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Talk:Vatteluttu

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1222:"Kucchawelli, 22 miles north of Trincomalee, on the sea side. There is a solitary rock inscription close to the sea which bears a fragment of an inscription in the characters of the seveth century. The country is now inhabited almost exclusively by Tamils, but that time must have been Sinhalese, as we can see not from this incription but also from the remains of a buddhist temple found at at Nattana kovil, about three miles west Nilawelli (8 miles from Trincomalee), and close to the bund of the Periyankulam tank. One or two other places north of Kuccawelli which are also said to contain buddistical remains, I was unfortunately not able to visit". 1295:@SriSuren - why isn't Manogaran a RS - because you say so or because he's a Tamil? Manogaran was a professor of geography at the University of Wisconsin-Parkside for 30 years. He has written many articles and two books on political geography and climatology. He has 1,560 entries on Google scholar and his work has been cited by well known historians such as K. M. de Silva, C. R. de Silva, Patrick Peebles and Kristian Stokke. I have no idea if he's right about the Vatteluttu alphabet but don't dismiss him just because he's saying something that goes against your own POV.-- 515: 248: 223: 177: 152: 106: 81: 50: 434: 458: 332: 294: 318: 505: 484: 342: 21: 410: 896: 1261:
Either I have to assume you are a no-good doing POV pusher, or you do not have thecredentials to read/comprehend proper English, which is more important to edit EN.Wiki more than anything else. In the article its mentioned that the Vattelutu alphabet evolved from Tamil-Brahmi. Aburd claims? Tamil and
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So the question is, is this guy an epigraphist? If so, what are his credentials? His claims of Brahmi evolving from Vatteluttu are not accepted by any scholar and Vattelluttu is only found from about the 5th - 6th century. Brahmi pre-dates that by many centuries. Well, I am not going to waste my time
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What are the credentials of Chelvadurai Manogaran? Is he an epigraphist or a linguist for his political pamphlet called "Untold story of ancient Tamils in Sri Lanka" to be used as a reference for a this and not the one given in Epigraphica Zeylanica Epigraphica Zeylanica III; pp. 158 - 163? Manogaran
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With all due respect, I am not here to rewrite history, but to present facts and change incorrect information just like you do. I admire your your interest in the various subjects, and do respect the time you have put over the years with your research work. Below are a list of some books which may be
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is a classification of writing scripts that contain curvy styled characters. These were used by the Dravidians of Southern India/ Sri Lanka and introduced to Southeast Asia over time. Grantha, Tamil, Malayalam, Khmer, Thai, etc. would fall under the classification of Vatteluttu since they contain the
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script, which resembles Hindi with a line over the top of the sentence. Once again, it were the Pallava kingdom of the Tamils along with their Brahmin priests who brought both Sanskrit and Tamil with them. Afterall, Tamil was the language they communicated in while Sanskrit was used by their priests
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mentions it in his work. So Austronesians from Indonesia initiated a trade flow between southern India and the Indonesian archipelago. Amongst "goods" they would bring back in their voyages were cultural elements, including the Sanskrit language (not Tamil), Indian religious concepts, and of course
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We have heard He is a historian who substantiates his facts with well-backed archaeological references. Read carefully, don't ramble. He states the Vatteletu evolved from Tamil-Brahmi and not the reverse, as you claim. The Brahmi script again was not only exclusive to Sanskrit. Tamil had a greater
694:("capital funds"), but these are much more recent borrowings than the Pallava script. Wolters and Manguin have shown the other way round, i. e. that part of the vocabulary related to sailing in languages of southern India have Austronesian origin, which makes sense since Austronesian were sailors. 1195:
As far as I can see you have no idea what you are talking about even, and a pamphlet of 80 pages, which is more or less a long essay of whining, complaining, blaming and baseless allegations can hardly be considered as having any academic value, other than documenting the whining
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was the Tamil script containing several added characters to be used to write Sanskritic words, with letters that are absent in spoken Tamil such as the letters ஜ (j), ஷ (ṣ), ஹ (h), க்ஷ (ks), just to name a few. The Grantha script would fall under the classification of Vatteluttu.
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literary culture in the pre 5th Century BCE than any other language in India(unless you can prove otherwise). And it is well and widely known Sanksrit borrowed its fundamental script and grammar from Tamil language, so however you may phrase it, your argument would seem invalid.
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discussing your absurd claims about Sanskrit borrowing its script and grammar from Tamil language, let alone it being well and widely known. Anyway the nature of this pamphalet and his political involvement in Tamil separatist agenda, makes him an unreliable source.
867:, or the history of cultures communicating and sharing influences with one another. I guess that explains similarities of cultures, languages, dance, and scripts in various parts of the world. Did you know the Sri Vijayan empire travelled as far as Madagascar? 828:
I have not stated "Malay language received a lot of Tamil influence". Please point that out where I have wrote that and I will take back what I said. Before posting something, I make sure to find at least one referenced source to tag along what I write.
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is an interesting book. I've learned from reading that there are Malay words in the Polynesian languages such as Tonga, Samoa, and Tahiti. An example would be Ikan for fish, is found in some of the Polynesian languages. One of my interests is in
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page. Don't get me wrong, this chart is nice, but can be made better. For those who are unfamiliar with these scripts, there needs to be more info showing which belongs to which classification of scripts. Also, wasn't the original name for Jawa
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does not say anything about Devanagari scripts. So, it would be proper to have a chart just showing the curvy Vatteluttu scripts of South and Southeast Asia. Perhaps, in the "See Also" section, there can be link leading the reader to the
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In an unfortunate situation, we have noticed several Tamil nationalists vandalising this page by removing Old Malayalam from the copper plate inscriptions from Kerala stating that Malayalam wasn't a language by then. Please refer to the
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Vetteluttu evolved because South Indians predominantly wrote on dried palm leaves and found that straight letters often cut through the veins of these leaves shortening the lifespa of the script. Circular letters work around this
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is a name of a a kingdom of present day Southern India which migrated, interacted, and traded in various parts of Southeast Asia. That is where the term Pallava script may have originated from. As a matter of fact what the
1274:, the Vattelutu script evolved from Tamil-Brahmi which was fundamentally common to almost all languages in South Asia, and as I said wahtever way you try to phrase it, you can't possibly make it sound otherwise.-- 673:
Pallavas did not "(carry) their writing system on their voyages to the east". Oliver W. Wolters of Cornell University and Pierre-Yves Manguin of Ecole Française d'Extrême Orient see evidences that it was
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No honesty? fake claims? Well, I don't subscribe to your preaching, maybe you should try a catherdal nearby. In any case they are highly fickle and not seem to be connected at all to what we have here.
918:. This chart is incorrectly presented. Reason being is while both Devanagari and Vatteluttu (Pallava) scripts are presented, there is a script being called "Devanagari" in the box. Also, the article on 1466: 1131: 1076:
I've removed the two photographs of inscriptions from the article based on an email clarification from Prof.Vijaya Venugopal (epigraphy) that those are not Vatteluttu. He also noted that
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So what is his reading and text? As for rambling, you are the one who is doing that, all over Knowledge - no sources, no honesty, no nothing, but wants to rewrite history, fake claims.
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And, you hearing that he is a historian doesn't help at Knowledge. For a source to be accepted as a reliable source, the scholar has to be an academic in the subject matter.
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is also claiming that the Brahmi script used all over India is derived from Vatteluttu, which is not acceptable, as Vatteluttu first apears around the 5th-6th century (See
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was a term used by European historians of their version of categorization of Vatteluttu scripts taken from the Pallava kingdom of the Tamils and latter Telugus.
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As you've stated, "early Indonesian inscriptions were written in Sanskrit, not Tamil". I agree. However, there seems to be a confusion between
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The word "Pallava" was used by European "scholars" to generically categorize the curvy writings found in Southeast Asia. As a matter of fact,
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Pallava is not the same as Vatteluttu. Compare the inscription image in the article with this article on Pallava script on Omniglot.com:
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It is not correct to state that "Malay language (...) received a lot of Tamil influence". You do have a few Tamil words in Malay, like
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Sanskrit literary traditions existed in the mainland for several centuries before even languages like Prakrit was vocally spoken.
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Sanskrit or Sanskritised to an enormous extent, perhaps seventy percent or more. Let Kuchaveli have been inhabited by even the
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If you are referring to the indigenous peoples of Australia, then you are correct. Dravidians are aboriginals of South Asia.
936:? Do you know who created this chart? Perhaps we could put together a better chart. Let me know what you think. Regards. 419: 304: 61: 1056:
Currently, the infobox and the bolded part of the title say the former, so I feel like it really should be moved... --
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The Dravidian project is a nice one. It deserves more accuracy, especially with regard to other people's culture! :-)
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Please give references from a third party reliable source, that this inscription is in Vatelluttu, before reverting.
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who sailed westwards, maybe as early as the 4th century BC, looking for new markets for their products, including
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As a research worker, I think an encyclopedia must be as close as possible to the present state of knowledge.
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script, which makes sense since, at least in the case of early Indonesian inscriptions, these are written in
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Hai...Isnt it zha used there?????So isnt i more sensible to use he title vattezhuttu than vatteluttu?????
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Likewise, I am here to communicate and interchange historical information with those interested. Regards.
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This is a screenshot of the text and reading from Epigraphica Zeylanica, Vol III. Does it sound Tamil?
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be used to write Sanskrit? Please learn some basics before reverting and editing these articles.
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wrote in the Tamil script. So, if one historian wants, he or she could also call Vatteluttu a
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linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check
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interested in improving the encyclopaedic coverage and content of articles relating to
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when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an
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for rituals. But, the curvy Vatteluttu script was used to wright both languages.
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The Indonesian Language: Its history and role in modern society - James Sneddon
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This is what Edward Müller writes about the Kuccaveli inscription in his
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The Politics of Expansion: The Chola Conquest of Sri Lanka and Sri Vijaya
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page to understand it better. We must keep an eye out for such vandals.
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on Knowledge. If you would like to help out, you are welcome to drop by
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Below this chart states "Examples of various scripts derived from the
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That this article is linked to from the image description page.
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The Indonesian Language: Its history and role in modern society
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South Indian Influences in the Far East - K.A. Nilakanta Sastri
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curvy characters. Please take note that I am talking about the
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Chelvadurai Manogaran and Vatteluttu and Kuccaveli inscription
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The following chart has been removed for further discussion:
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on the image's description page for the use in this article.
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Pallava script, Grantha script, Vatteluttu - which is which?
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Pallavas of Kanchi in South-East Asia - Suki Subramaniam
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765: 761: 756: 749: 747: 745: 744:Pandya script 741: 737: 733: 729: 724: 716: 711: 709: 708: 704: 700: 695: 693: 688: 685: 681: 677: 676:Austronesians 671: 669: 665: 661: 656: 650: 648: 647: 644: 638: 630: 628: 627: 624: 620: 615: 614: 611: 607: 600: 597:Merging with 596: 581: 577: 571: 568: 567: 564: 547: 543: 539: 535: 531: 530: 522: 516: 511: 509: 506: 502: 501: 497: 491: 488: 485: 481: 468: 459: 455: 454: 450: 447:(assessed as 446: 445: 435: 431: 430: 426: 423:(assessed as 422: 421: 411: 407: 406: 402: 398: 392: 389: 388: 385: 368: 367: 362: 358: 357: 349: 338: 336: 333: 329: 328: 324: 310: 306: 301: 298: 295: 291: 279: 262: 261: 256: 252: 249: 245: 244: 240: 235: 230: 227: 224: 220: 208: 191: 190: 185: 181: 178: 174: 173: 169: 164: 159: 156: 153: 149: 137: 120: 119: 114: 110: 107: 103: 102: 98: 93: 88: 85: 82: 78: 73: 69: 63: 55: 51: 46: 45: 37: 33: 29: 25: 22: 18: 17: 1392: 1384: 1361: 1345: 1339: 1322:Cite error: 1317: 1309: 1296: 1260: 1256: 1221: 1220: 1128: 1093: 1075: 1036: 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668:Sanskrit 621:uthu? -- 467:May 2012 260:inactive 234:inactive 189:inactive 163:inactive 118:inactive 92:inactive 28:deletion 1196:itself. 1179:WP:RELY 1058:V2Blast 934:Carakan 760:scripts 736:Pandyas 664:Grantha 578:on the 399:on the 1272:Batman 1082:Sundar 1072:Images 1015:Arvind 801:script 793:script 732:Cholas 680:cloves 305:Kerala 64:scale. 1326:Staal 1041:KUMAR 692:modal 658:The " 610:Polar 372:India 361:India 300:India 1404:talk 1277:CuCl 1246:talk 1157:CuCl 1144:talk 1110:talk 1062:talk 1038:ARUN 1019:talk 998:. -- 942:talk 930:Kawi 914:and 903:and 889:Hi, 876:talk 791:and 734:and 703:talk 532:, a 36:keep 34:was 1181:, 1044:P.R 742:or 570:Mid 391:Low 1418:: 1406:) 1332:). 1248:) 1146:) 1116:) 1112:• 1064:) 1021:) 944:) 878:) 766:. 746:. 705:) 619:zh 451:). 427:). 307:/ 303:: 1402:( 1279:2 1244:( 1209:: 1159:2 1142:( 1108:( 1060:( 1017:( 940:( 874:( 701:( 582:. 548:. 469:. 403:. 369:. 263:. 236:) 232:( 192:. 165:) 161:( 121:. 94:) 90:( 70:: 38:.

Index

Articles for deletion
deletion
the discussion

content assessment
WikiProjects
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Dravidian civilizations
inactive
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WikiProject Dravidian civilizations
inactive
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Tamil civilization
inactive
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WikiProject Tamil civilization
inactive
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Tamil Eelam
inactive
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WikiProject Tamil Eelam
inactive
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India
Kerala
Tamil Nadu
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India portal

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