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own experiences and observations of some of these other spats (including with Guari) - is that the same contributors and admins can come across as dismissive, unfair, and outright hostile to others, usually escalating conflicts and then punishing people when provoked into reacting. It comes across as bullying, whether intended or not. It does not help that the same admin citing various WP policies (albeit rarely ever specifics) in the process themselves often ignore and violate the same policies without anything being said about it.
1147:
you are curious though, take a look at my
Rigveda Tilak talk page and Padmakar Vishnu controversy. In any case, you are absolutely right that this is not a worthwhile use of our time. In fact, this makes me even more motivated actually to work outside Wiki with other organizations to fight what appears to be some serious POV pushing. I would suggest you do the same and devote time to other organizations that are working to counter this. Use this experience to get motivated and work with others outside Wiki.Best of luck to you!
680:: Yes, my thinking was/is that as the article is a general reference intended for the lay-person (especially to settle disputes since claims are often taken at face-value), a more generalised (albeit imprecise) title was best. It's easy to find and remember, and I believe most searches would be phrased this way. However, your point about that lack of precision is right. If the title is a problem, then I suppose a new article could be created and a redirect left on the current one. Happy either way.
1086:, I didn't realise people like Joshua get to take ownership of articles, start edit wars, revert changes without explanation, ignore legitimate criticism, manipulate other users, shit all over people's time and effort, and knowingly disseminate false information in articles... as long as he's polite about it. I've no plans to contribute to wikipedia again because of people like him and like you. Your loss, not mine.
614:, but it turned into a somewhat lengthy process to "disentangle" the layers of claims, mostly repeating claims themselves repeating other claims, often ultimately based on pure speculation or even nothing at all. Evidence-wise, it all boils down to a reference by Al-Biruni around 1000 CE. The issue of the origin of the Bhagavata also seemed to be somewhat of a contentious issue, so was hoping to put that to rest.
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hundreds) of Vedic texts have been lost over time, too. Another issue is that although it seems quite certain the
Bhagavata is a later Purana - the legend of Matsya in it, for example, seems almost-certainly to be adapted from the likely-earlier Matsya Purana - but there is no way to prove this (i.e. it's all purely speculative).
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I fully understand what you are saying, and the recurrent spats with presumed or apparent Indian nationalists on the wiki. I am also certain you and the other editors usually involved in these spats (e.g. Joshua) give a lot of your free time and energy to benefit the wiki, too. My point - based on my
1146:
Yes I agree with you. There seems to be hardly any neutral point of view. In fact, in my experience one of the admins actually wrote false information publicly with no fact-checking and not even a warning was issued of any kind. Anyway, you know how all this works so no point in just repeating it. If
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laying out what changes you are proposing and what reliable secondary sources support those changes. If on the other hand, for whatever reason, you find yourself unable to contribute on the page or collaborate with the editors active there, please find other articles or areas on wikipedia that may be
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2. Your claim that 'neither reference says the black boar is referred in the
Upanishad' (i.e. refs 55 and 59) is demonstrably false. DaniƩlou (ref 59) refers to the earth being 'raised by a **black boar** with a hundred arms' (penultimate paragraph of p168) and Eggeling (55) states 'the earth is said
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Sorry that you are no longer active on Wiki as an editor but completely understand. I am having similar experiences as you with the same editors too. You can see this on my talk page on edits related to
Rigveda and Talwade. The admins can't seem to decide on why Tilak is an unreliable source and so
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3. No explanations or examples have been given to support why you believe there is too much detail or whether a non-Hindu would have difficulty understanding the content, most of which consists of paraphrases of
Puranic myths. Regardless, I see no problem anyway since you and other editors can edit
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What 'personal attacks' are you talking about, exactly? I called you a bully because you blocked a user based on a blatently false accusation of 'not being here to help create an encyclopedia'. His contrib history alone proves this to be false, and you know he was angry and frustrated about how he
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I realise it's probably a waste of time explaining myself, but I'll try. Of course I know the difference between astronomy and astrology and that Vartak was using astronomy as an argument to push arctic ancient origins, not astrology. It's the point good Indian scientists are making, that science
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Maybe you should read that very article yourself, given - as very clearly stated on Gauri a11ā¬'s own page - you did in fact accuse him without any evidence of having conflicts of interest. Nice way to treat a new user giving his time and energy for free. You obviously don't like being accused of
1131:
I totally understand your frustration. Unfortunately, I was not the first contributor to have problems with their manipulativeness and mind-games, and you will not be the last. There is no point in taking the issue to the senior editors / admins either, as they are even worse, and you'll just be
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If you have any suggestions to improve the article, then they would be most welcome. Had considered adding a section exploring the 'inter-textual' aspect of this Purana, elements of which can be traced back to the RigVeda. Problem is, the Vedas can't be reliably dated, either. And dozens (if not
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per
Knowledge naming conventions. The title of the article may give the reader the idea that it nails down the origin of the Purana, but you have said above (believably) that such a thing is unlikely. Therefore I am merely suggesting a change to the article title, something along the lines of
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things... even if actually true in your case. Also, I already tried taking the same issues I encountered with the same people to the admins, and just got cussed, insulted, mocked, and threatend for it. That's why you can't hold onto new users, and why Hindu-related articles are neglected.
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Ref: "Mythologically, according to Dr. Suniti Kumar
Chatterjee, a well-known historian, they are āthe offspring of son of the Vishnu and Mother-Earthā who were termed as āKiratasā during the Epic period.": The entire sentence is plagiarized, but without quotes. Write in your own
639:- Thanks for the informative response, but I have absolutely no dispute with any of the content in the article. I am not anywhere close to knowledgeable on the topic but as an interested reader I find the text convincing. My initial concern was simply about the article's
979:, which will give a better idea how the best articles in Knowledge are written. While lot of hard work has gone in this article, the article is going into unnecessary details and it will be very difficult to non-Hindu to understand the article.--
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threatened, insulted and mocked (as I and others have been). I suspect this is why many Hindu-related articles on
Knowledge are neglected. That's just the way it is on this site. You might be better off spending your time and energy elsewhere.
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was treated before understandably saying he wanting to leave. You could've shown a bit of respect to the guy instead of just blocking him like he was nothing. Feel free to block me anyway. I honestly don't care.
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I have revoked Gauri a11's talkpage access. Please stop using their page as a discussion board; the talkpages of the articles in question are the right place for that. If you make any more personal attacks on
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Totally understand! Used your advice and moved to correctly-accented page, so much appreciated as well. Can I ask: Do major edits in my sandbox copied and pasted into existing articles count?
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Criticism is fine when justified and done properly. Attempts at shaming for trying to help editors and to protect the encyclopedia when necessary are not (and it won't work on
Knowledge). ā
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from the old title to the new. If you cannot perform a particular page move yourself this way (e.g. because a page already exists at the target title), please follow the instructions at
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610:, appreciate the review! In a nutshell, it is impossible to reliably date this or any other Vedic or Puranic literature. The article was originally intended as a section in the
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and to provide evidence for your rant. Please avoid pinging me for baseless accusations, unless it's to report me at an appropriate administrator's noticeboard. Thanks, ā
218:! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the
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a different title by copying its content and pasting either the same content, or an edited version of it, into another page with a different name. This is known as a "
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should not be used as a vehicle to push a political argument, which was what Vartak was doing. As for Guari, it's no coincidence that his first editing interested as
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If your submission has already been deleted by the time you get there, and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion by following the instructions at
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The "black boar" statement in
Mahanarayana Upanishad statement is another example of synthesis. Neither reference says the black boar is referred in the Upanishad.
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Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit
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Thank you for this informative new article, but I wonder if the title is accurate. The article does not actually nail down the book's origin, but instead lists
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1483:, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply
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5. Heavy quoting is my writing style; I do not like paraphrasing too much. Still, moot point as I've no plans to contribute further to wikipedia.
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1. The "close paraphrasing" referred to in regards to the Boros People has nothing to do with me; that info was added by different contributor.
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that origin. This should be evident in the article's title in some fashion. I will leave it to the experts, but for pointers see
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are āthe offspring of son of the Vishnu(VarÄha) and Mother-Earthā who were termed as āKiratasā during the Epic period."
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4. Totally agree with your criticism regarding the synthesis of the Gita and Varaha (and agree with you removing it).
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has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by AngusWOOF were:
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to have been uplifted by a **black boar** with a thousand arms' (ref 451:1 on the linked page).
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1512:this link
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