364:talk
358:. --
2300:) (
2216:QPQ
2063:at
2025:'s
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1980:'s
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1928:by
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634:In
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1569:.
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1507:3.
1498:.
1488:2d
1473:.
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1403::
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1331:1a
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546::
544:}}
540:{{
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