330:. In this case, it sounds like you are writing about your own invention or discovery, and I haven't been able to find any outside published sources to back it up. The usual places I look for information about a medical device or process are PubMed and Google Scholar; I looked, but those search engines found nothing about use of this technique for back pain. In fact the only article I found about "vibration analgesia" in either archive was an article about using the technique to relieve the pain of heel-sticks in infants; nothing about back pain. I'm afraid this article will have to be deleted, for lack of references in reliable sources. I'm sure there are other places where you can publicize your discovery, but that's not what Knowledge (XXG) is for. See
705:
keeping a page which is contrary to our policies and guidelines, whether as an article or as a user space page. Userfication is appropriate for a page which, though currently unsuitable as an article, has the potential to be edited so as to be suitable, not, as in this case, for an article on a subject which does not satisfy the notability criteria. It may also be worth mentioning that allowing an unsuitable article to be preserved in user space with the intention of being kind to an inexperienced editor is likely to be a mistake. The effect is all too likely to be that the user is encouraged to spend more time on editing the article, only to see all that extra work thrown away when the page is deleted either at
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this article into an article about vibration analgesia in general, rather than limited to back pain, I think it might be worth trying. One way for you to do that would be to ask the closing administrator here to "userfy" the article to you. That means it would be removed from the
Knowledge (XXG) general pages and put into a private page for your use only. Then you could take as long as you like, rewriting and finding sources, and then when you have it in Knowledge (XXG) shape you ask to have it moved back to Knowledge (XXG). Does this approach appeal to you? --
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it less promotional. ii. declaring
Confilict of Interest as a person who has been testing the method in practice and in a specific condition - low back pain iii. improved the layout, busy wikifying the content adding internal links and pictures: and this is a delight as WIKIPEDIA is a treaure trove of wisdom and knowledge - this make even a person which is naive and gullible as I am much richer and happier. iv. added literary qotations that can be
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I have been able only due to your assistance/comments/criticism to spot a lot of serious mistakes I have made and removed them at once: i. any mention and information on the gadget I have been developing all those years using the method known and described by
Lundeberg's in the 80s removed - to make
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in general. I did see some published material about the technique - for example, during a heel-stick procedure in infants. It would require some actual verification in published sources; merely posting a link to a university or a professor is not the same as a reference. If you would like to convert
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Maybe I am a bit wordy butt being a disabled person having his secondd hand bedside PC as his sole life line to the society and community life outside his bedroom is a pretty effective and painful exclusion for anybody I think and so having a rare and precious opportuninty to discuss, dispute - even
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Being a disabled person - thank G. still not bedridden but confined to my bedroom only and the freedom of information offered by the web (the BBC and WIKIPEDIA, I am a modern maths lover, investigating the paradoxes of the zero set on other levels than e g vacuuous truth - prefering naive theory to
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where the vibration effects are demonstrated - for the difference from the back and spine, paravertebral areas in the above mentined
Lundeberg's work, on the volar forearm. This is in agreement with my own observations - having little if no importance and notablility but I dare to mention them - in
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I am happy to find your comments on my botched articled sentenced to deletion. I am trying as hard as I only can to absorb every word of advice I am given by all of you - and beside the way I do prefere tranparent full versions when discussing ( which is always a rare privilege when your partners
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I have developed and tested the first versions on myself and the process has taken some 10 years to get it such far that people who use it are happy that at least something simple and without side effects on kindney on liver is there. I am sorry if this true and precise information may sound like
48:. There does not yet seem to be sufficient material for an article. The possibility of an article on Vibration anaalgesia should be pursued, if there are in fact sufficient 3rd party sourcing. Whether this particulardevice is yet appropriate for mention in such an article would need discussion.
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Note please that my gadget uses a harmonic mix up of frequences not 100 Hz exactly, which adds to the higher efficiecy of the gadget. The flat brushless vibration units I have developed - which is what you rightly see as a new feature - are 10 to 12 cm apart from each other on both sides of the
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Insufficient notability, and sufficiently promotional that it could perhaps have been speedy-deleted. I sympathise with someone unacquainted with how
Knowledge (XXG) works coming here to promote their ideas and not realising that their work is likely to be deleted, but that is not a reason for
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Capekm, I realize you are acting in good faith and just trying to spread the word about something you think is valuable. However, that's not how
Knowledge (XXG) works. Knowledge (XXG) is an encyclopedia, a summary of what is already known - not a format for putting out brand new information. A
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to Capekm: I am not convinced that the subject "vibration analgesia and back pain" has enough outside coverage to be notable. In fact I could find nothing about the application of this technique to back pain. But from what I have seen I think there could be a notable article about
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an established
Medical Publisher and I have duly quoted this in references. Vibratory analgesia is a proven treatment method and my article tries - perhaps clumsily - to give information on a method that is an important alternative to eg
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What about your kind giving me a hand and starting this botched&bungled article from scratch, rewriting it? I mean something like the one on TENS as it is published in
Knowledge (XXG) already? Is it too insolent of me?
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getting a few positive words before having this prematurely born article disposed of me some power to go on - even if I feel losing energy and even frustration at times - but your comments are right and I fully accept
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Lundeberg T. A comparative study of the pain alleviating effect of vibratory stimulation, transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation, electroacupuncture and placebo. Am J Chin Med. 1984 Summer;12(1-4):72-9
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I have read these articles when my librarian (I am a disabled person and so they were very helpful to me then and made a thorough reseach for me those years ago when the web was not yet in practical use
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Now please let me know what can be be changed in addition to this and shall be happy to do so. And well I have to admit that I am a naive person as Mr
Haworth rightly puts it and a bit gullible at that
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I can go on with other sources supporting what is written in my article on vibration analgesia in back pain. This topic is covered by renomated and reputable researchers - not mine, e g:
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Lundeberg's works on vibration or vibratory analgesia are extensive and they spread across a time period of at least 20 years beginning in the 80th. I have quoted only one of of them, as
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And I am proud of having excellent advisors all the long way untill now and of being able to offer this reliable light and practical version of the gadget to low back pain sufferers.
515:, Medical Deputy Director of the Medical Faculty Hospital in Brno, the second largest hospital in the Czech Republic, specializing in pain research and treatment for twenty years
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the area of low back arch, but the dermatomes affected by analgesia may be as far from each other as cervical ones and lumbar ones - which is certainly a new observation,
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the axiomatic ZFC) is if far from easy for me to wwrite an article and in
English at that which in not my mother tongue so I am struggling heavily at times with language
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I would appreciate if I may be given a concrete hint what can be deleted - I have deleted the link to the site where WIKIPEDIA users could find out how to get the
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I would be happy to cooperate and discuss the article with you, making further changes as you may deem appropriate to get it into the WIKIPEDIA shape.
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I would rater move that page to AFC-space/userfy. The autor is really new and don't know how to edit correctly/know how our policies are working.
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Obviously I am not capable to put a good article together without a bit of help or advise of an Experienced Senior WIKIPEDIAN & Wikignome.
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Sorry for sounding a bit personal here - this may be well considered cause for deleting my post and this talk page altogeter.
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503:, Prague, Head of Pain Treatment and Research Center at the Medical Faculty of Charles University Motol Hospital in Prague
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if it hurts a bit if you know that your work is going to be disposed of and thrown away - is dear&welcome to me.
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Please Melanie, I were wondering if you could have a quick look at the diagram fig 6 vibration application points
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so Mr Haworth would be right calling my article SPAM in this regard too, hope I do not sound too disruptive here.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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whose uplifting words I am taking to my heart - it took me 10 years, including lots of experiments on myself.
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On the talk page the author naïvely states "my intention has been to inform Knowledge (XXG) users of the
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The notability criteria are one of the strongest WIKIPEDIA pillars - and I shall respect them.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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So I have made some basic reseach of the references for you as availabe on the web nowadays:
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I understand that this time you cannot rescue an article from deletion proposed by Mr Haworth
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are clever people, and all of you - no matter how much you dislike my article) rather than
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users meeting your standards in full, including the notability for a medical treatment.
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362:) found them for me but this method is now an out of date and a time consuming approach.
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that I have developed". That reads to me like an admission that the article is spam. —
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436:- sorry for talking about it - I have it round my waist now sitting at my bedside PC)
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if you can help me to put another article together covering this topic for
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respecting the basic rules that an article must not advertise anything.
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if Knowledge (XXG) users should get quality information from the source.
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Maybe you could not find the references backing up what I am writing -
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vibratory/vibration analgesia to be as effective in myalgic pain as
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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Lundeberg T. Vibratory stimulation for the alleviation of pain.
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You are right that I wanted to spread the word about something
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in Knowledge (XXG), proved valuable by clinical tests.
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Vibration reduces thermal pain in adjacent dermatomes.
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or at a second AfD when it is returned to mainspace.
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39:). No further edits should be made to this page.
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452:So what next after you have deleted the article?
369:this one is the most telling one on the subject
217:spam and do not know what can be changed on it
664:I think I may be able to get the article into
276:list of Medicine-related deletion discussions
239:THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE and feedback. --
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382:E, F and G application points in particular.
274:Note: This debate has been included in the
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389:. This is on the page 8 of this article
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464:To put an end to this rambling of mine:
18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
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328:multiple reliable published sources
387:as Ludeberg calls it paravertebral
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351:Thank you for reading my article.
74:Vibration analgesia and back pain
66:Vibration analgesia and back pain
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301:Mr Haworth is absolutely right
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610:ONCE AGAIN THANK YOU ALL, to
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513:Doc MUDr Lubomír Hakl, CSc
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675:verified online - PubMed.
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765:Please do not modify it.
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428:Lundeberg clearly prove
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501:MUDr Jiří Kozák, PhD
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