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characters (etc.) in all fiction, notable or not, would be indiscriminate. , or even a list of all characters significant or not which have appeared in notable fiction. But the double limitation here makes it justifiable. "Magical attributes" is a clear distinction, applying to almost all of the characters listed -- as is telekinesis and superhuman speeds. Parasites is unquestionably defined. If individual entries are challenged, they can be discussed in the talk pages. I point out that for almost all of this the work itself is a reliable source, and if sourcing is thought needed, an appropriate line from the work would do. (with respect to the argument about categories, lists and categories are complementary--lists have the advantage of indicating the work, which categories generally cannot, & are thus much better suited for browsing, a key function of lists.)
1018:. I'm not accepting the arguments that these cross-categorizations are encyclopaedic. There are too many fictional characters in notable works who use magic for this list to reach any feasible level of completion, and for categorizing characters which meet the general notabiilty guideline, a category would arguably preferable, although I am aware that these lists were created due to the categories being deleted as overly arbitary. --
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976:- problem with eg telekinesis is that in some stories, characters use magic (or indistinguishable-from-magic technology) to move things around, yet our common idea of telekinesis usually involves mysterious "mental powers". It's not obvious whether magic would count. It might be possible to restrict to e.g. characters referred to as having telekinetic power in secondary literature.
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as I'm not seeing a policy based reason to delete (unless something has changed "corresponding categories that duplicate the functionality" isn't a reason to delete as lists and categories can go hand-in-hand.. The List of fictional magic users I'd personally not mind seeing go away as it's probably
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That sounds a very reasonable argument for the magic-related lists; the "parasites" one seems rather different (it's certainly the odd one out in the batch), do you think that what you said works quite so well for them? There are certainly very many magic-using characters but I should think a list of
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If people put effort creating some useful/verifiable content for some readers, people may simply ignore, keep or just improve the page instead wasting time on talk page/AFD debates in long term. My point: whatever you say, the comparative article/categories are valuable and informative for comic fans
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on the others as directory style listings better handled by categories. I continue to be of the belief that straight lists of articles (as opposed to ordered lists or those with extensive discussion about inclusion criteria or the nature of each entry) that duplicate categories are neither necessary
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and make the necessary improvements. list of significant characters with a defined attribute in notable fiction is appropriate. Many of the characters on the lists are not merely significant, but notable, with
Knowledge (XXG) articles about them. This is farfrom Indiscriminate: a list of magical
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fictional parasites. The distinction is that there is an attempt being made to make the parasites list something more than indiscriminate. The other three are wasted opportunities that follow the boring "click on the blue link" format. Most of the superhero articles, with tables to explain that
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Knowledge (XXG) has some unique features that cannot be accomplished anywhere else. Yet, people constantly try deleting info valuable for specific users or specific needs. Lots of much more important and extensive comparison table and list based articles about comics have already been deleted. My
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valid to consider whether a page does no harm. It is really important for people to work out whether an article is doing harm, please please please don't criticize someone for taking time to think about harm implications at AFD, even if they're conclusion is that the article isn't harmful. (If
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The justification offered by Axel
Titanium for deleting this is "these lists are not appropriate content on Knowledge (XXG). It seems they have corresponding categories that duplicate the functionality of this list as well." Neither of these are reasons to delete and general references to
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do not make them so. Numerous editors have asserted that these lists are appropriate and Axel has shot them down by referring to policy and demanded they justify why these lists should be kept. In fact it is Axel's job to justify why they should be deleted and he has not done so.
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I don't see how the list of fictional parasites belongs in this group, that something totally different. Should've been nominated separately. There is nothing wrong with these list, they helping with navigation, and being far more desirable than a category would be.
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non-maintainable and adding something about each character (which would make the list more useful than the category) would be really painful at this point. That's not a policy based reason to delete, but it is enough for me to stay neutral on.
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all others. it's not that big and the fictional parasites on there have individual notability, if only someone would take the sources from the other articles and put it into this list. Plus, the gaming parasites even have reception here:
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Knowledge (XXG) policies are not clear, AFD discussions mostly based on a few or a few dozen coincidental users' opinion who happen to read via AFD tag or watchlist since most of the AFD's don't have a proper notification
424:, and numerous other AFDs linked from those discussions, these lists are not appropriate content on Knowledge (XXG). It seems they have corresponding categories that duplicate the functionality of this list as well.
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Marvel Comics and DC Comics were, indeed, comic books, got deleted during the summer. Obviously, "List of fictional characters who can move at superhuman speeds" got away because it could move so quickly.
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DGG isn't saying that primary sources give notability - he's mentioning primary sources only to point out that they can be used to check whether each list item possesses the defining attribute, that's all.
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84:. I will userfy if someone wants to make these into categories. There were a lot of !votes either way, but upon reviewing it I realized that many of the Keep votes were not particularly valid. I saw
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Even most of the AFD guidelines or AFD nominating steps are very vague, AFD nominating is easy with 1 button, but creating or keeping info is harder since there are various deletionist users around.
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applies) lists of this nature are not in line with the guidelines nor should
Knowledge (XXG) be including all these lists. Kind of hinting at the idea of non-encyclopedic cross-categorizations. --
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First of all I thank nominator for notifying users kindly. Lots of AFD nominators does not bother spending time on notifying others and prefer a small AFD with a few people.
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someone's entire rationale is "Keep, no harm done" that's not a good rationale, and you're well within your rights to say so, but this isn't what Dream Focus has done here.)
833:(although no category simply called "Comics characters who can move at superhuman speeds"-- perhaps the Marvel ones deal with relevant social issues at superhuman speeds).
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If anyone shows signs of wanting to work on these over the next seven days, then I'd say to reconsider on whichever ones have that quality. Some do have categories, with
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per DGG. I found his rationale convincing. I think that it might be necessary to impose harsher inclusion criteria on the list than he suggests, but that is feasible.
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1253:- though it looks silly to me, if people have gone to all the effort to make this list, clearly it is important to some people, and should be kept.
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Kind of stupid, but I don't see any reason not to have this list. There is no problem with defining "fictional" and "magic" to determine the list.
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I think you misunderstand. How a list is defined is one thing. How the categories virtually duplicate through cross-categorizations is another. --
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with an explicit intention that it should not be proposed for deletion. These parasites should be accessible within
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Your argument stems from saying the list-members are notable, which makes the list notable, but notability is not
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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e.g. species/families of animals. I see that some of those have already survived AfD with a Keep decision, see
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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while many types of reference lists are more than worthy of inclusion on
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I don't see any reason not to ignore your !vote since you don't seem to provide any "keep" rationale.
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/Lists of fictional characters by superhuman feature or ability
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but a list is better than a category. I acknowledge that it needs work, and suggest a Rescue. -
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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http://www.gamepro.com/article/features/211647/10-most-blood-curdling-video-game-parasites/
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Big problem is inclusion criteria, keep "parasites" as clear, others need careful thought
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664:, the only way I can see this article being kept is if it were renamed to something like
800:(if it could count prose in lists) ratio of at least 40% prose size(text only)/wikitext.
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112:. The lists rely too much on original research. However, consensus seems to be to keep
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Yet there is no place users can change Wiki policies effectively as individuals.
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No, his main argument was about navigation implications (list vs category as in
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The rest I think are on TV tropes right? So they'd be fine to delete. Sincerely
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Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/List of fictional characters who can fly
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Useful page/category for comic fans/researchers. Not useful to anyone else.
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668:, but then a criteria would have to be placed to see who would qualify. -
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1062:. I don't think we can say the same about the parasite article though.
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Category:Lists of fictional characters by superhuman feature or ability
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nor helpful but have not generally seen a consensus for such a view.
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Having both a list and a category for the same thing is common on WP.
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Articles for deletion/List of fictional magic users (2nd nomination)
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Category:Marvel Comics characters who can move at superhuman speeds
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especially if all listed characters are already in a category. --
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Fictional parasites should definitely be considered separately.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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Category:DC Comics characters who can move at superhuman speeds
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List of fictional characters who can move at superhuman speeds
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seems to do the job just fine. This article also fails per
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fictional magic users, telekinesis and superhuman speeds;
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magic users, telekinetic folks and superhuman speedsters;
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which refers to others. It was created as a result of a
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Articles for deletion/List of fictional magic users
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36:
1315:filceolaire
1292:TheGrappler
1234:TheGrappler
1119:TheGrappler
1033:TheGrappler
978:TheGrappler
765:Weak Delete
238:free images
110:directories
1008:Delete all
770:Eluchil404
1269:WP:EFFORT
1207:WP:NOHARM
1079:Keep all
1056:WP:NOTDIR
1016:WP:NOTDIR
916:WP:USEFUL
835:Mandsford
798:prosesize
721:• Gene93k
695:• Gene93k
646:Mandsford
551:Fayenatic
102:WP:EFFORT
94:WP:USEFUL
1350:Category
1310:WP:IINFO
1174:Keep all
1060:WP:IINFO
1020:Claritas
1012:WP:IINFO
960:Spatulli
943:all but
902:Kasaalan
805:or else
199:View log
895:system.
884:point:
384:protect
379:history
338:protect
333:history
292:protect
287:history
244:WP refs
232:scholar
172:protect
167:history
1255:Wxidea
1225:WP:CLT
1066:Snotty
1048:Delete
952:WP:GNG
941:Delete
920:WP:ATA
856:Delete
811:Lexein
807:delete
735:Delete
654:Delete
637:Delete
554:(talk)
495:Borock
465:Borock
440:Delete
416:. Per
388:delete
342:delete
296:delete
216:Google
176:delete
77:, but
75:delete
1196:Focus
1141:Hobit
1090:talk
528:Keep
405:views
397:watch
393:links
359:views
351:watch
347:links
313:views
305:watch
301:links
259:JSTOR
220:books
193:views
185:watch
181:links
79:keep
16:<
1319:talk
1305:Keep
1296:talk
1277:talk
1259:talk
1251:Keep
1238:talk
1215:talk
1163:talk
1145:talk
1123:talk
1108:talk
1069:Wong
1058:and
1052:keep
1037:talk
1014:and
1010:per
997:talk
982:talk
964:talk
945:keep
928:talk
906:talk
878:Keep
869:talk
854:and
849:Keep
829:and
815:talk
796:Per
774:talk
755:talk
725:talk
710:Note
699:talk
684:Note
674:talk
641:keep
627:talk
621:. --
615:Note
604:talk
589:Note
578:talk
563:Note
513:talk
499:talk
485:talk
469:talk
461:Keep
452:talk
430:talk
401:logs
375:talk
371:edit
355:logs
329:talk
325:edit
309:logs
283:talk
279:edit
252:FENS
226:news
189:logs
163:talk
159:edit
108:and
1085:DGG
719:--
693:--
266:TWL
201:•
197:– (
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118:—
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