2070:, as "Indo-European" ones). Furthermore an "Indo-European" classification (which would be made entirely based on the language-group), containing only the European IE-speaking traditions (and not the broader Indian, Iranian, Anatolian, Tocharian and other IE religions) would make little sense. It seems to me that the better classification woulde be a continental one, including IE-speaking and non-IE speaking European religious traditions, which are still distinctly European, though, in essence. A further problem with basing the religious classification on language-groups is that things like the Jamaican Maroon religion, mentioned in the template, would count as "Indo-European traditions" as the Jamaicans speak a language from the Indo-European branch (English creole). I see no problem in applying the same "continental criteria" to African religions, including the North African Berber religion (and also Egyptian, Ethiopian & others). Please don't forget to make the appropriate adjustments when the discussion is finished.
2117:
language-groups too? Have a Niger-Congo, Nilotic, Semitic (Horn of Africa & Ethiopia) and Berber categories rather than an unified
African one? Should we also add the African diasporic religions, such as not only Jamaican Maroon, but others such as Candomblé, Santería, Vodun, etc. to the Indo-European category too, since its belivers mostly entirely speak Indo-European derived languages (Brazilian Portuguese, Spanish, French Creole, etc.)? That would be a huge blow to the general quality and accuracy of the template for the sake of precisely meeting criteria for criteria's sake. That seems to go against the general purpose of informing people.
2233:, I propose to discuss the various issues separately: "the naming of Indo-European category, the separation of North Africa and Sub Saharan Africa, and should religions of Asia be cluster together under an Asia banner." Plus, the place of neo-Paganism and ethnic religions. Let me note, in advance, that I'm afraid there's no single, logical way to structure this template. Abrahamic and Indian religions refer to historical developments; Austroasiatic, Chinese, etc. refer to geographical boundaries. But it seems logical to me to follow the structure of
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all one including other regional religions. He also separated
Traditional African Religions into North and Sub-Saharan Africa seeing it as a major difference instead of religions of a continent. The only religion on the North Africa line was Berber and since it wasn't broken up into the 5 parts of Africa, (North, Southern, East, West, and Center), Berber should be included as it is on the Traditional African page.
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1969:, can you say something here about the reversions going on? I agree with Doremon that Indo-European is the established category. WP is not the place for redefining these categories and creating new ones based on personal opinion. It's only for documenting them. Recategorizing them according to personal opinion or independent research could be considered
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1990:
It seems
CaptainKaptain assumed that Indo-European meant India and Europe from lines he stated, "Indo-European religious category without Indian religions makes no sense & is, thus, just European." Which disregards the term Indo-European and instead tries to infer European religions category is
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has a subdivision of
Central Africa, East Africa, Horn of Africa, North Africa, South Africa, West Africa, African diapsora. Makes sense to me; northern Africa is mediterrenean, and closely connected with southern Europe and the Middle East, while the Sahara forms a significant natural border with
2211:
First-time ever I see the term "Indo-European religions" being used in such a way. It refers to the (reconstructed, hypothetical) religion of the proto-Indo-Europeans; to use it to group present-day religions is absurd. The term "European" seems to refer to various strands of neo-Paganism (and are
2009:
on the template under "Recent"). That whole line should be deleted from the template and those few entries that aren't already in "recent" can be moved there or deleted as too minor to appear here. Dividing North and Sub-Saharan Africa leaves a lot of blank space and means that we lose the link to
2005:"Indo-European religions" is not really a thing and it certainly doesn't make sense to have a category labelled thus that excludes Hittite, Iranian, German, Norse, Greek, Roman etc. religions. In fact, all of the religions linked to in that category are branches of Neo-Paganism (most of which are
2116:
I understand that it is important to establish criteria and stick to it. But in that case, the result of the criteria is utterly absurd. Where would the Non-Indo-European speaking
European religions such as Basque, Circassian, etc. be classified? Should we split African ethnic religions along
2065:
in Europe. However, not only did he forgot to remove several non-IE-speaking ethnic religions from the category (such as Uralic, Circassian, etc.), but the whole "Indo-European" classification for religious traditions doesn't make much sense to begin with, as certain non-IE-speaking
European
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A friend of mine is librarian; no matter how she sorts her books at home, she always has some books that defy the classification, which she finds very frustrating. I love it; sort of 'nature defies human systematization'. Some sort of 'freedom peeping out from whatever systematizatiin'.
2153:, split the religions into language-group classifications (such as Tibeto-Burmese, Japanese, Tai and Miao, etc.). The same could, theoretically be done to the European (splitting into "Indo-European" - including the Afro-American diasporic religions, "Basque", "Caucasian" and "Uralic"
2320:. Ethnic religions and NRM can be grouped as well, but I've had enough for the moment; the accolades are dancing before my eyes. And I screwed-up the make-up somewhat: some of the thick white lines disappeared. Does anybody else know how to fix that? Regards,
2544:
It's clear that most of these topics are about neo-Paganism, which is mentioned under "recent," while Adyghe Xabze is an ethnic religion, and
Hellenism is a historic religion. And why are these links piped (that's the correct term, isn't it?).
2378:
19 may 2021 CaptainKaptain, "European group includes
Circassian, Uralic and others who are not Indo-European speakers. Plus Indo-European speaking groups such as Indians are listed under the Dharmic religions category & so forth."; changed
2629:
include other religous grouping outside
Chinese, Indian, Japanese, and Korean. Some groupings are in the Ethnic and Indigenous grouping, and that what makes it more complicated. Nepalese, Vietnamese, Philippines, and
2212:
also mentioned under "Recent"), and some original native religions (which belong to (Other ethnic"). The Abkhaz people most certainly are not IE. And the common name for "Dharmic religions" is "Indian religions."
2028:
I suggested that in the discussion above to remove the ones that are already label under the
Historical category, but if they are also labeled in Recent i don't see why not the removal. The
2061:
reverted the "European" classification into "Indo-European" perhaps due to being more accustomed to the term (as you also mentioned being), which is used to refer to the dominant
2135:, which is a religious scholar but also a proponent of Indo-European studies. I don't think that source would be strictly neutral, in that regard. Anyway, something to consider.
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I've vreated several subgroups now; I wasn't able yet to fihure out how the thick lines will appear; and the alignment still sucks too. But I'll try to fix those problems.
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21 may 2021 Doreman764, "Uralic added back as a catagory different from Indo European"; moved several neo-Paganistic movements and ethnic religions to a new group of
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2652:, we'll have to resort all the links again; a lot would go under "Ethnic religions," I suppose. And "Ethnic religions" would still have a geographical subdivision.
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20 may 2021 Doremon764, "The Religious studies category is known as Indo-European and is focused on that region which differs from Indian and Iranian Religions"
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religious traditions, such as Basques, Uralics (which are entirely native to Europe) and Circassians can only be classified as "European" religious traditions (
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I personally believe that not all religions considered Indo-European should be so. But that's personal opinion. On WP we go with the sources. Language
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that category) if one is going to stick to classifying religious traditions according to culture groups based on language groups alone as a criteria.
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Lingayat is already there. Ganapatya can't be under Shaivism. It's in the list linked to at the end, not sure whether a specific entry is needed.
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Should we remove religions that are listed on the Historical Religion from the Major religious groups and denominations. So there is one of each?
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has the main category of "Eastern religions," with a subdivision into "East Asian religions" and "Indian religions." Seems reasonable to me.
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2099:. We should stick with the language categories. It doesn't matter whether or not we personally think we have a better idea. -
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how cultures are generally grouped. So when you say, "...would make little sense. It seems to me..." - that is your opinion/
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There are no borders between the sub-navboxes in the section "Major religious groups and denominations; how do I fix that?
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may have the answers. The thick line has to do with "border"; it is set as "none" when using a child navbox. Regards,
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2779:. You might also consider pinging some of the other contributors to this template to see if they can help. –
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I don't agree. Creating a whole Asian section and separation religion s by Contintents gets messy because of
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How can I set the various cells to the same width? See Middel eastern, eastern, etc.
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Some of the Religions are listed on both list, while other religions are not.
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2775:, the best place to ask for help with template formatting is probably the
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226:-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us
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Oh, and PS: the main source that seems to be utilized in the template is
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The naming of Indo-European category - neo-Paganism and ethnic religions
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Should religions of Asia be cluster together under an Asia banner
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Yeah, it will never be smooth... As for this box, if we follow
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1873:/East Asian Religions Section right under Dharmic religions.
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Since Kaumaram was there, adding Ganapatya seems right.
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The term Middle Easter Religions or Western Religions
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The separation of North Africa and Sub Saharan Africa
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2688:. One describes a region the other is about culture.
2383:(links to Indo-European languages!) into "European."
2730:, contact the responding user(s) directly on their
2316:I've tried to re-arrange the subboxes in line with
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2802:Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2022
2014:, so doesn't seem like an improvement to me.
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2575:(linking to "Traditional African religions")
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2606:List of religions and spiritual traditions
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2030:List of religions and spiritual traditions
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1945:Reverting each other, Indo-European, etc
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2239:Major religious groups#Classification
275:Proposed a modification as follows *
212:This template is within the scope of
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248:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Religion
158:It is of interest to the following
23:for discussing improvements to the
1827:Religions and spiritual traditions
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2032:page only contains two religions
45:New to Knowledge (XXG)? Welcome!
2912:Template-Class Religion articles
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279:IS MUCH CLOSER TO ISLAM THAN *
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40:Click here to start a new topic.
2917:NA-importance Religion articles
1754:Separation of church and state
283:and introduced the other Shias
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2922:WikiProject Religion articles
2846:in Hinduism within Shaivasim
2580:Traditional African religions
2012:Traditional African religions
251:Template:WikiProject Religion
37:Put new text under old text.
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2871:04:41, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
2856:20:09, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
1906:09:50, 27 January 2021 (UTC)
1883:16:11, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
2832:to reactivate your request.
2820:has been answered. Set the
2734:, or consider visiting the
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2229:In response to Doremon764
1940:17:50, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
1926:17:43, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
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75:Be welcoming to newcomers
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2682:Middle Eastern religions
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2407:- hetanism, neo-Paganism
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2001:22:41, 24 May 2021 (UTC)
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1817:New religious movements
1434:Evolutionary psychology
2413:- Baltic neo-Paganism
1896:isn't enough sourced.
953:Unitarian Universalism
70:avoid personal attacks
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2133:Mircea Eliade
2130:
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2109:
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2103:CorbieVreccan
2098:
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1898:DayakSibiriak
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1100:Indo-European
1097:
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475:Protestantism
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47:Learn to edit
44:
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36:
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26:
22:
18:
17:
2881:
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2829:
2818:edit request
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2724:
2719:help request
2680:
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2158:
2154:
2150:
2092:
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2067:
2062:
2006:
1953:
1929:
1915:
1889:
1869:
1851:
1844:
1759:Unaffiliated
1575:Universalism
1485:Religion and
1414:Anthropology
1323:Supernatural
1318:Spirituality
1224:Denomination
1133:Neoplatonism
1085:Mesopotamian
1011:Lepcha (Mun)
928:Seicho-no-Ie
820:Confucianism
658:Samaritanism
455:Christianity
450:Bahá'í Faith
433:Major groups
408:
390:
287:INTRODUCE:
286:
271:
230:articles to
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160:WikiProjects
149:
106:
92:
19:This is the
2844:Lingayatism
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2573:Traditional
2554:Let's talk!
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2329:Let's talk!
2250:Let's talk!
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1797:Deification
1734:Objectivism
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1652:Persecution
1617:Populations
1538:Proselytism
1511:Monasticism
1496:Agriculture
1424:Development
1419:Comparative
1396:Transtheism
1381:Panentheism
1249:Monasticism
1145:Manichaeism
1062:Paleolithic
1054:Prehistoric
923:Scientology
908:New Thought
898:Neopaganism
750:Vaishnavism
465:Catholicism
460:Anglicanism
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1602:Minorities
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1528:Evangelism
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1031:Polynesian
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1386:Pantheism
1376:Nontheism
1311:sacrifice
1286:Orthodoxy
1271:Mythology
1266:Mysticism
1194:Behaviour
1150:Mithraism
1072:Near East
918:Rastafari
800:Zurvanism
790:Mithraism
720:Ayyavazhi
703:Vajrayana
693:Theravada
670:Yârsânism
665:Mandaeism
648:Noahidism
636:Chassidic
626:Orthodoxy
599:Ahmadiyya
582:Zaidiyyah
529:Batiniyya
522:Hurufiyya
480:Mormonism
470:Orthodoxy
442:Abrahamic
391:as well.
382:Zaidiyyah
329:Batiniyya
322:Hurufiyya
281:Yârsânism
83:if needed
66:Be polite
27:template.
21:talk page
2887:hemantha
2863:hemantha
2736:Teahouse
2507:Estonian
2489:Romanian
2483:Ossetian
2465:Germanic
2405:Armenian
1846:Category
1832:Scholars
1807:Founders
1787:Timeline
1647:Violence
1501:Business
1469:Theories
1464:Theology
1185:Apostasy
1118:Germanic
1108:Armenian
1080:Egyptian
1006:Javanese
938:Tenrikyo
893:Moralism
883:Eckankar
745:Smartism
740:Shaivism
735:Shaktism
725:Lingayat
710:Hinduism
698:Mahayana
688:Buddhism
546:Ismāʿīlī
534:Seveners
512:Alawites
425:Religion
346:Ismāʿīlī
334:Seveners
312:Alawites
245:Religion
223:Religion
179:Religion
150:template
94:Archives
51:get help
2527:Mordvin
2512:Finnish
2457:Druidry
2179:Western
1950:Reverts
1802:Deities
1782:Outline
1704:Atheism
1627:Science
1555:Freedom
1487:society
1439:History
1361:Animism
1343:Worship
1328:Symbols
1306:liturgy
1214:Deities
1199:Beliefs
1178:Aspects
1090:Semitic
991:Chinese
976:African
943:Thelema
913:Raëlism
903:New Age
878:Druidry
845:Cao Dai
840:Hoa Hao
772:Iranian
762:Sikhism
757:Jainism
641:Charedi
621:Karaite
611:Judaism
589:Khariji
575:Ja'fari
556:Mustali
375:Ja'fari
356:Mustali
107:30 days
2537:Udmurt
2501:Uralic
2495:Slavic
2451:Celtic
2437:Abkhaz
2423:Romuva
2411:Baltic
2397:Uralic
2159:inside
2155:inside
2036:&
2016:Furius
1853:Portal
1669:Wealth
1622:Schism
1587:Growth
1506:Clergy
1353:Theism
1301:Ritual
1296:Prayer
1276:Nature
1204:Clergy
1160:Slavic
1113:Celtic
1001:Gurung
860:Recent
830:Taoism
825:Shinto
795:Yazidi
785:Mazdak
680:Indian
502:Ghulat
302:Ghulat
156:scale.
2891:brief
2867:brief
2826:|ans=
2816:This
2717:This
2703:Help!
2278:page
2097:WP:OR
1971:WP:OR
1777:Index
1769:Lists
1694:Deism
1632:State
1474:Women
1366:Deism
1338:Water
1333:Truth
1229:Faith
1155:Roman
1123:Greek
958:Wicca
850:Muism
570:Alevi
517:Druze
492:Sunni
487:Islam
370:Alevi
317:Druze
292:Islam
277:Druze
148:This
79:Seek
2882:Done
2852:talk
2838:Add
2783:brad
2694:talk
2684:and
2636:talk
2630:etc.
2569:diff
2532:Sámi
2522:Mari
2393:diff
2387:diff
2376:diff
2288:talk
2237:and
2231:diff
2191:talk
2181:and
2167:talk
2141:talk
2123:talk
2076:talk
2046:talk
2020:talk
1997:talk
1973:. -
1961:and
1936:talk
1922:talk
1902:talk
1892:for
1879:talk
1254:monk
1234:Fire
594:Sufi
497:Shia
297:Shia
234:and
232:good
68:and
2824:or
2068:not
1682:and
1662:War
1259:nun
1239:God
835:Zen
236:1.0
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2842:,
2830:no
2792:🍁
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