Knowledge (XXG)

:Articles for deletion/Youssef Barakat - Knowledge (XXG)

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would appear without doubt to be the top football/soccer league in Lebanon, and one would therefore assume that there is Lebanese media coverage out there regarding the league. The fact that we have so far been unable to find this coverage, that it isn't readily findable using Google, or that it isn't in English don't matter. We have plenty of articles which only or predominantly cite offline sources - perhaps if there are any Lebanese users active on enwiki we could ask them? (although perhaps that is better left to
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we cannot keep an article just in case sources exist and happen to back up the stance. It is not whether sources exist somewhere, it is whether they have been found. It is clearly not acceptable to keep an article because there "may" be reliable sources out there that prove notability and back up the
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League Football (soccer) in Lebanon." - opening sentence of the article (my emphasis). Just because it isn't supported by sources now, does not mean that the article should be deleted. My rationale for the assertion that sources are likely to exist is simple: whatever its other attributes, this
377:, which can do significant damage to someone's life if some unsourced claims are inserted (which is very likely given WP's current practices), the probably-not-notable should not be kept unless there is actual evidence that they meet our inclusion criteria — which we just don't have. – 401:. The question, as far as verifiability is concerned, is not whether "there are no reliable sources present, or have been found by the several users who have looked, to back up the LPL being fully-professional": it is whether such sources exist to verify the article content. 159:
any of the (little) information in the article. Although the Lebanese PL's pro status was debated by the Prod-contesting editor, there is no evidence that he ever even played in it, only that he was at one point in the squad of one team.
215:- I found that he has played in the Lebanese Premier League (per RSSSF), but I don't know if that league is fully-pro. We have very few English sources for this athlete, so it's difficult to know if he is notable. 417:. Please don't let start treating the verifiability and living persons content policies as somehow subservient to the notability guidelines, which are about whether such content should go into a separate article. 373:
assertions made here. What it comes down to is there are no reliable sources present, or have been found by the several users who have looked, to back up the LPL being fully-professional. Given that this is a
409:. The question of whether the Lebanese league is professional or not doesn't have any bearing on the fact that the contents of the article are verifiable, which is the standard for both 272:
is a core policy - if you think that "sources are likely to exist" could you perhaps present some? We have looked and can't find any, so I don't know what your assumption is based on. –
268:- can you please point me to where our article states that it is fully pro? I even did a search for the words "pro" and "professional" and it didn't pop up... am I being stupid? Plus, 247:
The article states that the subject has played in the Lebanese Premier League, and Knowledge (XXG)'s article on that league states that it is professional. Subject therefore satisfies
136: 364:- even if sources were theoretically available, we cannot speculate on their contents. We cannot assume that they prove either side of the argument, and since our core 319:
deleted from league article as that is unsupported by evidence. League season article is pretty much a single editor article lacking peer review or sources.
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for those wishing to assess this issue, the most recent version of the article including the 'professional' claim can be found
289: 370:"If no reliable, third-party sources can be found for an article topic, Knowledge (XXG) should not have an article on it." 468: 36: 402: 394: 467:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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per nom and others, having not played to required level per ATHLETE or achieved anything special besides.--
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
380: 275: 185: 163: 414: 374: 206: 86: 78: 152: 410: 365: 269: 156: 144: 292:"The 2005-06 Season of the Lebanese Premier League was the 58th season of Top-Flight 216: 209:. No evidence he has played in a pro-league so not notable. 21:36, 20 July 2009 (UTC) 346: 302: 252: 124: 251:, since even if sources are not currently cited it is likely that they exist. 405:
means verifiability of the article content, not verifiability of
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
151:, having not competed in a fully pro league, no coverage in 343: 131: 120: 116: 112: 182:'s list of association football related deletions. – 39:). No further edits should be made to this page. 471:). No further edits should be made to this page. 8: 393:. The previous editor seems to be confusing 48:. No sources have been found to prove that 323:makes no such claim of professionalism.-- 178:: This discussion has been included in 18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion 7: 24: 301:rather than an Afd discussion) 290:Lebanese Premier League 2005-06 1: 488: 454:11:17, 24 July 2009 (UTC) 427:21:53, 25 July 2009 (UTC) 386:15:35, 24 July 2009 (UTC) 375:living person's biography 355:14:14, 24 July 2009 (UTC) 335:11:17, 24 July 2009 (UTC) 311:22:43, 22 July 2009 (UTC) 281:16:25, 22 July 2009 (UTC) 261:15:26, 22 July 2009 (UTC) 240:08:24, 21 July 2009 (UTC) 225:21:43, 20 July 2009 (UTC) 191:21:20, 20 July 2009 (UTC) 169:21:11, 20 July 2009 (UTC) 73:23:09, 27 July 2009 (UTC) 464:Please do not modify it. 32:Please do not modify it. 50:Lebanese Premier League 368:clearly states that 366:verifiability policy 180:WikiProject Football 44:The result was 452: 333: 193: 52:is professional. 479: 466: 449: 443: 384: 330: 324: 279: 189: 174: 167: 153:reliable sources 134: 128: 110: 69: 64: 59: 34: 487: 486: 482: 481: 480: 478: 477: 476: 475: 469:deletion review 462: 447: 378: 328: 273: 183: 161: 130: 101: 87:Youssef Barakat 85: 82: 79:Youssef Barakat 67: 62: 57: 37:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 485: 483: 474: 473: 457: 456: 437: 436: 435: 434: 433: 432: 431: 430: 429: 359: 358: 357: 321:Parent article 242: 227: 210: 201:Clearly fails 195: 194: 155:and no way of 141: 140: 81: 76: 42: 41: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 484: 472: 470: 465: 459: 458: 455: 451: 450: 441: 438: 428: 424: 420: 416: 412: 408: 404: 403:Verifiability 400: 396: 395:verifiability 392: 389: 388: 387: 383: 382: 376: 371: 367: 363: 360: 356: 352: 348: 345: 341: 338: 337: 336: 332: 331: 322: 318: 315:reference to 314: 313: 312: 308: 304: 300: 295: 291: 287: 284: 283: 282: 278: 277: 271: 267: 264: 263: 262: 258: 254: 250: 246: 243: 241: 238: 235: 231: 228: 226: 222: 218: 214: 211: 208: 204: 200: 199:Speedy delete 197: 196: 192: 188: 187: 181: 177: 173: 172: 171: 170: 166: 165: 158: 154: 150: 146: 138: 133: 126: 122: 118: 114: 109: 105: 100: 96: 92: 88: 84: 83: 80: 77: 75: 74: 70: 65: 60: 55: 51: 47: 40: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 463: 460: 445: 444: 439: 419:Phil Bridger 390: 379: 369: 361: 339: 326: 325: 317:professional 316: 294:Professional 293: 285: 274: 265: 244: 229: 212: 198: 184: 175: 162: 142: 45: 43: 31: 28: 407:notability 399:notability 299:WP:CLEANUP 249:WP:ATHLETE 203:WP:ATHLETE 157:verifiying 149:WP:ATHLETE 232:per nom. 266:Question 217:Jogurney 137:View log 391:Comment 362:Comment 347:Cynical 303:Cynical 253:Cynical 237:Snowman 213:Comment 104:protect 99:history 54:King of 448:Oranje 440:Delete 415:WP:BLP 329:Oranje 286:Answer 230:Delete 207:WP:BIO 147:, and 143:Fails 132:delete 108:delete 46:delete 234:Giant 135:) – ( 125:views 117:watch 113:links 16:< 446:Club 423:talk 413:and 411:WP:V 397:and 381:Toon 351:talk 344:here 340:Note 327:Club 307:talk 276:Toon 270:WP:V 257:talk 245:Keep 221:talk 205:and 186:Toon 176:Note 164:Toon 145:WP:N 121:logs 95:talk 91:edit 425:) 353:) 309:) 288:: 259:) 223:) 160:– 123:| 119:| 115:| 111:| 106:| 102:| 97:| 93:| 71:♠ 421:( 349:( 305:( 255:( 219:( 139:) 129:( 127:) 89:( 68:♣ 63:♦ 58:♥

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
deletion review
Lebanese Premier League
King of



23:09, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
Youssef Barakat
Youssef Barakat
edit
talk
history
protect
delete
links
watch
logs
views
delete
View log
WP:N
WP:ATHLETE
reliable sources
verifiying
Toon
21:11, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
WikiProject Football
Toon
21:20, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

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