Knowledge (XXG)

:Articles for deletion/100 Greatest TV Moments - Knowledge (XXG)

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947:, the process was that a panel of experts selected a short list of 100. This was then voted upon by an online poll and an opinion poll conducted by the polling organisation ICM. The results of the two polls were then combined and the experts broke the ties. I'm not sure that the process is significantly different in the case of record charts, so far as copyright is concerned. There's a process of expert involvement there too - choosing representative sources and determining genre classifications. Neither of these seem very creative. They seem to be more 806:: "... polls are likely to be protectable as well because the parameters of the survey are chosen by those who conduct the polls and the selection of respondents indicates 'at least some creativity.'" The same text recommends that polls be accompanied by critical commentary so as to meet the criteria for fair use. Keeping these separate articles doesn't seem to be an option - the majority are full or partial reproductions of polls without commentary, which seems to violate the fair-use principle. Perhaps fleshing out the main 1007:: don't normally like mass deletions but this is copyright infringing territory. The way to summarize these and escape infringement is to incorporate individual ranks into the "reception" section of individual creative works. Quoting entire segments of the lists is asking for trouble from the copyright holder. I don't like how copyright law denies power to consumers. But there it is. 904:
is a compilation of hard statistics based on actual events (plays and sales). The Channel 4 shows were based on loose polls of opinions of people who felt like voting and there is no way of independently verifying how much input Channel 4 themselves had in the final results. Therefore, the two cases
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spin-out articles not listed in this AfD have been (often more than once, depending on whether or not the article was re-created) variously AfDed, PRODed or SPEEDYed over the years. In my experience, "countdown"-style pages such as the ones listed above are also popular targets for vandalism (people
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the list, which would supersede the original. It is only the top 10 of the list, but, again, our attorney points out that the higher numbers are the more commercially valuable. That said, I have just noticed that the only critical commentary that existed was removed without explanation at the time
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which is a guideline not a hard policy and so has a fair amount of wiggle room. Fair use is, by its nature, a matter of compromise and discretion not an exact rule or law. I don't see how it makes any sense to say that we can summarise the plot of a story like Harry Potter or report who won the
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example just list the top ten and so this is a fair use summary of the most significant part of the results. The main issue, to my mind, is that there are numerous clip shows of this kind and so there's some scope for merging our coverage. For an example of the notability of this phenomenon see
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My interpretation (and I'm open to correction, naturally) is that these articles would only be acceptable if they were not lists but rather objective analyses of the subject matter (based on coverage and commentary from reliable sources) that contained a few references to poll positions (no pun
1051:), but it has not been completed because I could never launch a community discussion about how to handle it. People don't generally like to talk about copyright concerns. Previously, we had always felt confident with limited selection of much larger lists, such as the 10 out of 500 listed at 1046:
The Wikimedia Foundation's attorney was approached about this matter when a similar list was brought to the copyright problems board, and her expert opinion is quoted liberally in that footnote. I had been working on a guideline at the time we received her recommendation
700:, is not accurate. The fact that another organisation has published part of one of these lists does not justify a belief that the material itself is copyright free. The poll results remain the intellectual property of Channel 4 154: 722: 198: 872:
I'm not buying the footnote. This seems to be copyright paranoia which has been added to the guideline recently and does not represent settled policy. What it suggests is that we'd have to delete lists like
725:, I considered starting a mass AfD just like this one, only I was distracted by other business on-Wiki and it kept slipping my mind. They're interesting pages, but the nominator's concerns regarding 957:
is very relevant here because it's not a single article that has been nominated but a big bundle. It is therefore appropriate to see what else will be affected by this broad brush action.
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is an example of such an article that does not reproduce the list at all, but it is easier for that list to critically discuss contents because it is variable. More information on what
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article with a handful of results for each programme (Top 10? Top 5? Top 3?) and critical analysis from book sources - therefore a partial merging - would be an acceptable compromise.
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That is a fair summary of her position. Based on her feedback, I would say that the specific article in discussion here makes a poor claim for fair use, as there is little
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oh-so-subtly changing poll results to reflect their own opinions as to which is the best/worst TV show/comedy film, etc.). For multiple reasons, therefore, deletion
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about it. Actually, in the version tagged for deletion, there was no critical commentary whatsoever; the only possible appeal to our readers
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because these are based upon Billboard's "creative" selection of country music. I do not believe there is community consensus for this.
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I thank you for the feedback. I'm extremely interested to see the result of this AFD as it seems a clear precedent may well be set.
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I am also nominating the following related pages as they are also violations of Channel 4's copyright for the reason given above:
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A complete or partial recreation of "Top 100" or similar lists where the list has been selected in a creative manner.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Oscars but that we can't summarise the findings of a Top 100 poll like these. What's the difference?
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The Channel 4 shows are based upon polls and so the rankings are not creative in the sense meant. The
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of the TV programmes in question, which is probably a strong rationale for deletion in itself. Similar
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in nature and this is not a copyright consideration in the USA, where Knowledge (XXG) is based.
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nevertheless seem accurate. Furthermore, none of these articles meaningfully substantiates the
990:: Long-time magnet for copyright violations, and the list article contains sufficient detail.— 948: 29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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It is my understanding that copyright rules (which, after all, are based on
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Consuming history: historians and heritage in contemporary popular culture
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/100 Greatest TV Moments from Hell
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/100 Greatest TV Moments from Hell
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Wikipedia_talk:Non-free content/Archive 51#A little different question
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calculated weekly mostly by airplay and occasionally commercial sales
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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WT:Non-free content/Archive 51#A little different question
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that the list was truncated from complete to the top 10,
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and especially the subsection on "Attorney feedback." --
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recommends in terms of handling these can be read at
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No further edits should be made to this page. 902:List of number-one country hits (United States) 875:List of number-one country hits (United States) 651:list of Television-related deletion discussions 1083:intended) as part of the overall evaluation. 185:Clear violations of copyright as detailed in 8: 671:Note: This debate has been included in the 649:Note: This debate has been included in the 673:list of Lists-related deletion discussions 670: 648: 1049:User:Moonriddengirl/Copyright in lists 18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion 7: 910:That argument in general seems like 1053:The 500 Greatest Albums of All Time 24: 842:Unacceptable use, Text example 5 960:The support for this action is 745:seems to me to be appropriate. 1117:10:40, 22 September 2011 (UTC) 1095:01:41, 22 September 2011 (UTC) 1072:10:12, 21 September 2011 (UTC) 1038:17:15, 20 September 2011 (UTC) 1017:14:13, 20 September 2011 (UTC) 1000:17:30, 19 September 2011 (UTC) 975:15:37, 19 September 2011 (UTC) 935:01:15, 19 September 2011 (UTC) 887:22:52, 18 September 2011 (UTC) 864:04:07, 21 September 2011 (UTC) 829:19:33, 18 September 2011 (UTC) 793:17:30, 18 September 2011 (UTC) 764:01:56, 18 September 2011 (UTC) 712:22:08, 17 September 2011 (UTC) 687:21:02, 17 September 2011 (UTC) 665:21:02, 17 September 2011 (UTC) 644:21:00, 17 September 2011 (UTC) 314:100 Greatest Christmas Moments 213:20:49, 17 September 2011 (UTC) 58:03:07, 25 September 2011 (UTC) 1: 452:The 50 Greatest Documentaries 193:". Articles are offshoots of 891:Problems with that argument: 544:Greatest Comedy Catchphrases 406:100 Greatest Kids' TV Shows 1155: 360:100 Greatest Scary Moments 268:The 100 Greatest Cartoons 1131:Please do not modify it. 896:the Billboard chart is " 850:following discussion at 498:50 Greatest Comedy Films 32:Please do not modify it. 774:100 Greatest TV Moments 72:100 Greatest TV Moments 64:100 Greatest TV Moments 808:100 Greatest/100 Worst 738:100 Greatest/100 Worst 222:100 Greatest Stand-Ups 195:100 Greatest/100 Worst 730:are still completely 945:a more current case 905:cannot be compared. 900:". In other words, 698:This edit rationale 1088: 928: 705: 680: 658: 637: 206: 44:The result was 1086: 949:sweat of the brow 926: 703: 689: 678: 667: 656: 635: 590:100 Worst Britons 204: 1146: 1133: 1092: 1089: 932: 929: 849: 847:added March 2011 825: 820: 815: 760: 755: 750: 709: 706: 684: 681: 662: 659: 641: 638: 631: 613: 585: 567: 539: 521: 493: 475: 447: 429: 401: 383: 355: 337: 309: 291: 263: 245: 210: 207: 180: 179: 165: 113: 95: 34: 1154: 1153: 1149: 1148: 1147: 1145: 1144: 1143: 1142: 1136:deletion review 1129: 1090: 1085: 930: 925: 845: 823: 818: 813: 798:According to a 758: 753: 748: 707: 702: 682: 677: 660: 655: 639: 634: 604: 588: 558: 542: 512: 496: 466: 450: 420: 404: 374: 358: 328: 312: 282: 266: 236: 220: 208: 203: 122: 86: 70: 67: 37:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 1152: 1150: 1141: 1140: 1125: 1124: 1123: 1122: 1121: 1120: 1119: 1114:Moonriddengirl 1101:transformative 1081: 1075: 1074: 1069:Moonriddengirl 1041: 1040: 1019: 1002: 984: 983: 982: 981: 980: 979: 978: 977: 958: 952: 938: 937: 915: 906: 892: 889: 869: 868: 867: 866: 770:Keep/merge all 767: 766: 715: 714: 691: 690: 668: 646: 632: 586: 540: 494: 448: 402: 356: 310: 264: 215: 183: 182: 119: 66: 61: 42: 41: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 1151: 1139: 1137: 1132: 1126: 1118: 1115: 1111: 1106: 1102: 1098: 1097: 1096: 1093: 1079: 1078: 1077: 1076: 1073: 1070: 1066: 1062: 1058: 1054: 1050: 1045: 1044: 1043: 1042: 1039: 1035: 1031: 1027: 1023: 1020: 1018: 1014: 1010: 1006: 1003: 1001: 997: 993: 989: 986: 985: 976: 972: 968: 963: 959: 956: 955:WP:OTHERSTUFF 953: 950: 946: 942: 941: 940: 939: 936: 933: 922: 918: 913: 912:WP:OTHERSTUFF 909: 903: 899: 895: 890: 888: 884: 880: 876: 871: 870: 865: 861: 857: 853: 848: 843: 839: 838:That footnote 836: 835: 834: 833: 832: 831: 830: 827: 826: 821: 816: 809: 805: 801: 797: 796: 795: 794: 790: 786: 782: 781: 775: 771: 765: 762: 761: 756: 751: 744: 739: 735: 731: 728: 724: 720: 717: 716: 713: 710: 699: 696: 693: 692: 688: 685: 674: 669: 666: 663: 652: 647: 645: 642: 629: 625: 621: 617: 612: 608: 603: 599: 595: 591: 587: 583: 579: 575: 571: 566: 562: 557: 553: 549: 545: 541: 537: 533: 529: 525: 520: 516: 511: 507: 503: 499: 495: 491: 487: 483: 479: 474: 470: 465: 461: 457: 453: 449: 445: 441: 437: 433: 428: 424: 419: 415: 411: 407: 403: 399: 395: 391: 387: 382: 378: 373: 369: 365: 361: 357: 353: 349: 345: 341: 336: 332: 327: 323: 319: 315: 311: 307: 303: 299: 295: 290: 286: 281: 277: 273: 269: 265: 261: 257: 253: 249: 244: 240: 235: 231: 227: 223: 219: 218: 217: 214: 211: 200: 196: 192: 188: 178: 174: 171: 168: 164: 160: 156: 153: 150: 147: 144: 141: 138: 135: 132: 128: 125: 124:Find sources: 120: 117: 111: 107: 103: 99: 94: 90: 85: 81: 77: 73: 69: 68: 65: 62: 60: 59: 55: 51: 47: 40: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 1130: 1127: 1104: 1060: 1021: 1004: 987: 920: 916: 907: 897: 893: 811: 778: 773: 769: 768: 746: 742: 737: 729: 721:. Following 718: 695:Further note 694: 190: 187:WP:FU#Text_2 184: 172: 166: 158: 151: 145: 139: 133: 123: 45: 43: 31: 28: 943:Looking at 149:free images 1005:Delete all 988:Delete all 734:notability 727:WP:COPYVIO 719:Delete all 50:Ironholds 1057:Time 100 1030:Novickas 856:Flatscan 800:footnote 116:View log 1022:Comment 921:the law 607:protect 602:history 561:protect 556:history 515:protect 510:history 469:protect 464:history 423:protect 418:history 377:protect 372:history 331:protect 326:history 285:protect 280:history 239:protect 234:history 155:WP refs 143:scholar 89:protect 84:history 1087:ŞůṜīΣĻ 1009:Dzlife 967:Warden 927:ŞůṜīΣĻ 879:Warden 804:WP:NFC 785:Warden 704:ŞůṜīΣĻ 679:ŞůṜīΣĻ 657:ŞůṜīΣĻ 636:ŞůṜīΣĻ 611:delete 565:delete 519:delete 473:delete 427:delete 381:delete 335:delete 289:delete 243:delete 205:ŞůṜīΣĻ 127:Google 93:delete 46:delete 962:WP:FU 819:Mario 814:Super 754:Mario 749:Super 628:views 620:watch 616:links 582:views 574:watch 570:links 536:views 528:watch 524:links 490:views 482:watch 478:links 444:views 436:watch 432:links 398:views 390:watch 386:links 352:views 344:watch 340:links 306:views 298:watch 294:links 260:views 252:watch 248:links 170:JSTOR 131:books 110:views 102:watch 98:links 16:< 1110:here 1091:¹98¹ 1034:talk 1013:talk 996:talk 971:talk 931:¹98¹ 883:talk 860:talk 844:was 789:talk 708:¹98¹ 683:¹98¹ 661:¹98¹ 640:¹98¹ 624:logs 598:talk 594:edit 578:logs 552:talk 548:edit 532:logs 506:talk 502:edit 486:logs 460:talk 456:edit 440:logs 414:talk 410:edit 394:logs 368:talk 364:edit 348:logs 322:talk 318:edit 302:logs 276:talk 272:edit 256:logs 230:talk 226:edit 209:¹98¹ 163:FENS 137:news 106:logs 80:talk 76:edit 54:talk 1061:she 992:Kww 840:on 824:Man 802:at 759:Man 189:: " 177:TWL 114:– ( 1105:is 1036:) 1028:. 1015:) 998:) 973:) 917:3: 908:2: 894:1: 885:) 862:) 791:) 783:. 743:is 675:. 653:. 626:| 622:| 618:| 614:| 609:| 605:| 600:| 596:| 580:| 576:| 572:| 568:| 563:| 559:| 554:| 550:| 534:| 530:| 526:| 522:| 517:| 513:| 508:| 504:| 488:| 484:| 480:| 476:| 471:| 467:| 462:| 458:| 442:| 438:| 434:| 430:| 425:| 421:| 416:| 412:| 396:| 392:| 388:| 384:| 379:| 375:| 370:| 366:| 350:| 346:| 342:| 338:| 333:| 329:| 324:| 320:| 304:| 300:| 296:| 292:| 287:| 283:| 278:| 274:| 258:| 254:| 250:| 246:| 241:| 237:| 232:| 228:| 201:) 157:) 108:| 104:| 100:| 96:| 91:| 87:| 82:| 78:| 56:) 48:. 1047:( 1032:( 1011:( 994:( 969:( 914:. 881:( 858:( 787:( 630:) 592:( 584:) 546:( 538:) 500:( 492:) 454:( 446:) 408:( 400:) 362:( 354:) 316:( 308:) 270:( 262:) 224:( 181:) 173:· 167:· 159:· 152:· 146:· 140:· 134:· 129:( 121:( 118:) 112:) 74:( 52:(

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
deletion review
Ironholds
talk
03:07, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
100 Greatest TV Moments
100 Greatest TV Moments
edit
talk
history
protect
delete
links
watch
logs
views
View log
Google
books
news
scholar
free images
WP refs
FENS
JSTOR
TWL
WP:FU#Text_2
100 Greatest/100 Worst
Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/100 Greatest TV Moments from Hell
ŞůṜīΣĻ¹98¹

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