3535:
introduction. I think all parties can understand that such sweeping statements should be qualified whenever they are made, and that it should be indicated that it is only according to one extant theory, however highly regarded it is. Also, the last sentence of the introduction seems to be conflating
Feinberg's analysis, mentioned twice, with someone else's opinion, referenced at the end. And the section after the hyphen makes reference to something outside the article, without even making a single statement regarding the subject in the article, which is at best extremely poor article construction, particularly in the introduction. Also, the fact that the first "by Feinberg's analysis" could be seen as indicating that the second "also by Feinberg's analysis" is contingent on the first reference to Feinberg seems to be placing all the emphasis on that single source. Unless sources which explicitly stated that such a source were universally accepted, and no such sources are yet indicated, that would seem to be placing too much emphasis on that single theory. Based on all the above, the introduction I believe is still in dire need of grammatical and content work. Basically, all that was done was restoring the content and adding a reference. Consensus is based on a lot more than that, particularly since several of the concerns I first expressed have yet to be addressed at all, so far as I can see.
3838:'s research into finding ways for tapping energy directly from the ether. According to rumour, he was apparantly close to some kind of breakthrough, but then he lost all economical support. The corporative supporting him was alledgedly into the electric bulb business. I've heard his laboratory was destroyed. As I reason, the signified element, the ether, objective for Tesla's experimentation has, at least on the level of the signifier, evolved, or merged into the theoretical tachyonic field. Thus it attracts such "New Age" speculation here above referred to. Allthough I would imply that the history of inventions has been followed by all sorts of speculation about beneficial theurapeutic, or medical properties (cf. Galvanotherapy, Cymatic therapy, Radiotherapy, magnetotherapy and so on) with regard to the new "worlds" which is explored. This should be regarded as a rather reasonable redundancy, and not a phenomenon specific to New Age. Often, I believe, that the inventors themselves are the most imaginative of the potential fantastic effects of their discoveries, confer for instant John Logie Baird, inventor of television, who imagined that his invention would make visible the invisible spirits of the ether. It might even be hold that it was his prime motive. What it actually became in our culture he despised. --
3325:, which explicitly states that such things are at least mathematically possible. I am sure you would agree that we do not yet know enough raw data on the universe outside the planet to be really able to make such sweeping generalizations that "such things are not possible". And, now for the third time, I request a specific indication that the consensus was reached. I note now that there are two parties, Gluck and yourself, who seem to support such phrasing, and at least one party, myself, who has serious reservations that such a sweeping statement denying the very possibility of something is responsible in a field such as this, about which even the experts would acknowledge our knowledge of the subject is basically limited to a very pathetically small segment of the various possibilities. I do acknowledge however that there was to date agreement of one person to that statement. As there is now a disagreement about the sweeping nature of that statement, however, I would request that comments from other parties come in to establish a current, existing, consensus.
3780:) speaks of tachyons hypothetically ("If they were indeed to exist ... ") and more or less concludes that people have looked and never found any evidence. Physicists often look for things that they don't entirely expect to find, just to be sure. I really don't think this article supports the statement "However the debate and scientific speculation over the existence of tachyons is still open". A more accurate interpretation would be "There is no experimental evidence for the existence of physical tachyon particles, but scientists remain open to the possibility." But the second part is redundant, since scientists are (or certainly should be) always open to the prospect of anything, provided that it has enough firm, reproducible scientific evidence. It would be much more appropriate and accurate, so I'll change it to "There is no experimental evidence for the existence of physical tachyon particles". That's really what the encyclopedia article seems to be saying.
3583:, and in particular the following quotation about biographies which probably also applies here:"When writing about controversies... neither suppress notable information nor overwhelm the subject with negative material; always pay scrupulous attention to sources. Write clinically, and let the facts speak for themselves." As it is, this article does seem to be suppressing notable information about contrary viewpoints, and even specifically writing them off. Also, the lead currently contains a single sentence paragraph, which is counterindicated in the style guidelines. Also, the final clause in question violates that style guideline as well, "Do not tease the reader by hinting at startling facts without describing them." The statement that tachyons do not exist is not in fact expanded upon anywhere in the article. As such, the final section of the lead in particular completely fails to adhere to even the most minimal standards of style.
3960:
3i, not to mention that physics right now doesn't have a proper explanation for what an "imaginary" mass would be. The fact that they are both hypothetical and related to string theory at this stage doesn't make much difference simply because there are a lot of hypothetical particles that come up in string theory that we have no evidence for yet. And while a tachyon's speed will vary inversely with its energy, that says nothing about the "range" of the particle. We're pretty sure that gravity (and thus, the graviton) being massless, propagates at the speed of light, and would therefore also negate the idea that they are tachyons. Though there are a few superficial correlations, they have very different properties.
2462:
In field theory, this occurs with the Higgs mechanism. In that case, the potential is not simply quadratic and actually has a minimum. The field has the standard E-p relation at the top of the potential. This is unstable since the mass is imaginary and this mode will grow exponentially. But as it grows, one must take into account higher-order effects in the field magnitude and the E-p relation is no longer the simple quadratic one. This tames the exponential growth and makes the field settle to the minimum of the potential. There one can use the standard E-p relation again, but it now has real mass.
2001:
Higgs, I can give another example of apparent incongruity. Part of the reason why he claims that one must use anti-commutators is that there are unitary transformations which switch creation and annihilation operators. But this is common when one studies
Bogolubov transforms, which are used to describe Hawking radiation and cosmological particle production and there is never any mention in those contexts of the need to change statistics. It could be that these issues were worked out after this Feinberg paper. I will need to look into it further before I can make a definite conclusion.
4139:- having a reference is worthless if its wrong, in FTL physics and tachyons we are dealing with the clash of inherently incompatible models of science. My own work is still lacking experimental proof and is probably years from publication, I may never publish - any comments I make beyond a certain point become OR. The central problem is that FTL behaviour almost certainly is causality breaking. Physics as it stands in this area is till very incomplete. Works like Feinbergs are very detailed but he is missing an essential part of Relativity - that
2391:
particles going backward in time (which we can't understand easily) as anti-particles going forward in time. Okay, I think I understand that. If this is correct, maybe it should be in the article - the particle/antiparticle analogy is useful to understand the real/imaginary mass. Re: unphysicalness - If the tachyon mass is imaginary, then that's obviously unphysical. But if it were interpreted as real, as above .... Hmm. Well, I thought the presence of tachyons sounds the death knell for a theory, isn't that right? As mentioned in
3260:
acceptable. It was stated by the editor who inserted the content that the issue was "discussed" on this talk page. "Discussion" and "consensus" are far from being the same thing. I would now ask the editors involved in this page whether they believe the content I removed should be included or not. If they indicate it should not, I would also request some input as to what alternate phrasing, if any, would be acceptable, so that we can determine what the existing consensus regarding this subject is. Thank you.
1978:). My understanding is that it has to do with first quantization in special relativistic quantum mechanics(not QFT). This could easily lead to problems since special relativistic quantum mechanics is sort of an incomplete description anyway. I think it should be made clear in the text that although "tachyons are scalar fermions" may follow in special relativistic quantum mechanics, it in no way holds in quantum field theory. Again, the canonical example is the Higgs mechanism but there are others.
3761:
unless the theory is clearly, absolutely, and specifically proven beyond a doubt. And, as we all know in matters of this kind, such absolute proof rarely if ever exists. However, clearly, by including such information only in the lead and not referencing it anywhere else in the article, this article as it is currently constructed almost certainly violates both POV and MOS guidelines. Also, I regret to say that as currently constructed the entire last sentence of the lead might be seen to violate
3566:
smokescreen to obscure that request above is completely irrelevant to the discussion, and unfortunately seemingly in keeping with that editor's tendency toward unfounded statements. Also, it should be noted that wikipedia is specifically intended for the general reader, and that it is not a good idea to assume that the reader is an expert. Such a reference establishing the credibility of the only source cited on a subject of that importance are reasonable. Regarding sources, the entry in
3765:, as it seems to be grouping multiple ideas together in a way which does not seem to have apparently done in the sources themselves. I will forego placing the POV tag as well, at least for a while, if I receive clear indications from some party who has responsibly worked with the article, such as the editor who posted the last earlier comment, that there will be an effort to address these concerns in the near future, and actually see efforts to that effect in the near future.
201:--- I think the subject of tachyons is a rather delicate matter, more delicate than perhaps this article presents. That is, I changed "hypothetical" to "theoretical," in an attempt to distinguish between the theory and practice without the ladened hyperbole' (is that a fair description?). It seems to me that tachyons are quite a bit deeper than "fanciful things," where their existence may even end up being necessary in order to explain any number of real phenomena (see
3344:
sources as "unreliable". I also note that at least some other parties, I think
Hawking (?), have also indicated that faster-than-light travel is at least theoretically possible. Therefore, dismissing it as impossible could be seen as both explicitly ignoring reliable sources and original research. I would welcome substantive discussion of more acceptable phrasing, and look forward to further input regarding that subject from any and all parties.
4256:
31:
4093:
at all velocities (impossible for obvious reasons). Saying that "A is correct and everything else is wrong inevitably comes before the discovery that A is wrong too. Any real solution has to deal with
Relativity, with non-locality, and Minkowski space time and gravitational curvature. - Oh dear that has already broken the Quantum based answer in this article. (Relativity maps gravity one way Quantum Mechanics another, at least one is wrong.)
2504:
it out clearly and in so many words, that even after 45 years, this model (like string theory) has produced absolutely nothing! Period!!! If anyone has any evidence that these things exist, I would like certainly like to know about it. Finally, it was my link that Dan Gluck deleted on the assumption that the article was unpublished. In fact, it has been published. (See my
Knowledge user account with user name Ernstwall.)
3284:
to me a specific section which clearly indicates that a consensus of the editors agreed to the specific wording used in the now-removed content, I will gladly withdraw my objeciton. However, I do believe that based on what I have read that the content as added was not agreed to in advance. If I am wrong, my apologies. If by whatever chance I am right, I would welcome discussion as to what phrasing should be used.
4101:- The third point is rather uglier, the article states an old saw about tachyon velocities. Well while not directly incorrect this assumes a great deal about the FTL universe (much of it wrong) and its really little more like angels dancing on the head of a pin. (My OR shows that tachyons have a very complicated phase space and different maps and many different behaviors are quite possible, but some are not. )
3321:
really wish people spelled Arthur C. Clarke's name right, particularly considering that he is a moderately respectable futurist who explicitly disagrees with that statement which I have removed. Also, Dan Gluck's sweeping statement that "such things are not possible" is itself dubious, given the admittedly unlikely but still at least theoretically possible, as indicated in the last paragraph of the
3677:
Feinberg, whom you take as apparently being the ultimate source, I believe that would be an additional indication that the contested statement ending the lead needs to be elaborated, or better, removed from the lead entirely. Also, I note that you have not addressed any of the other points raised. Considering I have fulfilled your requests, I very much request that you respond in kind. Thank you.
873:
3700:
article. Also, I find myself once again forced to ask you to respond to the other points made, as you have continued to refuse to respond to them. Please do respond to them, rather than continuing to ignore them. Thank you. And, as these concerns have not yet been addressed, I have placed the appropriate tags for improving references and copyediting until they are addressed.
1959:
potential. This field is tachyonic but the quantization is performed using commutation relations. If it were fermionic, one would quantize by introducing non-trivial anti-commutators. So could someone explain to me what the passage in the text means? Maybe there is confusion with the term ghost field; these are fields which satisfy the wrong spin-statistics relation.
2618:
even deserve a paragraph stating that it has no experimental evidence. The article currently simply states that according to the modern view (i.e. quantum field theory) tachyon particles cannot exist. Tachyonic fields do exist, but no corresponding particle does, as is explained under the relevant section dealing with modern interpretation via quantum field theory.
3413:, and have once again indulged in a weakness that has been observed by several people regarding your conduct, specifically your tendency to to avoid directly dealing with questions asked of you by attacking and insulting others, as you have explicitly done above. In fact that was the exact nature of my incomplete evidence as reported
4105:
behaviour is how closely it models parts of 'psychic phenomena', and unfortunately I pointed that out. Where people like the 'New Agers' fall down of course is that no-one actually knows how to generate such things as large scale
Quantum Coherence or tachyon transience - otherwise their bracelets and magic totems would already work.
374:. There might be, now that I think about it, a few cases where nominations for the Nobel are actually significant: a person who is nominated several times and eventually wins; a person who is nominated for work shared with others, but because no more than three people can split the award, receives nothing (a bit like
666:
3391:
comment from the
Physics project. I believe that they will be probably fairer than you. And I sincerely suggest that, considering you are now on probation for your misconduct for a full year, that you perhaps learn something from the experience, like ceasing to indulge in your earlier problematic behavior.
4092:
My central complaint is that the article simply assumes and knows to much, and precognitively tells the us answers to questions that physics hasn't solved yet. As such it makes several quite obvious errors about causality and assumes that current models of
Quantum Mechanics and Relativity are correct
3959:
The short answer is No. Tachyons are by definition faster than light particles. Gravitons do not travel faster than light, they probably travel at the speed of light, in fact. Also
Tachyons aren't massless... they have an imaginary mass. There's a big difference between a mass of 0 and a mass of say,
3644:
It is a claim which is not made elsewhere, thus it qualifies as an extraordinary claim. And references to other articles are not indicated as being sufficient in the MOS. Creating a separate section of the article to deal with it is what is indicated, or at least further references within the article
3544:
Science is all about finding universal truths and thereby making sweeping statements. Such universal qualifications you seek are, well, universally valid and thereby redundant. Do you seek to pepper each and every paragraph in every science article with the same redundant qualifer? Unless you have
3495:
I don't think he was being used as a source, rather that his theories were being explicity discounted bove and that seems to have been involved in making the decision to change the content. He was I believe respected for some work relevant to oceanography, but that isn't relevant to this article. And
2716:
I meant in the layman meaning, i.e. a person moving faster than light. Perhaps you're familiar with Arthur C. Clark's ridiculous statement that spaceships may be able to move faster than light in the future, because we already know that there are particles that do that - the tachyons. Since
Knowledge
2354:
Okay, so this does not really help the imaginary mass issue. Tachyons still have imaginary mass, as understood by the usual E-p relation. Arbitrarily putting m' = im just hides the imaginariness. Right? In this case, I don't really see the point of such re-arrangement. It seems to me that we are just
2334:
What is the justification for moving the mass term to the other side of the equation? It seems to be arbitrary, just so you can get a real mass. Why should we expect any particle to obey a different energy-momentum relation? Also, although I don't seem to know as much about tachyons as some people on
2297:
be possible to come up with physical/mathematical proof of their nonexistence (i.e., a contradiction in existing laws of physics as yet undiscovered). I think it's important to point out that tachyons have never been shown to exist, but that their existence has never been explicitly ruled out either.
4104:
Finally on the section on New Age 'nonsense' I'm afraid that I may be partly responsible for some of this since I talked on the subject in several groups five or six years ago, and a lot of what appears now looks a little like my terminology of the time. One of the uncomfortable things about tachyon
3800:
Im not certain there is a wiki article about it but it has become a common internet scam to use 'tachyon' as some kind of mysterious holistic energy found in products certain sites sell, evidentally increasing the negative entropy of the human system and spontaniously healing/strengthening. I wonder
3746:
Thank you for the information. It's nice to actually get some. However, the remaining problems which I raised before, which specifically include the fact that at least one recognized source in the field, Feinberg himself, seems to indicate that he believes that tachyons might exist, as per the quote
3699:
The article is also written by Feinberg himself, presumably after the other source mentioned, as already indicated, which would seem to indicate that even the writer himself has perhaps decided that the statements from 1967 are not such as he would make at the time of the writing of the encyclopedia
3578:
states at the end of the entry on "Tachyons", "Whether this means that tachyons do not in fact exist, or whether future experiments of a different type will reveal them, remains uncertain," which is an entirely different take than this article's current blanket dismissal. On that basis, I believe it
3320:
Interesting. However, it does not address the specific question I asked regarding the specific content added. Also, please note by policy the obligation rests on you to demonstrate where consensus was reached. I note once again that you have yet to offer any such clear evidence of consensus. Also, I
3283:
Actually, you presume incorrectly. I did read the sections of the talk page which had headings which indicated relation to this topic and I did not see what would be qualify as consensus. Content of the other page is basically irrelevant to the content of this article. If you can however demonstrate
2922:
I think that the difference is just because when we have a sphere, the images of its upper and lower parts connect with the arriving and departing images to create one connected image. When the back part of the sphere leaves the point where the observer is located, this will no longer be true and we
2910:
Thanks again for your comments but it strikes me that if we follow the supersonic jet analogy, instead of having one image that splits into two, both departing in opposite directions from the same point, we have two images or series-of-images/sounds, one arriving ( even if in reverse order ) and one
2050:
However, this sentence is vague as well. It leaves the reader confused imho because how can a particle get to this point? The confusion arises because to get to superliminary speeds would seemingly be impossible from a subluminary speed. The particle would have to be created at FTL speeds. Therefore
2014:
pointer, but it defines them in terms of preserving the CCRs/CARs, whilst Feinberg shows that we have to drop this requirement. Ergo we would probably have to look beyond Bogoliubov transformations in the Higgs/Goldstone case. Feinberg's claim of the existence of unitary operators (that correspond
1958:
I would like to challenge the bit about tachyons as scalar fermions. I'm not familiar with Feinberg's work(and I can't access those journal articles right now to check it out), but this seems quite incongruous with things that I understand quite well. Consider the Higgs field near the maximum of its
489:
Reverted back and this removed "Another significant paper appeared recently (December,2005) when Aasis Vinayak.P.G propossed his new paper , 'physics/0511253' , on tachyons with which he is trying to prove that they will have real mass . The paper is a very revolutionary one also." Paper, unrefereed
3760:
article itself, which would describe when the theory was developed, how it seems to impact the possibility of tachyons existing, and what if any parties still disagree with the idea that tachyons cannot exist. Such would seem to be required, after all, for the article to not violate NPOV, until and
3380:
Please calm down. You did not say that you were referring to your earlier mention of SF author ACC, and so I asked for clarity. Has ACC published a text book about, or in a scientific journal on, tachyons? I doubt it. BTW I did not "explicitly denounce" Arthur C. Clarke's statements; never even
3343:
True. However, I do note that the earlier consensus discounted at least one source who might generally be thought as being at least notable. As indicated above, the specific phrasing can be seen as being problematic. There is no particular rush to restoring content which seems to dismiss recognized
2877:
it passes the observer. Since the object arrives before the light the observer sees nothing until the sphere starts to pass the observer, after which the image-as-seen-by-the-observer slowly splits into two -- one of the arriving sphere (to the right) and one of the departing sphere (to the left).
2856:
Thanks for coming back. However you haven't answered the question in layman's terms; I am not a scientist so don't understand doppler. I just want to know whether the left-hand side ( or the right-hand side ) is the arriving view. Then I can deduce that the other -hand is the departing view. It's a
2508:
I have no desire to get into a tourney of urination, but Dan has stated in no uncertain terms in his user account that he doesn't want to argue with "nobodys". I trust after reviewing my summary of my background he will not consider me to be a total nobody (maybe just a partial nobody?). Also, does
2503:
It would appear that many people believe the Sudarshan particles (imaginary mass particles) might someday be shown to exist. This web page almost implies that they actually do as of today because it spends time writing about a model that has yet to agree with experiment. So I added a note to point
2461:
so a complex energy means this isn't just a phase but rather grows or decays in time. In classical electrodynamics, when light propagates through some medium, the signal decays as the medium absorbs energy from the wave. But sometimes a system is unstable and a certain mode will increase with time.
1899:
This sounds like noncense: "Tachyons (if they existed) could be used to transmit energy-momentum, but they can't be used for communication." By shannons law if you transmit energy you transmit information. Think about it: just modulate if and when, or how much energy you send, and you automatically
506:
This is paper ('physics/0511253ā) is basically from the Cornell University Authorized website. www.wbabin.net - might have just lifted the paper. All the submissions here, University Online Library, are up to the university academic standards. The paper is a very revolutionary one itself. Those who
271:. I hate to play the card-carrying obnoxious physicist, but any remark like "is considered to be" is weasel terminology. The only reason it could belong in the introduction is if a fuller description followed below, with proper citations to both original journal articles and later retrospectives.
4152:
Even if all my own work is rubbish such heavy claims about something so speculative are dangerous because they can give a very wrong impression of the truth. - In this case Knowledge's rule of only quoting referenced work is again a likely potential route to disaster or at least egg on face. (The
3751:
in the content of the article, indicates that (1) the article may well be a violation of POV (even if it is the most generally accepted POV), as at least one verifiable, reliable source seems to indicate that he believes such particles could at least potentially be proven to exist, and (2) clearly
3149:
Once such mathematical extension to complex numbers is accepted, all the rest of the article is OK. However it would be inappropriate to assume such extension without explicitly stating it, especially because this article will be read by people with very different backgrounds, not only physicists.
2685:
Yes it was a bit cruel, but as someone who's used to much worse articles, it wasn't that bad... anyway I can live with the present form of the article. My only fear is that people won't understand that all the science fiction stuff about moving faster than light is totally fictitious (according to
2617:
By the way the deletion of the link is unrelated to the deletion of the paragraph regarding the Sudarshan particle. In my (not so humble as you've noticed) opinion, this particle is totally unnotable today, since the modern view of the subject is that tachyon particles cannot exist, so it does not
2427:
asked me to look at the recent edits and comment on this discussion. Tachyons are kind of a funny subject but if thought of properly do not "doom" a theory or demonstrate inconsistency per se. It is best not to think of them as particles in the classical(or even first quantized) sense; this may in
2000:
That is certainly not how I understand commutation relations to work. Such relations are constraints on operators and are not functions of the expectation values of those operators. I don't know the resolution of this but I'm strongly skeptical of Feinberg's claims. Besides the comparison with the
3390:
And you are continuing to indulge in the accusations and attempts at misdirection which have put you in the situation you are now in. Your attempts to dodge directly responding to fairly clearly made points by once again insulting others is now on record here as well. By the way, I have requested
3370:
the earlier discussion. The two of you explicitly denounced Arthur C. Clarke's statements. I would have thought mentioning the name once might have been enough. Evidently I was mistaken. Also, now that I have the opportunity, several recognized scientists over the years have asserted at least the
1963:
I was wondering about the Higgs angle, but don't really know enough to comment more. Re the scalar fermions, that's definitely how Feinberg presents it: he says the Lorentz group has no finite dimensional rep for imaginary mass (something I dimly recall from my college days) hence we are dealing
231:
It should be said rather strongly that the hypothesis that tachyons exist as particles, and are able to interact with ordinary matter, is very hard to entertain, unless you throw away one of the main principles of particle theory. It would introduce logical paradoxes, that is self-contradictions,
2390:
Yes, the dynamics are unchanged. So you're saying that if we interpret tachyons as obeying the usual E-p relation we would view them as having imaginary mass, but if we interpret them as obeying the re-arranged relation, we would not view them as having imaginary mass. Just like how we interpret
523:
clearly states "appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions" and that the only criteria for publishing a paper is endorsement; "The endorsement process is not peer review." You may also wish to note the original reverter's
227:
Considering that superpartners and even the Higgs are currently hypothetical particles, this adjective implies no opprobrium. If a particle exists "real" or "physical"; if it doesn't it's "fictional" or "unphysical"; if we don't know yet it's "hypothetical". In fact, "theoretical particle" is an
3676:
Perhaps. However, as the article was written by Feinberg himself, presumably after the article cited, it would seem to me that the contention of the article is in fact one that the author himself does not any longer make with the same degree of force. And, considering the article was written by
3653:
made elsewhere, I believe that it does in fact qualify as an extraordinary statement. And please note that the writer of this entry seems to be the same Gerald Feinberg who is the source of the statements in contention, although I presume the entry in this dictionary, copyright 1997, is in fact
3156:
Rigorously speaking, tachyons are incompatible to special relativity, at least as it is known today. One way to understand such incompatibility is to remark that in special relativity, time and each of the three space dimensions are represented by real numbers. When deducing special relativity
3933:
1- They are both massless 2- They are both hypothetycal 3- They are both related to strings theory 4- Gravitational energy tends to be weak, so much its hard to be detected, but has unlimited range; tachyons tends to have infinite speed at low or zero energy. Being not a physicist i can hardly
3426:
It is not a PA to state that you're imagining things (such as my claimed explicit rubbishing of ACC, which never happened). Yes, I have a tendency to ignore irrelevant questions, such your issues about the arbcom evidence; they are irrelevant to tachyons (take it to my talk page). As for the
3565:
I specifically requested only one source on one particular claimant's reliability, which would seem to be reasonable for a party featured as prominently in the lead of the article. The statement about making sweeping generalizations is basically irrelevant and ignored. The attempt to create a
3259:
I have removed the following cluase from the article: - "- but they don't exist anyway (by tachyon condensation)." I cannot see how such a preemptive dismissal of content without specific comments in the text itself explicitly identifying why such preemptive judgement is made is even remotely
2932:
1. I agree. 2. Standing on-axis certainly makes the double image effect more dramatic, but even if you're watching from a distance you'd still see the same effect, namely one image appearing without warning which then splits in two. I don't know to prove this rigorously but you can probably
2675:
Hi Dan, I don't think we disagree about the physics, just best way of expressing it. I don't buy the "defined asymptotically" argument since that would still permit the existence of virtual tachyons appearing as particles in Feynman diagrams. Also I thought it was a bit cruel to present the
576:
being superluminal and then show how that implies the rest mass would be imaginary in order for momentum and energy to be real. I would guess that's how the presentation goes in original papers in physics discussing tachyons, though admittedly I don't have any at hand to properly back myself
2649:
Hi Michael. The new section explains why the modern concept of particles does not allow tachyon to exist as particles. This is not because their existence would violate causality, but because a particle is defined asymptotically, meaning that it has to exist long enough to be measured. While
2428:
fact be inconsistent, I am not sure. But it is certainly consistent when you consider them as waves, or quanta of a field. Waves often have complex components to the energy; this just means that there is some exponential growth or decay as well as the oscillation. Recall waves propagate like
1215:
600:
I believe that sentence is erroneous. Indeed it is almost contradictory since one section ago, we just discuss the foundation of tachyons in the framework of Special Relativity itself! The main issue here is that tachyons can violate the principles of causality. But if I recall correctly,
3515:
And if Michael Price bothered to read my statements, he'd know I never said anything different. I sincerely hope he learns to actually deal with content at some point, and cease his seemingly never-ending stream of put-downs and obvious attacks, for the sake of both the project and himself.
3534:
Well, they aren't. What would seem to be required before making any sort of statement to the effect that "it's impossible" or "it doesn't exist" would be a proximate qualifier along the lines of "according to current prevailing opinion", which is still lacking in the final paragraph of the
3145:
Special Relativity theory works with one real time dimension and three real space dimensions. So having v being greater than c (and having imaginary numbers as the contraction/dilatation factor in Lorentz equations) requires extending special relativity to deal with complex numbers.
2055:"In special relativity, while it is impossible to accelerate an object to the speed of light, or for a massive object to move at the speed of light, theroetically it is possible for an object to exist which always moves faster than light provided it was created at superliminary speed.""
2627:
The new section does not explain why tachyons do not exist, but rather why they are unstable. It is not true that they don't exist because their existence would violate causality -- Feinberg's QFT treatment still maintained the CCRs for QFT and the vanishing of the anticommutator of
239:
require tachyons, since no energy or information is exchanged faster than c. The paper cited above from the 'arxiv' is on "superbradyons", not strictly tachyons, and is highly speculative. All the references are to the author's own previous work, i.e. no-one else works on this.
2771:
I object. Tachyon condensation should deal with tachyonic fields as a sign of instabilities (note that its' tachyonic fields, not non-tachyonic!). Tachyon should deal with why the tachyon under modern interpretation should not be considered as a particle in the usual sense.
539:
Now I was told by a friend, who goes by "The basement man" that the only way to survive the comubstion etc. of a tachyon particle would be throuhg means of black body radiation. Now, is black body radiation truly possible, or is it just another theory? hit me up at, thanks.
2072:
The energy-momentum relation given in this article is incorrect, I have corrected it without changing any of the other mathematics on the page. If there are any inconsistencies that crop up from this I apologise... but really it should have been correct in the first place.
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A tachyon might be a magnetic monopole. Many theoretical searches for magnetic monopoles have concluded they may not exist thanks to them breaking multiple physical laws (conservation of energy for one). It seems fashionable to attribute to tachyons anything proven to be
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hits you (the observer) and hence at that moment you only see one image and 2b) as time goes to +infinity the distance off-axis become irrelevant (compared with the along axis distance) and you must see two images. By continuity the one image must separate into two.
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can fairly be stated that this article as it is currently constructed makes what could be called extraordinary claims. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary sourcing. It should also be noted that the existing lead section does not conform to the standards of
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2044:"not impossible" is a double negative. Double negatives don't help understanding. Should be "is possible". Then I have a problem because these are hypothetical particles with imaginary mass and have never been detected (I guess). Shouldn't this then read ...
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278:) added a similar comment, "Discovery of tachyons is attributed to Indian scientist George Sudarshan who was nominated for the Nobel Prize six times." IMNSHO, this sounds like gushing from a partisan supporterānever mind that we shouldn't speak about the
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with scalars. The Lorentz transform may switch the annihilation and creation operators in the commutation relation, which voids it: hence we are forced to use anti-commutation relations, which are preserved by an arbitrary LT. Hence scalar fermions. --
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So the upshot, is that tachyons themselves are not signs of inconsistency, just instability. But if the instability is never tamed(if the field keeps growing exponentially) then it will become singular and then presumably inconsistent. Hope that helps.
3225:, then the abovementioned expression has a negative value and it has no square root in real numbers. So special relativity equations can not be deduced. Note that this problem is not solved by claiming that tachyons have zero mass or imaginary mass.
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OK, I looked into the Feinberg paper some and he does in fact make the claim that tachyons are scalar fermions. There is something funny about this however. It may be true from some standpoint, but it certainly does not hold up in field theory(see the
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and a section in this article exists as well which explains why tachyons don't exist. Probably it is could be clearer, although my solution would be just leave a pointer to the condensation article and delete the duplicated material/section content
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Thank you for the explanation and the improved caption to the diagrams. I suppose it's a bit like being overflown by a fighter-jet, you see the back end of the departing aircraft and then hear the roar of its engines as the sound-wave trundles on
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Yes, but only because we don't observe them, not because they're impossible. Also tachyons imply there would exist no stable lowest energy state vacuum -- again not impossible, but not observed. I'll add a few words to the article later today.
868:{\displaystyle L={\frac {m}{2}}\left(\left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)^{2}-\left({\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{d\tau }}\right)^{2}\right)+e\left(\varphi {\frac {dt}{d\tau }}-\left(\mathbf {A\cdot } {\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{d\tau }}\right)\right)+...}
2047:"In special relativity, while it is impossible to accelerate an object to the speed of light, or for a massive object to move at the speed of light, theroetically it is possible for an object to exist which always moves faster than light."
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I've adapted the title of the causality section to conform with the condensation section. Perhaps the "Modern Interpretation" prefix is superfluous for both sections, or we could make both subsctions of s "quantum field theory" section..
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I am quite convinced that if tachyons could be made they could be easily used to send information backwards in time. The Feinberg reinterpretation principle doesn't quite work. If I can create negative energy tachyons, I can construct an
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I agree, improve don't delete. Anyway I think I "get" the diagram now. The right hand bluish shape is the image formed by the light arriving at the observer -- who is located at the apex of the black lines -- from the FTL sphere as it
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can't be transmitted FTL and that causality is preserved. That's the part I've been trying to emphasize. As physicists we have grown used to spacelike propagators in QFT. Virtual tachyon particles seem like a pretty mild extension of
2038:"In special relativity, while it is impossible to accelerate an object to the speed of light, or for a massive object to move at the speed of light, it is not impossible for an object to exist which always moves faster than light."
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exist is not an extraordinary claim. Claiming they do (or might) is. Please cut-and-paste the entire paragraph from the Encyclopedia Americana so that we can judge context. In particular I want to see what "this" refers to.
4097:- Specifically tachyons can or might break causality. - This seems so obvious to me but then I am developing a model of causality that specifically allows for local causality breaking and copes far better with such things.
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Feinberg's treatment is legitimate, it does not state that particle tachyons exist, in the modern sense (explained in the reference I have given, for example, - Peskin and Schroeder, which I'm sure you know, chapter 7).
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There's no pretence going on, since the underlying dynamics is unaltered by the rearrangement. PS I don't agree with your "physicalness" of tachyons statement. The whole point of Feinberg and others was that tachyons
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are commenting here may first go through the paper. The university will never publish one paper with out the recommendation of an eminent person from the same field. The paper is available at arxiv.org - Dr. Ravi
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hysteria, that is my judgement of your mental state to explain your evidential blunders; less of a PA than your overblown accusations of fraud etc. Again, take it to my talk page -- no one here is interested. --
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I don't see the problem with the repetition of "by Feinberg's analysis", since both points are made in the source (and evidently this was not understood by some editors, which was why this is stressed more than
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Assuming no objections, maybe if I have more time I will attempt to do a rewrite myself. Note that this is just purely a matter of the flow of information in the section; I'm not proposing to add or delete any
4099:- Although Imaginary Mass is pretty much the standard model for the tachyon and can be derived directly from Relativity, it is hardly mentioned. - Maybe because it emerges from the wrong side of the physics.
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If John Carter bothered to read the talk page more carefully he would see that ACC's views were a spur to presenting the scientific position more clearly, and nothing more. Nothing scientific was discounted.
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pointing out the obvious fact, in no uncertain terms, that playing with the Sudarshan particle is at a dead end, violate Dan's "scientific consensus" or is it "scientific consensus" that these things exist?
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I accept the current version. However, if we express all equation in four dimensional form, we do not need to use imaginary numbers. We can start with Lagrangian (Ā§7.2, Gravitation (1973). W. H. Freeman,
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Thus I marked that sentence with a "citation needed" tag. If the sentence is fully accurate a citation from a reliable source shouldn't be too hard to find. Otherwise, please remove and/or revise that
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I propose to delete the diagram as original research. I don't understand at all what's going on there. I believe the diagram should be understandable at least for the average PhD student in physics...
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will see two separate images. So the difference from a supersonic jet is because: 1. we have here a 3-dimensional description, and 2. the sphere is moving THROUGH the observer and not passing it by.
2561:? What can exist is a field whose quanta at the approximation around some point is tachyonic, such as the Higgs expanded around zero VEV, but no tachyon particle is possible in quantum field theory.
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HAHA! This is what I'm talkin' about! This was clearly written with the layman in mind, not like the other incomprehensible mathematical garbage floating around Knowledge. I salute the author/editor!
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I reject your point about conflation since each clause is referenced, again in line with the practice in science articles, but let's see what Dan, Joshua, ScienceApologist et al thinks about this.--
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The grey shape is the where the moving FTL sphere actually is. The coloured object that splits in two is what we see (the colours represent the doppler shift). The description needs expanding. --
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If tachyons really exists, what difference if tachyons don't exists?The main clue for tachyons is to know what things would change if they exists.And if they don't exist, what things are changed?
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It is rearranged just so that we get a real mass. But it's not a different equation, it's the same equation, just with m'=im, which is why we expect the "new" equation to be obeyed by tachyons.--
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Although extending special relativity to deal with complex dimensions is mathematically feasible, currently there is no experimental evidence supporting a four complex dimensional space-time.
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Actually, I didn't see any sections which indicated that there was a consensus. That is why I specifically asked you to indicate where that consensus was achieved, and now repeat that request.
3092:. This possibility has prompted some to propose that each particle in space has its own relative timeline, allowing particles to travel back in time without violating causality. Under this
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I look quite favorably upon the existence of magnetic monopoles simply because they lead to quantization of charge. I wasn't aware that they necessarily violated any laws of physics though.
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this page, I'm going to add a sentence about the implication of a theory predicting tachyons and the "physicalness" of tachyons, to the best of my knowledge. Please clarify it if I'm wrong.
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Can anyone please tell me which way the tachyon is to be perceived as moving in the diagramsĀ ? In the second diagram which is the arriving view and which the departing viewĀ ? Many thanks.
3756:. As a suggestion, I think it might make sense to create a summary section regarding the current theory of tachyon condensation, particularly given the comparatively poor condition of the
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3069:. This result has no citing (the citing leads to another encyclopeida with no source to support this specific claim), it has not been reproduced, and the model is highly non-mainstream.
3736:, making it the best source on the subject. If you find a source of equal quality which contradicts it, please let us know. Otherwise, this whole debate is pointless. Have a good day!
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We might also need discussion about the wave front effect, virtual particles, and how exactly causality is violated if tachyons exist (which might as well go into the causality link.)
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1991:. Perhaps the Higgs field operators anti-commutate near the local Higgs maxima (at Higgs = 0), whilst the Higgs-Goldstone boson field operators commutate near the local minima? --
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Coule has argued that schemes such as the one proposed by Alcubierre are not feasible because the matter to be placed on the road beforehand has to be placed at superluminal speed.
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According to the author, this change was because "it is not up to scientists to disprove the existence of tachyons". I only partially agree with this: if tachyons don't exist, it
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but as people at least knowledgable in physics, its sad to see him not given any credit. by the way, i agreeĀ ::::with the removal of sudarshan in the introduction of this topic --
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And I suggest you stop misrepresenting me. As I said, I never made any comment about ACC. Although quite how he is relevant to a science subject such as tachyons is beyond me. --
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I think there is a serious deficiency in this section. Tachyons, despite travelling FTL, do not violate causality because they can't be used to transmit information, due to the
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evidence and in no way a criticism of Feinberg's theoretical work (which would have presented a conflict of interest) or the later work on tachyon condensation by others. --
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that discusses tachyons from the point of view of Special Relativity: right now that section more or less starts off with imaginary rest mass and then work from there to
3649:. Asd it is in print, I assume that it is understood that it cannot be cut and pasted from a different site. As the statement within this article clearly is one which is
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The following discussion regarding tachyons and special relativity assumes a somehow āextendedā special relativity to deal with complex versions of space-time and mass.
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Dear John Carter. The reference of Peskin and Schroeder, on which the "they don't exist" entry relies, is the most common (and usually considered the best) text book on
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Hmmm... yes, it's a bit like saying "A unicorn might be like a fairy"... one fanciful thing being compared to another. Losing it doesn't hurt the article - good call. -
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If negative energy tachyons can be created then FTL is already possible under general relativity. If not, then Feinberg's principle doesn't work. Choose your poison.
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is such an obscure achievement (because of the large and very inhomogenous group able to nominate), that it never ever should be mentioned in any Knowledge article.
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The statement that tachyons would not break causality is referenced, not just asserted as you complain. I suggest you acquaint yourself with G Feinberg's work. --
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the model was based on the naive assumption that the Lorentz transformation, which is based on subluminal measurements, could be applied to the hyperluminal domain
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comments on the lack of empirical evidence. So my point remains: find me a source that specifically expands upon the Feinberg ref and/or tachyon condensation. --
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an undesired background signal, which would drown out the information. I've attempted to explain this in the article -- it probably needs more explanation. --
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Tachyons is theorized to exist in universes with extra time dimensions. A universe with 1 space dimension and 3 time dimensions are comprised of only Tachyons.
105:"It is not generally realised that if a tachyon were to exist and were allowed to interact with ordinary (time-like) matter, causality would not be violated"
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itself, particularly not for content included in the lead section. Regarding the presumptuous nature of the above request, here is the entry in its entirety
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I agree it sounds like nonsense, but it isn't. I swear it's taken from Feinberg's article. Do a goggle on the "Feinberg reinterpretation principle". --
303:. What did Sudarshan contribute to the theory? If his name is important enough to be mentioned in the lead, he deserves a paragraph or two down below!
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No one is interested in your insulting personal opinions either. Too bad that hasn't stopped you from deciding to almost start the discussion with one.
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This article on tachyons is much expanded since I last looked several years ago, however it seems that with expanded detail comes expanded speculation.
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in Americana from him, as well as the fact that as it now stands the article clearly is referring to something in the lead which is not elaborated on
1210:{\displaystyle \mathbf {v} =\left({\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{dt}}\right)=\left({\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{d\tau }}\right)/\left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)}
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Special Relativity, strictly as formulated in the original papers and in most textbooks, does not allow any particle moving faster than light.
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You MIGHT have magnetic monopoles which are also tachyons, but it's even closer to say that you might have unicorns which are also infrared. --
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I suggest we delete all but the first paragraph of "Modern interpretation: Quantum field theory" and move any non-duplicated material over to
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Not being up on this subject and just skimming through to get a gist of this subject. I'm no expert, but this makes little sense to a reader.
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rule of being like an Encyclopedia is that Encyclopedias are slightly wrong about almost everything.) Sorry for hassling you. 24 Sept 2008,
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Later, by slightly modifying the Van Den Broeck metric, Krasnikov reduced the necessary total amount of negative energy to a few milligrams.
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Right, so you accept that there is no evidence for a lack of consensus. For evidence for consensus, see "adding a section" for starters. --
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Sorry if I am rather critical of the article but this is an irritation to me - I hate seeing something I know is incorrect. 22 Sept 2008,
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Note there is more detailed analysis associated with the graphic. I don't follow it all yet, but neither have I seen any obvious flaws. --
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fascinating diagram, it would be a pity to remove it. Much better to explain it, this is after all a layman's encyclopedia. Many thanks.
2604:, what I meant was that your article to which your linked is very non-concensussial. Furthermore, by linking to it you do not follow the
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I would say revert to your original statement. If it isn't up to scientists to disprove the existence of tachyons, then whose job is it?
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oxymoron, because theories are made of ideas, not particles. "Theoretical particle physics" is not the physics of theoretical particles!
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The only person to have spoken against the consensus on the talk page is you, who has made the lead and the main body contradictory. --
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To directly address the communication issue: yes you could modulate a signal and send it back in time, but the receiver would detect
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I don't entirely follow this: the scalar fermion conclusion looks like a product of QFT analysis: it appears in Feinberg section 4:
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3096:, such a particle would be a "tachyon" by virtue of its apparent superluminal velocity, even though its rest mass is a real number.
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mentioned the guy (although I like his stories). You're imagining things and getting a bit hysterical, just as you did before. --
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equations, like Lorentz space-time transformations, it is unavoidable, at one point, to take the square root of the expression:
4223:, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
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written later than the 1967 article referenced. Unfortunately, the time the article was written is not included in the article.
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the point was only made because of the apparent effort to discount any and all such theories, regardless of who they came from.
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Feinberg work as merely a suggestion, yet the next paragraph was presented with absolute certainty -- so I toned it down. Ā :-)--
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possibility of faster-than-light travel. To write off all of them with a single simple phrase is clearly less than acceptable.
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609:; causality is more a principle that physicists generally believe to be true, but is otherwise independent of the framework of
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Thanks -- bit of a typo there on my part. And it shouldn't cause any inconsistencies since that is what I'd meant to say. --
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For every field there is a particle -- except that for the tachyons the particles are non-localisable, as Feinberg showed.--
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departing. This is not the same as one image breaking into two and both departing from the same point. What do you thinkĀ ?
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The above is pure synthesis and original research. The Higgs field captures many of the properties of tachyons; so, yes, "
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of a hypothetical particle. The article on Sudarshan himself seems similarly toned; a good POV shakedown may be in order.
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I'll look at both articles and see what belongs where. Some stuff may appear twice, if it contributes to both articles.
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Just saw your last edit and I'm satisfied with that, except that I'm changing the "FTL" acronym to "faster than light".
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is meant not only for physicists but also for the lay person, it should be emphasized that such things are not possible.
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Feinberg's reinterpretation principle requires that it be possible to construct negative energy tachyons. Catch on now?
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Don't think of it as a caption. Think of it as a sidebar. Your section title is too tall with the image, by the way. --
1455:{\displaystyle v_{0}\equiv \gamma _{tachyon}=\left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)={\frac {1}{\sqrt {\mathbf {v} ^{2}-1}}}}
1335:{\displaystyle v_{0}\equiv \gamma _{tardyon}=\left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)={\frac {1}{\sqrt {1-\mathbf {v} ^{2}}}}}
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Yikes! A pre-print from 2005-12. Let's wait for some comments on this, before claiming a revolutionary breakthrough.
2690:" statement in bold letters. Maybe there's another way to emphasize that, or maybe it's already clear. I don't know.
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I accept the distinction, but most of the content of "Modern interpretation: Quantum field theory" is duplicated at
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1853:{\displaystyle t^{\prime }={\frac {1}{\sqrt {v^{2}-1}}}\left(tv-x\right)=\left(t\sinh \beta -x\cosh \beta \right)}
1735:{\displaystyle x^{\prime }={\frac {1}{\sqrt {v^{2}-1}}}\left(xv-t\right)=\left(x\sinh \beta -t\cosh \beta \right)}
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Some modern presentations of tachyon theory have demonstrated the possibility of a tachyon with a real mass. In
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What happened to Feinberg? If he named the tachyon (I've heard he "invented" it...), shouldn't he be mentioned?
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The caption of this current image in this article is way too long, it takes up the whole length of the browser!
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Please so not rewrite your earlier talk page contributions, especially when they have later responses attached.
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the earlier consensus discounted at least one source who might generally be thought as being at least notable.
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unless supplemented by some clever principle which no-one has yet been able to incorporate in a coherent way.
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physics community. I know he is not known in the general audience (who is except maybe Newton & Einstein)
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too much to ask? "Tachyons were first proposed by physicist Arnold Sommerfeld, and named by Gerald Feinberg"
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does not illuminate the topic, as far as I can see, since that page does not mention tachyons. However, see
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The caption is also a bit confusing, someone should tidy it up for better comprehension for other readers.
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Sounds like I didn't presume incorrectly. Show me the talk section with the lack of consensus mentioned. --
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our present understanding bla bla), because I'm not sure we emphasize that enough. That's why I made the "
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Thanks. I was a little worried that by changing those lines I might have broken some other maths later...
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The uncommon and not-so-well-known term is "tardon". Sounds like it could be the punchline to a joke ....
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2702:-- not so sure about the "moving" part; that's what the Feinberg was all about, but I totally agree that
1081:{\displaystyle \left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)^{2}-\left({\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{d\tau }}\right)^{2}=-1}
975:{\displaystyle \left({\frac {dt}{d\tau }}\right)^{2}-\left({\frac {d\mathbf {x} }{d\tau }}\right)^{2}=+1}
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3357:" eh? Notable or reliable? They're different things. And don't be vague, who are you referring to? --
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about it, the presentation seems somewhat backwards; I think it would be more logical to start off with
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Could anyone add a link to the name for particles at sub-luminal speeds? I forgot what the name was. --
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At some point there are many similar charactheristics of both particules in which i find interesting.
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Michael, it is not a misrepresentation to state that above you have explicitly violated the policy of
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it has passed and then you would see two images - both moving away from you. PS I do not have a PhD.--
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It's a little disturbing, as someone from the field, when i read comments about the reality of someone
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Can anyone verify this? I removed it as it sounds highly dubious to me; in any case, it is too vague.
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As of now there is no compelling, or even half-compelling, reason to try. Quantum entanglement does
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exist. That we don't see them is another issue (we don't see a lot of things that could exist.) --
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to Lorentz transformations that flip the sign of a tachyon's energy) seems pretty well founded. --
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under What is excluded?; "An edit counts as original research if it proposes ideas or arguments."
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like Sudarshan; a man who has contributed alot to physics. I'm pretty sure he didnt "discover" the
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Michael, I believe someone (probably youĀ :-) ) should explain in the diagram what we see there.
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Great Michael. Now even I can understand itĀ :). I now think the diagram should indeed be kept.
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trying to make ourselves happy by pretending the mass is real, but it doesn't change anything.
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In fact, such square root is explicitly present in most of special relativity equations. If
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I suggest the following paragraph, or something similar, to be included in the article:
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Does anyone want to clarify this sentence? It is very confusing with the double negatives.
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So what? You're saying nothing new or interesting. I think you should read his article.--
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2991:. I say keep the diagram; as it says: if a tachyon passed you you would not see it until
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I have deleted a link to an unpublished article very different from scientific concensus.
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if tachyons could be made they could be easily used to send information backwards in time
4175:-- it seems obvious to a lot of people, and they're all wrong, as Feinberg's work shows.
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reinterpretation principle. I'll dig out a reference and rewrite accordingly soon. --
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I am delighted by the fact that my intimidating remarks have been successful. Anyway,
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I see: so when I point out a factual error on your part that is "almost" a PA.Ā :-) --
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Last edited at 00:37, 21 October 2006 (UTC). Substituted at 22:09, 3 May 2016 (UTC)
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Specifically tachyons can or might break causality. - This seems so obvious to me
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criticism of the expressed theories about tachyons I see no grounds for inclusion.
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convince your self of this by drawing trigonometric diagrams; 2a) there has to be
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http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Tachyon&diff=32225280&oldid=32175239
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
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Section rewritten with reference to the Feinberg reinterpretation principle. --
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
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This paragraph has irritated me for a long time. Thanks for removing it. --
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its contents, no matter whether field or particle, sub- or super-luminal. --
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To date, the existence of tachyons has been neither proven nor disproven.
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If I don't see an argument brought forward, I'll simply keep reverting. --
3417:. I sincerely hope that you can in time overcome this tendency of yours.
389:). None of these categories apply to the present situation, of course.
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GR specifically requires the transfer of information faster than light.
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A Remarkably 'Precognitive' Article on some aspects of Tachyon Physics.
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Arthur Clarke should not be used as a source for anything scientific.
568:(velocity) being superluminal. While there's nothing factually wrong
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comments; the paper is far too new to have met any of these criteria.
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explain the correlation but thats somehow why i ask the questionĀ ;).
141:
1612:{\displaystyle E_{tachyon}={\frac {m}{\sqrt {\mathbf {v} ^{2}-1}}}}
1536:{\displaystyle E_{tardyon}={\frac {m}{\sqrt {1-\mathbf {v} ^{2}}}}}
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makes no such statement as "but they don't exist anyway", and the
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http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/SmarandacheHypothesis.html
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Interesting. So the "this" was only in reference to the lack of
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shower (an observation which has not been confirmed or repeated)
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So, you couldn't tell whether or not a signal was sent or not?--
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Diagram rules! Keep forever, this stuff is blowing my mind!!
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It is hardly teasing the reader since a link is provided to
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I think it appear only in the bosonic string theory?? no? --
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We can try, but tachyons are inherently confusing, IMO. --
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reported a superluminal particle apparently produced in a
2534:(imaginary mass particles) might someday be shown to exist
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And Lorentz transformation for tachyons can be written as
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Some time ago, I added a sentence to the first paragraph
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To date, the existencec of tachyons has not been shown.
382:); a person who looks like a shoe-in but dies too soon (
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I nixed the comment in the introductory paragraph about
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That's not the problem though, the position stated is
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AFAICS the content issues are consensually settled. --
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Michael - why do you claim that tachyons can exist in
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http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:No_original_research
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Sudarshan is back. This time, it's thanks to anon IP
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Perhaps it could be better to give that no credence.
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I have two points to make about the current revision
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http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=Sudarshan+tachyon
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point on the path of an object from which the light
591:'s first paragraph currently ends with the sentence:
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I am considering revamping this page a fair amount.
3776:This Encyclopedia Americana article (as read here:
2574:do not exist, while tachyonic fields certainly do.
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513:http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Reliable_sources
85:Tachyons arise in many versions of string theory.
3686:No perhaps about it. The article quite clearly
2608:guideline. Therefore the deletion is justified.
4219:, and are posted here for posterity. Following
2051:it should say so (or have I assumed too much)?
1989:Quantum Field Theory of Noninteracting Tachyons
2700:moving faster than light is totally fictitious
4213:The comment(s) below were originally left at
2222:{\displaystyle E^{2}=p^{2}c^{2}+m^{2}c^{4}\;}
2143:{\displaystyle E^{2}=p^{2}m^{2}+m^{2}c^{4}\;}
8:
3274:nor checked the past discussions on this? --
1863:I've used these transformations to make the
328:the first treatment in quantum field theory
3834:I believe this speculation has to do with
3204:{\displaystyle {1-{\frac {v^{2}}{c^{2}}}}}
3116:Because it was already on the other side.
3057:I deleted the following paragraph, due to
3801:if there is any way we can mention this?
3323:Faster-than-light#Variable speed of light
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1877:And a pretty awesome image it is, too! --
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274:A couple months ago, an anonymous user (
4189:If they exists, where's the difference?
3926:QUESTIONĀ : Could tachyons be gravitons?
4269:Do not edit the contents of this page.
2628:spacelike-separated field operators.--
2273:Existence: Proven/Disproven vs. Shown?
44:Do not edit the contents of this page.
544:http://www.xanga.com/LeUntouchable_xx
7:
3119:Why did the tachyon cross the road?
2900:By a supersonic jet, yes exactly.--
593:At the very least the principle of
338:being nominated for the Nobel prize
209:http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-ph/9905454
2974:(I changed to "keep" - see below)
366:Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!
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4221:several discussions in past years
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2987:Diagrams are not subject to the
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243:Also, the (now removed) link to
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3545:a reliable source that makes a
3138:Tachyons and Special Relativity
2570:I meant of course that tachyon
2317:Very well. Statement reverted.
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3778:User:Warlordjohncarter/Tachyon
3647:User:Warlordjohncarter/Tachyon
2786:. Can you please remove it?--
1:
4004:. Wrong. Read Feinberg. --
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1220:then velocity time component
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298:single bibliographic citation
163:21:18, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
110:23:44, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
89:Could tachyons be gravitons?
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394:10:52, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
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316:Sudarshan seems to be real:
308:15:11, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
4137:at least partly speculative
3950:09:56, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
3630:BTW claiming that tachyons
3270:I presume you neither read
2779:07:27, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
2285:which was later changed to
597:would have to be discarded.
494:. Probable self-promotion.
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605:doesn't require causality
370:thanks to his work on the
333:Some followup is required.
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2298:How should it be worded?
2012:Bogoliubov transformation
982:for regular particles or
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97:09:22, 14 Mar 2007 (UTC)
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2330:Rearranging E-p relation
2068:Energy-momentum relation
647:19:22, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
622:04:23, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
258:19:00, 13 May 2004 (UTC)
149:22:47, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
137:18:37, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
128:Baryons? Normal matter?
3569:Encyclopedia Britannica
2454:{\displaystyle e^{iEt}}
3575:Encyclopedia Americana
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1093:Since 3D velocity is
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363:; he even pops up in
245:Florentin Smarandache
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42:of past discussions.
4229:Needs a longer lead
3858:Image:Tachion04b.jpg
3758:tachyon condensation
3734:quantum field theory
3594:tachyon condensation
3272:tachyon condensation
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2820:Diagrams of tachyons
2784:Tachyon condensation
2759:Tachyon condensation
2753:Tachyon condensation
2559:quantum field theory
2536:". Statements like "
2475:I see, thanks guys.
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2951:Yes, you're right.
878:then we can choose
4209:Assessment comment
3255:Removal of content
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2966:Diagram should be
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603:special relativity
595:special relativity
372:weak nuclear force
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4273:current talk page
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4062:comment added by
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3053:Deleted paragraph
3033:MisplacedFate1313
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3796:New Age Anoyance
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3366:Please actually
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2034:Language please
2010:Thanks for the
1976:Higgs mechanism
1956:
1954:Scalar Fermion?
1897:
1895:bit of nonsense
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658:0-7167-0344-0
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395:
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387:Henry Moseley
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376:Freeman Dyson
373:
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3803:12.206.61.50
3799:
3748:
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3567:
3553:previously).
3546:
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2703:
2699:
2688:do not exist
2687:
2571:
2541:
2537:
2533:
2502:
2488:
2474:
2468:Joshua Davis
2464:
2422:
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2003:Joshua Davis
1988:
1980:Joshua Davis
1957:
1924:
1923:your signal
1920:
1898:
1862:
1621:
1464:
1219:
1092:
1088:for tachyons
877:
651:
627:
619:24.16.27.166
615:
606:
599:
592:
586:
580:information.
578:
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203:entanglement
196:
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129:
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100:
92:
88:
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60:
43:
37:
18:Talk:Tachyon
4261:This is an
4064:75.45.18.99
4058:āPreceding
3987:75.45.10.20
3962:Drlecter491
3942:96.20.61.73
3936:āPreceding
3856:Caption of
3767:John Carter
3702:John Carter
3679:John Carter
3656:John Carter
3585:John Carter
3537:John Carter
3518:John Carter
3498:John Carter
3438:John Carter
3419:John Carter
3393:John Carter
3373:John Carter
3346:John Carter
3327:John Carter
3304:John Carter
3286:John Carter
3262:John Carter
3241:189.24.6.58
3235:āPreceding
2704:information
2511:āPreceding
2152:changed to
1880:Grey Knight
511:Please see
378:'s role in
294:80.0.191.52
175:impossible.
36:This is an
3087:cosmic ray
3083:Roger Clay
2871:approaches
2319:Sloverlord
2300:Sloverlord
445:Trekphiler
421:Blckavnger
336:Of course
276:82.68.88.6
130:Everything
107:Muaddib131
4297:ArchiveĀ 3
4292:ArchiveĀ 2
4286:ArchiveĀ 1
3976:Casuality
3899:WinterSpw
3866:WinterSpw
3738:Dan Gluck
3665:empirical
3125:Shnakepup
3024:Dan Gluck
3015:Dan Gluck
2979:Dan Gluck
2953:Dan Gluck
2925:Dan Gluck
2837:Dan Gluck
2797:Dan Gluck
2774:Dan Gluck
2728:Dan Gluck
2719:Dan Gluck
2692:Dan Gluck
2652:Dan Gluck
2620:Dan Gluck
2610:Dan Gluck
2602:Ernstwall
2576:Dan Gluck
2572:particles
2563:Dan Gluck
2517:Ernstwall
2506:Ernstwall
2491:Dan Gluck
2310:Mike Peel
617:sentence.
587:Causality
280:discovery
72:ArchiveĀ 3
67:ArchiveĀ 2
61:ArchiveĀ 1
4155:Lucien86
4109:Lucien86
4060:unsigned
3938:unsigned
3860:too long
3763:WP:SYNTH
3547:specific
3237:unsigned
2918:Oharrez
2896:Oharrez
2864:Oharrez
2831:Oharrez
2525:contribs
2513:unsigned
2241:contribs
1465:Energy
984:tardyons
453:Reverted
326:Perhaps
80:Untitled
4264:archive
4205:agre22
3754:WP:LEAD
3581:WP:LEAD
3059:WP:NOTE
2968:deleted
2913:Oharrez
2891:Oharrez
2889:behind.
2859:Oharrez
2826:Oharrez
2707:this.--
2265:Jheriko
2233:Jheriko
1869:TxAlien
589:section
562:section
478:Pjacobi
468:Pjacobi
391:Anville
344:Pjacobi
305:Anville
286:Anville
39:archive
4195:Agre22
3818:Rotiro
3782:Rotiro
3749:at all
3411:WP:NPA
2606:WP:NPV
2477:Rotiro
2425:Rotiro
2397:Rotiro
2357:Rotiro
2337:Rotiro
1902:Ariel.
607:per se
570:per se
205:).
155:Rotiro
142:Tardon
3632:don't
3597:here.
3094:model
3067:WP:OR
2993:after
2989:WP:OR
2939:first
2875:after
2367:could
2060:Candy
1938:RLent
384:e.g.,
255:Tdent
223:Matt
122:Redge
16:<
4237:talk
4199:talk
4159:talk
4113:talk
4068:talk
3991:talk
3966:talk
3946:talk
3903:talk
3885:talk
3870:talk
3844:talk
3840:Xact
3822:talk
3807:talk
3786:talk
3688:only
3415:here
3368:read
3245:talk
3112:Joke
3081:and
3075:1973
3063:WP:V
3037:talk
2970:kept
2521:talk
2423:Hi,
2237:talk
1942:talk
1921:both
1867:. --
1837:cosh
1822:sinh
1719:cosh
1704:sinh
655:ISBN
584:The
560:The
526:Alex
496:Alex
361:real
193:MMGB
159:talk
4095:...
4020:--
3997:JH
3651:not
2935:one
2761:.--
2542:all
2295:may
2263:--
2231:--
1925:and
577:up.
380:QED
237:not
199:CIM
187:CYD
185:--
4201:)
4178:--
4161:)
4115:)
4070:)
3993:)
3968:)
3948:)
3905:)
3887:)
3872:)
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3788:)
3635:--
3506:--
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3174:ā
3127:15
3123:)
3077:,
3065:,
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2523:ā¢
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2395:.
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2239:ā¢
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1843:Ī²
1840:ā”
1831:ā
1828:Ī²
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1780:ā
1756:ā²
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1710:Ī²
1707:ā”
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1638:ā²
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1365:Ī³
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1014:Ļ
948:Ļ
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800:Ļ
783:Ļ
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727:ā
711:Ļ
660:)
251:.
161:)
144:--
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3211:.
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2444:E
2441:i
2437:e
2235:(
2213:4
2209:c
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2199:m
2195:+
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2186:c
2180:2
2176:p
2172:=
2167:2
2163:E
2134:4
2130:c
2124:2
2120:m
2116:+
2111:2
2107:m
2101:2
2097:p
2093:=
2088:2
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1940:(
1885:ā
1847:)
1834:x
1819:t
1815:(
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1504:=
1499:n
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1162:d
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613:.
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157:(
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