1321:"What happened in 1948" was vague was shown to be false as it was clearly defined in the source as "massacres and expulsions at gunpoint" "which led to over 80 per cent of the Palestinian population being violently forced to flee". What BK49 seems not to want to say is that it is easier for AE admins to treat AE as though it were WP:AN3 where simple revert-counting is normally addressed. I too was sorry to see that the complaint was not treated seriously, as the evidence presented was very clear and in the context of a larger complaint it will likely be successfully muddied. While someone could reinitiate the same case with exactly the same evidence, mentioning both user x and user y, it would have been much simpler to give a 1RR warning without falsely claiming that you were unilaterally edit-warring when there were
1052:
conversations across multiple pages that some people have significant real-world fears about restrictions on gender care. IMO those fears aren't entirely misplaced, but from the
Knowledge (XXG) POV, real-world anxiety does not make for a dispassionate Wikipedian. Regardless of whether the fear is about COVID vaccines, Trump's re-election prospects, climate change, gender equality, the mess in Gaza, immigration, or any other subject, real-world anxiety consistently produces POV pushers. We have traditionally tried to address this by accepting and moderating the POV pushing. I hope that we will be able to continue doing that for GENSEX topics, but perhaps society has shifted enough over the years that it's no longer a viable model.
734:) I won't have a chance to write anything substantial till this evening. I've responded the most recent issue (the “trans kids” one) on the talk page it occurred, to try to address how that's been misrepresented. But as you note there are a lot of diffs offered, and I'm quite sure by this evening there will be other posts by other editors with 50 more diffs. I wish it was clearer which are the areas of concern you guys would like me to address, and which you've already dismissed as misinterpreted. You can email me if you think that might be kinder. --
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well. And so with your report there was an attempt to keep the discussion focused - which in this case was on the edit warring presented by the filer. The ask for a separate report is showing it's being taken seriously. Rather than nothing happening because it is buried as a small part of a large discussion of which it is not the focus, its own report means that conduct would be the focus.
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it will take me at least 24 hours to even be able to read the rest of the diffs. I'd like to have more time to view and comment on any real issues, which the most recent was not. And the mobile diffs will make it much harder to work from my (very slow) hotspot at the airport; I did not realize, for example, that
1186:
Could I file a report saying simply "In a previous AE report, I made a statement alleging misconduct by user(s) x. I was told to submit a separate report to address these concerns. Here is my statement and note that there were statements by other editors in the IOHANNVSVERVS report which are relevant
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I assume that confusion (around who used the term first) is because Colin objected when a different editor used the same language, and I assume that was because it's difficult on long pages to keep track of which comment belongs to which sig, or because he had other things he needed to say about that
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Sorry for missing that question earlier. I wish there was a good tutorial for learning about AE. The rules and procedures are written in the box labeled "Important information". But how to write effective AE reports is something that doesn't exist as far as I know. However, most of the advice on how
1051:
I do think sometimes that we need the equivalent of amusement park signs on some subjects. Instead of saying "You have to be at least this tall for this ride", we need one that says "If you have this much real-world anxiety about this subject, don't edit this page". It's obvious when you watch the
945:
was the first to use the term "trans kids" because of the mess of trying to view the whole page from a mobile diff with limited time. Is it possible to reinforce that the OP needs to better focus their diffs on any that are truly problematic, hopefully with non-mobile version, so that context can be
940:
BK and SFR, I don't want to clutter the AE page with my typical travelogue, but I saw the AE last night after I finished packing, am headed this morning to the airport, will be flying all day, then traveling from the airport to my destination for a family wedding, getting in late. That is, at best,
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22 December Went back here per
Radilacs response to my first batch. WP:SPLC notes that they are reliable but their labeling shouldn't automatically be included in the LEAD. I'm curious in what circumstances Void would find it appropriate to include a gender related hate designation in the lead given
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The most successful reports have specific diffs with easy to understand explanation of why those diffs present a problem - that was something the report that just closed did well. So "read a whole bunch of other stuff to find what was relevant" won't be successful. Nor would "read the statements by
1127:
Arbitration
Enforcement is designed to be a board with structured discussion about editor behavior in certain (Arbcom approved) places. A problem with many Palestine-Israel reports there is that it attempts to turn it into a wide ranging discussion about many editors' behavior. AE does not do that
1149:
I don't intend to be argumentative and I'm just registering my disappointment. I have a lot of respect for the individual admins who respond at AE, but AE itself has something wrong with it. There seem to be inconsistencies with how things are done there, and I'd like to ask if there is somewhere
651:
I appreciate that background. I'm certainly familiar with the harassment of Chan. My quick googling doesn't reveal quite that same kind of harassment but does reveal a focus on the BLP violations that caused me to revdel the move logs. Can you document (perhaps best done in an email) more of that
157:
Thank you. Am I allowed to add a reply to my statement? LunaHasArrived has pointed out I've made a mistake I want to apologise for, and also I'd like to respond to the "LGBA Founders" thing because it's been kind of my white whale and I've not covered myself in glory there over the years but I've
124:? In my statement I replied to points made and incorrect claims which have been removed or edited or changed. I've already edited my statement once to account for the changing request, I don't have time to stay on top of it though. Apologies for asking here if this isn't the done thing either!
1171:
the right answer for efficiency. If someone were to file a report today that was straight forward in the way the report just closed was, there's a great chance that the total time to close both would be less than the time it takes to close the sprawled report about
IntrepidContributor.
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but that is just a single diff when the 3 of you are arguing a pattern and the rest are assertions without clear evidence to back them up. Someone needs to compile what the pattern of diffs are. An example of that happening for something somewhat like this is
1340:
The ask for a separate report is showing it's being taken seriously. Rather than nothing happening because it is buried as a small part of a large discussion of which it is not the focus, its own report means that conduct would be the
1076:, I don't understand what happened with the concerns of myself, Levivich and SashiRolls that filer was engaged in disruptive editing and POV pushing? It would appear these concerns were ignored and have not been addressed. Thank you,
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for considering my case as fairly as you can. I can only conclude that all four of you must have been terrible people in a previous life, and brought back to spend your evenings moderating the bickering of folk on the internet. --
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They're not ignored, as much as there have been millions of words written on talk pages and thousands upon thousands of edits. Without a clear demonstration of what exactly the problem is its very difficult to suss out.
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The "singer-songwriter" draft page you just moved is the target of a long harassment campaign similar to Chris Chan. The page is pure trolling and serves no purpose except to continue that harassment.
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1386:, looks like your edit was caught up in a revdel of material added to the Kautilya3 thread by Ms Sarah Welch. Your contributions came between the addition of the material and its removal.
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Yeah, it has to load all your scripts before it knows to open the right version of the page. It's better than nothing though. Also, you reminded me to do a bit of cleanup on my common.js.
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Thanks. That seems to work, though I can see the browser fetch the mobile page and then the desktop one after. SFN, your common.js is, em, extremely trusting of a lot of random users! --
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which, not for nothing, was too late in a thread that had already spiraled. And yes a person can file two or three concerns in a row about similar concerns for different editors.
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I'm glad FFF was able to reformat the diffs for you (I was going to put them here). Also because this is at a conduct noticeboard I will be keeping my substantive comments there.
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will take care of that. I have that installed to keep the site from forcing me back to the horrible mobile interface randomly, but it also shifts diffs to regular desktop diffs.
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I can understand why as a non-frequent participant you're not seeing it this way, but it is my sincere belief that
Vanamonde's suggestion was correct: filing a seperate report
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I really don't understand how AE works. One doesn't get the impression that concerns of POV pushing are being taken seriously here. I will not be filing a separate report.
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Very clear evidence was presented that user x was misrepresenting the source you provided and which he and user y repeatedly reverted. His claim that the variant on the
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I'm happy to respond but I'm at my limit now do you still want me to? I've already added links to relevant context to two edits you mentioned I hope that's ok.
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What BK49 seems not to want to say is that it is easier for AE admins to treat AE as though it were WP:AN3 where simple revert-counting is normally addressed
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more easily viewed and discussed? I wasted what little time I had last night commenting on a mobile diff with no context that was better handled by WAID.
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Did we? You and I agreed, SFR was ambivalent to negative and
Valereee didn't really comment on it. I'm obviously not opposed but I'm not sure it was there.
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replies under 300 words you're fine. If this gets much larger and you need more words ask again. I hope to jump substantively to what's happening soon.
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again). There are two diffs with a "diffonly=1" flag on them, which prevents examination of the context. Could those be removed too please. --
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thanks for your email. As chance would have it I was in possession of that information already, but I appreciate your making sure of that.
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They've not been ignored? Three users reported concerns about a user's conduct but these concerns have not been responded to or addressed.
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1266:"Without a clear demonstration of what exactly the problem is"? The allegations were very clear in identifying what the problem is.
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harassment campaign? Alternatively I agree it's unlikely they'll ever be able to move from being a draft page so perhaps try MFD?
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And should two or three separate reports be filed or can my concerns about the three editors be dealt with in the one report?
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comment. Mixing up who said what happens all over the wiki. I really don't think anyone was trying to be unfair here.
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It would be really great if someone could just edit those urls to be standard diffs. Surely that's not contentious? --
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Yes, I removed some false information that is part of the trolling. This is very similar to Chris Chan, including
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I was going through my contributions, and the edits I did to an AN/I hat was revdel'd. Did I do something wrong?
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indicated filing a separate report - especially given the source manipulation concerns - would be appropriate.
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Thank you for your time
Barkeep, and know that I take seriously the warning I recieved for edit warring/1RR.
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Thank you for the time you put in to assessing my case. I'll take all the constructive comments on board.
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I can confirm that it was intentionally changed in DS to CT from clear and substantial to clear. Best,
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I'm pretty ambivalent. I don't think it does much, but I didn't want to hold up a possible consensus.
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It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can
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people involved, counting user x (who made claims on the talk page) and user y (who did not).--
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It's unfortunate that serious allegations are ignored unless certain hoops are jumped through.
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I'll ask again if there is somewhere I can read about the rules/procedures/etc regarding AE?
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Thanks for closing, I did think we had a consensus for a general reminder re: AGF though.
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Knowledge (XXG) talk:Arbitration
Committee/Noticeboard § Change to the Functionary team
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WikiCup enters final round, MCDC wraps up activities, 17-year-old hoax article unmasked
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Gotcha, thanks. I'm just glad that I didn't hallucinate asking about that somewhere.
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me, Levivich, and SashiRolls" because the one that comes closest is SashiRolls
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I put it up for a MfD, although I still think it should be speedy deleted.
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you could delete that and make a new link you use in your response.
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Meet the 12 candidates running in the WMF Board of
Trustees election
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if you think the page is better off deleted don't let me stop you.
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Following a request to the Committee, the CheckUser permissions of
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Hi, thanks for permission to go over 500 words in responding to
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This came up in an earlier discussion, and I finally found it.
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You can definitely have some additional words to reply to me.
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Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration/Requests/Archive 19#Quick question
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Hello, Barkeep49. Please check your email; you've got mail!
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583:, the latter piece of art also pictured on the Main page. --
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if you want to amend a statement to my close please do so.
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no they shouldn't be doing that. I've requested they stop.
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AI is not playing games anymore. Is Knowledge (XXG) ready?
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613:'s 200th birthday was celebrated (a few days late). --
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is because I don't think it's true. Instead I think
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910:Thank you, I will make a minimal amendment.
321:What it's like to be Wikimedian of the Year
571:Three stories related to today in memory,
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1022:Thx to both, that helps, I'm off ...
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1400:Oh. So I didn't do anything wrong?
668:a wiki his "fans" have put together
609:for a stunning sunrise, on the day
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860:as assent, but we can just ask
433:For the Arbitration Committee,
122:continually amend the complaint
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1072:Regarding your closure of the
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1464:at any time by removing the
313:A month after Wikimania 2024
601:! On display, portrayed by
599:Schoenberg's 150th birthday
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1334:The reason I haven't said
359:MediaWiki message delivery
346:Read this Signpost in full
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1287:would also apply to AE.
1068:Question about AE report
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172:Yes. If you keep your
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798:Thank you Barkeep,
329:After the gold rush
303:News from the WMF:
1488:Have a great day!
1461:remove this notice
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1319:wh-cleft structure
1074:AE report about me
272:: 4 September 2024
1379:talk page stalker
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1195:IOHANNVSVERVS
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319:Serendipity:
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1144:bureaucratic
1133:
1104:
1071:
1054:WhatamIdoing
1024:
948:
943:WhatamIdoing
939:
901:
847:
797:
788:
761:
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729:
695:
674:
673:
657:
631:
615:Gerda Arendt
606:
603:Egon Schiele
596:
585:Gerda Arendt
573:11 September
570:
559:Gerda Arendt
548:
490:
461:
449:
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344:
270:The Signpost
269:
232:
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181:
173:
148:
118:my AE report
115:
31:
25:
1193:Thank you,
1097:Vanamonde93
912:Vanamonde93
894:Vanamonde93
866:Vanamonde93
840:Vanamonde93
826:Vanamonde93
808:Vanamonde93
628:Attack page
402:protections
355:Unsubscribe
351:Single-page
311:Wikimania:
1490:Phoebezz22
1327:SashiRolls
936:AE, travel
414:page moves
158:moved on.
112:AE Request
1484:template.
1413:Barkeep49
1411:Correct.
1388:Folly Mox
1344:Barkeep49
1289:Barkeep49
1219:Barkeep49
1174:Barkeep49
1130:Barkeep49
1101:Barkeep49
898:Barkeep49
844:Barkeep49
785:Barkeep49
749:Barkeep49
692:Barkeep49
654:Barkeep49
597:Today is
487:Barkeep49
408:deletions
379:Barkeep49
229:Barkeep49
211:Barkeep49
178:Barkeep49
145:Barkeep49
804:Valereee
611:Bruckner
555:my story
435:Primefac
390:contribs
335:Humour:
27:Archives
1028:Georgia
952:Georgia
581:20 June
577:20 July
1341:focus.
762:(ping
730:(ping
607:places
551:BWV 78
542:places
420:rights
396:blocks
1323:three
1025:Sandy
998:Colin
968:Colin
949:Sandy
813:Colin
781:Colin
768:Colin
736:Colin
538:music
534:story
174:total
33:Index
1494:talk
1417:talk
1392:talk
1348:talk
1293:talk
1272:talk
1255:talk
1240:talk
1223:talk
1210:here
1199:talk
1178:talk
1159:talk
1134:talk
1119:talk
1105:talk
1095:as @
1082:talk
1058:talk
1033:Talk
1014:talk
988:talk
957:Talk
916:talk
902:talk
884:talk
870:talk
858:this
848:talk
830:talk
806:and
789:talk
753:talk
710:talk
696:talk
658:talk
638:talk
619:talk
589:talk
579:and
563:talk
505:talk
491:talk
472:talk
439:talk
384:talk
363:talk
247:talk
233:talk
215:talk
201:talk
182:talk
164:talk
149:talk
130:talk
1479:ygm
1474:or
1169:was
1035:)
959:)
862:him
688:Liz
557:--
426:RfA
1496:)
1482:}}
1476:{{
1472:}}
1466:{{
1419:)
1394:)
1350:)
1295:)
1274:)
1257:)
1242:)
1225:)
1201:)
1180:)
1161:)
1136:)
1121:)
1107:)
1084:)
1060:)
1016:)
990:)
918:)
904:)
886:)
872:)
864:.
850:)
832:)
802:,
791:)
755:)
726:AE
712:)
698:)
678:iz
660:)
640:)
621:)
591:)
575:,
565:)
540:·
536:·
507:)
493:)
474:)
441:)
365:)
357:*
353:*
349:*
343:*
249:)
235:)
217:)
203:)
184:)
166:)
151:)
132:)
102:10
36:)
1492:(
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1103:(
1091:@
1080:(
1056:(
1031:(
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1000:°
986:(
970:°
955:(
914:(
900:(
892:@
882:(
868:(
846:(
838:@
828:(
815:°
787:(
779:@
770:°
751:(
738:°
708:(
694:(
686:@
675:L
656:(
647:@
636:(
617:(
587:(
561:(
503:(
489:(
481:@
470:(
437:(
428:)
423:·
417:·
411:·
405:·
399:·
393:·
387:·
382:(
361:(
245:(
231:(
223:@
213:(
199:(
180:(
162:(
147:(
139:@
128:(
97:9
92:8
87:7
82:6
77:5
72:4
67:3
62:2
57:1
30:(
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