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Talk:Lexicographic order

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coordinates where they disagree is a nonempty set, has a least element, compare at that coordinate.) In particular, you could do this for a family of well-ordered sets, but in this case, the dictionary order might not be well-ordered. (Consider the dictionary order on 2, 2, 2, 2, ..., where the index ordinal is w. Then 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, ...; 1, 0, 1, 1, 1 ; ..., 1, 0, 0, 1, 1, ...; etc. is a strictly decreasing sequence in 2, 2, 2, ..., so it can't be well-ordered.)
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The set of words of finite length, even over a finite alphabet, is not well ordered by the lexicographic order. Consider words over the alphabet {0, 1} (with 0 < 1), and consider the subset S of all words whose last letter is 1. If the lexicographic order were a well-order, S should have a least
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Are the image labels accurate? The 2 labels above the very left grids of red and white squares seem backwards. The labels above the circled numbers all make sense, and on the right side of the image, the labels for the red and white squares match the labels above the circled numbers, but on the left
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Nevertheless, "dictionary order" is standard mathematical terminology, regardless of whether it completely conforms to the ordinary use of the term. BTW, I see no reason why the number of sets cannot be generalised to range over any ordinal number, (e.g. here it is given for a finite ordinal, but the
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This is a terribly confusing set of explanations of a relatively simple idea. Mathematicians are increasingly using terminology and notation that are more complex than the ideas they are trying to describe. Mathematics is becoming swamped with people more concerned with definitions and notation than
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which are not defined in Knowledge nor in the source. These have not any evident meaning as there are more than two orders that are involved here (the order being defined, the order used to convert subsets into sequences, the order for reading the sequences, the order for comparing elements, and the
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Does this whole thing fall apart if they are mostly ordered, or completely unordered, or what? And what on earth is this about a Cartesian product? What does multiplication have to do with putting a series in order, and how can two sets be multiplied, partially ordered or otherwise? Numerous puzzles
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I think the red ordering (binary vectors) is correct or incorrect whether we consider that the most significant bit is on the left or right. If we consider that the least significant bit is on the left, then the red and the blue ordering should be the same. Can someone confirm or infirm ? If so, it
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Yes, it looks like there's something wrong. On the right-hand side as well, according to my understanding. The various instances of the word "Rev" seem to be misplaced. Nothing we can immediately do, since the image is not editable, but unless someone can enlighten us as to its correctness, I think
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Second the motion... think of me as an intelligent but uninformed reader. As it stands now it says: "Given two partially ordered sets A and B, the lexicographical order on the Cartesian product A × B is defined as (a,b) ≤ (a′,b′) if and only if a < a′ or (a = a′ and b ≤ b′)." I feel like a bunch
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OK, I see, I guess it's correct. But for this to make any sense, it all needs to be explained in the article. There seems to be nothing in the article about binary vectors, or how they might "correspond" to subsets (and in fact I don't think it's strictly subsets that are being ordered here, but
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This could be misinterpreted as implying a_1!=b_1 due to the comma appearing before "which," when the intention was clearly to define i to be the least i such that a_i!=b_i. It seems like bad practice to place the definition of a variable inside what one might interpret as an appositive phrase,
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I made it like that for a purpose. You can see that the colors in the arrangements of 20x3 balls on the left and on the right are horizontally reflected, although the numbers are not. So we can see how colex order is related to lex order. The similarity between lex and colex order is not easily
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sets, indexed by an ordinal number, then you could define the dictionary ordering on that family, and it would again turn out to be a totally ordered set. (Define: if two elements aren't equal, then they disagree in a coordinate, these coordinates are indexed by an ordinal, so the set of all
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Ah, I think I see where I screwing up. It is true (I checked a set theory book) that the product of two ordinals is the dictionary ordering on the cartesian product, with the order of factors reversed. And, it also seems true (I haven't gone through the details) that if you have a family of
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Isn't this just ordinal multiplication, with the order of A and B reversed? If this is the case, is it possible to define ordinal multiplication where the factors themselves are indexed by an ordinal? I've seen cardinal multiplication defined for indexed families, but not ordinal.
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says, "The lexicographic ordering of strings is the same as the familiar dictionary ordering, except that shorter strings precede longer strings. Thus the lexicographic ordering of all strings over the alphabet {0,1} is {empty,0,1,00,01,10,11,000,...}." That would seem to be the
450:... is an infinite decreasing sequence of elements. In general strings of fixed length do preserver the well-ordering property but by using the 'space padding' method described in the article to extend the definition to the LR-lex order the property no longer holds. 1100:
I'm taking classes again and need a quick reference to the word. Found extensive discussion that was so much more useful and enlightening on the subject. Now I can go back to class with a much better understanding of, and ability within the subject area. Thank you
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Why did we have a C++ string comparison function here? It is, at most, marginally related to the topic of this article. Moreover, why case insensitive? Lexicographic orders have nothing to do (are ortogonal) to being case (in)sensitive. Since, anyway,
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There is also a wreath product of orderings on sets that preserves the well-ordering property but it is a bit involved to explain here. Maybe at some point in the future I'll take a shot at rewriting this page to include these definitions.
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The current text in "Definition and Motivation" replaced a significantly more abstruse version. If you have suggestions for improvement, please add them below. And please sign your comments by appending four tildes (~~~~) at the end. --
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ordered triples). I also agree with the proposal to merge the article on colex order with this one. And there seems to be inconsistency in the definition of reverse lex order as given in the article and as used here. Lots to sort out.
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of knives are being tossed at me to catch. A, B, got 'em. Now here's a and b, what are lower case a,b? part of sets A or B or something else? a and b are not defined! And what is the significance of A and B being
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This should be mentioned in the article itself, no other source mentions that strings of finite length is not well ordered on lexicographic order, and the statement in the article itself is misleading by itself.
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word w. But for any putative least word w in S, you can change the last letter from 1 to 01, yielding another word in S that precedes w in the lexicographic order. Thus there can be no least element of S. --
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There should be a more accessible introduction, which gives an example that older elementary school children (and for that matter high school students and non-mathematically inclined adults) can understand. --
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An important property of the lexicographical order is that it preserves well-orders, that is, if A and B are well-ordered sets, then the product set A × B with the lexicographical order is also well-ordered.
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here, all of which require research before I can solve them, and only then can I learn what I came here to learn. I suggest that if you can't express it clearly you might just not understand it yourself.
446:.) The standard dictionary order is what (Sims 94, Computation With Finitely Presented Groups) calls the left-right-lexicographic order. This is not a well-order, since if a < b then b : --> 271: 1204:
In the last sentence of the "Motivation and definition" section, when it says "of a fixed length", this seems a bit trivial and silly, maybe what it meant to say is "of finite length"?
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shown, and this is one way to do it. However: The actual information are the white numbers. The bluish colors are just a background to make the pattern comprehensible.
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The "Definition" section would be a good place to introduce the term. More material could be put in the "Reverse lexicographic order" section if necessary.
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The article says (paraphrased) the word A comes before B "if and only if the first a_i, which is different from b_i, comes before b_i in the alphabet.
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I have largely rewritten the section "Motivation and definition" in response to the "clarify" tag placed there in March, 2020. Hope it helps. --
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There is a problem here with how the ordering is extended to products of different lengths. (For simplicity I'll assume we have a fixed alphabet
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can ever be more than a dictionary definition; anything of encyclopedic value that can be said in one article can also be said in the other.
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I added a paragraph on the ordering of strings, in which I also mention what you call Length-plus-lexicographic ordering; I found a stub (
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But why does it say "Rev Lex" above the top left chart, and "Lex" above the bottom left one? Shouldn't these be the other way round?
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As it is, the article is highly confusing and misleading. The main point is that the lexicographical order is primarily defined for
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definition for countable number seems obvious, and the definition for an arbitrary ordinal seems like it should make sense.)
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Mathematics. As a professional Mathematician of many years this brings me close to tears. I think Knowledge can do better.
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When the actual triples (caption in gray) are in lex order, the corresponding binary vectors (red caption) are in
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at OEIS-Wiki states that reverse lex. order is lex. order upside down. Reading the OEIS article I would say that
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The term "dictionary order" is a misnomer: most dictionaries are not in simple lexicographical order. --
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On the left side the smaller numbers are have a dark background, on the right side the bigger numbers.
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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This is essentially said in section "Cartesian products". However, I agree that this section is
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on 2014-03-27. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see
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That would be nice. Another observation is that these are all equivalent for any set with the
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A word about lexicographical orders being nonrepresentable by real functions in general?
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though with that interpretation i would be appearing without any definition whatsoever.
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I have started cleaning up this article. I have a problem with the recent additions by
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ordering. Maybe something should be said noting that the definition is not universal.
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this article states that reverse lex. order is that of a rhyming dictionary. But
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b_{i}{\text{ for the largest }}i{\text{ for which }}a_{i}\neq b_{i}.}" /: -->
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The source of these additions are a wiki. Thus this is not a reliable source.
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b_{i}{\text{ for the largest }}i{\text{ for which }}a_{i}\neq b_{i}.}": -->
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Length-plus-lexicographic ordering: b < ab < aab < aaab < ...
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I'm removing the clarify tag, because it seems it's now been clarified.
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Length-plus-lexicographic ordering: a < b < aa < bb < abab
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Left-right-lexicographic ordering: a < aa < abab < b < bb
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b_{i}{\text{ for the largest }}i{\text{ for which }}a_{i}\neq b_{i}.}
575:. To see how these orders differ, consider the following examples. 1009:
colex order the corresponding inversion vectors are in colex order.
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The name used for these ordering do not seem to be standard.
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lex order, the corresponding binary vectors are in are in
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Lexicographic ordering in multi-objective optimization
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v:Lexicographic and colexicographic order#Permutations
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Merge Colexicographical order to Lexicographical order
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I corrected a parsing error, and this is the result:
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may be too technical for most readers to understand
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If 406: 394: 318:; for the discussion at that location, see 19: 1355: 1289: 1205: 688:Knowledge is not a collection of "how-to"s 453:There, is, however, a natural ordering on 178: 47: 1525: 1512: 1503: 1495: 1489: 1476: 1465: 1457: 1438: 1425: 1406: 1400: 747:Learn how and when to remove this message 731:, without removing the technical details. 690:, I've decided to remove this section. -- 656:Introduction to the Theory of Computation 559: 553: 464: 458: 430: 424: 386: 1580:Start-Class applied linguistics articles 1585:Applied Linguistics Task Force articles 180: 49: 729:make it understandable to non-experts 7: 1154:, because of their numerous issues: 226:This article is within the scope of 101:This article is within the scope of 1575:Mid-importance Linguistics articles 38:It is of interest to the following 1184:I'll thus remove these additions. 794:I have split off ==Definition==.-- 556: 461: 427: 388: 14: 1600:Mid-priority mathematics articles 1314:Motivation and definition section 890:is that of a rhyming dictionary. 246:Knowledge:WikiProject Mathematics 121:Knowledge:WikiProject Linguistics 1595:Start-Class mathematics articles 1590:WikiProject Linguistics articles 1570:Start-Class Linguistics articles 1124:Rewriting this article is needed 708: 291: 249:Template:WikiProject Mathematics 213: 203: 182: 124:Template:WikiProject Linguistics 88: 78: 51: 20: 1109:) 17:29, 22 October 2015 (UTC) 990:When the actual triples are in 412:{\displaystyle \Sigma =\{a,b\}} 266:This article has been rated as 141:This article has been rated as 1384:08:50, 23 September 2020 (UTC) 1135:I'll try to fixing this mess. 1080:I attempted to clarify it. -- 765:06:21, 23 September 2007 (UTC) 695:11:21, 16 September 2006 (UTC) 166:Applied Linguistics Task Force 1: 1556:04:15, 16 February 2023 (UTC) 1470: 1463: 1090:04:02, 26 November 2013 (UTC) 1075:01:37, 26 November 2013 (UTC) 681:Removed C++ string comparison 646:20:19, 25 February 2007 (UTC) 240:and see a list of open tasks. 163:This article is supported by 115:and see a list of open tasks. 1343:06:14, 16 October 2020 (UTC) 1284:There is a need of defining 1119:17:29, 22 October 2015 (UTC) 624:22:51, 6 November 2006 (UTC) 419:and are ordering strings of 1005:- When permutations are in 900:15:10, 1 January 2012 (UTC) 832:02:56, 28 August 2009 (UTC) 568:{\displaystyle \Sigma ^{k}} 473:{\displaystyle \Sigma ^{*}} 439:{\displaystyle \Sigma ^{*}} 1616: 1272:08:52, 25 March 2018 (UTC) 1254:01:51, 25 March 2018 (UTC) 1237:13:53, 13 April 2017 (UTC) 1220:13:23, 13 April 2017 (UTC) 610:22:14, 26 April 2006 (UTC) 578:Set: {b,ab,aab,aaab,...} 147:project's importance scale 1328:18:55, 19 June 2020 (UTC) 1308:09:45, 21 June 2017 (UTC) 1194:15:32, 21 June 2016 (UTC) 1145:10:27, 18 June 2016 (UTC) 1057:Misleading comma/phrasing 1052:15:42, 5 April 2018 (UTC) 337:08:18, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC) 265: 198: 162: 140: 73: 46: 1036:10:15, 7 July 2012 (UTC) 1020:12:29, 6 July 2012 (UTC) 975:11:01, 6 July 2012 (UTC) 960:09:30, 6 July 2012 (UTC) 944:07:26, 6 July 2012 (UTC) 934:it ought to be removed. 928:19:16, 5 July 2012 (UTC) 866:02:03, 18 May 2011 (UTC) 673:23:22, 8 July 2008 (UTC) 361:23:46, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC) 272:project's priority scale 1349:Explanation is terrible 888:colexicographical order 851:Colexicographical order 843:Colexicographical order 804:22:11, 3 May 2011 (UTC) 786:20:54, 3 May 2011 (UTC) 593:Set: {a,b,aa,bb,abab} 374:01:10, 8 Jul 2004 (UTC) 346:23:34, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC) 301:Colexicographical order 229:WikiProject Mathematics 104:WikiProject Linguistics 1539: 1286:Lexicographic ordering 914: 845:should be merged into 569: 474: 440: 413: 159: 28:This article is rated 1540: 912: 847:Lexicographical order 570: 475: 441: 414: 298:The contents of the 158: 1399: 1159:copyright violations 905:Image Label Accuracy 552: 457: 423: 385: 252:mathematics articles 127:Linguistics articles 1167:They use the terms 918:they're switched -- 310:Lexicographic order 64:Applied Linguistics 1534: 1471: 1464: 998:lex order as well. 915: 773:partially ordered? 565: 470: 436: 409: 221:Mathematics portal 160: 96:Linguistics portal 34:content assessment 1506: 1498: 1468: 1369: 1360:comment added by 1310: 1294:comment added by 1222: 1210:comment added by 1200:Possible mistake? 1096:like your article 822:comment added by 757: 756: 749: 644: 326: 325: 286: 285: 282: 281: 278: 277: 177: 176: 173: 172: 1607: 1545: 1542: 1541: 1535: 1530: 1529: 1517: 1516: 1507: 1504: 1499: 1497:for the largest 1496: 1494: 1493: 1481: 1480: 1469: 1466: 1462: 1461: 1443: 1442: 1430: 1429: 1411: 1410: 849:. 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Index


content assessment
WikiProjects
WikiProject icon
Linguistics
Applied Linguistics
WikiProject icon
icon
Linguistics portal
WikiProject Linguistics
linguistics
the discussion
Mid
project's importance scale
Taskforce icon
Applied Linguistics Task Force
WikiProject icon
Mathematics
WikiProject icon
icon
Mathematics portal
WikiProject Mathematics
mathematics
the discussion
Mid
project's priority scale
Colexicographical order
merged
Lexicographic order
its history

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