Knowledge (XXG)

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443:" Merger is not deletion and so this a matter of ordinary editing. As for the facts of the matter, I don't see why the print runs of religious works or the thoughts of Chairman Mao should be any less well-documented than the works of authors like Charles Dickens, which were pirated in the USA and are long out of copyright. Sales and printing are both grounded in particular technologies and modes of business. What about library loans? What about digital downloads? We have many 218:- even its lead misrepresents the contents as there are no book series in the content. Few readers are going to realise there are two articles and I'd lost track of that fact myself. It's out of date for that reason. If there is a desire to have a list of books for these four religious books and the words of Chairman Mao, set up such a list as that seems to be the only thing distinguishing the two. The last AfD didn't fix the problem. 489:. This would be a sortable list with several columns for a variety of relevant statistics including: print run, editions, translations, unit sales, revenue, &c. These are all common measures of success for a book and so it makes sense to combine them rather than bicker about the use of a particular one. Doing this would be a matter of ordinary editing in which we would preserve the existing content per our 240:. While that list is regularly maintained and expanded(although all help is welcome!), the list of most-printed books is only used as a battle-ground between different religions (and a few people trying to maintain NPOV like Dougweller), with the result that the last 100 edits, going back six months, contain nothing but edits to Bible and Qu'ran to change numbers, authors, ... 507:
It would make more sense to have a separate short list for the religious and political books (or two separate ones). The list we are discussing here though is just for 99% an old copy of the best-selling list, so that a few books could be included and be edit-warred about (indicating just how hard it
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This discussion makes me uncomfortable because of the idea that we should delete the page because it's only used for edit-warring. The trouble is that if we ever start to delete pages because people edit-war, then we're creating an incentive for people to edit-war when they want a page deleted.
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is to get some acceptable numbers and information on these crammed into such a list). Remove the 99% abandoned copy, rename the list to "List of religious books", and let those interested in it edit war until the end of time (which, according to some of them, is near anyway ;-) ).
273:: I got here from Fram's talk page. These figures don't seem to be reliable. Mao's figure is incorrect too. There is hardly any scope because this list doesn't cover all books, editors may have cherry picked the listings. There are no actual estimates of Qur'an and Bible. 82: 183: 309:
However, OccultZone makes a decisive point in favour of deletion. Print run figures for the various holy books are not available and will never be available, so the figures given for the top books on the page fail
246:, one of them another religious book with discussion about the author, and one uncontroversial addition. No figures were changed for any book. Meanwhile (in a shorter period, since December 2012), 77: 314:. That's a failure of a core policy which it's impossible to fix: the entries have to be removed. And once you remove the unverifiable entries, all you've got left is a duplicate of the 177: 143: 357: 471:, are you actually calling for a merge? If so, would you change your !vote to that because if we keep the article then merging is often objected to by those who !voted keep. 136: 431:
The idea that we should have a list of the most numerous books which excludes the leading candidates such as the Bible is absurd. If this is a content-fork of the
236:. For the reasons stated by Dougweller. This list was set up as a way to include religious and political books, which are excluded for a number of reasons from the 377: 109: 104: 113: 254:
POV fork, where no one is interested in maintaining the list but some people are using it as the battleground to edit war over religious truth and precedence.
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and it seems clear that the total size of the print run is a notable way of doing this. The list should therefore be kept in some form per
198: 330:. But I think we should be clear that this isn't because of user conduct issues, it's because the page can never be policy compliant.— 165: 17: 343: 290: 159: 250:
are the changes to the original list; this means that the list of most-printed books is now not just a POV fork, but an
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If the content fork was unjustified, the more recent article should be merged back into the main article.
538: 486: 171: 36: 490: 405: 494: 476: 468: 452: 339: 286: 223: 191: 409: 448: 436: 243:. Since the end of the previous AfD and today, nearly two years later, only two books were added 417: 385: 365: 29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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User conduct issues should never be a factor in deciding whether to delete a page.
130: 509: 255: 53: 52:. If anyone wants to create a redirect at this title, be my guest. 83:
Articles for deletion/List of most-printed books (2nd nomination)
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
247: 244: 241: 126: 122: 118: 190: 204: 404:. I reviewed the edit history. This seems like a 43:). No further edits should be made to this page. 545:). No further edits should be made to this page. 78:Articles for deletion/List of most-printed books 358:list of Literature-related deletion discussions 8: 376:Note: This debate has been included in the 356:Note: This debate has been included in the 378:list of Lists-related deletion discussions 375: 355: 75: 18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion 7: 74: 24: 1: 562: 433:list of best-selling books 328:List of best-selling books 316:List of best-selling books 238:List of best-selling books 216:List of best-selling books 214:This is a content fork of 93:List of most-printed books 68:List of most-printed books 518:06:45, 20 June 2014 (UTC) 503:22:38, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 485:My preference would be a 481:20:44, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 461:18:13, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 422:16:24, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 390:15:18, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 370:15:18, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 348:14:22, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 300:11:51, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 264:10:11, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 228:09:55, 19 June 2014 (UTC) 62:13:21, 28 June 2014 (UTC) 534:Please do not modify it. 32:Please do not modify it. 73:AfDs for this article: 487:list of popular books 408:on which to hang a 439:, the remedy is " 392: 372: 346: 298: 553: 536: 338: 336: 284: 281: 278: 209: 208: 194: 146: 134: 116: 48:The result was 34: 561: 560: 556: 555: 554: 552: 551: 550: 549: 543:deletion review 532: 332: 279: 276: 151: 142: 107: 91: 88: 71: 41:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 559: 557: 548: 547: 527: 526: 525: 524: 523: 522: 521: 520: 491:editing policy 445:lists of books 425: 424: 394: 393: 373: 352: 351: 303: 302: 267: 266: 212: 211: 148: 87: 86: 85: 80: 72: 70: 65: 46: 45: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 558: 546: 544: 540: 535: 529: 528: 519: 515: 511: 506: 505: 504: 500: 496: 492: 488: 484: 483: 482: 478: 474: 470: 467: 464: 463: 462: 458: 454: 450: 446: 442: 438: 434: 430: 427: 426: 423: 419: 415: 411: 407: 403: 399: 396: 395: 391: 387: 383: 379: 374: 371: 367: 363: 359: 354: 353: 350: 349: 345: 341: 337: 335: 329: 325: 321: 318:. We should 317: 313: 305: 304: 301: 296: 292: 291:Contributions 288: 283: 282: 272: 269: 268: 265: 261: 257: 253: 249: 245: 242: 239: 235: 232: 231: 230: 229: 225: 221: 217: 207: 203: 200: 197: 193: 189: 185: 182: 179: 176: 173: 170: 167: 164: 161: 157: 154: 153:Find sources: 149: 145: 141: 138: 132: 128: 124: 120: 115: 111: 106: 102: 98: 94: 90: 89: 84: 81: 79: 76: 69: 66: 64: 63: 59: 55: 51: 44: 42: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 533: 530: 465: 440: 428: 400:per nom and 397: 333: 323: 319: 308: 275: 270: 251: 233: 213: 201: 195: 187: 180: 174: 168: 162: 152: 139: 49: 47: 31: 28: 406:WP:COATRACK 178:free images 473:Dougweller 435:then, per 334:S Marshall 220:Dougweller 539:talk page 410:WP:BATTLE 382:• Gene93k 362:• Gene93k 322:and then 37:talk page 541:or in a 449:WP:LISTN 437:WP:CFORK 324:redirect 252:outdated 137:View log 39:or in a 466:Comment 414:SW3 5DL 402:WP:FORK 326:to the 184:WP refs 172:scholar 110:protect 105:history 495:Andrew 469:Andrew 453:Andrew 398:Delete 320:delete 277:Occult 271:Delete 234:Delete 156:Google 114:delete 50:delete 248:these 199:JSTOR 160:books 144:Stats 131:views 123:watch 119:links 16:< 514:talk 510:Fram 499:talk 477:talk 457:talk 429:Keep 418:talk 386:talk 366:talk 312:WP:V 287:Talk 280:Zone 260:talk 256:Fram 224:talk 192:FENS 166:news 127:logs 101:talk 97:edit 58:talk 54:Deor 295:Log 206:TWL 135:– ( 516:) 501:) 493:. 479:) 459:) 451:. 420:) 412:. 388:) 380:. 368:) 360:. 293:• 289:• 262:) 226:) 186:) 129:| 125:| 121:| 117:| 112:| 108:| 103:| 99:| 60:) 512:( 497:( 475:( 455:( 416:( 384:( 364:( 344:C 342:/ 340:T 297:) 285:( 258:( 222:( 210:) 202:· 196:· 188:· 181:· 175:· 169:· 163:· 158:( 150:( 147:) 140:· 133:) 95:( 56:(

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
talk page
deletion review
Deor
talk
13:21, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
List of most-printed books
Articles for deletion/List of most-printed books
Articles for deletion/List of most-printed books (2nd nomination)
List of most-printed books
edit
talk
history
protect
delete
links
watch
logs
views
View log
Stats
Google
books
news
scholar
free images
WP refs
FENS
JSTOR
TWL

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