267:. While it is correct that it does not trump GNG, it is a guideline that creates a presumption. Therefore we presume sources exist unless given a valid reason otherwise. Her qualification was 9 years ago. Online, that is a long time. A Google search for "2008 National Finals Rodeo" and "2008 NFR" yields only about 3,500 collective results results while a search for "2016 National Finals Rodeo" and "2016 NFR" collectively yields about 25,000 collective results. I think the presumption is not just the coverage received by competing at the NFR, but the results that got a cowboy/cowgirl there (e.g., the rodeos they won that season and the coverage in newspapers and the like that those wins produced). Is anyone really going to go to the medium-sized town newspaper archives from a decade ago to determine if there is coverage? No. If this were for a 2015 or 2016 qualifier, I would think a show cause would be fair. But due to the age of this subjects top athletic prime, I think we need to have the presumption carry weight. And as a reminder, the community of editors came up with the guideline to give the presumption - the stance that this is on par to competing on America's Got Talent and only winners are notable goes directly against what the editors established as the guideline. GNG does trump, but when GNG is not able to be reasonable assessed, as is the case here, then we should follow the wishes of the community of editors and keep.
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So there were a total of ten wins that season (counting
Caldwell). If Caldwell produced the result that we can find, I think we can presume at least some of these other rodeos would produce similar results if someone whet through the local newspaper archives. Also, the Texas Circuit Finals and the
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for a stand-alone article or list." Note the "if". So the burden is on you to find the actual source material -- the number of qualifying wins are irrelevant, the issue is if these wins got enough coverage to warrant a stand-alone article per GNG: ""Presumed" means that significant coverage in
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because, bottom line, the article in its present state is not going to cut it. If she had been covered -- say, articles like "favored person's horse tripped and she came in 10th, what a tragedy", that might be coverage sufficient to convey notability. Or, if she has articles profiling her in a
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Individual is non-notable. I am also from wiki project equine and knowledgeable about rodeo. One qualification for the NFR is non-notable in this case. NRODEO does not make notable here. If she was notable, perhaps the article would not be a few sentence stub. There are not enough sources or
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Unfortunately, "We can probably find sources somewhere, someday, and until then, we keep" is, sad to say, not what works at AfD, at least for people in the modern age (for a pre-google age person who was famous in, say, the 1960s, one or two articles plus stats might cut it, but not in the
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While the NSPORTS "qualifying for the highest national-level event" is a well-known standard across multiple sports, GNG still must be met. WP:N is policy; NRODEO is a guideline--it explains to the uninitiated editor which rodeos are considered the nationally significant
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that is, at best, pretty weak. When you search "Wrangler NFR" and "Stephanie Fryar" and Barrel racing (which I needed to do to filter out all the other people named
Stephanie Fryar), I got 188 hits, most of which were lists of stats. Now if you
430:, Guess what? I wrote much of what is now at NRODEO, shepherded through the changes, and I am quite familiar with the topic of rodeo. I actually am generally an inclusionist, but I really didn't see significant coverage here when I did my
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Window Rock, AZ rodeo had prize funds similar to
Caldwell, so if nothing else we can be confident that three sources exist - one for each of those rodeos. We have the presumption and the facts line up that the sources exist.
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information, but they do not, even collectively, get you to "Significant coverage" -- which "is more than a trivial mention". (per GNG: "more than a trivial mention, but it does not need to be the main topic of the source
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After my comment above, I decided to research this a bit further. Rodeo season runs Oct-Sept with the exception of the NFR in Dec. Winning the
Caldwell Nights Rodeo produced this result that is in the article
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Compare to her father's article that you worked on, note I did NOT AfD it, because though it is a poor-quality stub, his accomplishments qualify, and there is enough evidence that there is more coverage to be
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if she'd won the NFR, she'd be notable, but she just qualified, which a lot of people do. It's like competing on
America's Got Talent versus winning the million dollars.
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and see if you have significant coverage , go for it. My mind can be changed if you find more sources like the
Caldwell news piece, but so far, I'm not convinced.
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fits the standard of "significant coverage in a third-party source independent of the subject", that's not quite enough, standing alone. You may want to read
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First AfD was not reviewed by members of
Wikiproject Equine. This individual is completely non-notable... NRODEO is a guide, not a policy that trumps GNG.
288:. I think that is a quality source. So I checked the rodeo association archives to see what else she won the year she qualifier for the NFR:
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There are few hits for Fryar -- the only thing I found at WP:BEFORE that is more that a stats sheet is
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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She qualified for the NFR once, nine years ago, and placed 10th. She's done nothing since.
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Articles for deletion/Stephanie Fryar (2nd nomination)
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