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775:) Metropolitan area in 1995, officially having 10,168,321 inhabitants on 30 June 2008, and thus forming the largest metropolitan area in the EU. According to the German Knowledge (XXG) (see link), the official definition of the "European Metropol Region Rhine-Ruhr" is contained in North Rhine-Westphalian development laws and - to be exact - stems from the "Development Plan of the State of North Rhine-Westphalia (part A), where it was defined in terms of space, and had been treated as a subject matter in form of verbalized 'goals' in section B.I.2." (in German:
1155:, "Port Said's twin city is Port Fuad, which lies on the eastern bank of the canal. The two cities coexist, to the extent that there hardly is any town centre in Port Fuad. The cities are connected by free ferries running all through the day, and together they form a metropolitan area with over a million residents that extends both on the African and the Asian sides of the Suez Canal." The caption should perhaps be edited to say, "Istanbul, one of only two metropolitan areas that span two continents, the other being Port Said in Egypt." --
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eight panoramas of countries' largest metropolitan areas constructively demonstrates illustratively the differences and commonalities between metropolitan areas globally. If anything, this article needs to be expanded, and the glaring voids that come to mind immediately involve China and India; it would be helpful for someone to work on those and build them up.
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article. In short, it seems that the application of the term in many cases here stems from opinion, mistranslation, an effort to "group" a schema between all countries for the sake of a single demographics study, or perhaps endearment for foreign terms, but indicating it as a "translation" in many cases is simply not fact.
991:(Just as aside for people who disagree with me: Canada’s largest city, Toronto, has an economy that is embarrassingly small for a North American metro area of it’s size: it’s behind Miami and just ahead of Detroit and Seattle. It also lacks a great university. It’s a nice city that’s extremely “livable,” but so is
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reliable citations. However, reading the article now, most statements are factual and supported by legitimate sources. So I'm at a loss as to why the citation template would apply here, or what would need to be changed to justify removing it. Clarification would be appreciated, and absent any clarification I will
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It's not the skylines themselves that are the problem - highly developed skylines are indicative of very large cities, and one or two of them should be included to illustrate the type of area that forms the article's subject matter - but the sheer number of images in the article is grossly excessive.
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I’m not sure if all
Canadians are like this, but many of the ones who edit Knowledge (XXG) seem to think that Canada (and Toronto in particular) are underrated and unfairly ignored by the rest of the world. It has nothing to do with Canada per se, it’s the ignorance of non-Canadians that needs to be
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adds a citation template to this article. I don't understand the justification for the edit, which is summarized in edit history as "Tagged". In order to improve the article, I'm asking for some guidance about what specifically needs to be improved. A number of editors have put effort into including
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What I think could be useful would be a map or satellite image showing how a metro area is constituted from a set of distinct urban areas, separated by rural land. Ideally also showing the transport links connecting the lot together. The NY metro county map does not advance our understanding of what
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Because many
Canadians view Knowledge (XXG) as a vehicle for promoting Canada. It used to bug me but now I’m just amused by it. I think that the more Canada-centric and Toronto-centric articles and sections there are, the more it weakens the credibility of Knowledge (XXG). (Which is not good but
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aka Tel Aviv metropolitan area. There must be many examples, but this one is arguably within the same country and therefore more poignant. The "city" might have less contiguity of its built-up areas than the "metropolitan area" or "conurbation", but being called a (or one) city makes it be at least
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The problem with some editors is that they don't seem to read carefully. I clearly said that we need more material on China (with none now) and India, and that would include with accompanying pictures. There's also nothing to stop The
Promenader or anyone else from adding more material about France
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In fact, the confusion grows further when the official translation for the areas described is another term altogether: as indicated above, what this article insists is the French equivalent of a "metropolitan area" is in reality translated as "urban area", so it should not even be mentioned in this
1463:. The article text needs to be expanded. But it's very hard to see how a profusion of panoramic images of (mostly) western city centres - pretty though they may be - expands readers' understanding of the concept of the metropolitan area. Perhaps retain one - the rest should be moved elsewhere.
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The article is also far from U.S.-centric. One has to remember that the U.S. has far greater depth, breadth, and complexity with respect to this topic than most other countries, with many more metros, many more definitions of metros, and many more available statistics about metros. Having seven or
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The images aren't suppose to show the largest cities, but rather the variations in metropolitan areas, and there build up. I think we should have pictures of well-known cities of various size, build up, density, etc. For example, the skyline of New York City could been compared with the skyline of
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Note: The external link for metrofyi.com is more of an advertisement for that website in that many major metro areas are excluded and some listed are clearly incorrect. At the very least, it should be noted as a partial list. Perhaps excluded in that it contains more advertising about places to go
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The only question here is whether your edits improve this article or not, and my view is that they do not, because they distort it and add little or nothing of encyclopedic value. I'd advise you not to assume that other editors can guess what your intentions might be, and not to suggest to other
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I've noticed that many editors from quite a few countries familiar with the
English language have become quite endeared with the term "metropolitan area", but in many cases the term cannot apply, as it is neither an official translation for the existing demographic/administrative regions of those
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It's quite unfortunate that this article is being taken in a direction that completely ignores the actual visual and culturally definable aspects of a metropolitan area. Nevertheless, I'm willing to work with you on what diagrams or images would be acceptable to the consensus, which seems to be
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How does embellishing only the US section (with non-sequitur illustrations) not seem 'Murica #1'-ish? And these illustrations are of no informative value at all, as they give no sense of the breadth, depth, etc., that even here you need words to describe... they are but a 'pretty bunch of
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term, but where it is used I think it should be made clear that it is used as such; in other words, it should be clear that it is a term included as a description for better understanding, but not as an official term or officially translation when it is nothing of the kind.
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My observation has been that editors from each country have tried to have their own country represented. As long as there is a section for each country, I don't mind there being one picture associated with it. I would draw the line however at no more than one per country.
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article that's referenced now is also unsourced. I'm not sure there are official metropolitan areas. Anyway, the articles as they stand give the misleading impression that the entire area is urbanized, when some of these metros are separated by fairly large distances.
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Oh please, stop with the histrionics. The pictures are all clearly panoramas - that's the best way to illustrate the physical flavor of a metro area. Most (but not all) metros have a skyscraper core. How many skyscrapers are there in the
Istanbul picture?
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Are Surat, Ahmedabad and Pune included in the list of
Metropolitan cities in India? There are no proper citations in the article to support this. I hope someone will provide citations failing which the cities will have to be deleted from the list. Thanks.
486:(5.4million), Sapporo MA (2.5million), Sendai MA (2.2million) and Hiroshima MA (2.0million) (the numbers are populations of 1.5% Urban Employment Areas in 2000). Some major individual cities in each MAs are designated by government ordinance as the
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I don't know. I tried to make the paragraph less specific as possible. I felt that the article focuses too much on specific areas so I started some discussion in general. If you think it is wrong, feel free to correct, expand and clarify it. --
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I know that the concept of metropolitan area is popular in the US because of post-1950s deurbanisation. However, it is a marginal concept in some other countries. For example, I never encountered it being used in Russia - e.g., something like
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would be better, but I'm not sure if it really is US-specific, so I need some input from others. I'm not even sure what the
British English equivalent is, apart from the adjective "Greater" (e.g. Greater London, Greater Manchester).
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is also a distinct entity. German cities also seem to be considered distinct from one another, though don't take my word on it. It would be good if somebody could highlight the differences in the cultural perception of the concept.
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Landesplanungsrechtlich wird die Europäische
Metropolregion Rhein-Ruhr im Landesentwicklungsplan Nordrhein-Westfalen (Teil A) räumlich bestimmt und sachlich in Form von textlich formulierten "Zielen" unter dem Abschnitt B.I.2.
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By the way, it is not a correct statement to make that the images are of "mostly" Western cities. Only NYC and
Toronto are even in the Western Hemisphere, and Paris is the only other city to be considered a "Western" city.
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or any other country for that matter, in the diagram caption and/or text, as their topic experience allows. Either have zero images, or (more sensibly) have seven or eight panoramas of metropolitan areas to effectively
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And it is probably more trouble than it is worth to try to fix it, as the boosters will always come back for another go. What we need as permanent warning tag saying "This concept should not be taken seriously".
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Chicago is significantly larger that the “Golden
Horseshoe.” Combine another two contiguous metro areas, L.A. and San Diego, and you have 18,345,313, which makes Toronto's horseshoe look more like a paperclip.
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TakuyaMarata, could you explain the paragraph you just added? It doesn't seem to make any sense in the context. What is "The area"? Are you claiming that the trends you note are necessary characteristics of
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I think it would be useful for this reference to clarify this difference somewhere in the article, and gate the same to all concerned articles. I have already tried to do the same where France is concerned.
1102:; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so.
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Moved above text from article. It would be better if instead of listing specific metropolitan areas, the criteria for what is included in a metropolitan area in Japan be put in the article instead.
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Also, the abbreviation "MSA" should be included in the commonly used abbreviations used for this topic due to the fact that it covers standard conventional references used in most all industries.
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saying that more geographic rather than photographic emphasis is preferred. For starters, I've changed the sarcastically named title of this section to the more constructive "Images or diagrams".
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1660:"metropolitan area". Again. adding pictures of skyscrapers to this just adds a 'pretty factor' to it, and nothing more, and distrating attention to 'sections that need more material' is
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But another question: if only the core of a metropolitan area has skyscrapers, how is that representative of the entire metro area? That would mean that such illustrations have even
1656:, you're either 'misinterpreting' the intent and scope of this article, or are attempting to change it. Until now, it was but a description of of how every country defines/uses the
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makes a metro area. The NY area at night image, although it doesn't have the metro area extent marked, might have some use in either the general definition section, or the lead.
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countries, nor a term used there. The "Japan" clarification mentioned above is a good example of this. France is yet another example, as, although neither its government nor its
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of metropolitan areas to sections, that would be a more informative and useful illustrative addition, but you seem more intent on promoting your affinity with skyscrapers ; )
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Ive changed Torontos population back to its actual population of just ocer 2 million, the person who had it at 8.1 million might be a little to patriotic or just stupid lol
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I have inexpertly tried to fix a couple of the thousand things about it which are horrible. It should be drastically shortened because it already has its own article, and
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A little exaggerated on your part, I believe. The article is (and should be) far more than simply about definitions. Certainly more on point than what used to be there.
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Wow - this is one of the most ridiculous things I've read. Knowledge (XXG) has such a tendency to be default US-centric, I think any correction of that is a good thing.
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people don’t seem to care anymore). Promotional editing by Canadian editors on Knowledge (XXG) has turned into something of a problem that isn’t really being addressed.
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999:. It just lacks the cultural, artistic, historical, and scientific gravity that even smaller US cities like San Francisco and Boston have, much less larger US cities).
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addressed and rectified. In their opinion, Knowledge (XXG) should be a tool that’s used to teach the world about the importance, significance, and relevance of Canada.
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On a related note, I've noticed "metro" and "metro area" being used as abbreviations, but these aren't actually explicitly defined anywhere. I'd suggest something like
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The caption under a picture of Istanbul incorrectly states that the Istanbul metropolitan area is the only one that spans two continents. As noted explicitly in the
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There is a lot of images on this article, and some of them just show skylines of cities, not the metropolitan area of the city. Shouldn't these be removed?
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All metropolitan areas are culturally defined and identified by their cores. And these panoramas are of the metropolitan areas, including their cores.
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Perhaps someone would like to consider whether the reference to the Ruhr area alone should be changed to a reference to the larger Rhine-Ruhr area. --
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The panorama images make the article look like some coffee-table glossy for a real estate marketeer. They are a distraction from the actual subject.
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I've placed a more representative image of the NYC metro area. The area still has a ton of skyscrapers, but this image expands far beyond Manhattan.
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However the most ambitious metropolitan area population figures are often better seen as the population of a "metropolitan region" than of a "city".
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Oh please, stop with the cultural attribution that was never intended and do something about your complaint by building China and India sections.
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are not definitely not considered a part of Moscow socially. Likewise, I don't think e.g. Oxford is considered part of London in the UK, and the
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It's almost as though editors from each country have tried to ensure that their own country is represented. Surely that can't be the case?
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OK, sounds like a reasonable suggestion...will place the satellite image in the General Definition section, with a clarifying caption. Best,
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What an absolutely crap article about metropolitan areas. Where are the explanations about the various methodes used around the world etc?
1366:, the 'United States' section looks a little less Murica-centric-non-sequitur, but these additions to an article outlining each country's
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I see it as a matter of self-definition, which can be ideologically or politically driven, so not objective in any way. See for instance
780:) It might be of some importance to know that matters of regional development, to a large part, fall into the competencies of the German
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but I suspect this abbreviation is US-specific. Case in point: using "metro" to describe the greater Paris area risks confusion with the
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I'm not sure why "hypercities" link to Sky city 1000 of if "hypercity" even a real term. Someone who knows what he's doing please edit
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To say that western Lake Ontario is a metro area is just as silly as saying that Chicago and Milwaukee are one, even though there are
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Why do you think that panoramic views of city centres are "the best way to illustrate the physical flavor of a metro area"? As
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is needed for such a vague statement that it is useless to anyone trying to understand the idea of a "metropolitan area"Â ???
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Maps don't show topographic relief of land or buildings, while pictures are worth a thousand words. That's the argument.
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the differences and commonalities between the actual physical layouts of different metropolitan areas around the globe.
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the statment "Both Statistical Divisions and Districts are equivalent to metropolitan areas." is disputed.
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Metro Manilla isn't even a metropolitan area based on commuter statistics, at least get that one right...
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Barcelona's Metropolitan Area is 5.150.000 (updated 2006) in 3.925 km2 (1.515 ml2), as is observed in...
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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of the term 'metropolitan area' is, for sure, 'pretty', but still arguably off-topic.
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But if you click on the image you get a bigger version of the image with the caption:
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then you may need to upload it to Knowledge (XXG) (Commons does not allow fair use)
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It is intimately related but I believe that a LMA should have it's own article. --
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I hope that one or both of these images/diagrams would be acceptable to people:
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Remainder of the New York-Newark, NY–NJ–CT–PA Combined Statistical Area
903:"Metropolitan region" helps explain "metropolitan area"Â ??? Puh-leeze.
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File:Levent financial district in Istanbul.jpg Nominated for Deletion
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as a foremost argument is a pretty good sign that there is none ; )
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metro areas? At the very least the writing needs clarification.
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How high is it for Mexico, for South Africa, for North Korea?
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New York–Jersey City–White Plains, NY–NJ Metropolitan Division
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Berlin to show contrast between two well known metropolitans.
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and does nothing to change that. Now, if one wanted to add
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Primate city#What is a "city", what a "metropolitan area"?
1547:. All bar (debatably) Istanbul are "western" cities.
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Statistical Division is not the same as metropolital area
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Metropolitan areas vs cities: use of concepts by country
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World "metropolitan areas" - description or translation?
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Dutchess County–Putnam County, NY Metropolitan Division
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Nassau County–Suffolk County, NY Metropolitan Division
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Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Urban studies and planning
1319:"Tokyo, Japan, the world's largest metropolitan area"
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Port Said metropolitan area also spans two continents
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perceived as more unitarian and compact. Conundrum.
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Now that you've added skyscraper-skylines to (most)
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Knowledge (XXG) level-4 vital articles in Geography
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947:Megalopolis: why such a focus on Canada?
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2199:Knowledge (XXG) level-4 vital articles
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1624:editors what they should be doing.
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1418:03:24, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
1403:02:49, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
1386:12:26, 18 March 2018 (UTC)
1031:04:54, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
976:14:36, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
744:Surat, Ahmedabad and Pune?
708:18:13, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
455:14:42, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
257:project's importance scale
152:project's importance scale
123:Urban studies and planning
114:Urban studies and planning
70:Urban studies and planning
2093:12:43, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
938:16:44, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
285:
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1751:value for this article.
1740:What 'histronics' - and
738:15:44, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
519:13:30, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
461:Japan metropolitan areas
427:00:58, Aug 7, 2004 (UTC)
418:00:33, 7 Aug 2004 (UTC)
214:WikiProject Architecture
719:than data on the area.
660:(commonly abbreviated "
1978:
1965:
1126:CommonsNotificationBot
1973:
1936:
1922:Let's begin with NYC:
917:And someone thinks a
237:Architecture articles
43:on Knowledge (XXG)'s
36:level-4 vital article
2080:London commuter belt
1153:article on Port Said
1049:02:27, 10 March 2022
620:official translation
400:Clarification needed
1264:Megalopolis section
206:Architecture portal
101:Architecture portal
2162:User:107.127.46.35
1979:
1966:
1352:Images or diagrams
1274:is different from
1115:fair use rationale
826:"according to the
327:and various other
316:WikiProject Cities
45:content assessment
2125:municipality vs.
1975:Satellite imagery
1362:of the sections,
1346:
1332:comment added by
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1095:What should I do?
1087:Wikimedia Commons
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1328:— Preceding
1324:
1312:
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997:Sun City, AZ
958:— Preceding
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587:(data 2005)
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438:
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376:— Preceding
369:
314:
252:
228:Architecture
219:Architecture
212:
175:Architecture
147:
107:
51:WikiProjects
34:
2116:conurbation
2085:Humanophage
1100:Don't panic
1017:ntigrandios
859:—Preceding
839:114.75.1.18
832:hypercities
724:—Preceding
675:Paris Metro
631:descriptive
550:John Dalton
546:talk Sydney
524:The entire
329:settlements
41:Start-class
2188:Categories
1742:ad hominem
1494:illustrate
1368:definition
778:behandelt.
773:Rhein-Ruhr
700:Hairy Dude
686:metro area
662:metro area
643:PROMENADER
565:Randwicked
484:Fukuoka MA
2167:WP:BEBOLD
2158:This edit
2123:Jerusalem
2076:Serpukhov
2041:Castncoot
2013:Batternut
1988:Castncoot
1890:Batternut
1856:Castncoot
1824:Castncoot
1787:Castncoot
1694:Castncoot
1654:Castncoot
1585:Castncoot
1513:Castncoot
1498:Castncoot
1410:Castncoot
1395:Castncoot
1364:Castncoot
1280:Domrivers
964:Alphachap
865:Gargabook
822:hypercity
480:Nagoya MA
39:is rated
2136:Arminden
2131:Gush Dan
2127:Tel Aviv
2072:Mozhaysk
1938:Counties
1718:Ghmyrtle
1626:Ghmyrtle
1549:Ghmyrtle
1465:Ghmyrtle
1342:contribs
1330:unsigned
1198:Ghmyrtle
1108:non-free
1045:unsigned
972:contribs
960:unsigned
926:deletion
919:citation
873:contribs
861:unsigned
809:Wimstead
726:unsigned
591:unsigned
579:New data
531:Dekimasu
476:Osaka MA
472:Tokyo MA
443:unsigned
390:contribs
378:unsigned
2118:pages.
1334:Fholson
1276:megalo-
1157:Wbush89
852:Toronto
751:Swaroop
512:Polaron
255:on the
150:on the
2171:Cleter
2129:&
1986:Best,
1272:metro-
1172:Images
782:Länder
692:") ...
668:") ...
338:Cities
321:cities
280:Cities
47:scale.
1219:Hwy43
1004:towns
890:C9900
690:metro
666:metro
616:INSEE
504:Sakai
496:Osaka
492:Kyoto
468:Japan
382:Daran
325:towns
28:This
2175:talk
2140:talk
2114:and
2112:city
2089:talk
2045:talk
2017:talk
1992:talk
1894:talk
1860:talk
1828:talk
1791:talk
1749:less
1722:talk
1698:talk
1666:maps
1658:term
1630:talk
1589:talk
1553:talk
1543:See
1517:talk
1502:talk
1469:talk
1414:talk
1399:talk
1338:talk
1284:talk
1248:talk
1223:talk
1202:talk
1184:talk
1161:talk
1130:talk
1053:talk
1008:just
995:and
993:Bern
968:talk
934:talk
930:Daqu
894:talk
869:talk
843:talk
813:talk
793:talk
755:talk
734:talk
704:talk
599:talk
516:Talk
502:and
500:Kobe
451:talk
425:Taku
386:talk
370:See
247:High
2160:by
2074:or
1360:all
1244:Rob
1180:Rob
641:THE
466:In
407:all
142:Top
2190::
2177:)
2142:)
2091:)
2083:--
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2019:)
1994:)
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1344:)
1340:•
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