Knowledge (XXG)

:Categories for discussion/Log/2014 August 2 - Knowledge (XXG)

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1075:-- While we have a convention that alumni of merged institutions are deemed to be alumni of the successor. I apply that to renamed sports teams, but I think this would be taking it too far. VW, Ducati, and Bugatti are distinct brands. They may NOW be in common ownership, and but that implies a common parent, not merger. The category is not empty: it has an article on an aero-engine. Should it not have articles on engines for Bugatti cars too? However one category should be ample. 942:
cars, subcategories for vehicles, and parts should be left with the old name if they are identified with the old company, and parented to the new company at the highest reasonable level. Some might need dual parents if they were developed by the old company and marketed by the new one (Lets ignore Fiat/Chrysler here). In this case, there is no harm, and probably a lot of goodness by keeping the engine category and parenting it with
1093:. It is not clear that the various companies are tied together by more then acquiring the brand name and not the products. If that is correct, we really should have a category for each of the companies. Acquiring a brand and then effectively starting from scratch is not the same as a merger of two companies. But as I said, that is for after this close. If anything it builds the case for most of this not being upmerged to VW. 950:
as a parent? I'm not convinced since VW had nothing to do with the products. My understanding, which could be wrong is that anything new produced under the Bugatti nameplate will be made by VW and those should be in the VW categories with any car being in both the Bugatti and VW categories. But I'm
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splitting. At the moment this category is a jumble. The overseas locations need splitting out - they are not in the United Kingdom. Jersey, Guernsey and Man may not be legally be part of the United Kingdom but for the purposes of this category that is where they logically should be. Add a hatnote to
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As a general rule, I have opposed renames and upmerges when something is acquired by a new company or when a team moves. These are historic categories and for sports, the players on the old team may have never played on the new team. For engines the acquiring company may not build the engine in
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Corporations can be complicated because of the many parts. When a brand is acquired, then it needs to go into the categories for the new company. Any subcategories need to be reviewed on a case by case basis and not all just renamed at speedy, even if the top level category is. In the case of
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This category is being used for something wider than the scope implied by its name. The UK consists of the four home nations. Jersey, Guernsey and Man are all self-governing crown dependencies, belonging to the queen as monarch, with the advice of the Home Office. The rest used to be called
808:. These two categories contain only one article combined (and a redirect to that same article) so they serve no navigation function. There is no complete set of engines by automaker let alone engines by subsidiary. No objection to recreating later if/when the article count grows. 533:
colonies: they are now UK dependent territories, belonging to the queen as monarch, with the advice of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. An alternative might be to split out the dependencies, but the category is so large as to need splitting.
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I've struggled with this a lot for larger corporations too. When they buy a company, it ends up placing a large number of products and people under a company that were never made by them (or never worked for them). I don't have a good solution
630: 1479:-- WE do not need categories that will never have more than their main article. I suppose there may be room for sub-cats such as members of ... and legislation passed by ..., but until we do, these shouldbe merged. 1107:
I struggle with that too, for instance with Indian Motorcycles. Since categories are for navigation, people are likely to look by brand name even when that doesn't coincide with a specific company, in my opinion.
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do not necessarily have any right to enter UK. It is an imperfect solution, but I think it is much more sensible to treat the three dependencies as if they were part of UK, explaining the issue in a hatnote.
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which case it belongs in the old company category. I think we are seeing a trend in keeping old countries in the category trees for clarity and would like to see that expanded to more classes of categories.
200:- At what point in time do we distinguish "China" from "historical China"? I think that one of the other potentially pertinent conventions, though they are all far from ideal, would be more appropriate: 665: 668:
in general, and not just for football venues. Frankly, I am starting to think that a three-way split might be best: United Kingdom, British Overseas Territories, and the Crown dependencies. --
847:, but dubious about the dual upmerge as the only engines in the category long predate any association of the Bugatti brand name with the Volkswagen company. I see no reason why an upmerge to 551: 490: 42: 37: 1267: 201: 908: 752:
for deletion, but mis-pasted this in the nomination, so I don't think there is sufficient consensus to delete that, especially as keeping it meets Vegaswikian's objection. –
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I think that this is too broad of a cat, but if we don't delete, then it is need of some serious populating because dozens, if not hundred, of article are missing.
518: 645:-- Technically Black Falcon is correct. The three home Crown Dependencies are not part of UK. Nevertheless, travel between them and UK is unrstricted, whereas 522: 164: 1255: 160: 21: 1266:: Empty category; only article deleted per recent AfD. Category does not follow the established naming pattern of related family of categories, e.g., 1568:, though I caution against applying real-world classification schemes to fictional universes and against assuming that "humanoid" implies "human". -- 209: 94: 825: 1161:. I did remove the VW and motorcycle parents since the only content is aircraft engines and clearly they don't belong in either of those parents. 1594: 1279: 1247: 234: 1892:-- The lead sayts this is the second most popular character, so there ought to be an article on the most popular. At worst, merge to parent. 1795: 1238: 757: 498: 314: 137: 102: 17: 573: 205: 140:. Think about it, the initial category would mislead readers to think the category is for documentary television programs about China's past. 646: 221: 97:. There is a consensus to change from the current name, so I chose one of the existing naming patterns that exist for other countries. – 123: 1914: 1585: 749: 213: 1910: 912: 1822: 372: 217: 119: 1830: 1602: 1813: 1005: 341: 1957: 1771: 1743: 1553: 1525: 1326: 1298: 1218: 1190: 722: 694: 474: 446: 294: 266: 78: 1381: 1369: 1357: 915:. But how would that work with companies? Would we have different (sub)categories for each of the many owners of the 1377: 1365: 633:. Restricting the scope to British Overseas Territories only would exclude Jersey, Guernsey, and the Isle of Man. -- 1937: 1901: 1884: 1861: 1804: 1723: 1702: 1685: 1666: 1652: 1633: 1572: 1505: 1488: 1471: 1454: 1437: 1415: 1399: 1353: 1345: 1170: 1143: 1117: 1102: 1084: 1061: 1029: 960: 932: 898: 879: 860: 837: 766: 672: 659: 637: 621: 607: 598:
explain what the category is intended to cover and note that UK (in this category) is not used in its formal sense.
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and populate. I've added a few, but there are hundreds more. Animated characters by species seems reasonable.
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because it had no articles. Is your suggestion to keep the category but remove a parent category?
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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category, but I think this concern involves a broader realignment of corporate categories.)
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With sports teams, I think there is at least a clearer line: this player played for the
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as nominator did not tag the category. It has since been speedily deleted as empty. –
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Contains only one article with little likelihood of expansion. Categorize article as
1407: 991: 946:. Deletion needs to consider that it is a part of a series. Now does it also get 664:
That is true, but that is a change we should consider implementing at the level of
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Once this closes, it will be interesting to see what really should be done with
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Category:Football venues in British Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies
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If this passes, what will be the next step with the Japanese subcategories?
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories.
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who has been animated as well as seen in live action belong here or not?
1676:-- This is potentially useful as a container category if nothing else. 523:
Category:Football venues in the United Kingdom and dependent territories
916: 1875:, depending on what happens to the parent category nomination, above. 1256:
Category:University of Florida Gators' men's Cross Country athletes
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Category:University of Florida Gators' men's Cross Country athletes
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what additional articles would you populate these categories with?
398:, there is no category for the similar 'symbolic ethnicity'. -- 159:
now that I looked at the contents. Would also support renaming
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Seems like a good idea, given the current number of articles.
919:? {Again, I have no problem not upmerging this article to the 666:
Category:British Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies
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Category:Television shows set in historical periods of China
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and splitting this. Not opposed to your suggestion though.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
1917:. This is an excessive quadruple-intersection of object ( 1732:
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
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The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.
1496:-- There are not enough pages to fill these categories. 990:. To me it's pretty disorienting and nonsensical that a 552:
Category:Football venues in British Overseas Territories
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Category:Football venues in British Overseas Territories
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Category:Florida Gators women's cross country runners
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Category:Television series about the history of China
612:As nom, I am now supporting the last two comments. 1960:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1774:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1746:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1556:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1528:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1329:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1301:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1221:). No further edits should be made to this section. 1193:). No further edits should be made to this section. 725:). No further edits should be made to this section. 697:). No further edits should be made to this section. 477:). No further edits should be made to this section. 449:). No further edits should be made to this section. 297:). No further edits should be made to this section. 269:). No further edits should be made to this section. 81:). No further edits should be made to this section. 572:I would lean toward starting a sports category in 124:Category:Television shows set in historical China 519:Category:Football venues in the United Kingdom 493:, without prejudice to further nominations. – 456:Category:Football venues in the United Kingdom 1048:My original nomination proposed to eliminate 8: 1406:Seems reasonable, I'm not opposed to this. 1199: 165:Category:History of Manchuria in television 161:Category:History of Mongolia in television 824:and this discussion has been included in 210:Category:Chinese period television series 95:Category:Chinese period television series 18:Knowledge (XXG):Categories for discussion 1004:: how about for the time being we leave 704:Category:Bugatti engines and subcategory 375:. Editor2020 17:10, 2 August 2014 (UTC) 826:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Automobiles 218:Category:History of China in television 1157:is part of a well established series, 138:Category:Television shows set in China 120:Category:Chinese history in television 60:Category:Chinese history in television 998:be classified as "VW Group Engines". 647:British Overseas Territories citizens 574:Category:British Overseas Territories 206:Category:Historical television series 7: 222:Category:History of China in fiction 1814:Category:Indian animated characters 1753:Category:Indian animated characters 1657:Leave it be. It is far less broad. 1915:Category:Animated human characters 1586:Category:Animated human characters 1535:Category:Animated human characters 136:. C2C, and the parent category is 28: 1781:The result of the discussion was: 1563:The result of the discussion was: 1336:The result of the discussion was: 1228:The result of the discussion was: 750:Category:Bugatti aircraft engines 732:The result of the discussion was: 484:The result of the discussion was: 304:The result of the discussion was: 214:Category:Period television series 88:The result of the discussion was: 1911:Category:Fictional Indian people 1378:Category:11th Kenyan Parliament 1366:Category:10th Kenyan Parliament 550:Amended nomination - split out 381:: I have nothing against it. -- 1354:Category:9th Kenyan Parliament 1308:Category:Xth Kenyan Parliament 373:Category:Sociology of religion 1: 1805:13:30, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 843:No objection to the deleting 767:21:31, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 508:21:01, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 333:Category:Symbolic religiosity 276:Category:Symbolic religiosity 112:20:48, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 30: 1006:Category:Lamborghini engines 1938:03:13, 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rationale: 131:Nominator's rationale: 1264:Nominator's rationale 157:Support & Broaden 822:the category creator 1921:), character type ( 1919:fictional character 996:1980s Ducati engine 909:Washington Senators 851:wouldn't suffice. 1716:John Pack Lambert 840: 51: 50: 1968: 1951: 1877:RevelationDirect 1843: 1842: 1810:Propose deleting 1798: 1765: 1737: 1645:RevelationDirect 1615: 1614: 1582:Propose deleting 1547: 1519: 1447:RevelationDirect 1436: 1434: 1427: 1320: 1292: 1253:Propose deleting 1241: 1231:procedural close 1212: 1184: 1136:RevelationDirect 1133: 1110:RevelationDirect 1091:Category:Bugatti 1054:RevelationDirect 1047: 980:Category:Bugatti 944:Category:Bugatti 925:RevelationDirect 872:RevelationDirect 849:Category:Bugatti 830:RevelationDirect 819: 810:RevelationDirect 792:Propose Deleting 783:Category:Bugatti 772:Propose Deleting 760: 742:Category:Bugatti 716: 688: 578:RevelationDirect 501: 468: 440: 362: 361: 329:Propose deleting 317: 288: 260: 169:RevelationDirect 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me.-- 1419: 1417: 1413: 1409: 1405: 1404: 1401: 1398: 1394: 1390: 1387: 1383: 1379: 1376: 1373: 1371: 1367: 1364: 1361: 1359: 1355: 1352: 1349: 1348: 1347: 1344: 1340: 1337: 1334: 1333: 1330: 1328: 1324: 1319: 1313: 1312: 1307: 1302: 1300: 1296: 1291: 1285: 1284: 1282: 1281: 1277: 1273: 1269: 1265: 1257: 1254: 1251: 1250: 1249: 1246: 1243: 1242: 1236: 1232: 1229: 1226: 1225: 1222: 1220: 1216: 1211: 1205: 1204: 1194: 1192: 1188: 1183: 1177: 1176: 1172: 1168: 1164: 1160: 1156: 1152: 1149: 1145: 1141: 1137: 1131: 1130:Peterkingiron 1126: 1125:Clarification 1123: 1119: 1115: 1111: 1106: 1105: 1104: 1100: 1096: 1092: 1088: 1087: 1086: 1082: 1078: 1077:Peterkingiron 1074: 1071: 1070: 1063: 1059: 1055: 1051: 1045: 1044:Cloverleaf II 1040: 1039:Clarification 1037: 1036: 1035: 1034: 1031: 1027: 1023: 1022:Cloverleaf II 1019: 1015: 1011: 1007: 1003: 1002: 997: 993: 989: 985: 981: 977: 974: 973: 962: 958: 954: 949: 945: 940: 939: 938: 937: 934: 930: 926: 922: 918: 914: 910: 906: 905: 904: 903: 900: 896: 892: 887: 886: 885: 884: 881: 877: 873: 868: 867: 866: 865: 862: 858: 854: 850: 846: 842: 841: 839: 835: 831: 827: 823: 818: 815: 811: 807: 803: 800: 796: 793: 790: 788: 784: 780: 776: 773: 770: 769: 768: 765: 762: 761: 755: 751: 747: 743: 739: 736: 733: 730: 729: 726: 724: 720: 715: 709: 708: 703: 698: 696: 692: 687: 681: 680: 674: 671: 667: 663: 662: 661: 657: 653: 652:Peterkingiron 648: 644: 641: 639: 636: 632: 628: 625: 623: 619: 615: 614:Peterkingiron 611: 609: 605: 601: 596: 592: 589: 587: 583: 579: 575: 571: 568: 566: 565: 561: 557: 556:Peterkingiron 553: 548: 547: 544: 540: 536: 535:Peterkingiron 531: 528: 524: 520: 517: 516: 511: 510: 509: 506: 503: 502: 496: 492: 488: 485: 482: 481: 478: 476: 472: 467: 461: 460: 455: 450: 448: 444: 439: 433: 432: 426: 422: 418: 414: 411: 409: 405: 401: 397: 394: 392: 388: 384: 380: 377: 376: 374: 370: 367: 359: 355: 351: 347: 343: 339: 334: 330: 327: 326: 325: 322: 319: 318: 312: 308: 305: 302: 301: 298: 296: 292: 287: 281: 280: 275: 270: 268: 264: 259: 253: 252: 248: 244: 240: 236: 232: 230: 227: 223: 219: 215: 211: 207: 203: 199: 196: 192: 188: 184: 180: 179: 178: 174: 170: 166: 162: 158: 155: 154: 151: 147: 143: 139: 135: 132: 129: 125: 121: 118: 115: 114: 113: 110: 107: 106: 100: 96: 92: 89: 86: 85: 82: 80: 76: 71: 65: 64: 59: 54: 44: 41: 39: 33: 32: 23: 19: 1948: 1945: 1935:Black Falcon 1930: 1926: 1922: 1918: 1906: 1889: 1872: 1868: 1849: 1809: 1794: 1788:Black Falcon 1783: 1780: 1762: 1759: 1734: 1731: 1707: 1690: 1673: 1640: 1621: 1581: 1570:Black Falcon 1566:no consensus 1565: 1562: 1544: 1541: 1516: 1513: 1493: 1476: 1464:Marcocapelle 1462:nomination. 1459: 1442: 1431: 1424: 1388: 1374: 1362: 1350: 1338: 1335: 1317: 1314: 1289: 1286: 1263: 1262: 1252: 1237: 1230: 1227: 1209: 1206: 1181: 1178: 1150: 1124: 1072: 1038: 1000: 999: 983: 975: 911:but not the 853:Mighty Antar 801: 791: 779:Dual Upmerge 778: 771: 756: 734: 731: 713: 710: 685: 682: 670:Black Falcon 642: 635:Black Falcon 626: 594: 590: 569: 549: 529: 514: 512: 497: 486: 483: 465: 462: 437: 434: 417:Marcocapelle 415:nomination. 412: 395: 378: 368: 328: 313: 306: 303: 285: 282: 257: 254: 226:Black Falcon 197: 156: 133: 130: 116: 101: 90: 87: 69: 66: 1393:WP:OC#SMALL 1272:Dirtlawyer1 1163:Vegaswikian 1095:Vegaswikian 986:upmerge to 978:upmerge to 953:Vegaswikian 891:Vegaswikian 806:WP:SMALLCAT 239:NeoBatfreak 183:NeoBatfreak 142:NeoBatfreak 1001:Suggestion 593:renaming; 233:How about 1954:talk page 1931:animation 1792:Fayenatic 1768:talk page 1740:talk page 1550:talk page 1522:talk page 1323:talk page 1295:talk page 1235:Fayenatic 1215:talk page 1187:talk page 754:Fayenatic 719:talk page 691:talk page 495:Fayenatic 471:talk page 443:talk page 311:Fayenatic 291:talk page 263:talk page 99:Fayenatic 75:talk page 1956:or in a 1890:Populate 1873:Populate 1770:or in a 1742:or in a 1712:Superman 1708:Question 1641:Question 1552:or in a 1524:or in a 1397:Armbrust 1325:or in a 1297:or in a 1217:or in a 1189:or in a 1073:Populate 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1797:L 1718:( 1697:( 1680:( 1661:( 1647:( 1628:( 1613:) 1589:( 1500:( 1483:( 1466:( 1449:( 1410:( 1274:( 1240:L 1165:( 1138:( 1132:: 1128:@ 1112:( 1097:( 1079:( 1056:( 1046:: 1042:@ 1024:( 955:( 927:( 893:( 874:( 855:( 832:( 816:) 812:( 759:L 654:( 616:( 602:( 580:( 558:( 537:( 500:L 419:( 402:( 385:( 360:) 336:( 316:L 241:( 185:( 171:( 144:( 104:L

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Categories for discussion
Log
August 1
August 3
talk page
deletion review
Category:Chinese period television series
Fayenatic
L
ondon
20:48, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
Category:Chinese history in television
Category:Television shows set in historical China
Category:Television shows set in China
NeoBatfreak
talk
21:01, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
Category:History of Mongolia in television
Category:History of Manchuria in television
RevelationDirect
talk
21:34, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
NeoBatfreak
talk
05:11, 3 August 2014 (UTC)
Category:Television series about the history of China
Category:Historical television series
Category:Chinese period television series
Category:Period television series
Category:History of China in television

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