1428:, as noted above, is the most sensible course of action. I don't see that there is enough notable information about the brand itself to warrant a separate article. A vast majority of people who come to Knowledge (XXG) for information about Panadol will almost certainly be looking for information about the drug (the active ingredient) rather than anything particular to the branded product.
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as a source? this is exactly the point. What independent sources are there they show there is anything notable about this brand? The article about
Tylenol makes sense - the cyanide poisonings happened which led to lots of coverage of the brand in independent sources, as well as damage to the brand's
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is a marketing success and satisfies the general notability guidelines, but there is still a strong case for a merge: a reader can find all the drug information in one place, (also easy for experienced pharma editors to watch) and there can still be a supporting article about the leading brand names
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In my view all that Winner42 has done is say that a lot of it gets sold and not provided anything beyond trivia. Knowledge (XXG) is not a directory nor an indiscriminate collection of facts. All the article is, is a listing of countries where it is sold and various formulations, with a little bit
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and then worldwide, we end up with a lot of duplication of information. Every one of them is a redirect to the generic, and that is desirable and per guideline, to avoid duplication of information. Being widely used does not indicate a reason to create separate articles on every trade name; any
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We do not need a seperate article for each brand name of acetaminophen. When someone types in a brandname they are looking for information about the medication. They are not looking for a discussion of the brand. Thus the term panadol should redirect to paracetamol. What we need is a series of
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The existence of independent sources shows that an article with this name is feasible. The question that should also be asked is "Is it desirable?". I have seen no argument above that indicates why the few sources unique to
Panadol should not be discussed in the article for the generic drug,
682:. From a medical standpoint no. The activity of Panadol is no different from generic paracetamol. From a business standpoint and given the large global sales of Panadol, it very well may be. Is there any thing unique and notable about the marketing of Panadol (for example
949:, etc. And per Boghog's comment that the recall made it notable, we don't have a vioxx article in spite of the laypress using vioxx rather than Rofecoxib when that scandal happened. There is nothing in this article that can't be accommodated at paracetamol.
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and their marketing success (or otherwise). Some of these brands proved their significance by outselling generics for decades after patents expire, but it is easier to read about all these in one place, rather than in individual articles about each brand. --
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In most cases, I would suggest an article about a specific brand for a drug should be merged with the article for that drug. That may be best here. However, Panadol seems to me one of the few cases where the brand is significant in itself, as per Winner 42.
873:. Indeed, Panadol is already mentioned in the Paracetamol article five times, in the infobox, the lead and the history section, as well as being prominently featured in an image. Isn't that enough advertisement for a commercial brand name already?
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of
Knowledge (XXG)'s notability guidelines. Only the times article could possibly be construed to be about the active ingredient rather than the brand. All the remaining sources are independent and all significantly discuss the brand. See
442:. If you dislike the superbrand report, (which actually cites HouseholdPanel – LMRB which is independent) there are many, many others. For example the product has the largest market share of any pain reliever in Australia
904:? at what point do we draw the line? as I'm sure someone can find sources for all of them. Without a good reason for an exception to our article-naming guideline, this topic should exist solely within the existing
1100:- a separate article under one brand name is not needed. If it were found that panadol differed significantly from paracetamol then it would warrant a separate article. Right now it just seems like promotion for
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to contain content specific to the product. This is a good general approach - certainly there are quite a few drugs whose advertising or business aspects are notable independent of the compound itself.
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also already exists and has 107 entries to date. How many of these deserve entries according to the arguments espoused above? We're being asked to retain an article on the brand name of the
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the conversation.com article is not about panadol - it is about analgesics in general. (this is what i mean about people being confused) all you have is a pile of trivia about a product.
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were all the brand names of X are discussed in detail for those who care. These brandnames would be linked from society and culture section. And guess what we have an article called
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As explained by RexxS, we don't need hundreds of articles on trade names, and we have a guideline to use INN. Tylenol is notable for an extreme incident; we don't have articles on
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488:, is notable - it absolutely is; people seem to get easily confused about that. and a blip of a recall over a wrong label is not notable. i do not see how this brand is notable.
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states: "If a topic has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject, it is presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list."
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information that needs to be include a specific brand name can be included in the generic article. Trade name articles for drugs should be the exception (as in the
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there is nothing notable about this particular brand; the article says nothing notable about it - it just provides a bunch of indiscriminate detail. Contrast with
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1069:, so, at least unless more noteworthy stuff comes to light or until the brand is involved in a lot more noteworthy events, I oppose the creation of
1553:. Antonyhcole and Doc James have it exactly right. The brand names article is short, and will benefit from the couple of paragraphs currently at
1445:. Given how significant and widespread the brand is I still maintain that a separate article is completely acceptable and indeed desirable. --
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I also weighed in on business guidelines which seems to have been completely lost. There does not need to be any duplication of information.
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227:. An incredibly common brand of paracetamol in many countries. Why on earth would we want to delete it? Makes no sense whatsoever. --
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The three recent recalls of panadol (late 2013, mid 2014, and last month) was also widely covered by a large number of news sources.
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right now. Adding hatenotes IMO is IMO undue weight. These are subpages of paracetamol rather than article on par with paracetamol.
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either, because the argument still holds that information that is distinct about this one specific brand name can be accomodated at
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To the arguments above about
Panadol being a widely used drug, here are, as an example, the top prescribed medications in the US
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but, as the various formulations include other active ingredients, it seems reasonable to keep this separate to make this clear.
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It appears this AfD was not properly thought out before it was posted. I am not seeing much value in continuing the discussion.
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with similar shares in other non-western countries. Can you tell me what specific deletion criteria that this article fails?
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888:. The INN for Panadol is Paracetamol and that is how our MOS tells us it should be titled. I should add that the article
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most of your sources there are about the active ingredient, not the brand. there is no doubt that the active ingredient,
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Also, I'm pinging the editors who weighed in here before the pharmacy and medicine guidelines were pointed out:
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That it covered significantly in reliable sources? For example it has 91% of the pain reliever market share in
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We shouldn't set up a situation where we might end up with duplicate information across hundreds of articles.
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Yes we have been seeing a lot of people trying to create spam articles based on brand names of medications.
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finds dozens of examples of significant coverage in reliable sources. I still fail to see how this fails
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We should just link to these article in the lead of the paracetamol article IMO such as we do with
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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because there is plenty of noteworthy stuff to say about that brand that would overwhelm
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the brand is so widespread and significant that a separate article on it is relevant.
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reputation, and how J&J managed it. Anyway, your vote to "keep" is clear.
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Just adding, relevant to the discussion below: I support the recent move of
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Knowledge (XXG):Manual of Style/Medicine-related_articles #Article titles
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I think the sources I just added to the article, as well as coverage in
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at 28%. They've also come under pressure for misleading marketing claims
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This is only the top 10 in the US; if we extend that to the top 100,
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indicated familiartity with the
Medicine and Pharmacy guidelines.
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as per Sandy and James, ensuring hat notes are in place to handle
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Just to note, the page on
Tylenol has just recently been moved to
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in the world by market share, with 21% of the global market share.
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The key question is whether
Panadol is independently notable from
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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is best. I am not seeing enough yet for a stand alone article.
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686:)? Are there any controversies specifically about Panadol?
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case per the cyanide poisonings) rather than the rule.
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for articles about drugs. Also, Kim
Kardashian's butt. --
648:. the various formulations are just triva that violates
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The brand is documented in detail in sources such as the
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is focused on the pharmacological activity of the drug,
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I hope it is clear, I still fail to see how this fails
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fails NOTABILITY, lack of independent sources so fails
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622:. The worst case would be merger with a page such as
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gives the following guidance for the article title:
730:Major recalls makes it independently notable. Also
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43:). No further edits should be made to this page.
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1755:list of Business-related deletion discussions
894:second largest selling non-narcotic analgesic
565:of Knowledge (XXG)'s notability guidelines."
246:list of Medicine-related deletion discussions
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1753:Note: This debate has been included in the
1511:Doc James' solution is a good one. Redirect
450:studies that they aren't better than placebo
244:Note: This debate has been included in the
268:What lack of independent sources? How does
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412:you are providing marketing material from
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644:I would definitely support a redirect to
709:Panadol is the 2nd largest non-narcotic
616:BMA Concise Guide to Medicine and Drugs
325:Knowledge (XXG):Deletion is not cleanup
1385:Looking at this more I think merge to
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18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
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1197:Okay IMO we should move Panadol to
1061:can be (and is) easily included in
620:Medicines: The Comprehensive Guide
302:. It is just a directory listing.
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1053:if we tried to include it all in
884:International Nonproprietary Name
734:. Needs to be added to article.
1271:List of paracetamol brand names
1165:List of paracetamol brand names
1067:List of paracetamol brand names
896:- so why not an article on the
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816:And that history is covered in
684:Panadol pharmaceutical markeing
349:what exactly is notable about
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982:(as clarified by Hrothulf).
452:and have recently faced some
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1205:. This is most inline with
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1275:Brand names of paracetamol
1265:I'm not convinced we need
1371:on the business aspects.
1776:Please do not modify it.
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32:Please do not modify it.
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980:Paracetamol brand names
561:how this article fails
513:how this article fails
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1013:recommends using the
927:Kim Kardashian's butt
849:Speedy Keep and Close
276:fail the golden rule/
1638:according to WebMD.
1307:And Adoil Descended
853:And Adoil Descended
1578:Merge and redirect
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1543:paracetamol
1519:and create
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1365:Paracetamol
1249:paracetamol
1211:WP:PHARMMOS
1203:paracetamol
1063:Paracetamol
1055:Paracetamol
1051:Paracetamol
972:paracetamol
932:Paracetamol
908:article. --
906:Paracetamol
871:Paracetamol
818:Paracetamol
723:Talk to me!
680:paracetamol
646:paracetamol
624:paracetamol
576:Talk to me!
529:Talk to me!
486:Paracetamol
475:Talk to me!
401:Talk to me!
342:Talk to me!
287:Talk to me!
266:Strong Keep
166:free images
1591:come howl!
1464:Necrothesp
1447:Necrothesp
1317:Bondegezou
1286:Necrothesp
785:Bondegezou
711:analgesics
250:Necrothesp
229:Necrothesp
1781:talk page
1759:• Gene93k
1709:Synthroid
1611:Doc James
1473:Winner 42
1393:Doc James
1293:Winner 42
1217:Doc James
1207:WP:MEDMOS
1171:Doc James
1129:Doc James
1011:WP:MEDMOS
947:synthroid
929:Merge to
900:, or the
780:Weak keep
757:this book
719:Winner 42
676:Weak keep
628:Andrew D.
572:Winner 42
525:Winner 42
471:Winner 42
397:Winner 42
389:Sri Lanka
351:the brand
338:Winner 42
283:Winner 42
50:merge to
37:talk page
1783:or in a
1699:Remicade
1689:Neulasta
1659:Cymbalta
1621:contribs
1584:issues.
1539:Redirect
1403:contribs
1227:contribs
1181:contribs
1139:contribs
1110:Мандичка
1083:contribs
1027:contribs
968:Redirect
925:Classic
830:contribs
370:contribs
358:unsigned
125:View log
39:or in a
1738:Georgia
1719:Vyvanse
1704:Sovaldi
1654:Crestor
1644:Abilify
1564:Hroðulf
1559:Panadol
1555:Panadol
1513:Panadol
1460:Comment
1443:Comment
1430:Deli nk
1369:Panadol
1342:Georgia
1253:Deli nk
1245:Tylenol
1059:Panadol
1043:Tylenol
988:Georgia
955:Georgia
672:Comment
362:Jytdog
300:Tylenol
172:WP refs
160:scholar
98:protect
93:history
81:Panadol
73:Panadol
62:Faraone
1694:Nexium
1684:Lyrica
1674:Humira
1669:Enbrel
1664:Diovan
1491:Jytdog
1468:Boghog
1373:Boghog
1324:Boghog
943:prozac
902:fourth
804:Jytdog
761:WP:GNG
736:Boghog
705:Boghog
688:Boghog
654:Jytdog
567:WP:GNG
553:Jytdog
538:Jytdog
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490:Jytdog
457:recall
440:WP:GNG
434:Jytdog
419:Jytdog
383:Jytdog
333:WP:GNG
319:Jytdog
304:Jytdog
278:WP:GNG
211:Jytdog
144:Google
102:delete
1735:Sandy
1625:email
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1231:email
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119:views
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107:links
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