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reliable secondary source I have read. As it stands, this is the only reliable secondary source Small seems to be able to provide to even conceivably support the first part of the assertion, but it isn't all that explicit in context. Given his comments about "rocking the system" and "not knowing how to judge me" in the context of discussing whether his work is considered art by critics, the mention of porn there should not be treated as some sort of admission to being a porn star.--
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recent past. The Jimbo issue is not resolved (though I am pleased that the suggested image is not the Jimbo portrait). Russavia is likely to face further sanction, to judge from NYB's talk page, and this article will not be stable for a while. This nomination should not be approved until the furore over Jimbo's image, the commons deletion debate, and the controversy over NYB's and
Russavia's actions are all resolved, and then the article has time to stabilise.
444:. The article should presumably have been moved with the history of its creation intact, which is not the case. Given that previous content in the incubating article has already resulted in a topic ban for Russavia, any decision about placing a link to it on the main page with an image should have a delay of at least a week (or possibly longer) to allow other editors to express their opinions. It is unclear whether this article was created to make a
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1232:"I have just finished a 4 day Sexpo in Australia and I will be going to Macau in a few days to paint at the Asian Adult Expo and then to Taiwan for another 4 day show then one in South Africa Spain and Germany I am pretty busy. And I have spent the past 7 years doing this so it feels really natural to be the only person naked holding my penis in a hall with 5 or 10 thousand other fully clothed normal people."
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flickr's own safe viewing and protection policies. Those policies are far more careful and finely judged than those of
Commons. Because of that I believe that if there is a hook (possibly with less "in your face" wording), there should be no accompanying image. It is unclear how stable the article will be, since at one stage it contained an image and content related to
831:, he was in a men's bathroom when he had the idea of sliding his penis across the dry stainless steel urinal and made a smiley face. After this, he bought some easels and paint, dipped his penis into the paint, and then started painting. He noted that after 30 seconds, due to the motion of moving his penis over the rough surface of the canvas, he gained an
1939:
Given the back-and-forth above. What would the protocol be for an April 1 nomination. Do I make that before the three days or after. I am not sure if there are policy issues to be addressed or if this is just an issue regarding the propriety of the subject. I am on record saying that simply reopening
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I just know that this has been around a while and been through extensive discussions. If you don't feel like it can attain support for a regular nomination you should go for April 1. If you want someone else to handle that nomination, I will do it. If this is not going to be a regular DYK nom, go for
1770:
Not at all. This nom almost got closed out the other day. At the DYK talk page I was suggesting that this be reopened as a discussion about an April 1 nomination. It seems to be unable to get support for a regular nomination, but this type of topic would fit right in with the main page on April 1, if
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article is very short, full of smutty puns. But the use of "adult shows" by Patch himself is in an indication that this is not safe material for DYK. Most of the "meticulous sourcing" claimed by
Russavia does not bear close scrutiny. It is a BLP cobbled or patched together from interviews. That makes
1291:
there is a short entry: "Patch, Tim (Australia). Contemporary builder and painter based in
Brisbane. He has been called 'Pricasso' because he creates paintings of landscapes, portraits, and female nudes using his penis as a brush." There are no proper independent recent sources. The BBC source relied
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Supplementary rule D6 states "The article is likely to be rejected for unresolved edit-warring or the presence of dispute tags. (Removing the tags without consensus does not count.)" Once the history is restored, it will be clear that there has been edit warring and protection of this article in its
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I think
Mathsci is correct. After 7 or 8 weeks with no consensus, there is little reason to resume the same discussion. That is why I proposed reopening the discussion as a consideration of this article for April 1 when WP avails a host of odd subjects on the main page. Reopening the prior stalemate
1336:, I have never been awarded a grant and have entered many art compertitions but never won any . I have sold thousands of paintings but probably would not have sold to much without also becoming a soft porn star which might be a contributing factor of why I feel they dont really know how to judge me.
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No one is going to ignore the preponderance of reliable sources describing him as an artist and relabel him a porn star as that would violate WP:BLP. Your evidence of him being a "porn star" or "porn star wannabe" is a poem and a misrepresented quotation. That is nowhere near enough. I asked you to
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I would note that the editor who added the tag insists, based off a single misrepresented comment in a source, that the subject is a porn star and not an artist, ignoring the multitude of other sources that plainly state he is an artist. Anyone can tag an article with any absurd excuse, and this is
1425:
Just to be clear A) Russavia's "vote" doesn't count, in fact somebody needs to step up to fill his place as the nominal "nominator" - who is that? B) It's this page that counts for DYK, there are discussion on this spread across at least 3 pages. Anybody who wants to weigh in on the DYK can do it
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a porn star or stop bringing it up. Should you assert again that he is a porn star without providing such a source, then I will report you at ANI for violating WP:BLP. You are free to your opinion, but your opinion is not fact and you have not shown any indication that said opinion is supported by
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Unless we are talking about someone with a paint fetish, then this doesn't qualify as "pornography" by any means. Given that his whole method is built around his penis, it is relevant and informative to note certain foreseeable issues he encounters. Whether the wording could be further improved, I
1810:
The close was correct. Reopening discussion will only waste more volunteer time. The intention of the original DYK has not altered: it was to bring en.wikipedia into disrepute. Not only has the original creator
Russavia been indefinitely blocked, but, because of inappropriate comments on his user
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The Devil's
Advocate is pretty aggressive in saying he's not a porn performer. He's seen this before but denies that it (and Pricasso) says that Pricasso is a porn performer. "I have sold thousands of paintings but probably would not have sold to much without also becoming a soft porn star which
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is not relevant here, due to there not being a distasteful image as part of the hook, and the article is about an artist, who just happens to paint with his penis. I have NO DOUBT that if this article is made the lead hook that it could possibly be one of the highest viewed DYKS of all time. I'll
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even if he is a "porn star"? Don't porn stars also deserve their right to notability? And certainly this "porn star' would qualify as notable... Look at the media coverage this "porn star" has got! I see no problem with the neutrally written and reliably referenced biography of this "porn star".
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Mind you, Small is not only insisting
Pricasso is a porn star, but that he is not even an artist. However, the very source being cited starts out by calling Pricasso an artist and he explicitly refers to himself as an artist and calls his work art with that being the description favored by every
619:
His site contains videos and such. The only adult imagery in the article is him holding his penis so that he can paint, but the paint obscures his genitals to the point where you can only really tell if you look at the enlarged versions of the image. Not an issue in my opinion. You can find more
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It's the 2nd time you've asked this, so I think you deserve an answer, but also deserve to know why this question could be seen as offensive. You're asking whether I will follow policy - do you have any reason to believe that I won't? AGF, please. You also seem to be asking whether the other
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A lot of
Artists only exist from being awarded grants paid for by the tax payer because their work is considered exceptional by a small number of Art experts which I guess is fine as it’s all part of the system as I do believe Art is a business dependent mainly upon rising prices and I rock the
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I do not see how the image can be used on the main page. Clicking on the image, uploaded by
Russavia, leads to the Commons file page with its link to the original on flickr. But on flickr an account is required to view this image and possibly any image related to Pricasso, presumably because of
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Despite pruning, the article is still poorly written and poorly sourced. There is too much reporting of non-events in the article (e.g. unsuccessful entries in competitions, Patch's activities as a builder). A lot of the content is not neutrally written, with uncritical and direct reporting of
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I cannot see any particular consensus at the moment. I see Newyorkbrad suggesting that pushing this article as a DYK os not a good idea. One problem with the article is that the novelty of Patch's artworks seems to have dwindled lately. Outside the world of Australian Sexpo and other soft porn
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Since the nominator has been indefinitely blocked, who is taking his place? there is almost always some back-and-forth between the nominator and commenters usually resulting in some adjustments in the article or hook. I'd like the responsible person to make adjustments to 1) the name of the
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Google search "Pricasso Porn" 185,000 hits, "Pricasso artist" 53,000 hits. Essentially all the articles on him are about Sexpo or similar exhibitions. He performs for 20 minutes for $ 50-100, includes a video, and btw includes a canvas with paint on it. No way he is an artist and nobody is
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that he could see himself getting paid to create art if he was able to get better and quicker, and liked the idea of being paid for doing the three things he liked most: creating art, being naked and holding his penis, noting that he would have to control his erections to achieve his goal.
604:, which is linked to in the article. The first thing you see there is: "STOP By entering my website you agree you're 18+". I believe the artist would not be comfortable with being featured on Knowledge's main page, which is visited by millions of school kids much younger than 18 years old.
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It isn't even a huge dispute. The whole thing is terribly petty at this point as the link to the Commons cat doesn't even have the image pictured. You have to go through another link to get to the image. As this is the only issue, it should be given time to be sorted out. We aren't going
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adults, writing on behalf of the straw man 8-yearold. This article is undoubtedly educational, and the subject, amusingly notable. Really, let's not get out of whack over this. It's quite mild, comparing to what else an 8-yearold might encounter on Knowledge.
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doesn't say it, but I don't personally think that anything blatantly offensive (say, um, an article of a picture of a guy painting with his p*n*s) should be linked to from a main page (imagine some 8-year-old clicks on it (many will, no doubt), and encounters
660:(and a green flag for those looking at DYK and seeing this thing that wouldn't look too out of place if the date were 04/01/2014). Aside from that, and this Jimbo portrait controversy that I've been reading about, I see nothing wrong with the article in its
436:. The creation history of the file is not accessible to non-administrators, since Russavia requested that the two pages in his user space be deleted. None of that history is viewable. Nor the fact that at a certain stage the article was fully protected by
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talk page, talk page access has very recently been revoked. The nomination was opened two months ago so the close was timely. The many problems with the article have not gone away. It was not dropped as a possible DYK because of some small technicality.
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A big reason the discussion has lasted as long as it has is because we had to wait for the RfC to establish something with regards to the Commons link. Since it is a clear stalemate on that point we can move on and address other concerns about the
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The RfC has failed to get a consensus on the link, which means the link to Commons is staying out for now. So, the main reason for editors objecting to the nomination has been addressed. I will try to begin resolving the concerns BM raised
1470:
the article is really not going anywhere. Per criterion D6, we don't feature articles with huge disputes, and the dispute on Pricasso is apparently so huge that the article got full-protected. So can someone maybe close this?
535:
Russavia, did you at any point in your correspondence with the artist promise him with (or strongly hint at) an appearance of his article on the main page, perhaps in exchange for the creation of freely licensed media?
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the article hard to distinguish from a promotional piece—free publicity through wikipedia. Several sources, including the dictionary above, describe Patch as a builder. That is not properly discussed in the article.
1308:
Mathsci, I meant on the question of artist v. porn star, though of course consensus will also determine whether or not a main page appearance happens. I think the consensus on the artist question is pretty clear.
1284:. He has posted the Jimmy Wales video there and writes, "I started painting naked using my Penis as a brush in 2005 and now travel around the world performing at adult shows, parties and clubs." His entries for the
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So of course there's some pornography in the article. Besides that kind of painting is an unsafe sexual practice, and I am almost positive there will be a backlash, if this "Fucking article" as Newyorkbrad
254:
Please note that I am still working some on the article, but in mainspace, but as with all of my articles they are meticulously sourced so please do not worry about this aspect of it still being worked on.
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If you can't understand 2 direct quotes from the subject or the obvious reality of his videos, then there is no point discussing it further. As far as me approving this for inclusion in DYK, no way.
1970:
Some of the issues Blue Moonset raised were actually addressed before this closed. I have handled the close paraphrasing I could identify and have made an effort to balance the article a bit.--
766:) with the edit summary "One of the images has caused an editor here to claim that it constitutes Hostile environment sexual harassment. Don't become a part of that," been re-added by
1823:
is not likely to lead anywhere. If people agree that the prior close was valid, then I think it would be best to open a new discussion regarding making this article an April 1 hook.--
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440:. Jimmy Wales found the content relating to himself offensive and harassing. As a consequence, per BLP policies, Russavia was topic banned from all matters related to Jimmy Wales by
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article, which has been changed; 2) the use of the term "artist" when he is clearly a porn show performer; and 3) "gained fame" in the hook, when it should be "gained notoriety."
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Patch's own statements in interviews. Much of the tone seems promotional. The quality of the prose is very variable, with some parts perhaps reflecting too closely the original
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The editing history of the article, together with the deleted drafts, has now been restored by The ed17. The article itself currently has the template {{underconstruction}}.
694:, you'll note that I am not commenting on whether the image should be removed from the article and the policy has nothing to do with the main page. I will also point you to
796:) with the edit summary "we're not linking to the problematic image that started this mess in the first place." This article is not presently stable. There is debate at
2086:
The Devil's Advocate, How about you give yourself a reasonable deadline and then just resubmit this as an April Fools only nomination. Maybe even close this out and open
1999:
I personally find it a waste of time to have such a long nomination period over one fact on the main page, but a new reviewer is needed to identify any other problems.
1288:(2011-2013) do not seem to have received any significant media coverage. On page 231 of the Dictionary of Erotic Art: Painters and Sculptors by Eugene C. Burt (2010),
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improved upon it a bit from what it was previously, is a separate issue. I think some of the prose could be developed further before considering a front page entry.--
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Closer's note: I changed the hook wording of penis and scrotum to genitals because I want to avoid a big controversy over having those words on the main page.
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1123:*seriously* calling him an artist. He is a porn performer. Presenting him in the article and in the hook as an artist is just misleading our readers.
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He's a porn star wanabee and has said so directly more than once. He works almost exclusively at Sexpo's and similar venues. Don't ignore reality.
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Supplementary rule D6 relates to "unresolved edit-warring." Within the last six hours, the contentious link to the Jimbo image has been removed by
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I am not associating myself with this nomination anymore because of this reason and because I don't want to be hounded about an April Fools hook.
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You know, it is not the children who get bent out of shape when they see a penis, especially a penis put to use as a painting brush, but rather
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The point about the claims about this person being a pornstar is that the article presents him as an artist, which is misleading. Also, see
656:. I think the mere mentioning of "penis, scrotum, and buttocks" should be enough of a red flag about not clicking on this article if you're
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from 2013, he states he is 63. I've still got more sources to scour for information, but I don't recall any giving an actual date of birth.
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as a special case asking for support/oppose from all concerned. It could point to here and to the prior RFC wherever that is archived.--
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about notability and an AfD is possible. I think the article is likely to run at some point, but it is not ready to be promoted yet.
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I am giving this three more days for any remaining concerns to be addressed. If they are not addressed, I will close this nomination.
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on the Commons link issue. When that concludes, presumably resolving the main problem, I will be happy to handle the other issues.--
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to the picture... I did not think that he would actually smear paint on those parts. But I have to admit, it's very well-written. ☯
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Ok, let me make this perfectly clear, either you provide a reliable secondary source that explicitly and unequivocally says he
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Do you often visit shows and events to paint pictures in front of the audience. You do not feel embarrassed about it ?
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Seriously, the guys who want to fail this are just pissed off at Pricasso for painting a majestic portrait of Dear Founder
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Not sure what the point of that would be as I believe I have done sufficient work to address the remaining concerns.--
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He does not even say he is a porn star in the poem, which shouldn't be taken literally in the first place as it is a
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conventions, there seems to be very little recent coverage in reliable sources. He advertises his services on vimeo,
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Note: I'm not saying the article itself should be censored, just that maybe it shouldn't really be on the main page.
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Smallbones, if the consensus here and at the article talk page is different from your view, will you accept it?
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Proposing this as an alternative to make it more hooky and reflect something beyond a simple "x is y" factoid.--
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I don't see how an article with this many problems in its current version can be approved at the present time.
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Youtube is not the source, the source is Metropolis TV, which is reliable, it's just that it's a video source.
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sources: "one celebrity was OK with it," "Pricasso hit back," "a canvass which concealed his brush," etc.
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698:. While not exactly the same thing, the subject of that thread and this controversy are fairly similar.
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editors on this page can understand 2 direct quotes - I see no reason to believe that they can't.
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Here is what the source says with the important parts Smallbones has consistently left out in bold:
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report back in a day or two on progress, as I am still adding information, etc to the article.
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The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below.
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Art Critics consider your work seriously ? They consider your painting as an Art ?
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If this fails to get a regular nomination, I encourge you to pursue an April 1 nomination.--
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I have re-opened the discussion because of what The Devil's Advocate said on my talk page.
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Or just google "Pricasso porn" - half the sites say they are selling Pricasso porn videos.
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is the explicit portrayal of sexual subject matter for the purpose of sexual gratification.
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might be a contributing factor of why I feel they dont really know how to judge me."
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Well, let me put it this way: I just do not think that posting the hook "... that
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Before reading the source, I thought he painted paintings with a little something
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as
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Let's get it over and done with, new hook cited and online, all reference to
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I honestly cannot figure out whether that was a sarcastic comment or not. --
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Wikipedia_talk:Did_you_know/Archive_34#Pornography-related_articles_on_DYK
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See my comment above. That image is not even close to being an issue.--
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The article is now locked down, following apparent edit-warring.
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Just to notify you all at DYK: Russavia has just been indeffed by
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O.K. if this gets closed out unsuccessfully, then you can create
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supposed to be tabulating your company's profits for this month
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explicit depictions of genitalia in sex education textbooks.--
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Template:Did you know nominations/Pricasso (April Fools' Day)
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Template:Did you know nominations/Pricasso (April Fools' Day)
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I'd never take a sickly and I’d work for very little pay ...
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here. I'll deal with the article page when I have time.
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Regardless of whether it's pornography or not, it fails
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and some of the borderline pornographic prose removed.
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I will not do a full review, but here are two comments:
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Somewhere I am suppose to note what article I reviewed:
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I'd love to be a porn star --now that would make my day
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the same nomination was not likely to lead anywhere.--
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on the article indicates a dispute if anything does.
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stop repeating this accusation and yet you continue.--
1621:'s review of the article's current state on June 30:
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who has gained fame for painting portraits with his
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Is YouTube a reliable source (especially for a BLP)?
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who has gained fame for painting portraits with his
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246:). Self nominated at 23:20, 18 June 2013 (UTC)
945:just an instance of that ability being misused.--
470:The article is not stable. It has been moved to
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268:Template:Did you know nominations/Darrell Tryon
781:) as an unexplained revert, and re-removed by
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1177:he's a pornstar. See the quoted poem above.
974:http://www.pricasso.com/pricassos_poetry.html
283:Is there any source for the age of this man?
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684:What about the apparently explicit image at
49:No further edits should be made to this page
1572:WP:Did_you_know/Supplementary_guidelines#D6
652:This entire article is a clear-cut case of
386:OK, maybe I'm going out on a limb here as
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1771:it can't get support for a regular run.--
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2223:Passed DYK nominations from June 2013
602:Here's the link to the artist website
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520:Knowledge talk:Did you know#Pricasso
817:" Here's a quote from the article:
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581:and there's now a discussion on
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2007:) 04:52, 17 August 2013 (UTC)
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1523:) 02:30, 27 June 2013 (UTC)
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80:10:19, 20 August 2013 (UTC)
45:Knowledge talk:Did you know
37:this nomination's talk page
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1656:) 18:34, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
1563:☯ 13:28, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
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933:The tag has been removed.
901:supplementary criterion D6
428:02:30, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
411:01:47, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
300:00:33, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
1515:the request for closure.
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518:I have begun a thread at
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152:Find sources (notability)
127:Earwig's Copyvio Detector
1689:16:45, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
1597:13:58, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
827:Some weeks after seeing
753:Delicious carbuncle
522:. Comment is invited.
1276:giving his location as
41:the article's talk page
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1278:Gold Coast, Queensland
1145:any reliable source.--
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913:tag on the article.
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813:@DA, Pornography is "
142:A Simple Word Counter
122:Reviewer instructions
2128:The Devil's Advocate
2063:The Devil's Advocate
2040:who paints with his
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2157:TonyTheTiger
2155:or I will.--
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1633:gutter press
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1576:{{
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1542:Jimmy Wales
1488:anywhere.--
692:WP:CENSORED
434:Jimmy Wales
324:What about
157:Hook length
108:DYK toolbox
2174:WP:CHICAGO
2109:WP:CHICAGO
2034:(pictured)
1959:WP:CHICAGO
1909:WP:CHICAGO
1862:article.--
1842:WP:CHICAGO
1790:WP:CHICAGO
1749:WP:CHICAGO
1707:tonight.--
1579:Pp-dispute
1451:Smallbones
1428:Smallbones
1411:Smallbones
1384:Smallbones
1369:Smallbones
1239:Smallbones
1125:Smallbones
1077:Smallbones
1040:(pictured)
1013:Smallbones
988:Porn star
587:Tom Morris
288:The Legend
207:(pictured)
87:Rcsprinter
65:Rcsprinter
2178:WP:WAWARD
2113:WP:WAWARD
2027:... that
1963:WP:WAWARD
1913:WP:WAWARD
1846:WP:WAWARD
1794:WP:WAWARD
1753:WP:WAWARD
1551:The Clown
1457:smalltalk
1434:smalltalk
1417:smalltalk
1375:smalltalk
1245:smalltalk
1131:smalltalk
1083:smalltalk
1019:smalltalk
562:The Clown
472:Tim Patch
393:this file
200:... that
132:QPQ check
117:DYK check
95:(chatter)
73:(chatter)
2217:Category
2050:buttocks
2030:Pricasso
1395:contribs
1282:Brisbane
1056:buttocks
1036:Pricasso
851:calls it
837:Fala Fil
833:erection
794:contribs
779:contribs
764:contribs
446:WP:POINT
426:Mareklug
377:Russavia
309:Russavia
295:of Zorro
272:Russavia
257:Russavia
240:Russavia
223:buttocks
203:Pricasso
168:Pricasso
58:promoted
2170:WP:FOUR
2105:WP:FOUR
2046:scrotum
1955:WP:FOUR
1905:WP:FOUR
1838:WP:FOUR
1813:Mathsci
1808:Comment
1786:WP:FOUR
1745:WP:FOUR
1704:Comment
1619:Mathsci
1556:\(^_^)/
1548:Bonkers
1517:Mathsci
1513:support
1386: (
1299:Mathsci
1294:The Sun
1052:scrotum
935:Optimom
785: (
770: (
755: (
662:current
567:\(^_^)/
559:Bonkers
549:Comment
476:Mathsci
461:Mathsci
450:Mathsci
219:scrotum
2140:cntrb.
2075:cntrb.
1986:cntrb.
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1723:cntrb.
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1667:an RfC
1504:cntrb.
1399:EdChem
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1311:EdChem
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1213:cntrb.
1161:cntrb.
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883:cntrb.
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798:WT:DYK
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735:cntrb.
690:As to
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