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reader. A better caption in this case would be "List of participating nations, showing the number of gold, silver, and bronze medals won". The row headers also provide for non-sighted readers, as a screen reader will then read the row in the correct order if the sorting is changed. The table cannot simply be considered in its initial state. The vast majority of FLs use sortable tables; indeed, the criteria state that a featured list is "easy to navigate and includes, where helpful, section headings and table sort facilities". Please do not see the headers as a highlight, as they are not. They are an indicator that this is the primary entry in the row. In this case, I actually believe that the country is the primary entry, not the rank, so that should probably be examined. If the bold is a problem, inserting the "plainrowheaders" attribute in the table class will remove the bold; I happen to think that it is much less obtrusive in cases like this. —
973:: The name of the entity that publishes (owns or controls) the website. Commonly, this is a government agency, educational institution, or business. For many websites, the author and publisher are the same, and only one needs to be included in the citation; prefer publisher for organizations, author (or first/last) for individuals. Please note that publisher is not the name of the website; that is the work, except in cases where the business name is identical to the site name. For example, the corporation Walmart is the publisher of the website at walmart.com, which is the work.
1249:@Andrwsc: modern screen readers provide the ability to navigate a table in different ways, for example a blind reader may want to go down the row of gold medals and hear how many were gained. If there is no row header marked up they will hear "Gold, 185"; "Gold, 32"; "Gold, 27", etc. as they move down the column; or the screen reader software may take a guess that the first column contains row header info, so they would hear "Gold, 1, 185"; "Gold, 2, 32"; "Gold, 3, 27", etc. However, if we mark up the 'Nation' column as a row header (i.e. <th: -->
967:: In most cases this is the name of the website (as usually given in the logo/banner area of the site), otherwise the site's domain name (without the leading "www." part). If the titled item being cited is part of some other larger work, such as a book, periodical or organizational sub-site (e.g., the law school's section of a university's website system), it is usually better to use the name of that more specific work than that of the entire site. Do not italicize; the software will do so automatically.
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and separate the name of the country into its own cell, which would then be marked as the row header, since that would remove the repetition of the country abbreviation each time when spoken by the screen reader. However, that is a minor gain for considerable effort in this case, so I wouldn't bother
467:
I saw ref 8, but it's not clear that that's supposed to be sourcing the table itself. It's citing the first paragraph of Medal table, which is about table conventions more than the table itself. There needs to be some indication that this ref is in fact meant to be sourcing the table. Many ways exist
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portion of the Manual of Style. Your question to RexxS leads me to believe that you are still viewing this header markup as a simple aesthetic change which you do not favor; I implore you not to think of it this way. I didn't like it either at first, but I volunteered to make an FLC for which I was
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If I had reviewed one of those other lists, my concerns would have been the same. I have not returned to active reviewing until recently. If the template doesn't meet access requirements, that needs to be raised with an admin with template experience. The template not conforming is a MOS issue, and
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No, it wasn't. "Because MOS says so" is an utterly useless answer. The MOS gives "good" examples of tables without row headers, so it appears as though only column headers are necessary. But perhaps that's besides the point. I do understand the accessibility considerations described here, and I
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one of cases where the business name is identical to the site name. And the banner does say the name of the games, which would be assumed to be the name of the site. But then again, I have no idea why walmart.com would be the "work=". So that means any site research is done from should should have
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A response to both. The short answer is that the caption and row-headers are necessary because MOS says so. The longer answers are slightly more complicated. The table caption currently labeling the table as "medal table" is poor; the caption should describe the table's content for a non-sighted
709:"shot put – F35/36, 400 m – T12, 200 m – T12 and 100 m – T12) and the men's discus throw – F51/52/53, long jump – F36, 1500 m – T11 and 1500 m – T37" - what on earth do all these abbreviations mean? It's not clear at all to readers who aren't familiar with the subject matter (I'm really not).
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You asked this question before. An answer was already provided. Regardless of whether the table tutorial (which is just an instructional guide, not an all-inclusive policy or guideline) contains this type of header structure, this table does require it, and that's because of the actual
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is that you can sort by different criteria, so highlighting the "Rank" column with bold text and darker table cell colour is contrary to that. The "Good example of headers structure" in the MOS:DTT tutorial does not utilize row headers, so I don't think they're necessary
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of the table. Clearly the intent of the darker color for header cells is intended for the top-most row and the left-most column. Is there any way to satisfy the accessibility requirements without coloring the "Nation" column differently? Your suggestion to use the
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in html) and give it the row scope, then the blind reader can hear "Gold, China (CHN), 185"; "Gold, Japan (JPN), 32"; "Gold, South Korea (KOR), 27", etc. Surely you would agree that is far better accessibility for the visually-impaired? Have a look at
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You can actually eradicate it by adding work=''gzapg2010.cn (Official website of the Games)'' in the template, or you can include it within the publisher parameter in case the AWB and other bots come and removes that italicization. —
117:
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is about the table? It just looks silly to have "Medal table" appear as a caption, which appears in the "Medal table" section of the "2010 Asian Para Games medal table" article. How many times do we have to label the medal
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You have consider what is the key element of data in each line, and without the country, the other items are irrelevant. So for screen reading software, the country is the most obvious choice. Perhaps we should ask
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Not necessarily, as it's difficult to understand what the medals were awarded for in this case. An explanatory footnote (or multiples thereof) would be sufficient; it doesn't have to be anything in-depth. —
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markup or is the scope declaration sufficient? I'm asking if the aesthetic effect of the table header can be decoupled from the semantic meaning. It really looks bad for a row header to appear in the
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requirements. The other medal tables were/may have been promoted before these requirements were added to the Manual of Style. At the very least, tables require row headers, scopes, and captions. —
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as a reason not to implement these because they "look silly". However, it's not within the spirit of IAR because this is not " you from improving or maintaining
Knowledge"; indeed,
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can see the utility to read the table column-wise per the example from RexxS. However, my question is whether or not the screen reader requirements depend on the <th: -->
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Naw, I didn't mean that in a serious way. As for the italics and parameters, it looks good now. Let me put in some consideration before I put in a vote though. Thanks. —
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Believe me, I didn't have any such intention, I apologize if you feel that way. As the issue is contentious, I've removed work parameter. Does it look good to you now?
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Well, these are the units of classifying the physical disabilities. Wouldn't it be out of scope if I add the details in an article dedicated to medal table only?
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Please specifically mention why it doesn't meet ACCESS? because there are so many medal tables of same type which have FL status, or I'm missing something?
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I am nominating this for featured list because it is comprehensive (in my opinion) and also fulfills other criteria. Thank you for your time and feedback.
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Forgot the word "needed" between "space" and "before"... is it indicating "up to 82.5kg"? otherwise it should be "– 82.5kg" like the other titles.
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this list as a good example of how accessibility can be implemented. I ought to mention that in the ] syntax, the parameter for alt-text has to be
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Several medal tables were promoted after these "new requirements" (please check promotion log). Like all other medal tables this article also uses
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class to remove the bold header text is exactly the kind of thing I'm looking for, but with respect to cell color instead of font style. Should
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The table at present is marked up about as well as it can be for accessibility - well done to the nominator for taking on board these issues.
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Remove
Simplified Han from the alt parameter of the second image. You should really give the gist of the image not into technical details per
557:– Don't italicize online website names and check the en-dashing of reference titles. Otherwise the list looks fine. I will comment again. —
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row scope necessary? It really looks silly for these columns to have the darker background color (since the default CSS style for
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I've no problem in de-italicizing the work parameter, but the documentation of the template implies that it should be italicized.
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Am I crazy or is there nothing citing the table? A general reference is needed, or barring that a Source note above the table.
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to the column headers ot RankedMedalTable, so the thousands of transclusions of that template will be updated shortly. —
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responsible a testcase for the implementation of this standard, and I am now convinced of its worth. Some may cite
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HTML markup (via the wikitable "!" syntax) for the Rank column; it is worse to use it for the second column. —
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Where? in between "–" and 82.50kg?? because there is already a single space in between "Women's" and –82.5kg.
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While on the subject, I doubt they actually shared the medal itself; "two silvers" would be more appropriate.
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The info in the captions is not mentioned in the body of the article, so you must add refs to the captions. —
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Medal table: En dashes needed in the eight no-bronze events, and another for the "shared silvers" event.
1482:, and I thought it's a some Pakistani name (author name), but actually it's a month of Muslims, my bad.
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the promotion of the list now. Nice work Bill, hope to see more of those old Asian Games lists. :) —
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Why is there a dash in "−82.50 kg event of powerlifting"? Should it be a less than sign (<)?
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of doing this, but it needs to be done. A table without an apparent source is no good here.
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For a screen reader to navigate by reading down a column as you describe, is a row header
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This is an official way of writing weight category, as per official website of the Games.
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utilize row headers, so what makes this medal table different that it requires them? —
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Knowledge:Manual of Style/Accessibility/Data tables tutorial#Correct headers structure
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issues to have a look at it and perhaps explain more clearly where we're coming from.
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Because there were only three athletes to participate in many events of the athletics.
225:" In athletics, bronzes were not awarded" in some events - is there a reason for this?
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implementing it hinders
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Mon erreur, it was in color box, but don't know how I forgot to put it after China.
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1056:: My dispute was resolved. Very well developed prose and other FL criteria. —
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No need for a hyphen in "most successful" in the last sentence of the lead.
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Legolas, as TRM said it's a moot point, so I've removed "work" parameter.
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No worries, I've divided references into two (General and
Specific).
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Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in
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Featured list candidates/2010 Asian Para Games medal table/archive1
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to comment as he is usually quite clued up on this kind of thing.
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The only improvement I can think of would be to drop the use of
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Andrwsc, I've got no option left. TRM, do I need to ask RexxS?
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Why is a table caption mandatory in this instance, when the
1277:). I note that the "Good example of headers structure" at
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MOS compliance falls under section 5 of the FL criteria. —
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Wouldn't be a bad idea, getting someone who is very up on
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I hope you weren't trying to insult me ;). I think this
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for a good description of how a popular screen reader (
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Ref 5 - I don't see a publication date on the webpage.
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Please reconsider your edit. It was bizzare to use
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1097:Why is a row header necessary? The whole point of
921:be written as such in the ref formatting? Wouldn't
1420:because the wikimedia software does not recognise
787:) explains the new table requirements for meeting
1559:The above discussion is preserved as an archive.
402:Same thing for the start of the second paragraph.
43:. No further edits should be made to this page.
1424:(I've fixed that for you) - hope that's ok. --
248:- do not use color alone to convey information
1565:No further edits should be made to this page.
29:The following is an archived discussion of a
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1513:Knowledge:MOSNUM#Common mathematical symbols
919:gzapg2010.cn (Official website of the Games)
1487:Ref 22 - space before 82.50kg in the title.
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41:Knowledge talk:Featured list candidates
1371:to each nation entry in the table? —
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825:requirements of ACCESS, also it has
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18:Knowledge:Featured list candidates
978:I hope you will know the answer.
72:2010 Asian Para Games medal table
65:2010 Asian Para Games medal table
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1253:HTML Tables with JAWS and MAGic
923:Guangzhou 2010 Asian Para Games
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865:Hope these comments help. —
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1387:04:08, 12 August 2011 (UTC)
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1301:20:28, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
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1369:style="background:#f9f9f9"
1365:background-color: #f9f9f9;
1357:.wikitable.plainrowheaders
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1217:10:53, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
1204:09:51, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
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1156:00:33, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
1134:16:19, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
1075:23:21, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
1041:14:43, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
1018:13:48, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
1005:13:00, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
949:From the documentation of
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909:01:19, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
881:23:35, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
849:11:56, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
807:21:35, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
783:The data tables tutorial (
744:21:36, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
671:14:56, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
650:14:49, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
625:13:48, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
607:18:02, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
589:15:24, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
566:11:47, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
548:14:56, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
530:23:03, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
497:17:12, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
539:Resolved comments from —
484:21:06, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
458:22:18, 30 July 2011 (UTC)
380:21:06, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
355:01:11, 26 July 2011 (UTC)
312:19:08, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
282:02:59, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
214:01:11, 26 July 2011 (UTC)
181:16:43, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
165:16:43, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
1562:Please do not modify it.
1463:Note C needs an en-dash.
189:Resolved comments from —
36:Please do not modify it.
31:featured list nomination
1442:Resolved comments from
1114:Note that I have added
679:Resolved comments from
364:Resolved comments from
1212:— Bill william compton
1013:— Bill william compton
620:— Bill william compton
584:— Bill william compton
514:– Meets FL standards.
492:— Bill william compton
176:— Bill william compton
160:— Bill william compton
56:16:36, 11 August 2011
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330:Nice list —
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518:Giants2008
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246:MOS:COLOUR
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917:– Should
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1459:Comments
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954:Cite web
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387:Comments
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134:Analysis
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512:Support
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126:Toolbox
89:protect
84:history
1348:middle
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