311:
do you think - should I a) simply remove it altogether, or b) expand it to mention that Banks considered but rejected abandoning ship as it was too far and if he survived he'd be marooned, and that Cook thought of running the sinking ship onto the nearest island, then building something from her wreck that could maybe sail to
Batavia. But neither option was very seriously considered, and then the fothering saved the day. Any suggestions?
639:
descriptions of symptoms include both diseases. I've gone with the references as they have the benefit of modern medicine in their identification. Malaria was almsot totallly unknown to the Royal Navy at the time, and there were no identified causes or cures for either condition in 1770. I think a longer dissertation on this in the article would be moving a little off-topic, but I'll put one in if you think it would add value.
550:
made a fairly quick recovery. By coincidence Cook's 1st lieutenant
Zachary Hicks died of TB, which he'd had since leaving England but finally succumbed to after leaving Batavia. One source (Hough) says disease killed 50,000 people a year in Batavia, and Cook's log says "the unwholsome air of Batavia is the death of more Europeans that any other place upon the Globe."
213:"The Royal Naval Ensign in use at the time of Cook's first voyage of discovery" cannot be immediately verified by a non-expert who looks only at the image; better would be "Red flag with Union Jack covering the upper left quadrant". The word "circa" should be removed, as the image doesn't say "circa". The hyphen between the years should be an endash, as per
711:
Thanks for these. They're fair points, though I'm not an image expert and these two predate my work on this page so it'll take me a few days to work out how to fix them or if they should be replaced. With the second one, would that be addressed by ] editing the commons page to reaffirm his release of
402:
and the preceding hyphen section would be a good read. No hyphens after adverbial "ly"; I've fixed "full size"; and there are lots of ranges (day and page) in the Notes section that have hyphens rather than en dashes. Someone here (can't remember who) may very usefully run a bot to fix this aspect of
1341:
Re the small map - there's an alternative one by Cook himself, though as it was a navigation chart rather than for amateur interest its not at all clearer. I've also found a 1790's map showing Cook's opath through the straits, but with so little frame of reference that its really just a line between
239:
Done, or at least improved. I used "Map:" to introduce the two map alt texts per the 5th example at WP:ALT (which uses "Diagram:"), but let me know if this should also be removed. It was a challenge with the map alt texts to balance information inclusion against verbosity - let me know if I got that
1307:
I think the south pacific one is OK (the big one), but I can see the problem with the Torres Strait map. If I can find a good PD replacement I'll put it in, otherwise would you suggest one or both maps be removed and replaced with a more detailed text description of the voyage? I covered the Torres
310:
Thanks, though its an exciting topic so the really hard thing would be to make this article boring. I agree the "prospects are grim" bit is a statement of the obvious, though I think it leads well into the following sentence. Still, I've spent an hour or so trying to reword it without success. What
292:
This is an excellent article, informative and clear but also it importantly is an exciting article. Some of the insights from Cook's crew on certain events makes it a special account. I come from a family where the men had a long history of being sailors before 1900 and the article makes me want to
1521:
Thanks to Dabomb87 who fixed the inconsistent date formatting in the online refs. Re the 1918 Advertiser reference listed above, Burdon and
Bonython were the publishers, though an examiantion of the publisher text on the last page of that edition of the paper indicates they did business under the
1326:
The larger map is marginally more legible. If no other reviewer sees it as a problem, leave it in. The second is more problematic, and doesn't really add to the value of the article. As the subject of the article is the ship, I think the Torres Strait journey is adequately covered by the text. My
638:
Added disease types mention and reference. Both Hough and
Blainey suggest the deaths around this time were dysentery other than 1st Lt Hicks (TB) and ship's master Molyneaux (drunkenness), though many of the crew were already weakened by malaria. Cook and Banks just called it "the flux" and their
549:
The earliest deaths sound like dysentery and the later ones malaria, though the first to die was the ship's surgeon and after that no one kept any lasting medical records. Banks described it as an inflammation of the lungs accompanied by a violent fever and physical collapse. Cook got it too, but
212:
The alt text needs a bit of work. The alt text for the maps should give a bit more gist of what the maps tell the sighted reader, e.g., it should say which direction through the Torres straight, and what bodies of water were traversed other than the Torres straight and in what order. The alt text
127:
This article passed GA last year, was peer-reviewed in June and was granted MILHIST A-class status in July. After extensive recent tweaking I think it meets the criteria for a featured article. However as this is my first FA nomination I apologise in advance for any newbie errors. Any comments,
1111:
Done. Was wrong about the French bit, the only source to discuss the perceived need for the guns refers to their use against hostile natives. This makes sense as they were small scale weaponry designed for anti-personnel combat. Have added their intended use to the text.
350:
in 1769-71."—I'd be inclined to follow WP:LINK and not link anglophone country-names, or if you really want to, to section-link to their history sections (those whole articles are too large and diffuse to be beneficial as links in this context). ("Australia" is linked
1342:
two other lines. Per
Brianboulton's comment above, I'd prefer to keep the current map for the (admittedly limited) value it adds, but if anyone else prefers its removal (or if Brian presses the point even mildly) I'll call that consensus and take it out.
1001:- Done, or at least improved. Replaced first point with "was beached on the mainland for seven weeks for rudimentary repairs to her hull." The two "for"'s in the sentence trouble me slightly, if they bother anyone else let me know and I'll reword again.
1049:
No problem. MeasuringWorth was founded by two professors of
Economics, from UIC and Miami University respectively. Its advisory board has a host of academics from US and UK universities. The site has been accepted as reliable on many previous FACs.
177:
It's the official website of the De Delft shipyard where the replica docked, though I should have noted that it was in Dutch, sorry about that. However, I've removed the link altogether because a) it doesn't provide a unique resource per point 1 in
1181:
The carpenter's quote contains nautical terms which won't be familiar to most readers, e.g. "main keep", midships", "larbord". It might be better to paraphrase what the carpenter said so that we can better understand the nature of the
1185:
Final para, second sentence: there seems to be a disjunction between "shipworm" and "they". If "shipworm" refers to a condition (like for example woodworm), then I think "they" should be "it". Otherwise you should say "shipworms"
1299:
General point: I'm uncertain about the value of the maps. The detail on each is mainly illegible, even when the maps are forced to their full size. On the "Track of
Endeavour" map it is very difficult to find and follow
1177:
Fourth paragraph begins "Despite this, the ship remained in very poor condition..." I'm not sure what "this" refers to; the last event recounted was the ship being struck by lightning. I think "Despite this" could be
1030:
It would be useful to have present-day equivalent values for the ship's cost. I normally use
MeasuringWorth.com; their calculation gives figures of £265,000 and £326,000 respectively for the two cost figures you
1469:
Citations need some cleanup for consistent formatting (I left some sample edits, problems with dates and page numbers). Is one of these supposed to be an author? If so, author comes first in other citations
1201:
I agree the carpenter's account adds flavour. Why don't you just add wiktionary links for "midships" and "larbord" (correctly, "larboard")? The main keep, one might reasonably deduce, is the ship's main hold.
841:
452:- Done the one in the first sentence. I confess I find the MOSDASH isntructions a little confusing, so a particular thanks to Dabomb87 for fixing the other ones. If any have been missed please let me know.
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1040:
Last paragraph: can you say briefly why the ship carried armaments of this nature? Presumably they were in case of trouble in the unknown waters that were their destination; this could be clarified.
825:
Your opinion on this point is at odds with consensus, which is that OTRS is just fine, and there is no need for every image to offer publicly accessible proof that the license claimed is legitimate.
844:, which is less visually striking but perhaps more historically relevant. The Bayldon image narrowly fails PD-1996, but I've found an acceptable and much older alternative which I'll upload today.
182:; b) sufficient replica images are already in the article; c) most of the De Delft photos aren't that good; and d) a pet peeve - the photos show the replica with blue-painted upper works. The real
802:
is, unfortunately, in a deleted revision, and therefore accessible only to administrators. This still makes it far more accessible that our OTRS tickets, which are visible to even fewer people.
355:
further down, too, just before the more appropriate linking of Botany Bay, NSW".) And there are so many valuable links in that vicinity and the rest of the article that are better less diluted.
689:- The uploader does not seem to be the same as the author, so the uploader could not have released the rights to the photo. Could you contact the uploader and/or the author and sort this out?
1097:- will do tonight - there was something in one of the sources about protection from the French while near Europe and indigenous people in the Pacific, so I'll hunt that down and add it.
470:
it was an accident so he could abandon his crew and flee with the loot, but that's as close to an accidental scuttling I can think of. Anyway, done - redundant word removed.
520:
To keep
Endeavour’s voyages and discoveries secret, Cook confiscated the log books and journals of all on board and ordered them to remain silent about where they had been
293:
sail the high seas like they did. Awesome. The only complaint is "The prospects if the ship sank were grim. ". I think that is stating the obvious and could be reworded...
992:"...she was forced to beach herself." I doubt this is literally true; should it not be "Cook was forced to beach her", or perhaps "the crew was forced to beach her"?
679:- This image is hosted on Commons, which means it has to be in the PD in both the US and NZ, therefore we need a tag explaining why this image is in the PD in the US.
985:: While I agree that this is a well-written and comprehensive account, and interesting, too, there are still a few minor points requiring attention. For instance:-
359:
to use an en dash for ranges; but not to use range punctuation where there's an introductory preposition. Thus, "from 1769 to 1791" ... is that the correct meaning?
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186:′s upper works were painted mud-brown. So the De Delft images aren't an accurate representation of the real ship, which limits the utility of a link to them.
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Strait-Batavia voyage only briefly because I'm trying to keep the focus on the ship as the aticle subject, rather than the voyage which is better covered
890:
Replaced
Bayldon image with an Atkins from 1794. Hopefully this address the remaining query - feel free to let me know if there's more that needs doing.
1134:
Outward voyage: "The voyage commenced with a landfall among the Madeira Islands." Surely the voyage commenced when they left Plymouth? Suggest reword.
1037:"Cook and his passengers" - there were passengers? I imagine that you are referring to the scientific team, so perhaps passengers isn't the right word.
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On consideration I'd probably prefer to keep the "grim prospects" sentence as is, as I think it leads well into the rest of the paragraph, and is not
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You have to be an administrator to see that page (I can't view it, for example). Releases have to be as available to the public as we can make them.
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name "J.L. Bonython & Co." I've replaced the individuals with the company name in the reference. There is no stated author of the article.
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The citenews template not permitting the spelling out of "page", I have changed all the references to either "p." or "pp." for consistency. I
1257:
Return voyage: On a pernickity point of geography, the voyage from Cape Town to England cannot really be described as "across" the Atlantic.
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223:, example 2). And please use proper English punctuation (one alt text ends in two periods, some non-sentences are punctuated with periods).
1540:
the issues raised in this comment are now addressed, but if I've missed something please let me know and I'll have a look back through.
1198:- I think the quote adds something to the "flavour" of the article, will have a think about how to address this and get back to you.
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OTRS is definitely not an ideal solution, I agree, but sometimes we have to resort to it. In this case, happily we do not.
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is a nice tool to use to locate a book quickly especially for those books that were pre-ISBN. You can look up your titles
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a statment of the obvious (shipwreck survival prospects sometimes being pretty good). Obviously, any other views welcome.
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482:- Do you mean in the journey length for the replica? If so, done. If not, let me know and I'll have another look through.
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But had they actually discovered any southern continent? It is indeed a strange sentence. The main text only says that
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Later service: "two tedious voyages" - suggest you remove the POV, or cite the description. ("routine" would suffice)
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Good point - I changed it to "lands." Hope this addresses the issue, but if I've missed the point please let me know.
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Yep, should have done that when you asked last time. Don't have the references on hand, so it'll be a little while.
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with one comment. You should utilize the |oclc= parameter in the cite cook template in your bibliography section.
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Suddenly, metrics come first, which is much more comfortable to me; but whichever way, they need to be consistent.
583:
Odd, I was sure I did that yesterday. Done now, let me know if you'd like something other than how it reads now.
510:. Well written and well sourced article. It, in my opinion, satisfies all FA criteria. I have only two comments:
339:. A fine nomination with an impressive standard of writing. (I haven't examined for the other criteria, though.)
217:. The phrases "Painting showing", "sketch", and "a sketch of" are unnecessary noise and should be removed (see
1327:
recommendation would be lose this map, though I won't oppose on this if you/other reviewers decide otherwise.
240:
balance wrong and I'll have another go. Lastly, sorry for the grammar errors - don't know how I missed those.
995:"American Revolution": "American Revolutionary War" or "American War of Independence" would be more precise
1568:
Ref formatting looks good now (can hardly believe I failed to check it in my review; must be going soft).
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1416:- I've given this a quick copyedit, but my changes were very minor. This is in excellent shape—well done.
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I confess I agree with Hesperian. However to resolve the issue I have replaced the John Hill image with
1485:. Frederick Britten Burden & John Langdon Bonython, Adelaide South Australia. 24 October 1918. p. 4
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Done - replaced "Voyage commenced" with "The first port of call". Also expanded this section a little.
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1378:: All my points properly attended to. I leave the decision on maps to you. Great article now.
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is active. Hoever, if you would rather replace the image than contact him, that is fine.
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I suppose, but would be an embarassment of epic proportions for a Royal Navy vessel.
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release the license by signing on the image description, that will fix the problem.
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Thanks, the new alt quite good and is well-balanced between brevity and verbosity.
1046:- Happy to do this, but how would I assert Measuringworth as a reliable source?
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I am very interested what disease killed a third of the crew? Is anything known?
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Otherwise, sources look okay, links checked out with the link checker tool.
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her crew sworn to secrecy about the southern continent they had discovered.
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Odd, must have died in the last day or so. Replaced with Beaglehole.
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We still need to have the author verify his relase of the rights at
522:. I think the sentence from the lead should be removed or rewritten.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in
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Banks should be described and linked on first, not second mention
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No we don't. We have his explicit release in a deleted revision
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This is an outstanding article and easily meets the FA criteria
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Not sure I agree, but I've reworded the sentence to remove it.
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You did not change anything. I still see "southern continent".
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Can scuttling be anything but deliberate? Perhaps it can ...?
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1397:: well written, sourced and illustrated. Good work. —
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the photo? If not, what should I do to address this?
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Can you add a note with information about diseases?
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http://www.dedelft.com/en/dockyard/2004/apr2004.html
1363:I hope to add my support when these are addressed.
1312:. But that's just my opinion, other views welcome.
876:I've now done that too, thanks for the suggestion.
798:. The claim must be highly visible, and it is. The
92:Featured article candidates/HMS Endeavour/archive1
1589:The above discussion is preserved as an archive.
965:Thanks, done. Never knew there was such a thing.
694:Looking forward to striking this objection soon.
41:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Featured article candidates
43:. No further edits should be made to this page.
741:File:Endeavour replica in Cooktown harbour.jpg
728:File:Endeavour replica in Cooktown harbour.jpg
687:File:Endeavour replica in Cooktown harbour.jpg
1595:No further edits should be made to this page.
466:once deliberately scuttled his flagship then
29:The following is an archived discussion of a
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18:Knowledge (XXG):Featured article candidates
96:
677:File:Endeavour, Bayldon, Francis J. B.jpg
1304:track, given the multiplicity of lines.
128:suggestions or criticisms are welcome.
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488:- done, thanks for pointing this out.
670:- These issues should be easy to fix.
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154:) What makes this a reliable source?
790:There is a difference between the
220:WP:ALT #Flawed and better examples
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1237:- Done, changed to "shipworms."
1434:Current ref 54 is a dead link.
858:I would like to point out that
403:Notes sections ... PING PING?
371:Apostrophe for officers' mess.
1:
458:- An accidental scuttling is
1578:02:56, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
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904:All image issues resolved.
328:00:42, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
31:featured article nomination
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726:I've fixed the issue with
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444:Wikilinks for Australia/NZ
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1592:Please do not modify it.
36:Please do not modify it.
450:"From" and "to" vs "-"'
56:05:25, 12 August 2009
1174:Northward to Batavia
1064:Done, as footnote a.
668:Oppose on criterion 3
1479:"Interesting Relics"
743:. If you could have
1138:Voyage commencement
1027:Purchase and refit
421:Fixed the dashes.
377:A fringe of leaves
1196:Carpenter's quote
1005:Revolutionary War
765:. That suffices.
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209:Done; thanks.
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65:HMS Endeavour
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1487:. Retrieved
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1380:Brianboulton
1375:
1365:Brianboulton
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1329:Brianboulton
1301:
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1204:Brianboulton
1195:
1190:Despite this
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113:Citation bot
72:
54:SandyGeorgia
49:
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28:
1302:Endeavour's
348:New Zealand
299:Dr. Blofeld
1192:- Removed.
1089:Passengers
464:Blackbeard
400:WP:MOSDASH
1095:Armaments
860:John Hill
827:Hesperian
804:Hesperian
767:Hesperian
745:John Hill
732:Hesperian
468:pretended
456:Scuttling
344:Australia
256:Eubulides
227:Eubulides
215:WP:ENDASH
184:Endeavour
1542:Euryalus
1524:Euryalus
1453:Euryalus
1436:Dabomb87
1344:Euryalus
1314:Euryalus
1283:Euryalus
1262:Euryalus
1239:Euryalus
1235:Shipworm
1218:Euryalus
1178:dropped.
1156:Euryalus
1142:Euryalus
1114:Euryalus
1099:Euryalus
1066:Euryalus
1031:mention.
1009:Euryalus
1007:- Done.
967:Euryalus
906:Awadewit
892:Euryalus
878:Euryalus
864:Awadewit
846:Euryalus
842:this one
813:Awadewit
794:and the
776:Awadewit
749:Awadewit
714:Euryalus
696:Awadewit
641:Euryalus
622:Euryalus
585:Euryalus
552:Euryalus
490:Euryalus
460:possible
423:Dabomb87
320:Euryalus
316:entirely
242:Euryalus
225:Thanks.
188:Euryalus
162:Ealdgyth
144:Comments
130:Euryalus
108:Analysis
75:Euryalus
50:promoted
1570:Maralia
1503:Georgia
1489:23 July
1432:Comment
1418:Maralia
1414:Support
1395:Support
1376:Support
1182:damage.
1085:- Done.
983:Comment
941:Support
508:Support
480:Metrics
446:- done.
337:Support
290:Support
273:Support
205:Comment
180:WP:ELNO
100:Toolbox
1281:Done.
1216:Done.
603:Ruslik
566:Ruslik
530:Ruslik
413:(talk)
389:(talk)
277:Nick-D
1538:think
1501:Sandy
989:Lead
800:proof
796:proof
792:claim
474:Comma
353:again
342:" to
16:<
1574:talk
1546:talk
1528:talk
1508:Talk
1491:2009
1457:talk
1440:talk
1422:talk
1403:talk
1384:talk
1369:talk
1348:talk
1333:talk
1318:talk
1310:here
1287:talk
1266:talk
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1160:talk
1146:talk
1118:talk
1103:talk
1070:talk
1056:talk
1013:talk
971:talk
957:talk
953:Brad
951:. --
949:here
945:OCLC
910:talk
896:talk
882:talk
868:talk
850:talk
817:talk
780:talk
763:here
753:talk
718:talk
700:talk
645:talk
626:talk
608:Zero
589:talk
571:Zero
556:talk
535:Zero
494:talk
427:talk
407:Tony
383:Tony
346:and
324:talk
281:talk
260:talk
246:talk
231:talk
192:talk
166:Talk
134:talk
79:talk
1470:...
398:PS
52:by
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