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336:(which may not be correctly named, BTW), and it seemed that much of the info would be better suited to a general history of Toledo rather than buried in an article about an obscure archaic town name. If you'd like, move it into article namespace. 'Til then, I'll just add what I can to the Vistula and (as yet still red-linked) Port Lawrence articles. Cheers.
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The reality of the situation is that
Knowledge (XXG) articles should try to prevent all prevailing views and shoot them down. People have blamed the creation of all the stadiums and the R&R Hall of Fame for the moves. I have a book that cites it (not on me right now, but I can get ahold of it and
434:. The leases were more valuable even with the lackluster Indians as a tenant than they would have been in a new Browns-only stadium. To hedge his bet, Modell made clear he would not be a part of Gateway, as without the Browns it seemed a sure thing the citizens of Cleveland would reject the project.
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at the same time it was offered to the
Indians and Cavs. (More on that in a moment.) Cleveland did spend money on infrastructure for the Rock Hall, and it's the same infrastructure (e.g. the RTA Waterfront line) which is now benefitting the Browns in their current stadium. Moreover, the experience
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I feel that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is still relevant to the Art Modell page because it was one of the reasons that
Cleveland did not have the funds to pay for a football stadium. If you'd like, I can reword it. The Cavs are definitely worth mentioning, as they are a sports team. Check out the
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from this point forward and go our seperate ways; if, however, this proves impossible, it would be foolish of me to ignore the issue. Clearly, we have a conflict on our hands (though frankly, I'm at a loss to explain why this is so). I offer you the choice: Either we can let this drop here, or you
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The Cavs were a big deal as well. I'm not denying that Big Art is in the wrong. As a Ravens fan I'm glad he's out of there, and looking at the state the team is in now the new owner inherited a mess, and he certainly mismanaged his money, and he has nobody to blame for that but himself. Getting back
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Hey don't you know the existence of
Buckeyes&Wolverines shop in Toledo? Also, an OSU student said to Lantern, OSU newspaper, "I grew up in Toledo, where 5 Wolverine fans per Buckeye. In what state are you living?". I'm afraid I forgot the date of issue, so it's up to you if you revert it, as it
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I wish that as well. However (and for the record, as I know you already understand this), even before I was aware the article was put to AfD, certain editors had already accused me of using the AfD process as part of a vendetta against the subject of the article. In refraining from the process, I
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Of course, Cleveland passed the project, via a "sin tax" in
Cuyahoga County. The Indians would be moving to a new stadium, the Cavs would be moving into Cleveland from neighbouring Summit County, and Modell was left holding the bag. He pressured Cleveland to build him a new stadium as well. But
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status is therefore unclear. If you have not created this media yourself then you need to argue that we have the right to use the media on
Knowledge (XXG) (see copyright tagging below). If you have not created the media yourself then you should also specify where you found it, i.e., in most cases
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have the money: That money was earmarked through the
Gateway project (and passed through a distinct levy by the voters of Cuyahoga County), which Modell had already rejected. And that, my friend, is why you can't blame the city of Cleveland for the Browns' move. If the folks at ESPN would get
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As for the Cavs, as I mentioned, they were part of the
Gateway project; mentioning them separately in the article is redundant, and suggests more credence to Modell's posturing than actually exists in fact. (To wit, even if you buy the argument that Cleveland snubbed Modell, it did so with only
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Considering that you were numbering your reverts in the edit summaries, it seemed clear to me that you were counting on using the Three-Revert Rule as tactical cover for your actions. Uh uh: the 3RR is an electric fence -- a limit -- and not an entitlement, and gaming the system for tactical
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be outraged every time a new theater opens on
Broadway? Come on, let's get real here. The city of Cleveland did not build the Rock Hall. It's a non-profit institution; which makes it all the more outrageous to think that Cleveland had to build a stadium for Modell's for profit business
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On second thought, no, I'm not going to ignore this. Neither, though, am I going to escalate this by continuing to participate in what I see as a resolved issue. The link has been removed by another editor. If you wish to dispute this, take it up with that other editor, or on the
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Sorry about that... I forgot to update the copyright tagging when I reloaded the image. (I'd converted it from a transparent PNG file which I'd created earlier and mistakenly made transparent, to a regular PNG file. This is a derivative work, created from a document found here:
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project, not two or three.) What really happened is this: Modell gambled that the citizens of
Cleveland would reject a public project to build new sports venues in Cleveland. This gamble made good business sense for Modell, as he already controlled leases on the existing
644:" link (it is located at the very top of any Knowledge (XXG) page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any unsourced and untagged images will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on
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I wish you didn't feel it necessary to withhold your AfD vote, but I understand your reasons. Thanks for trying not to contribute to the drama. I only wish that all these newly-registered users felt the same.
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advantage is frowned on and occasionally blocked for, because admins are not fooled. You want the link gone? Make a coherent, non-bogus argument on the Talk page, one that at least passes the giggle test. --
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And guys like you can edit it and have it meet all the standards you want it to. Personally I'm more concerned with getting information down, and people can edit it, making it more grammatically correct.
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Then please do cite it. And to be brutally honest, the paragraph could stand some cleanup as well. I'm not trying to be mean, but what you added was problematic just on grammatical grounds. --
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link to the talk page says nothing -- zip, zero, nada, nil, goose egg -- about this. Do you plan to actually address what I've actually said or will you continue pretending you've answered it? --
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in the first place (IANAL), but because the image is derived from this source and not merely copied, I am operating under the belief that it's my own creation and thus eligible for the GFDL. --
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If you have uploaded other media, please check that you have specified their source and copyright tagged them, too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "
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Considering that you were numbering your reverts in the edit summaries, it seemed clear to me that you were counting on using the Three-Revert Rule as tactical cover for your actions.
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But like it or not those are reasons that Modell and his supporters cite for him leaving. Now you can mention that was incorrect, but there in Maryland most people view it that way.
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Sry, afraid I don't have access to such information. I was trying to expand info about the rural area's liberal community, but I don't have sources, so it's not happening.
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cite it). Instead of deleting information that you feel helps Modell's cause you should allow for it to remain. Reading MOdell's info one sees how he truly is anyway.
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would have no reason to mistakenly accuse me of violating 3RR. My actions were not a "tactical cover"; on the contrary, I was operating as openly as I possibly could.
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hope to prove that allegation false. The record clearly shows that I tried working with those editors and was rebuffed, even when we were discussing this subject at
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Perhaps now you'll see I've done so. It frankly flabbergasts me that you've apparently not seen it yet, but perhaps now you will, as I'm reprinting this comment
183:. There was no reason for that link to be in the article, as the website author prohibits its contents from being republished on Knowledge (XXG) (see
147:). Your next revert was merely bog-standard bogus, and your previous revert's high bogosity level merely made me comfortable reverting it immediately.
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their heads out of... well, let's just say start thinking clearly, this story could be told instead of the Disney fantasy that is proffered in
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There was no reason for that link to be in the article, as the website author prohibits its contents from being republished on Knowledge (XXG)
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If the media also doesn't have a copyright tag then you must also add one. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then you can use
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No, I reverted the first time because your stated reason was so breathtakingly and obviously bogus that it defied reason (see chutzpah)
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The contents of the link? That's copyrighted? The contents of the link itself? That's copyrighted? See "Giggle test, failure of". --
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No, I reverted the first time because your stated reason was so breathtakingly and obviously bogus that it defied reason (see
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to the Cavs, most cite that as a reason they left, and quite frankly I'm surprised that more people do not mention that.
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I, on the other hand, won't be saying anything more to you about this edit; I bid you well. I'd like us both to
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what people don't realize is that not only did Cleveland not have the money for a new Browns stadium, they
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Hmmm, maybe you'd also like to note that my stated reasons were stated on the talk page all along (
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I've answered it. Move on, please. Further comments from you on this issue will be ignored. --
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Make a coherent, non-bogus argument on the Talk page, one that at least passes the giggle test.
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So you revert my edits twice because the reasons in summary aren't good enough for you...
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link to the website where you got it, and the terms of use for content from that page.
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is kinda "original research". I don't have any intention to re-add or re-revert it.
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Hi, this is just the article I was hoping might be around. I was trying to expand
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And I don't blame the city of Cleveland for Modell moving the team.
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makes the whole argument out to be the sham it is: Sports teams
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Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, Cleveland Cavaliers and Art Modell
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survive, and even thrive, without raiding the public coffers.
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have to do with "republishing" anything? Do you know what a
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Ravens AOL board. The debate is certainly still going on.
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for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/Robin Artisson
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Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.
