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:Articles for deletion/Japanese people in France - Knowledge

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mischaracterizing the sources), the English descriptions of the sources undercut the case for the subject's notability. It appears that the sources are, in order, a pamphlet from the Japanese ministry of foreign affairs (such as one might find for every country, giving only basic statistics and almost no narrative description, almost like a page out of a census), a short one to two-paragraph article in a Japanese newspaper, a single article testifying to the "invisibility" of the Japanese in France (hardly convincing evidence of notability), and three academic journal articles, which cannot be considered secondary sources for the general reader by any stretch.
191:- This seems like a notable population but the article is not very good yet. That doesn't mean we should instantly begin trying to delete a given article before consulting with the original author and attempting to source and improve it rather than instantly obliterating it and all possibility of improving it. A confrontational approach isn't always the best manner to proceed in such cases. 689:(Ethnic groups in France#Cultural anthropology based on the history of the ethnic community) a non-governmental source is cited in support of the claimed 11,000+ Japanese in France, without distinguishing between Japanese nationals (expatriates) and French citizens having some degree of Japanese ancestry; however, when I clicked on the 572:
Yeah, that's what I thought. It doesn't say anything about foreign language sources being as good as English language sources for notability purposes, in either direction, and is more or less agnostic on the question of verifiability. After reflection, I conclude that I stand by my original comment,
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for a partial list. I will expand the article and remove the unverifiable content sometime in the next few days. Also, nominating for deletion a 21-minute old article by a 23-minute old user, without making any effort to look for sources or otherwise help the user understand how to meet Knowledge's
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I am very leery of keeping an article based on sources which are almost entirely in a foreign language; this complicates questions of determining notability, verifiability, etc., to say the least. Furthermore, I would note that while I cannot read Japanese (and thus run the very real risk of
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Japanese people in France has a lot of sources? There are reliable sources available for dozens of ethnic groups existing in dozens of foreign countries -- the dispute is whether this is encyclopedic. We can start an article with reliable sources entitled
283:- though the article needs work, we're talking here about a substantial community (28 000, enough to populate a small town, not just a few hundred individuals), so one should look for more sources before nominating for deletion.-- 554:". If such English sources are not available then foreign language ones are fine. As far as notability goes there is nothing in the guidelines about the language of sources because notability doesn't depend on the language. 528:
Um. Apologies; are we reading the same policy? All I see is a remark to the effect that English language sources are to be preferred over non-English ones, and it certainly doesn't extend to questions of notability.
356:" are unconvincing. Quite a few specialist encyclopedias from reputable publishers see fit to cover the topic of "Fooians in Barland" for a wide variety of values of Foo and Bar. To give a small sample: 127:
The subject of this article has no merit. It is neither unique nor especially relevant. There are foreign nationals residing in all countries, and this article shall set a presedent for all
319:. I can find many articles that discuss the presence of police forces in various US cities, and using these sources to substantiate this article would be absurd. The same would be for 510:
is very clear that sources do not need to be in English, if they are available only in other languages. Just as notability does not decay with time, language is not a barrier to it. —
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I will change my "vote" if someone can help me understand how and why this article is distinguished from the others? My "vote" is partly informed by the following:
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Finally, the nominator's argument that "this article shall set a presedent for all permutations to exist" is just an extension of the usual
657:. Although consensus seems to favor keeping this article, I think it's probably useful for me to argue for deletion based on the following: 436: 385: 697: 402: 368: 300:. Concur with other keeps, this appears to be a notable minority and has enough sources with which one could write an article. -- 17: 419: 257: 78: 754: 736: 718: 649: 635: 617: 582: 563: 538: 519: 498: 474: 455: 339: 309: 292: 273: 225: 200: 182: 157: 139: 56: 732: 451: 269: 305: 690: 773: 573:
including the parts on the quality of the existing sources, which, IMO amount to less than substantial coverage.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
550:. What you see is that, for verifiability, English language sources are to be preferred over non-English ones " 353: 35:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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The Australian People: An Encyclopedia of the Nation, Its People and Their Origins, Cambridge University Press
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By the fact that this has actual sources which discuss the topic non-trivially. Please read and understand
728: 559: 470: 447: 328: 265: 515: 301: 196: 700:(MOFA) does not include specific numbers of Japanese expatriates in Japan and Japanese-French at 631: 578: 534: 494: 178: 153: 626:. Perfect example of very good article topic. Article quality is not a reason for deletion. - 555: 466: 433: 416: 399: 382: 365: 221: 29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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fr:Groupes ethniques de France#Anthropologie culturelle basée sur la communauté historique
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Encyclopedia of Japanese Descendants in the Americas: An Illustrated History of the Nikkei
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fallacy. Any human migration articles created in the future stand or fall based on the
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assuming the availability of an English-language source of equal quality
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as yet another example of non-notable "Fooian Barian" ethnic groups.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
465:. Those all look like potentially notable subject for articles. 394:
Ember, Marvin; Ember, Carol R.; Haggard, Martin, eds. (2005),
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multiple instances of non-trivial coverage in reliable sources
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web page cited, the information line in the chart was blank.
331:. Sources do not necessarily support encyclopedability. 115: 104: 100: 96: 704:, in contrast with similar pages for other countries. 709:
For me, this subject is not an easy one to parse. --
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standards for inclusion, goes against the spirit of
168:list of Ethnic groups-related deletion discussions 672:Knowledge:Articles for deletion/Japanese Jamaican 667:Knowledge:Articles for deletion/Japanese Guyanese 39:). No further edits should be made to this page. 776:). No further edits should be made to this page. 396:Encyclopedia of Diasporas: Overviews and Topics 8: 189:Use discussion before proposing for deletion 211:list of France-related deletion discussions 603:list of Japan-related deletion discussions 601:: This debate has been included in the 362:The Encyclopedia of the Chinese Overseas 209:: This debate has been included in the 166:: This debate has been included in the 7: 698:Japanese Ministry of Foreign Affairs 352:Vague appeals to your own sense of " 264:, not on the basis of this article. 24: 413:Encyclopedia of Canada's Peoples 643:per arguments already made. ··· 415:, University of Toronto Press, 377:Inouye, Daniel K., ed. (2002), 18:Knowledge:Articles for deletion 411:Magocsi, Paul R., ed. (1998), 1: 755:16:13, 8 December 2008 (UTC) 737:15:17, 8 December 2008 (UTC) 719:16:13, 8 December 2008 (UTC) 650:00:25, 8 December 2008 (UTC) 636:00:24, 6 December 2008 (UTC) 618:12:09, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 583:19:27, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 564:19:19, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 539:17:16, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 520:15:16, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 499:09:07, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 475:19:19, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 456:04:44, 5 December 2008 (UTC) 364:, Harvard University Press, 340:23:39, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 310:18:07, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 293:16:17, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 274:09:25, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 262:general notability guideline 226:08:38, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 201:05:36, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 183:05:33, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 158:05:31, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 140:05:05, 4 December 2008 (UTC) 57:02:12, 9 December 2008 (UTC) 741:Yes, thanks. I will review 702:MOFA France-Japan Relations 793: 321:Jewish people in Australia 428:Jupp, James, ed. (2001), 71:Japanese people in France 63:Japanese people in France 769:Please do not modify it. 325:Black people in Manitoba 317:Police forces in America 32:Please do not modify it. 360:Pan, Lynn, ed. (1995), 258:WP:OTHERCRAPDOESNTEXIST 329:Homosexuals in Haiti 381:, Rowman Altamira, 354:unencyclopedability 254:WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS 44:The result was 620: 606: 228: 214: 185: 171: 784: 771: 647: 607: 597: 441: 438:978-0-52180789-0 424: 407: 390: 387:978-0-75910149-4 373: 336: 302:Hemlock Martinis 215: 205: 172: 162: 136: 118: 112: 94: 53: 34: 792: 791: 787: 786: 785: 783: 782: 781: 780: 774:deletion review 767: 745:later today. -- 645: 439: 427: 422: 410: 405: 393: 388: 376: 371: 359: 334: 134: 114: 85: 69: 66: 51: 37:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 790: 788: 779: 778: 762: 761: 760: 759: 758: 757: 707: 706: 705: 694: 691:Joshua Project 678: 677: 676: 675: 674: 669: 659: 658: 652: 638: 621: 594: 593: 592: 591: 590: 589: 588: 587: 586: 585: 567: 566: 542: 541: 523: 522: 502: 501: 482: 481: 480: 479: 478: 477: 459: 458: 444: 443: 442: 437: 425: 420: 408: 404:978-0306483219 403: 391: 386: 374: 370:978-0674252202 369: 345: 344: 343: 342: 295: 277: 276: 249: 248: 229: 203: 186: 160: 125: 124: 65: 60: 42: 41: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 789: 777: 775: 770: 764: 763: 756: 752: 748: 744: 740: 739: 738: 734: 730: 726: 722: 721: 720: 716: 712: 708: 703: 699: 695: 692: 688: 687: 683:According to 682: 681: 679: 673: 670: 668: 665: 664: 663: 662: 661: 660: 656: 653: 651: 648: 642: 639: 637: 633: 629: 625: 622: 619: 615: 611: 604: 600: 596: 595: 584: 580: 576: 571: 570: 569: 568: 565: 561: 557: 553: 549: 546: 545: 544: 543: 540: 536: 532: 527: 526: 525: 524: 521: 517: 513: 509: 506: 505: 504: 503: 500: 496: 492: 487: 484: 483: 476: 472: 468: 464: 461: 460: 457: 453: 449: 445: 440: 435: 431: 426: 423: 418: 414: 409: 406: 401: 397: 392: 389: 384: 380: 375: 372: 367: 363: 358: 357: 355: 351: 350: 349: 348: 347: 346: 341: 338: 337: 330: 326: 322: 318: 313: 312: 311: 307: 303: 299: 296: 294: 290: 286: 282: 279: 278: 275: 271: 267: 263: 259: 255: 251: 250: 246: 241: 237: 233: 230: 227: 223: 219: 212: 208: 204: 202: 198: 194: 190: 187: 184: 180: 176: 169: 165: 161: 159: 155: 151: 147: 144: 143: 142: 141: 138: 137: 130: 122: 117: 110: 106: 102: 98: 93: 89: 84: 80: 76: 72: 68: 67: 64: 61: 59: 58: 55: 54: 47: 40: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 768: 765: 684: 654: 640: 623: 598: 556:Phil Bridger 551: 547: 485: 467:Phil Bridger 462: 429: 412: 398:, Springer, 395: 378: 361: 332: 297: 280: 231: 206: 188: 163: 145: 132: 129:permutations 126: 49: 45: 43: 31: 28: 512:Quasirandom 421:0802029388 335:DRosenbach 234:Topic has 135:DRosenbach 131:to exist. 446:Regards, 218:• Gene93k 193:Badagnani 628:Darwinek 575:RayAYang 531:RayAYang 491:RayAYang 240:see here 175:RayAYang 150:RayAYang 121:View log 548:Comment 486:Comment 463:Comment 245:WP:BITE 88:protect 83:history 52:MBisanz 747:Tenmei 711:Tenmei 655:Delete 285:Boffob 146:Delete 116:delete 92:delete 119:) – ( 109:views 101:watch 97:links 16:< 751:talk 743:WP:N 733:talk 725:WP:N 715:talk 696:The 641:Keep 632:talk 624:Keep 614:talk 599:Note 579:talk 560:talk 535:talk 516:talk 508:WP:V 495:talk 471:talk 452:talk 434:ISBN 417:ISBN 400:ISBN 383:ISBN 366:ISBN 306:talk 298:Keep 289:talk 281:Keep 270:talk 232:Keep 222:talk 207:Note 197:talk 179:talk 164:Note 154:talk 105:logs 79:talk 75:edit 46:keep 729:cab 646:日本穣 610:Fg2 605:. 448:cab 327:or 266:cab 216:-- 213:. 173:-- 170:. 753:) 735:) 727:. 717:) 634:) 616:) 581:) 562:) 537:) 518:) 497:) 473:) 454:) 432:, 323:, 308:) 291:) 272:) 238:; 224:) 199:) 181:) 156:) 107:| 103:| 99:| 95:| 90:| 86:| 81:| 77:| 48:. 749:( 731:( 713:( 630:( 612:( 608:— 577:( 558:( 533:( 514:( 493:( 469:( 450:( 304:( 287:( 268:( 256:/ 247:. 220:( 195:( 177:( 152:( 123:) 113:( 111:) 73:(

Index

Knowledge:Articles for deletion
deletion review
MBisanz
02:12, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
Japanese people in France
Japanese people in France
edit
talk
history
protect
delete
links
watch
logs
views
delete
View log
permutations
DRosenbach
05:05, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
RayAYang
talk
05:31, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
list of Ethnic groups-related deletion discussions
RayAYang
talk
05:33, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
Badagnani
talk
05:36, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

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