Knowledge

talk:WikiProject Japan - Knowledge

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3283:, but this usually only happens when there's some serious long-term disruption and tends to require quite a bit of discussion. A local block on one project doesn't automatically extend to all other projects; it might seem a little weird, but there are users locally blocked on one project who have no problems editing other projects either because they've kept their noses clean on those projects or otherwise have gone unnoticed/unreported as of yet. Since English Knowledge is the largest of the Wikipedias in terms of articles and users, its policies and guidelines tend to be (rightly or wrongly) more rigorously applied and enforced, and administrator response tends to be quicker. Jawiki's policies and guidelines may have many of the same policies and guidelines as English Knowledge, but applying them and enforcing them is the responsibility of the jawiki community and its administrators. For sure, you can monitor problematic edits on jawiki or any other wiki to make sure their not repeated here, but that's entirely up to you to do as a 427: 3415:
administrators will eventually be asked to intervene, but rarely do administrators pre-emptively block accounts based on what someone thinks they might do.Finally, the jawiki edit about the Kurds that you also linked to above was reverted by another jawiki user, and a discussion about it is taking place on the the jawiki user talk page of the editor who made it. Whether that discussion leads to the jawiki version of an administrator's noticeboard remains to be seen, but that's not too different from how the same thing would be treated here on English Knowledge. Similarly, the problems with the same jawiki user's edits to
3759:); it spends around half of its 100,000+ byte entry promoting fringe pseudohistorical theories that have little support in mainstream scholarship. While it may contain some facts when viewed in isolation, it includes too many simplifications, editorializing, and misleading claims, resulting in an overall narrative that is extremely biased, as it cherry-picks details that serve a particular point of view. It even states quite boldly, "There was no blueprint for the extermination of the Jews, no national budget allocated for extermination, and no organization that conducted centralized management." 2040: 3279:: each of the local Wikipedias are different and edits/content on each are assessed according to each local Knowledge's policies and guidelines. So, if you find content on jawiki that's not in accordance with its policies and guidelines, you can try to resolve things but you need to do so in accordance with its policies and guidelines over there; it can't be done afar from English Knowledge. Behavioral issues are, however, treated a bit differently since inappropriate crosswiki behavior can lead to 82: 64: 371: 3099: 209: 2998: 33: 2841: 3127:! All experience levels welcome. Never worked on a GA project before? We'll teach you how to get started. Or maybe you're an old hand at GAs – we'd love to have you involved! Participants are invited to work on nominating and/or reviewing GA submissions related to women and women's works (e.g., books, films) during the event period. We hope to collectively cover article subjects from at least 3760: 92: 3036: 2948: 3181:. A category for "refugees" was changed to "foreigner crimes". This user has been reported, but the only sanction they ever received was a week-long ban from posting on user talk pages. Otherwise, their edits have run mostly unchecked. They have been editing with impunity, with most of their edits remaining online, for months. 3353:
Wikipedias. Similarly, some members of the other various Knowledge communities might have similar concerns about English Knowledge. Responses to such matters (regardless of which Knowledge) tends to be much more reactive than proactive, but that's mainly due to the way Knowledge works. Absent certain types of
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inappropriate content from being added unless you're able to get technical restrictions put in place. It's a never ending game of whack the mole and knowing another mole is going to appear somewhere at some point isn't going to stop it from appearing unless you somehow set the game so that it doesn't. --
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You are right though in that it is not a trivial issue to solve, but I disagree that the culture of the site can't be changed. This is just my opinion, but culture is a product of the rules and how they strictly they are enforced. If you have a wiki where the policy is not strictly enforced, then you
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I wasn't trying to be repetitive, and my apologies if that's how it came across. In the same vein, though, you're sort of repeating "Japanese Knowledge has problem editors that we need to be aware of" who should be treated with "serious caution", but there's not a lot that can be done about them here
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It's been days and Marchjuly hasn't responded. I assume the issue is resolved. I do not regret saying that Japanese Knowledge is seriously ill and its illnesses should be quarantined. I'd be more sympathetic if the symptoms of their diseases didn't harm living people. I'll withdraw my sentiments the
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The context I'm providing is I think helpful for people playing the game of whack the mole. Knowing what the jawiki is like can contextualize things. I think most people would agree that that statement is reasonable. I never suggested we'll somehow systemically stop everything, and I never suggested
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before some one does notice it, but the best that can be done given the current set up is to deal with such content when it's found. If you've got particular articles that you're concerned about, you can monitor them yourself or ask others to also keep a watch on them; however, you can't really stop
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They don't exist in separate vacuums for sure, but they're rather like members of the same family: interconnected and overlapping in many ways but still leading separate lives. Your concerns about jawiki probably also apply not only other non-English Knowledge but also even to other types of English
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I agree with basically everything you just said; I shared those understandings when I made my OP. The only major thing: you can claim that they won't get very far if they try to go to the enwiki, but given what's happening on the jawiki I'd argue there should be extra caution taken to make sure they
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were both deleted by AFD in 2018. I was hoping to see if someone knew of any reliable sources in Japanese to help restore them? They may have been reviewed in offline sources that would not easily be found online. For the Gear Antique game, some passing mentions in a Google Books search came up for
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Ah man that's horrific... I feel distressing and serious topics are disproportionately affected by the Japanese Knowledge's issues. Normal people just avoid them and conflict altogether, which leads to the them being taken over by neurotic people with obvious biases. Thankfully enwiki's articles on
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3. BLP's for Japanese celebrities and politicians which source to sketchy outlets or to unreliable news sources such as Sankei Shimbun and peddle salacious rumors and conspiracy theories that amount to BLP violations. The current state of the Thomas Lockley page in Japanese is a flagrant example of
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I have not caught up with all of this discussion, but while Sankei is widely considered right-leaning, I think it is generally a reliable news source (its application in particular instances such as in relation to World War II history notwithstanding). If we were going to start excluding Japanese
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I wouldn't say entirely disconnected or irrelevant. For controversial topics, users of the jawiki have crossed over to the enwiki. In a similar way to how a user on enwiki's edits give that user reputation, it may be useful to check the user's edit history on the jawiki for context on their edits
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Stop. Do you want to say unequivocally that the mentioned article on Japanese Knowledge does not simply disseminate marginal theories, but in fact directly tries to deny the Holocaust and the participation of the Nazi leadership in it? I don't know if Japanese law prohibits Nazi justification or
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because of such things and have extra editing restrictions placed on them, but even in those cases the kind of edits described in the jawiki report still sometimes get through. Such edits usually end up reverted and perhaps the user who made them is warned. If such editors continue on as before,
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I wonder if there's a way to get Wikimedia further involved. Just my input, but Japanese Knowledge features large scale bigotry, racial supremacy, unsourced fringe alternative history, and genocide/war crime denial in violation of Knowledge policies (mostly due to editors intentionally ignoring
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I still maintain that it is useful for enwiki editors to understand the problems with the jawiki for Japan-related topics on the English Knowledge, for my earlier given reasons. I'm also not mandating that anyone do anything; of course everything is voluntary. I'm just sharing something I found
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means is that if jawiki users cross over to edit on English Knowledge, they're going to be subject to the same English Knowledge policies and guidelines as the rest of us; so, if they're making inappropriate edits there, they won't get very far arguing they should be allowed to do the same here
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If it's ok, I'll post on your talk page to work things out. I think we're continually miscommunicating and resolving it would be lengthy, and I want to save space on this public thread for main takeaways. Once we resolve things, either one of us can come back here and post a summary.
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The “つっ” part is important, and the play-by-play announcer originally wanted to say “捕まえて,” i.e., catch and throw, but this part cannot be omitted because it indicates that the game did not unfold that way and that the players moved beyond the play-by-play announcer's expectations.
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As a heads up, we're risking moving too far off topic, so let's try to keep this short and tightly linked to the main purpose of my post. I'll share this opinion for now because I think it provides some more context to others of why I don't think their issues will resolve any time
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on English Knowledge until they start causing serious problems here. Just for reference, many of the things mentioned in that jawiki report you linked to above also happen on English Knowledge regarding topics completely unrelated to Japan. Many such subjects have been designated
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Not really anything we can do, the Japanese Knowledge is unconnected to the English Knowledge. All we can do is ensure English Knowledge policies and guidelines are adhered to on all edits on this project. Ultimately what happens on the JA project is irrelevant to us.
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jawiki's issues are fundamentally hard to solve. These are documented in the research report I linked. Its issues are intertwined with Japanese internet culture and regular Japanese culture; trying to resist both of those is hard and possibly fundamentally
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A link to a timestamped version of the page was provided. The current version of the page still has the text. It's the first two sentences in that section. I'm not sure why the command "stop" was necessary in your comment; are you saying it like "no way"?
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A botched intervention could damage the Japanese Knowledge; not all of it is harmful or right-wing. Its good articles are honestly quite good and useful; I look at it pretty often (which is how I found out about these issues). But the bad articles, my
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In my time looking through articles translated from Japanese to English, most of the pages that have these issues in English are relatively niche (with a few notable exceptions. I've identified three categories of articles that tend to have these
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I have no problem at all with excluding Japan Forward, which is publishing articles like the ones you selected at the same time that its "about" page says its purpose is "to reveal the true face of Japan to non-Japanese speakers"
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tags myself. On an almost daily basis, I participate in and read discussions where the various language versions of articles are compared and contrasted. These are all helpful and frequent activities for the English
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If you meant "no way" to mean surprise, then yes. At least 30 of my relatives died in the Holocaust, so it is shocking to me that a wiki section in such a common language could contain such statements.
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The problem is not limited to articles directly related to the Imperial Japanese Army or contemporary Japanese politics. Take, for example, the Japanese Knowledge article on the Nuremberg trials (
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It doesn't appear that Sankei has been discussed at RSPS before. Is someone willing to start that conversation? I have moderate experience with both Sankei and Japan Forward but am not an expert
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5ch, which is a main part of your post, is essentially the base of operations for said group, and they've targeted more than just the Kurds in Japan and Yasuke articles, so this is not off-topic.
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Even if the WMF intervened somehow they may not even solve the issue, and a botched intervention would damage the credibility of both the WMF and the institution of Wikipedias as a whole.
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on the Japanese Knowledge run nearly unchecked. The Wikimedia Foundation has been investigating the issue and trying to recommend changes, but so far little has changed. See the article
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1. Imperial Japan related military articles (figures having poorly sourced hagiography, clear bias for or against certain military commanders, warcrime and attrocity denial, etc.
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Each version of Knowledge does not exist in separate vacuums; they impact each other in a number of ways. I know this first hand; I've personally added tens of thousands of
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will get a wiki with rampant BLP violations, a consistent heavily nationalist bias in violation of NPOV, poorly sourced xenophobia and racism left up for years, and so on.
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To the extent that you can contain it (this seems to be your concern), the underlying issues probably shouldn't be ignored or ultimately it will keep reoccuring.
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has an RfC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the
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by Bernhard Scheid or any other English material that looks at the 唯一神道名法要集 (Yuiitsu Shintō Myōbō Yōshū)? (or Japanese really, anything that analyses it)
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Respectfully, may not pursue this thread much further as it's resembling repetition. My point has been made: they have serious issues that may impact us.
3196:(in both Japanese and English) is currently heavily discussed on 5ch (to verify this, go to 5ch.net, and search "Knowledge" in the search bar. Pages like 2864:
I would appreciate it if someone who has knowledge of martial arts or fighting games and is a native speaker of English could help me out with the text.
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This report on the Japanese Knowledge is alarming. I highly encourage you to read it through carefully. The toxicity and defamatory claims about
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Would there be anyone here who can read Japanese and is well-versed in Shinto terminology particularly in regards to Yoshida Shinto?
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Running from October 1 to 31, 2024, WikiProject Women in Green (WiG) is hosting a Good Article (GA) edit-a-thon event with the theme
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This is a frequent issue on the Japanese Knowledge these kinds of 20th century controversies. They're even harder on Korean people.
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It is not a stretch to say that Japanese Knowledge is largely controlled by far-right, ultra-nationalist racial supremacy groups.
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I'm even afraid to imagine. Historical or political disputes are one thing, but such things are beyond the bounds in my opinion.
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and where it's being used if you're concerned that its use will lead to problems, but again that's another VOLUNTEER thing. --
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2. Current political events (the kurd page you mention is an example), which are likely to be corrected faster than the above.
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are two examples whose issues from the Japanese text were present on the pages for years before I found them. Diffs for those
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because nobody warned/stopped them there. This is essentially what's being said (at least in my opinion) in things like
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because any such community-wide action is going to fall outside the scope of this or any other WikiProject. --
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Again, I agree with almost everything you wrote, and don't think your points impact the validity of my points.
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I recommend you exercise serious caution when dealing with controversial editors from the Japanese Knowledge.
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I think the easiest way to deal with these when they go unchecked in English is to add Japanese sources to
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Then we should get it on the RS list with those caveats in mind. I'm thinking of articles like these
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The entire reason I became aware of this issue is specifically because of these crossover users.
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non-Japan topics like these tend to be more robust and see fewer jawiki editors crossing over.
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and assess the more notably unreliable ones on RSN so that editors have quicker reference.
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violations rampant on Japanese Knowledge (mostly against those deemed as adverserial by
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deeply concerning and that I think impacts us in some ways that I've already explained.
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sources, there would be a variety of weekly magazines, sports dailies, monthlies like
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Reading the Yuiitsu Shintō myobō yōshū: A modern exegesis of an esoteric Shinto text
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are heavily monitored pages, but often less frequented pages which are fine like
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seem to have been addressed (at least for the moment) and are being discussed at
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Look at this edit (with machine translation if needed). It is largely based on
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I am largely referring to the areas impacted by the Japanese version of the
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Hello. I wish to add an appropriate translation to an article about a meme(
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If there are any improvements to current translation, please revise it.
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Template talk:Infobox Chinese/Japanese#Requested move 31 August 2024
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Template talk:Infobox Chinese/Japanese#Requested move 31 August 2024
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Template talk:Infobox Chinese/Japanese#Requested move 31 August 2024
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Template talk:Infobox Chinese/Japanese#Requested move 31 August 2024
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reputable sourcing). Not only that but there are serious, serious
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That sounds fair to me, at least for now. I'm less familiar with
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The Japanese Knowledge has a serious nearly incurable sickness
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Holocaust denial, but I think it raises even more red flags.
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here. Thus, being aware of the culture of the jawiki matters.
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websites or blogs, and publishes defamatory claims about
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The text in this article is, for lack of a better term,
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that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject.
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that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject.
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link to problematic stubs for the generals involved.
2871:, and the text in the Japanese source is as follows 2861:) that originated from a fighting game in Japanese. 308:: Participate in Japan-related deletion discussions. 132:. Current time in Japan: 07:20, September 29, 2024 ( 109:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 3469:day they bother to step up and fix their problems. 3887:. Please comment there if you have any thoughts. 124:, where you can join the project, participate in 18:Knowledge:Japanese Wikipedians' notice board 3371:can certainly go unnoticed for quite a long time 3184:The Japanese Knowledge is heavily influenced by 3117:Good Article Edit-a-thon event in October 2024 3610:. Some of the most notable instances such as 3252:Furthermore, plenty of pages are tagged with 8: 3935:Is there a certain part you are working on? 3199:are discussions on the Japanese Knowledge). 3903:Assistance with Shinto Terminology (in JPN) 3506:) that are left up despite being reported. 2867:The original 17-second video can be found 174: 58: 3093:Women in Green's October 2024 edit-a-thon 2654:The Most Noble Barnstar of National Honor 43:does not require a rating on Knowledge's 3953:. Some of it also isn't proper English. 3764:This article has even been discussed on 3092: 3042:There is a requested move discussion at 2954:There is a requested move discussion at 146: 60: 3423:, which again is what's encouraged by 3188:; a relative of the English-language 7: 3983:NA-importance Japan-related articles 3978:Project-Class Japan-related articles 2912:Japanese tabletop role-playing games 2640:The Japan Barnstar of National Merit 2067:(18 years, 6 months and 10 days ago) 32: 30: 116:on Knowledge. If you would like to 49:It is of interest to the following 3913:Is there anyone who has access to 3150:Japanese Knowledge research report 2896:I made some edits to the English. 25: 3392:anyone should be forced to do so. 2853:Translation of fighting game play 103:This page is within the scope of 3164:Japanese Knowledge#Controversies 2996: 2839: 369: 90: 80: 62: 31: 3527:I think you're thinking of the 3963:15:24, 25 September 2024 (UTC) 3945:12:44, 25 September 2024 (UTC) 3930:11:35, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3897:21:58, 25 September 2024 (UTC) 3866:20:28, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3852:19:49, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3838:19:42, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3823:19:05, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3808:17:11, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3793:16:17, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3778:16:09, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3741:05:35, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3723:05:30, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3700:05:11, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3677:04:51, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3656:21:17, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3642:20:13, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3584:01:22, 23 September 2024 (UTC) 3556:07:19, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3519:07:09, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3479:20:39, 25 September 2024 (UTC) 3464:04:28, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3449:01:20, 22 September 2024 (UTC) 3405:23:18, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3384:22:52, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3348:19:57, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3305:19:38, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3266:18:19, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3248:17:38, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3230:16:43, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3212:08:40, 21 September 2024 (UTC) 3145:11:39, 10 September 2024 (UTC) 3088:00:17, 10 September 2024 (UTC) 2906:11:09, 12 September 2024 (UTC) 2626:WikiProject Japan Barnstar 2.0 1: 3287:. You can even monitor where 3057:16:52, 8 September 2024 (UTC) 3023:02:33, 2 September 2024 (UTC) 2925:the Japanese name: ギア・アンティーク 178:WikiProject Japan to do list: 3616:Port Arthur massacre (China) 3066:I've created a new page for 2278:Districts and municipalities 1665:Districts and municipalities 3882:post on the RS board about 3431:. 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history 2081: 2075: 2035: 2034: 2029: 2011: 1804:Old notice board 1790: 1674:Gaijin tarento ( 422: 421: 416: 409: 379:was featured in 373: 366: 297:requested images 233: 232: 175: 167: 166: 163: 160: 157: 150: 148: 141: 100: 95: 94: 93: 84: 77: 76: 66: 59: 36: 35: 34: 27: 21: 4003: 4002: 3998: 3997: 3996: 3994: 3993: 3992: 3968: 3967: 3905: 3602:Yamaji Motoharu 3330: 3328:Expand language 3324: 3320: 3314: 3291:Expand Japanese 3288: 3281:WP:GLOBALBLOCKs 3272:Canterbury Tail 3270:I believe what 3221:Canterbury Tail 3152: 3147: 3095: 3086: 3081: 3074: 3064: 3048: 3033: 3017: 3011:discussion page 3001: 2997: 2994: 2972: 2962: 2959: 2945: 2914: 2855: 2838: 2832: 2819: 2818: 2799: 2791: 2790: 2786: 2780: 2777: 2771: 2768: 2760: 2759: 2755: 2749: 2746: 2740: 2737: 2731: 2728: 2722: 2719: 2713: 2710: 2704: 2701: 2695: 2692: 2686: 2683: 2677: 2674: 2666: 2665: 2656: 2650: 2642: 2636: 2628: 2622: 2614: 2608: 2605: 2597: 2596: 2543: 2535: 2534: 2474:Anime and manga 2470: 2462: 2461: 2394: 2386: 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Thank you. 3013: 3012: 3007: 3006: 2992: 2988: 2985: 2983: 2982: 2977: 2975: 2967: 2965: 2957: 2949: 2943: 2939: 2937: 2936: 2932: 2928: 2923: 2919: 2911: 2907: 2903: 2899: 2895: 2894: 2893: 2892: 2888: 2884: 2879: 2875: 2872: 2870: 2865: 2862: 2860: 2852: 2850: 2842: 2835: 2830: 2826: 2823: 2822: 2817: 2816: 2812: 2808: 2804: 2795: 2794: 2789: 2785: 2784:User WP Japan 2776: 2764: 2763: 2758: 2754: 2745: 2736: 2727: 2718: 2709: 2700: 2691: 2682: 2670: 2669: 2664: 2662: 2655: 2648: 2641: 2634: 2627: 2620: 2613: 2612:WPJ-Barnsensu 2601: 2600: 2595: 2593: 2589: 2585: 2581: 2577: 2573: 2569: 2565: 2561: 2557: 2553: 2549: 2542:Related pages 2539: 2538: 2533: 2531: 2527: 2523: 2519: 2515: 2511: 2507: 2503: 2499: 2498:Final Fantasy 2495: 2491: 2487: 2483: 2479: 2475: 2466: 2465: 2460: 2459: 2455: 2451: 2447: 2443: 2442:Ancient Japan 2439: 2435: 2431: 2427: 2423: 2419: 2415: 2411: 2407: 2403: 2399: 2393:Project links 2390: 2389: 2384: 2379: 2375: 2371: 2367: 2363: 2359: 2355: 2351: 2347: 2343: 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