445:, isn't it? something like that in a different order I guess; Or is Nuxalk also in there, despite the ethnographic divide. I'm not clear on the ]s and maybe that's another article you could help with; the Central/North Coast is a mystery to me relative to southern parts; vanished villages and groups should all get articles, if the information is out there. Anyway, welcome, I hope you saw the edit comments about reply-format with the colon....and remember not to select/delete other people's posts :-), it's bad wikiquette (unless it's vulgar/offensive or an "attack edit" etc). Knowledge's rich ground for "indigenous internet space", a conensually developed resource combining information from all known material - ultimately; but nobody "owns" a page (again WP:COI and WP:AUTO....also pls note WP:BIO re any biography articles you may start/work on). Anyway you don't have to start a new section to reply, just use the colon format/ asterisk-bullets are more for sequential points; quotes from the page or a source in italics. Citation format I've never learned, but others are around as models, or other editors will tidy 'em up sooner or later. Anyway thanks for being out there on this part of BC wikidom; any locality or historical item in the area, FN or otherwise, please add as available, or as by your interest. g'nite.
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737:). The crafters of the ethnicities and tribes naming convention (which your guideline violates) clearly respected our collective decisions/consensus from long ago re both standalone names without "people/tribe/nation/peoples" unless absolutely necessary and also re the use of endonyms where available; but when I brought it up in the RMs of last year you insulted and baited me and
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google searches above indicate that the language isn't, either - but it's also not by definition, the people - who are a living people, not on a museum shelf - are who the
English language name for their language (which in their language is called Henaksiala) is named for; therefore a secondary topic
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Noting that the general readership is of more relevance to the title per TITLE and other guidelines, the Google
Scholar results which favour the language should be discounted; it would appear ethnography does not write as much about these people as do linguists. "Haisla tribe" and "Haisla Indians"
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There was a discussion once on whether the ethnicity should have precedence for the name, and it was decided it shouldn't. That could be revisited. But it really should be one discussion on the principle, not thousands of separate discussions at every ethnicity in the world over whether it should
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added as you rewrote your guideline to promote/enact. It says quite the opposite; the CRITERIA page also says that prior consensus should be respected, and those who crafted it an attempt to contact them towards building a new consensus done; and calls for consistency within related topics which
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It means "people of the snow" or "valley of the snow." From what I remember hearing, legend has it that when
European explorers were exploring this area they had Tsimshain guides with them and asked the Tsimshian what this place was called and they said Kitamaat, which was their word for it. They
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of users, two - no three - have engaged in insults against me is beyond smug to the point of ridiculousness; an RfC may be required to change that guideline, as it's clear I'm shut out of any process involving that group of editors, who have been relentlessly contrarian and hostile to anything
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While the language article was viewed slightly more than the people article, the views of the Haisla Nation article IMO count towards the "people" meaning, partly because some "Haisla" pipes on "what links here" are to the government title; other "what links here" are direct mentions of the
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but that's a crock. The way to "address this issue properly" is to examine all of these, but bulk of them needless directs from then-long-standing titles moved by yourself, one by one as I was instructed/advised re the bulk RMs; as case-by-case decisions are needed. You want a centralized
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dab page is a three-item dab page, where the "Haisla Nation" title is included, which is not a proper dab as not being a standalone term and related directly to the people, rather than the language; as with other three dab pages of this kind, it is really "two and a half
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that's fine to say about a discussion that you presided over on an isolated guideline talkpage that you didn't invite anyone but your friends into..... WP:ETHNICGROUPS is clear on the variability of "X", "Xs", or "X people" and says nothing being people
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for "people who are Haisla". This is a common ambiguity across many other related RMs and the question of this ambiguity is one of the main problems with "FOO people" ethnographic/people article titles. The main category for the ethnographic group is
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LOL that's funny I already tried that and got criticized for mis-procedure. Your pet guideline was never discussed at a central location nor even brought up with other affected/conflicting guidelines nor any relevant wikiprojects. And as for
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but those are in-wiki stats, not from the world at large, and are dependent on where and how the incoming links are located and configured. The googles show the "most common use" for the standalone term "Haisla" is the
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long ago had devised the use of "FOO" and often "PREFERRED ENDONYM" (for Canada especially, where such terms are common
English now and your pet terms are obsolete and in disuse and often of clearly racist origin e.g.
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Some 80-90% of those RMs have passed/moved; and yes there was a centralized discussions somewhere, it's called TITLE and look up PRECISION and CONCISENESS there, and note the guidelines cited by
CambridgeBayWeather -
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must have assumed that was what we called it too and they didn't verify it with us so the name stuck. The actual Haisla name for the reserve is C'imo'ca (pronounced tsee-MOTE-sah) which means "snag beach."
1099:. There seems to have been a ton of these requests over the past month, and there should probably be some centralized discussion somewhere (maybe there was, and I missed it?). Anyway, so long as we have
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to resolve the question of how to title articles about peoples, ethnicities are tribes. This will not be resolved either by a flood of similar RM discussions or by creating contested guidelines. --
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1146:, not with reference to a single flawed guideline, the writing of which ignored all those guidelines. Also, these have to be done on a case-by-case basis because of PRIMARYTOPIC issues as with
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654:"We" is not all of Knowledge obviously, it's you, Kwami and Uysvdi and other NCL regulars concocting a bad guideline (which is not a "policy") that is in conflict with various others.
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I'll write it up in a "raw stub" format as done already for some other people, a foundation/format to work on/up; generally there's leeway with band/nation articles about
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because of hte nature of hte source, but ideally all information provided should be in a verifiable source, preferably linkable but otherwise cited properly etc.
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No, no-one would criticize you for discussing this rationally. But this multitude of move requests is disruptive. They should all be closed without prejudice. —
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1138:"As with other recent moves, we appear to have an emerging consensus that the people are the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC and should be at the base name. CĂşchullain "
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have to say about this. The smugness in your suggestion for me to "try to change the guideline" in in a space dominated by the same small
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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a
386:, and shouldn't; I don't know enough to turn the redirect into at least a stub; can you help with some content about the village, Terry?
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Duh, because the people are more reelvant than their language; yours appears to be an old post, the articles have long since been split.
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980:" article where the two terms occur separately and references to "Haisla" are "Haisla culture", "Haisla people" and "Haisla heritage"
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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may be construed as referring to the people; in some uses it appears "Haisla tribe" is a reference to the government.
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government. There is no way links to the Haisla Nation article can be construed as pointing to the language meaning.
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per nom. An identified people should be the primary topic of a term absent something remarkable standing in the way.
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Oops, deleted you message. Didn't know that was going to happen, still figuring out the discussion page format.
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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441:- whatever the formal title used by the combined bands....unless that's not how it works; it's the
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on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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until the issue is addressed properly. These should be discussed at a centralized location.
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etc., we should follow the same pattern for all such names to eliminate ambiguity. Since
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and were in fact dismissive about any such effort. Pfft. NCLANG fans like to pretend
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upsetting the applecart they carefully concocted to please themselves..and no one else.
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and its subcats; to give ou an idea of the possible range of article content; likewise
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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where you'll also find a lot of those raw stubs for various peoples/places), likewise
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There appears to be a parallel dispute over whether the newly-created guideline at
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and, also, a two-word dab. The view stats aren't as compelling as the googles in
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To the
Kitamaat band office and let them decide what they would want added to it.
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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a
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https://web.archive.org/web/20070723085807/http://www.nanakila.ca/pole.html
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carries consensus support. It would be better for all concerned to open an
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has managed to dig up material/refs on lots of close detail on the
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yields 150 results. Curiously, excluding "language" there are
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for other extant articles. Please note the difference between
901:"Haisla people" excluding "wikipedia" yields c. 15,000 results
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yields 10 results, excluding "language" there are 3 results]
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Low-importance
Indigenous peoples of North America articles
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Knowledge:WikiProject
Indigenous peoples of North America
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WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North America articles
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Start-Class Indigenous peoples of North America articles
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Knowledge:Article titles#Use commonly recognizable names
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for "Haisla Nation" excluding "wikipedia" and "language"
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Knowledge:Article titles#Use commonly recognizable names
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The following discussion is an archived discussion of a
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Template:WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North America
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741:. Now you want a centralized discussion when you made
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715:"These should be discussed at a centralized location."
640:. If you don't like that, try to change the policy. --
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a
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Knowledge:Naming conventions (ethnicities and tribes)
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excluding "language"; including "language" there are
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Knowledge:Naming conventions (ethnicities and tribes)
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Knowledge:Naming conventions (ethnicities and tribes)
345:(Tsimshian) rather than Haisla....but what's it mean?
208:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
85:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
1271:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
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made into a dab page by same editor on the same day
546:. No further edits should be made to this section.
1213:. No further edits should be made to this section.
417:that's not necessarily online, though (see all of
598:first moved to redirect by JorisV on June 8, 2011
1111:exists as an article, this shouldn't be moved.
1071:Please note the ambiguity with the subcategory
82:WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North America
1257:This message was posted before February 2018.
1379:Low-importance Governments of Canada articles
926:, excluding "language" there are 646 results]
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910:"Haisla language" yields about 4,110 results
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658:has been ignored by all of you as has what
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443:Haisla-Heitlsuk-Oowekyala Tribal Council
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1359:Low-importance Canada-related articles
1144:with reference to the major guidelines
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313:, rather than the other way around? --
1364:Start-Class British Columbia articles
1136:Talk:Northern Tutchone#Requested move
1134:. And also this closer's comment on
930:"Haisla Indians" yields 5,850 results
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954:"Haisla language" yields 314 results
915:"Haisla Nation yields 21,400 results
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202:This article is within the scope of
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959:"Haisla Indians" yields 100 results
698:be at "X", "Xs", or "X people". —
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59:Indigenous peoples of North America
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860:was viewed 540 times in March 2014
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1231:. Please take a moment to review
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617:) 23:10, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
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461:I think I'll pass this on
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831:— Preceding
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40:WikiProjects
1211:move review
963:310 results
942:301 results
725:mandatorily
660:WP:CRITERIA
544:move review
482:—Preceding
415:Skwxwu7mesh
165:Governments
30:Start-class
1333:Categories
1320:Report bug
1172:view stats
1030:62 results
1014:25 results
853:View stats
739:still lost
570:HairedGirl
1303:this tool
1296:this tool
1177:this case
1039:3 results
1309:Cheers.—
1182:Skookum1
1152:Muscogee
1113:SnowFire
1082:Skookum1
1054:Skookum1
845:contribs
833:unsigned
760:Skookum1
673:Skookum1
656:WP:UNDAB
620:Skookum1
607:Relisted
578:contribs
517:RMCD bot
496:contribs
484:unsigned
447:Skookum1
388:Skookum1
378:redirect
376:Kitamaat
347:Skookum1
343:Smalgyax
323:Skookum1
315:Whimemsz
305:Untitled
1233:my edit
1180:people.
1170:. The
1069:Comment
818:Support
795:Support
642:JorisvS
407:WP:AUTO
246:on the
131:on the
1156:Haisla
1097:Oppose
890:dabs".
887:Haisla
802:bd2412
690:Oppose
638:WP:NCL
634:Oppose
594:Haisla
574:(talk)
431:Haisla
403:WP:COI
219:Canada
210:Canada
156:Canada
36:scale.
1168:Haida
1158:than
1012:with
778:kwami
700:kwami
668:cabal
600:then
568:Brown
1186:talk
1162:and
1140:THAT
1117:talk
1103:and
1086:talk
1058:talk
885:the
841:talk
782:talk
764:talk
730:"we"
704:talk
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433:and
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1277:RfC
1247:to
1203:.
611:BDD
576:• (
563:RFC
437:or
238:Low
123:Low
1335::
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