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ruler travels the world giving speeches and making appearances, or is in the press all the time for other reasons. One cannot automatically equate a wife of some king to a "First Lady" of the US or the spouse or heir of a
British monarch as having "a public position that is notable in its own right." (Seems like there should have been some press coverage of Hassan marring "Lalla#1" and "Lalla#2," both in 1961. Was it sort of a double wedding?) Google news archive had only a handful of passing references to her, listing her as the mother of her offspring, not sufficient to support of
882:@Phil - the citations you have presented do not assert a requirement that this person warrants their own Knowledge (XXG) biography, so my moved to a position of redirect is unaltered - nothing is lost with a redirect - all the detail currently in the article is already in the husbands article - if someone reliably expands the detail there about this wife then a case can easily be made to recreatew a bio under her name - right now from presented evidence here they seem notable in the husbands bio only or a mention in a list.
926:. The coverage highlighted by Phil Bridger is likely to get it over the line, in my view. When the "Hammou" is dropped from searches there is a fair bit out there, although admittedly not in a huge amount of depth/ Add to that a reasonable expectation of more coverage in the subject's native language (Arabic) and a separate article is warranted. --
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on the basis of multiple instances of significant coverage in reliable and independent sources, especially in small countries, and especially if they are somewhat closed societies. Being a family member of a ruler does not automatically make someone a public official. Not every family member of every
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that discuss them, often there are entire biographical books on them. The point here is that the subject of this article has virtually no mention anywhere in books or other key sources. No one is suggesting that she be eliminated from the encyclopedia, merely that she be described in a section in
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The wife of someone notable - unworthy of her own article - some contentious uncited also in the article - templated uncited since ten months - If someone can assert she really exists and was married to him then I support a deletion and then a protected redirect to stop this article being recreated,
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As I said, she was first lady for 39yrs with the title "Mother of the princes" (King Hassan II only had one wife), and that constitutes enough notability in the royal case. If this gets deleted than all first ladies articles should be. With the exception of
Hillary Clinton, i don't see any other
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It has been consistent practice that immediate family of heads of state and usually heads of government are notable. The attempt to change this consistent practice is inappropriate, for there is always both importance and interest. For an area where sourcing is difficult for us, the extent of
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The (possibly imprisoned?) mother of the current king whose brother attempted to kill King Hasan II is a non-notable...? ...and Iron Man's enemy "Whiplash" isn't? You guys are beyond laughable with all your little codes - it's breathtaking. "Knowledge (XXG) is Second Life for
Corporations"
497:: <<does not apply, to situations where the fact of having a relationship to another person inherently defines a public position that is notable in its own right, such as a national First Lady. In other words "Inherited notability alone is not necessarily enough notability.": -->
943:: Fascinating, I added a few references to the article. Though she has less coverage than a normal spouse of a king might have, she has coverage for being so kept out of the public eye, which has not escaped frequent attention. There's nothing gained by deleting this article.--
439:- Not sure I agree with DGG that " The immediate family of ruling monarchs are notable" some Kings have scores of children, do all the children warrant WP articles? of course not. I suggest that immed family members of national leaders are notable
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Well she certainly exists since her son is the current king of
Morocco. Article is worthy of existence in my opinion given that she is a member of the Royal house of Morocco and was "First lady of Morocco" for 39 years.
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The notability guidelines don't say - all wives of heads of state are notable. I can't find any mention of such a clause in the notability guidelines? Would you please point me to where it is asserted, thanks.
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per
Noleander. I don't see any policy stating that such people are automatically notable, and also note that all of the couple's children have articles; I'd make a pretty good guess that most
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960:- thanks for the improvements. The privacy content is not really about her, more about privacy in general. Anyways, if its kept, which is looking likely at least is sourcing is improved.
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780:(@Off2riorob and Black Kite) I moved the discussion on from the claim that such people are automatically notable. How do the sources that I linked not satisfy the
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806:(with my ropey translation skills) that the majority of the book mentions are in terms of her relationship to other people - mainly Hassan and her son.
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appears to have virtually no mention in Google Books. The best solution, in my opinion, is to include mention of her in the
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as the wife of a head of state she is notable as per both DGG, and
Noleander along with the coverage found by Phil Bridger.
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article but it is uncited there as far as I can see - anyway this person is not wiki notable and shouldn't have a BLP here.
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sourcing needs to be relaxed, or we will never escape WP:Cultural bias. WP:V is of course necessary, and has been met.
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560:. Some "royal families" where the rulers have multiple wives are so large that it is doubtful all members satisfy
528:"With the exception of Hillary Clinton, i don't see any other first ladies worthy of any notability on their own."
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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586:. The subject seems to be more commonly known as just "Lalla Latifa", so these sources should be considered:
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I looked at those. Even the newspaper article admitted that she is hardly ever seen in public, whilst I
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By that you mean that the article of an active head of state should be deleted too? Good guess indeed
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without coverage, nothing is notable, and I'm not seeing any coverage, certainly not to the level of
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Obviously not, hence my use of the word "most". I will however strike the "all" to make it clearer.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
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to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
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to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
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A link to the policy, guideline, or essay you are citing would be helpful.
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first ladies worthy of any notability on their own. This is exactly why
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if not then delete and salt. I notice the detail about her is in
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
662:. Lalla Latifa did undertake public duties covered by the press,
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Each of the first ladies that have WP articles have hundreds of
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sources discuss the family member in a significant way (such as
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It seems that she really exists and was married to Hassan II.
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the King's article, and this article redirect to that. --
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I agree with your suggestion of a protected redirect (to
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The immediate family of ruling monarchs are notable.
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837:Discussion has shifted, best to let it continue. -
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413:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
300:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
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39:). No further edits should be made to this page.
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459:article, where she is already mentioned. --
236:Note: This debate has been included in the
213:Note: This debate has been included in the
238:list of Africa-related deletion discussions
215:list of People-related deletion discussions
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569:. Where is coverage of her personally?
665:and is covered on 5 separate pages of
476:- I agree with Noleander's comments.
18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
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730:of these are in a similar position.
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782:general notability guideline
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526:It is not accurate to say
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980:Please do not modify it.
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32:Please do not modify it.
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962:Off2riorob
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451:, etc).
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946:Milowent
828:Relisted
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404:Relisted
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111:View log
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748:Tachfin
620:WP refs
608:scholar
584:Comment
514:Tachfin
441:only if
380:Comment
333:--: -->
320:Tachfin
150:WP refs
138:scholar
84:protect
79:history
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903:Delete
592:Google
571:Edison
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562:WP:BIO
554:Delete
384:Edison
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88:delete
868:talk
635:JSTOR
596:books
498:: -->
371:talk
267:). --
165:JSTOR
126:books
105:views
97:watch
93:links
16:<
966:talk
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684:Keep
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660:Keep
651:talk
628:FENS
602:news
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501:here
491:Keep
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361:Keep
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48:. ˉˉ
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