Knowledge (XXG)

:Featured article candidates/Pioneer Helmet/archive1 - Knowledge (XXG)

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598:"and lamellenhelm (de)" I know others have complained about the use of this template in FA candidates, and I agree that it is a construction that seems to exist nowhere other than Knowledge (XXG). Perhaps I could suggest (going against my usual support for redlinks) that you create a quick stub on the English Knowledge (XXG) for this style? 621:"The boar nonetheless persisted in Germanic tradition during the nearly 400 years of Roman rule in Britain," Maybe this is my mistake, but I initially misread this to mean that Germanic peoples in Britain kept a boar tradition alive during Roman rule, when (I now take it?) you mean that there was a continental tradition that persisted 592:
would perhaps work for the ref, but it makes it sound as if it is a temporary exhibition. My understanding is that the helmet is on long term loan, and the Armouries indicated in an email last month that "the helmet is on display in our war gallery here in Leeds." The Armouries does not have a page
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are some examples (haven't read the blog post, so no idea if its correct/reliable or not, but it has lots of good pictures). At a guess, it may have been a combination of ritual—the sword rendered dead with its owner—and practicality: don't go looting this grave, guys, its contents are worthless.
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On a wide screen, all seems fine, until you notice that in English, we have one line more. Can you try to match them exactly? Try to move your right side in and see what happens. I'd write more introduction, to make it fit with the it, or move it up, or make it smaller. But again, just my taste.
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This article is concise and complete. It covers the helmet from its discovery through its conservation and display, and contextualizes it with a discussion of its typology, and the boar’s iconography. All the known literature is covered: sometimes provided, kindly, by those who excavated and
110:, which is almost identical in its underlying structure but much richer—it is both rare and significant. The helmet’s 1997 discovery marked only the fourth time an Anglo-Saxon helmet had been unearthed, and the boar atop its crest evokes the world of the epic 319:
It looks fine on my screen; there are a few inches of white space between the English translation and the picture. On yours, does it push against the English translation, taking what should be one line, and making it display as two, or do something
577:. I thought the line "Excavations in the area had taken place for years on behalf of various aggregate companies before the land was exploited for gravel" took care of it, do you think I should add something specific to Pioneer Aggregates? 530:"the surviving cheek guard was reassembled from eighteen fragments alone" If I am understanding your meaning correctly, would "the surviving cheek guard, alone, was reassembled from eighteen fragments" be a little clearer? 692:
Another quick thought: I wouldn't bother including the publishers of the journals, but if you are going to do so, please do so consistently! I'm also unclear on when you are and are not providing closed access icons.
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publisher was in 1957). Closed access icons are provided when there is a link to a source but it has some sort of paywall (e.g., on jstor); the rule of thumb is if there is a link, there is an icon of some sort. On
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It's used in the sense of how the helmet was made; particularly since half the helmet is now missing, present tense does not work for parts. Not opposed to reworking what can be reworked into present tense,
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Changed to "The helmet was placed on public display". I believe there was a press conference beforehand, but I don't know most of the details (including whether the helmet was actually displayed there).
412:, the best way would probably be if someone in Leeds could take another picture. The Royal Armouries sent over a few beautiful and massive photos, but is unwilling to license them in any way. -- 230:
Sorry, I should not have written from memory ;) - yes, same, why not just "is similar"? For me, an image caption should be as much to the point as possible, but it's a matter of taste. --
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Good thought. There are some photographs of the sword and hanging bowl, although none with an appropriate license. I'll email a few of the organizations with them and ask.
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One tiny adjustment required: in ref 62, "p." should be "pp". Other than that, all sources appear to be in good order and are of appropriate quality and reliability.
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Appreciate your edits; undid the two re: logical quotation, as in those instances the punctuation marks are in the original sources (the comma in the
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I suspect I know the answer, but do we have any pictures of the other artefacts found around the helmet? They'd be a great addition to the article.
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may be able to offer some valuable insight, as she has brought topics related to English archaeology and the Anglo Saxons to FA status before.
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and the observation that literary analysis and archaeology can be mutually enlightening? Two closing thoughts: 1) Please check my edits. 2)
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The image in the Beowulf section is in the way of displaying the poem exactly line by line. Could it be moved? That's all. Thank you! --
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Another point: perhaps note somewhere on the talk that parts (like the Beowulf) are "copied", even if it's your own. Doesn't hurt. --
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Done and done. The source says "0.15m", but since that's exactly 15cm, which sounds more natural, I've made the change.
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quotation. The other ("crested helmet") is more a term of art than a quoted phrase, so I've left it without a citation.
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I really enjoyed this article; I think the topic's great, and what could be better than finishing with an extract of
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from me; everything looks good. I'll be watching the page in case someone points out something I've missed, though!
665:, which as usual is thoughtful and thorough. I've incorporated most of your suggestions, and placed comments above. 447:
I find the use of the past tense in the description section is a little jarring; has anyone else picked up on this?
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Also: You could probably be a little more consistent when it comes to the capitalisation of article/book titles.
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It's also associated with objects, such as swords, which were bent to make them unusable prior to deposition.
188:, I came to make the usual list, but found only three so minor points that I don't care if you follow or not: 593:
about the helmet or associated grave goods, however, which is probably precisely because it is a loan item.
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The boar-crested Pioneer helmet was made for battle. Utilitarian in design, it was discovered along with a
802: 735: 574: 351: 306: 235: 495:, standing for H Marcel Guest LTD. I could change to "the cellulose nitrate based adhesive HMG," or turn 464:"marks the grave as one of high social status" A high social status grave? Surely it marks it as a grave 143: 625:
while the Romans were in Britain. Perhaps this could be tweaked slightly? Or maybe this is my problem.
263: 255:"ritual killing" is normally identified with human sacrifice, but obviously means something else here. 752: 742: 643: 396: 862: 817: 783: 759: 713: 698: 678: 651: 515: 413: 369: 365: 282: 199: 166: 121: 82: 840: 725:, made capitalization consistent, and added publisher data (though still can't figure out who the 629: 331:
That's a byproduct of Heaney's translation—he gained a line here (Heaney line 1 is only half of
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conserved the helmet. Twenty years after the helmet’s discovery, this article is ready for FAC.
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on Friday nights... Changed to "marks the grave as one for a person of high social status."
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Two quotes lacking citations in the lead fill me with panic, but maybe that's my problem.
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has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see
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It says "extremely", not "exceptionally. Do you still suggest changing?
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grave of a man of about 25. Yet as plain as it is—compare it with the
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Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in
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line can actually be seen in the block quotation at the bottom). --
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I'll do some research on this and try to add a line explaining it.
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In the caption for the Coppergate, I'd do without "exceptionally".
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Thanks very much for reading through this and for your support,
546:, and in the last step, the boar was affixed to the apex using 502:
Update: changed to "These fragments were reassembled using the
557:, which is a type of glue, and I think broadly recognizable. 146:. Well done. As always, feel free to revert my copyediting. 628:
Changed to "The boar nonetheless persisted in continental
281:, and have added an explanatory line to the article. -- 65: 553:
Changed to "were then filled in and painted". Linked
570:What sort of company is Pioneer Aggregates UK Ltd? 874:The above discussion is preserved as an archive. 41:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Featured article candidates 43:. No further edits should be made to this page. 368:)? I think I can put that on the talk page. -- 880:No further edits should be made to this page. 853:template in place on the talk page until the 738:I've gone through and differentiated between 335:line 1), and then lost it somewhere later on. 161:Thanks very much for your edits and support, 29:The following is an archived discussion of a 8: 364:"Copied", as in from another article (here, 18:Knowledge (XXG):Featured article candidates 391:Any chance of a less shadowed main image? 471:But only the coolest graves can get into 586:will quickly go out of date. Also, ref? 7: 491:It's a brandname for an adhesive ( 24: 512:HMG Heat and Waterproof Adhesive 510:;" HMG links to the new article 812:Fixed. Thanks for the review, 1: 867:13:04, 24 February 2018 (UTC) 788:19:28, 11 February 2018 (UTC) 291:14:22, 13 February 2018 (UTC) 826:17:23, 29 January 2018 (UTC) 807:15:45, 29 January 2018 (UTC) 768:16:15, 4 February 2018 (UTC) 718:10:51, 4 February 2018 (UTC) 703:10:50, 4 February 2018 (UTC) 687:20:24, 28 January 2018 (UTC) 656:18:09, 28 January 2018 (UTC) 524:18:52, 29 January 2018 (UTC) 499:into a brief stub (or both). 422:18:54, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 401:18:30, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 378:16:45, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 356:16:33, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 311:15:53, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 240:16:33, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 208:16:11, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 175:15:22, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 156:15:21, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 130:07:38, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 91:07:38, 27 January 2018 (UTC) 848:featured article candidates 165:—good points all around. -- 31:featured article nomination 897: 64:) 13:04, 24 February 2018 468:with high social status? 877:Please do not modify it. 661:Thanks for your review, 36:Please do not modify it. 667:Will create a stub on 575:construction aggregate 438:Good point. Cited the 150:are my edits. - Dank ( 198:. Comments below. -- 366:Guilden Morden boar 144:standard disclaimer 630:Germanic tradition 181:Support from Gerda 504:cellulose nitrate 135:Support from Dank 108:Coppergate helmet 94: 888: 879: 852: 846: 843:, and leave the 757: 751: 747: 741: 623:on the continent 609:"Gaulish" Link? 430:Comments from JM 142:on prose per my 79: 48:The article was 38: 896: 895: 891: 890: 889: 887: 886: 885: 884: 875: 850: 844: 795: 755: 749: 745: 739: 727:English Studies 644:Midnightblueowl 432: 388: 279:Leslie Grinsell 183: 137: 76: 34: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 894: 892: 883: 882: 870: 869: 857:goes through. 829: 828: 818:Usernameunique 794: 793:Sources review 791: 773: 772: 771: 770: 760:Usernameunique 690: 689: 679:Usernameunique 636: 635: 634: 633: 619: 618: 617: 607: 606: 605: 596: 595: 594: 580: 579: 578: 568: 567: 566: 560: 559: 558: 536: 535: 534: 528: 527: 526: 516:Usernameunique 500: 486: 485: 484: 478: 477: 476: 462: 461: 460: 454: 453: 452: 445: 444: 443: 431: 428: 427: 426: 425: 424: 414:Usernameunique 404: 403: 387: 384: 383: 382: 381: 380: 370:Usernameunique 359: 358: 343: 342: 341: 340: 339: 338: 337: 336: 322: 321: 314: 313: 298: 297: 296: 295: 294: 293: 283:Usernameunique 269: 268: 257: 256: 252: 251: 250: 249: 248: 247: 246: 245: 225: 224: 218: 217: 213: 212: 211: 210: 200:Usernameunique 182: 179: 178: 177: 167:Usernameunique 136: 133: 122:Usernameunique 100:pattern welded 96: 95: 83:Usernameunique 81:Nominator(s): 75: 73:Pioneer Helmet 70: 69: 46: 45: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 893: 881: 878: 872: 871: 868: 864: 860: 856: 849: 842: 838: 834: 831: 830: 827: 823: 819: 815: 811: 810: 809: 808: 804: 800: 792: 790: 789: 785: 781: 777: 769: 765: 761: 754: 744: 737: 733: 728: 724: 721: 720: 719: 715: 711: 707: 706: 705: 704: 700: 696: 688: 684: 680: 676: 672: 670: 664: 660: 659: 658: 657: 653: 649: 645: 641: 631: 627: 626: 624: 620: 615: 611: 610: 608: 603: 600: 599: 597: 591: 588: 587: 585: 581: 576: 572: 571: 569: 564: 563: 561: 556: 552: 551: 549: 545: 541: 537: 532: 531: 529: 525: 521: 517: 513: 509: 505: 501: 498: 494: 490: 489: 487: 482: 481: 479: 474: 473:The Sepulchre 470: 469: 467: 463: 458: 457: 455: 449: 448: 446: 441: 437: 436: 434: 433: 429: 423: 419: 415: 411: 408: 407: 406: 405: 402: 398: 394: 390: 389: 385: 379: 375: 371: 367: 363: 362: 361: 360: 357: 353: 349: 345: 344: 334: 330: 329: 326: 325: 324: 323: 318: 317: 316: 315: 312: 308: 304: 300: 299: 292: 288: 284: 280: 276: 273: 272: 271: 270: 265: 261: 260: 259: 258: 254: 253: 243: 242: 241: 237: 233: 229: 228: 227: 226: 222: 221: 220: 219: 215: 214: 209: 205: 201: 197: 193: 192: 191: 190: 189: 187: 180: 176: 172: 168: 164: 160: 159: 158: 157: 153: 149: 145: 141: 134: 132: 131: 127: 123: 117: 115: 114: 109: 105: 102:sword in the 101: 93: 92: 88: 84: 78: 77: 74: 71: 68: 66: 63: 59: 55: 51: 44: 42: 37: 32: 27: 26: 19: 876: 873: 833:Closing note 832: 814:Brianboulton 799:Brianboulton 796: 780:Josh Milburn 775: 774: 726: 710:Josh Milburn 695:Josh Milburn 691: 674: 671:later today. 669:lamellenhelm 666: 648:Josh Milburn 639: 637: 622: 601: 583: 547: 543: 539: 497:HMG adhesive 472: 465: 439: 386:Image review 348:Gerda Arendt 332: 303:Gerda Arendt 275:Gerda Arendt 232:Gerda Arendt 196:Gerda Arendt 185: 184: 152:push to talk 139: 138: 118: 111: 97: 80: 49: 47: 35: 28: 753:free access 743:open access 736:good advice 466:of a person 104:Anglo-Saxon 612:Linked to 410:Nikkimaria 393:Nikkimaria 841:WP:FAC/ar 837:candidate 732:Firebrace 723:J Milburn 663:J Milburn 584:Currently 550:" Jargon 544:inpainted 540:gapfilled 506:adhesive 54:Sarastro1 859:Sarastro 835:: This 602:Will do. 573:It made 451:however. 50:promoted 776:Support 675:Beowulf 640:Beowulf 493:source) 440:Beowulf 333:Beowulf 186:Support 140:Support 113:Beowulf 58:FACBot 614:Gauls 604:Done. 555:epoxy 548:epoxy 533:Done. 320:else? 244:Done. 148:These 16:< 863:talk 822:talk 816:. -- 803:talk 784:talk 764:talk 758:. -- 748:and 714:talk 699:talk 683:talk 652:talk 632:..." 590:This 542:and 520:talk 514:. -- 418:talk 397:talk 374:talk 352:talk 307:talk 287:talk 264:Here 236:talk 204:talk 171:talk 163:Dank 126:talk 87:talk 62:talk 56:via 855:bot 734:'s 508:HMG 52:by 865:) 851:}} 845:{{ 824:) 805:) 786:) 766:) 756:}} 750:{{ 746:}} 740:{{ 716:) 701:) 685:) 654:) 522:) 420:) 399:) 376:) 354:) 309:) 289:) 238:) 206:) 173:) 154:) 128:) 89:) 67:. 33:. 861:( 820:( 801:( 782:( 762:( 712:( 697:( 681:( 650:( 616:. 538:" 518:( 416:( 395:( 372:( 350:( 305:( 285:( 234:( 202:( 169:( 124:( 85:( 60:(

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Featured article candidates
featured article nomination
Knowledge (XXG) talk:Featured article candidates
Sarastro1
FACBot
talk

Pioneer Helmet
Usernameunique
talk
07:38, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
pattern welded
Anglo-Saxon
Coppergate helmet
Beowulf
Usernameunique
talk
07:38, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
standard disclaimer
These
push to talk
15:21, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
Dank
Usernameunique
talk
15:22, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt
Usernameunique
talk
16:11, 27 January 2018 (UTC)

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