466:, those based on personal opinion only, those that are logically fallacious, and those that show no understanding of the matter of issue. If the discussion shows that some people think one policy is controlling, and some another, the closer is expected to close by judging which view has the predominant number of responsible Wikipedians supporting it, not personally select which is the better policy. The closer is not expected to decide the issue, just to judge the result of the debate, and is expected to know policy sufficiently to know what arguments are to be excluded as irrelevant. If the consensus of reasonable arguments is opposite to the closer's view, they are expected to decide according to the consensus. The closer is not to be a judge of the issue, but rather of the argument.
364:: Some processes, especially deletion-oriented pages, have a specified minimum length, typically of 7 full days. Other processes, especially Requests for Comments (RfCs), have typical lengths but no mandatory minimum. It is unusual for anyone to request a formal closure by an uninvolved editor unless the discussion has been open for at least one week. Similarly, if the discussion stopped, and editors have already assessed the consensus and moved on with their work, then there may be no need to formally close the discussion unless the process (e.g.,
380:: If additional comments, even weeks or months later, might be helpful, then don't close the conversation. Most conversations do not need to be closed. On the other hand, when further responses are likely to result in little more than wasting everyone's time by repeating the same widely held view, then it should be closed sooner rather than later. In between, wait to see whether enough information and analysis has been presented to make the outcome (including an outcome that editors do not agree) clear.
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everyone who reads the page has an opportunity to either leave the page as it is or change it. Editors begin discussions to resolve disagreements that cannot be easily resolved through the normal wiki-editing process. Many community discussions and decisions happen on project pages that are specifically designed for that purpose. If discussions involve several individuals, the discourse can become lengthy and the results hard to determine. After a while, it is time to
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discussion on the talk page. An uninvolved party might come up with a creative solution that addresses the concerns raised in the discussion. If it is a good solution, nothing needs to happen. There will be nothing more that is said, and everyone moves on. When this is the case, it often helps to leave a comment that the issue was resolved and perhaps link the edit that resolved the issue. On some pages, such as
81:
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1139:}} to start a review (refer to instructions in that template). In your reasoning, you should give a concrete description of how you believe the close was an inappropriate or unreasonable distillation of the discussion. You are more likely to succeed in your AN request if you focus on 1. an "underlying policy/guideline" and 2. "strength of argument". (See
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This page offers guidance on how and when discussions should be closed. There are no policies that directly dictate how to close a discussion. These information documents the customary practices that have evolved at
Knowledge in the years since it was started. These customs are grounded in the core
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Many informal discussions do not need closing. Often, consensus is reached in the discussion and the outcome is obvious. Disagreements in articles are often solved by further edits. For example, two or more individuals may disagree about how a section of text in an article is written and start a
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is when the discussion is moved into an archive area. This is usually done automatically by a bot, when no new comments have been added for a defined length of time. Most discussions go into Talk page archives with no need for a summary. However, sometimes an active issue will be archived while
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is
Knowledge's fundamental model for editorial decision-making. Policies and guidelines document communal consensus rather than creating it. Consensus is typically reached as a natural and inherent product of the wiki-editing process; generally someone makes a change to a page content, and then
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This format is designed specifically for closes involving written analysis or conclusions of the discussion. Either this format or the former is acceptable for closes involving analysis (which chosen is at the closers discretion), but this format should not be used for closes involving no
310:, decides that the discussion is irrelevant or disruptive. This practice is used quite often on pages that attract heated dispute, although there are no rules in place governing its use, and there are times when closing a discussion can create even more strife than had existed before.
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If you write only "There was no consensus", then editors may be confused about whether you meant that no general agreement was reached or if you were trying to find a gentle way to indicate that an idea was rejected. They may also disagree later about what, exactly, wasn't agreed to.
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Closing a discussion means putting a box around it for the purpose of discouraging further contributions to that discussion. Please do not close a discussion if you believe that further contributions (rather than starting a fresh discussion on the same subject) would be appropriate.
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editor may close most of them – not just admins. Generally, if you want to request closure by an uninvolved administrator, it's expected that the discussion will have already been open at least a week, and that the subject is particularly contentious or the outcome is unclear.
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All discussion closures are subject to review. Usually, reviews are initiated because someone disputes the outcome stated by the closing editor (e.g., a summary statement that some editors find confusing or incorrect), rather than the decision to discourage further discussion.
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Consensus is not determined by counting heads or counting votes, nor is it determined by the closer's own views about what action or outcome is most appropriate. The closer is there to judge the consensus of the community, after discarding irrelevant arguments: those that
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In uncontentious circumstances, even an involved editor may close a discussion. For example, if you propose something, and it's obvious to you that nobody agrees with you, then you can close the discussion, even though you're obviously an "involved"
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required to consult the closer of a deletion discussion (or the deleting admin for a speedy deletion) before starting a deletion review. However doing so is good practice, and can often save time and effort for all concerned. Notifying the closer is
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is to copy-paste the discussion back onto the original page and delete the discussion from the Talk archive. The discussion may then be summarized as normal. This enures that the summary of the discussion's outcome will be visible to the editors
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template is used to note that an issue has been resolved. The template is added to the beginning of the section, with notes that indicate what action was taken. This helps shorten the reading needed to scan the page. Similarly, the
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Sometimes, it is helpful for an editor to provide a summary statement of the outcome, if any, when closing the discussion. This optional statement may include both points of consensus and points that are not yet resolved.
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discussed how to appeal closures and whether an administrator can summarily overturn a non-administrator's closure. The consensus was that closures should not be reverted solely because the closer was not an
374:: The more contentious the subject, the longer this may take. Two signs of achieving this state are the same editors repeating themselves, and the rate of other editors joining the conversation is slowing.
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if an early closure is followed by multiple editors asking that it be reopened for further discussion, or a single editor has brought forth a compelling new perspective to the already closed discussion.
1066:, contact the editor who performed the closure and try to resolve the issue through discussion. If you are unable to resolve the issue through discussion with the closer, you may request review at the
1070:. Before requesting review, understand that review should not be used as an opportunity to re-argue the underlying dispute, and is only intended for use when there is a problem with the close itself.
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If you believe that it is necessary to make an explicit statement about whether consensus was reached, it may be helpful to consider three broad categories for summarizing the result of a discussion:
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If consensus remains unclear, if the issue is a contentious one, or if there are wiki-wide implications, a request for a neutral and uninvolved editor to formally close a discussion may be made at
234:(CfD) and the other XfDs. Observe however that intervening to close a discussion where this mode of resolution is not customary may prove to be incendiary instead of clarifying. Here, adding the
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Depending on the type of discussion, a review will take place at one of several review boards, and distinct criteria are used for each board. In general, deletions are discussed at
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discourages people from continuing to post comments, while leaving the discussion on the page, so that editors can read it. This may be accomplished by placing templates such as
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documents the outcome of the discussion (e.g. "The result was to keep the page"). Outside of the various deletion processes, most discussions are neither closed nor summarized.
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When a discussion involves many people and the outcome is not clear, it may be necessary to formally close the discussion. This is always the case in discussions at
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Remember that most contentious discussions benefit from a formal closing statement, and that closers undertake to assess consensus to the best of their abilities.
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717:{{Archive top |status = withdrawn |result = I've decided my idea needs some work. Thanks to everyone for the advice. ~~~~ }} {{lorem ipsum}} {{Archive bottom}}
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template may be used to indicate that a dispute about an important issue has not found its solution, inviting more people to weigh in their ideas and opinions.
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In closing, they applied policy X. I believe that policy Y should have been taken more into account / policy X never intended to apply to issues such as this.
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1004:. In general you don't need anyone's permission to recreate a deleted page, if your new version does not qualify for deletion then it will not be deleted.
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around a discussion. In addition to formal closes that analyze the consensus of a discussion, discussions may also be closed where someone, usually an
104:; rather, its purpose is to explain certain aspects of Knowledge's norms, customs, technicalities, or practices. It may reflect differing levels of
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dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
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dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
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873:. Specific instructions about each case are described in the subsections below. Any editor may participate in a discussion reviewing a close.
546:. Please ensure that any request there seeking a close is neutrally worded, and do not use that board to continue the discussion in question.
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if the closer was not made aware of significant additional information not discussed in the RM, and the RM should be reopened and relisted.
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776:{{Discussion top|I've decided my idea needs some work. Thanks to everyone for the advice. ~~~~ }} {{lorem ipsum}} {{Discussion bottom}}
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for uncontroversial undeletions, such as undeleting a very old article where substantial new sources have subsequently arisen. Use
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because of a disagreement with the deletion discussion's outcome that does not involve the closer's judgment (a page may be
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Many closures are also based upon
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if significant additional information or context was left out of the discussion and the closer was not aware of it.
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instead. (If any editor objects to the undeletion, then it is considered controversial and this forum may be used.)
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if significant new information has come to light since a deletion that would justify recreating the deleted page;
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process, or to have the history of a deleted page restored behind a new, improved version of the page, called a
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to attack other editors, cast aspersions, or make accusations of bias (such requests may be speedily closed);
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that have or have not been deleted (as each page is different and stands or falls on its own merits);
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The closed discussion can also be collapsed to save space. This is achieved by using the templates
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Closures will rarely be changed by the closing editor, but can be challenged in a closure review:
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if the discussion was undertaken under modified procedural rules that the closer was not aware of.
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to ask for permission to write a new version of a page which was deleted, unless it has been
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template may be a better option or informing all parties about the possibility of requesting
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waiting for an uninvolved editor to write a summary statement. The recommended procedure at
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if there were substantial procedural errors in the deletion discussion or speedy deletion.
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to argue technicalities (such as a deletion discussion being closed ten minutes early);
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After discussing the matter with the closing editor, you may request review at the
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Closures will rarely be changed by either the closing editor or a closure review:
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to request that previously deleted content be used on other pages (please go to
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Closures will often be changed by the closing editor without a closure review:
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I've decided my idea needs some work. Thanks to everyone for the advice.
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if you believe the closure was not a reasonable summation of the discussion
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I've decided my idea needs some work. Thanks to everyone for the advice.
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if an editor believes the closer did not follow the spirit and intent of
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Knowledge core policies, which requires that articles and information be
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For other procedures, whether formal RfCs or less formal ones such as
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Users who try to subvert consensus by appealing to other venues than
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1115:. Policies and guidelines are usually followed in the absence of a
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for guidance on actually determining consensus and writing closes.
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Knowledge:Deletion guidelines for administrators § Rough consensus
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Most discussions don't need closure at all, but when they do, any
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a page, have their own specialized templates). For example:
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Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/Closure review archive
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to repeat arguments already made in the deletion discussion;
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The discussion was withdrawn by the person who started it.
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For reviewing a closure of a page move discussions, the
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For reviewing a closure of a deletion discussion, the
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When further contributions are unlikely to be helpful
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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.
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