Knowledge (XXG)

:Miscellany for deletion/User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox - Knowledge (XXG)

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determined to prevent me from communicating with anyone about a mere PROPOSAL for a project that I attempted to make available to Larry Sanger and Jimbo Wales. This is only a DRAFT PROPOSAL, but it has resulted in numerous insults and accusations from User:Guy Macon. Interesting that this editor seeems determined to make a big deal out of statements I redacted with an apology, after he instigated great provocation against me, including baiting me at one point on my own talk page. User:Guy Macon seems determined to prevent any discussion by anyone other than himself of a proposal that does NOT advocate doing anything but compiling some history from public records, meaning verifiable and credible sources. This entire experience is just astounding to me, and is interfering with my ability to develop a better proposal than the DRAFT I originally floated.
520:(which is not allowed here for a variety of reasons) would become the only means of connecting specific casual factors associated with climate change with individuals and institutions associated with the industries and policies believed to contribute to said phenomena. Indeed, it would not be garden-variety synth, but rather a daisy-chain style of synth on steroids. All of this would destroy any notion of neutrality and reliance on presenting the facts surrounding the relevant topics without introduction of our own interpretations of the issue. 549:
one I won't presume to try to answer here. But what I can tell you is that such an objective is in fundamental, intrinsic conflict with several of the guiding principles and priorities of this project. We are not here to leverage to leverage our sizeable platform to encourage specific kinds of change. If we did that, the system we have carefully crafted for generating content free of our own biases (while simultaneously minimizing disputes over the
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perfectly fair to all parties, I did not see how it started). All of that said, I'll add my voice to the chorus who are trying to make it clear to you that Knowledge (XXG) is just not the place for such a venture. This project does not seek to be a promoter of social change in the world--at least, not beyond the objective of making people generally more knowledgeable. What we do here is provide an
534:. The resistance of those articles is in large part attributable to the diligent and professional editors working on them, but more than anything it can be ascribed to our strong policies which forbid editorialization and the introduction of our idiosyncratic views in the place of the more appropriate 299:
Note that no actual ANI case was filed. Something strange is going on with this user. First he saw a big red "VANDAL" in an edit summary that didn't mention vandalism, then he claimed that I had mistakenly deleted two users' comments when I had only deleted one, and now he has posted an imaginary ANI
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of matters between our editors) would grind to a cacophonous halt, and our reputation for how well we pursue our stated purposes (summarizing the whole of human knowledge) would disintegrate into our becoming a punchline--and justifiably so. There are many places online where your proposal would be
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This is problematic for a number of reasons. For one, it will necessarily involve massive amounts of diversion into original research and synthesis, since even those scientists whom are the most steadfast proponents of anthropogenic climate change do not typically engage with the topic by trying to
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of various topics. You classify your effort as one which attempts to record "history", but everything about the proposal--its format and the stated points of emphasis--makes clear that the primary objective would be to assign causal blame for what is likely to prove the single greatest calamity of
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At the end of the day, we are here to summarize topics neutrally, but what you wish to do is to get into the weeds and assign blame, and in a very targeted manner for specific pragmatic ends. Perhaps shaming particular individuals could be an appropriate venture--that's a complicated question and
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articles which do specifically discuss the overwhelming scientific consensus on the causes of climate change. And those articles withstand an onslaught of pretty much daily efforts to weaken the presentation of that consensus and introduce fringe alternative theories through the exercise of false
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Soapboxing isn't allowed on a user's talk page even if the user wants to allow soapboxing. This applies to all users and all userpages, even Jimbo. If don't like the existing policy, try to change it, but please refrain from telling me on multiple pages that I was wrong when I made a good-faith
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broadly. Mervyn, I understand that you are frustrated by the fact that you have not been able to even vet this notion, and from what I have seen of the dispute here, the explanation for why this just won't fly on this project could have been delivered to you less bombastically (though to be
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User:Guy Macon has spent the past few days STALKING me all over Knowledge (XXG), deleting material I have posted requesting comments from others, even on my own talk page and now in my own sandbox. He displays a pattern of uncivil, even hostile behavior in violation of WP:Civility and seems
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You might also note the following statement that appears on Jimbo Wales talk page: "This is Jimbo Wales's talk page, where you can send messages and comments to Jimbo Wales." Nothing on that page says it is ok for another editor to delete "messages and comments" from his talk page.
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Perhaps you should postpone any further action on this for the time being. I have requested assistance from AN/I in dealing with an over zealous and uncivil editor, Guy Macon, who appears to be stalking me all over Knowledge (XXG), posting negative comments about me on every page I
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have predictably already been cited as the most direct and brightline arguments as to why this proposal and even the content that forwards the notion are not appropriate for Knowledge (XXG), but there's actually a bevy of other policies on point, including, but not limited to
196:- Something needs to be done. The editor is out of control in his campaign. Some sort of sanction is needed, whether a block for incivility, a block for inappropriate web host use, or, at a minimum, deletion of the stuff. Since we are here: 554:
warmly embraced, but I would urge you to trust me (and the others who have tried to tell you as much already, even if/when they are not doing it as softly as they might have) that this project is just not going to be one of them.
399:. (Merwyn hasn't posted to ANI, either before or after I opened the current thread.) The only issue that needs to be considered here is whether the sandbox should be deleted, because the conduct issues are being dealt with at 56:. The discussion here and at ANI makes it clear there is no chance of there being any consensus except to delete this. Keeping this open any longer is unlikely to produce any additional, more useful outcome. 542:
and other forms of soapboxing in defiance of consensus views on particular topics. It would be especially problematic for articles relating to climate change (or any topic plagued by science denialism
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tests. To allow the introduction of articles such as the one you propose would be to introduce and a fault and a weakness into our processes, and would undermine every safeguard we have against
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proposal to out "the individuals who are making and have made destructive decisions leading to climate change". The exact same proposal has been deleted as soapboxing from User talk:Jimbo Wales
243:- however, I should warn you that you're unlikely to succeed at getting him sanctioned, and all you will end up doing is attracting more attention to this MfD and to your editing. 734: 100: 96: 707:
welcomes this sort of material, and post to Reddit's subreddits have a much larger audience than a post to even the most popular Knowledge (XXG) talk pages. --
387:. That page is well-known to be a free-fire zone, and censoring it has in the past resulted in an ArbCom case. It is also true that the greater error was 525:
Beyond this, there are more fundamental objections. The tone of any article on this project is meant to be encyclopedic, not editorial. Indeed, we have
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Guy neglected to mention that these comments were severely provoked by his own uncivil baiting of me and that subsequently I redacted them with apologies.
88: 622: 682:- In what way does this improve the encyclopedia ? .... Plenty of websites where it can be stored however preferably it should be stored offline. – 618: 418: 17: 755: 716: 695: 674: 638: 609: 592: 573: 489: 468: 435: 412: 374: 356: 341: 313: 294: 277: 252: 230: 211: 184: 163: 148: 69: 516:
create metrics which assign responsibility. Indeed, empirically, this would a be a fools errand. Lacking such sources,
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Knowledge (XXG):Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Knowledge (XXG):Miscellany for deletion/User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox
40: 92: 667: 408: 337: 207: 83: 75: 531: 588: 248: 651: 484: 423:"This applies to usernames, articles, categories, files, talk page discussions, templates, and user pages." 236: 605: 352: 290: 226: 159: 128: 517: 493: 29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below.
766: 739: 384: 273: 36: 539: 497: 133:"Just another climate change denier, doing the scut work of the corporate shills? Looks like it to me." 625:. The author should immediately move this content offline or to another website that allows advocacy. 404: 333: 203: 647: 480: 388: 362: 118: 751: 712: 631: 570: 464: 431: 370: 309: 180: 144: 535: 419:
Knowledge (XXG):What Knowledge (XXG) is not#Knowledge (XXG) is not a soapbox or means of promotion
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attempt to follow our policy to the letter. I am asking you nicely to stop this behavior now. --
395:, who has then continued by writing things that are not true, such as about filing a thread at 601: 392: 348: 286: 222: 155: 501: 474: 53: 267: 400: 396: 329: 325: 321: 301: 240: 765:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's
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For pretty much all the reasons above, just looks like an OR essay to promote a book.
137:"Your arrogance is truly breathtaking. Too bad your wisdom cannot keep pace with it." 57: 417:
You are attempting to replace a Knowledge (XXG) policy with something you made up.
658:... take your pick, but no matter what this contributes nothing to the project. -- 660: 328:
does not suspend the deletion discussion. The deletion discussion and the
239:(we don't use "stalking"), then the place to present your evidence is at 172:...only to turn around and accuse me of "stalking and threatening" you. 704: 361:
Soapboxing isn't allowed anywhere on Knowledge (XXG). Please read
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
621:, and if it went any further, would be a flagrant violation of 320:
I have reported this disruptive deletion discussion at
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User talk:Jimbo Wales#Your talk page is being edited
266:per nom. This isn't suitable for Knowledge (XXG). 324:. Reporting a disruptive deletion discussion at 43:). No further edits should be made to this page. 773:). No further edits should be made to this page. 623:Knowledge (XXG):Biographies of living persons 8: 619:Knowledge (XXG):What Knowledge (XXG) is not 235:If you believe that Guy Macon has violated 18:Knowledge (XXG):Miscellany for deletion 300:case. I am not sure whether this is a 7: 129:User talk:Mervyn Emrys#November 2018 48:The result of the discussion was: 383:was wrong in censoring a rant from 332:discussion continue in parallel. 24: 304:situation or subtle trolling. -- 583:per nom and others as soapbox. 530:balance and other varieties of 1: 617:This is a clear violation of 756:20:36, 7 November 2018 (UTC) 717:18:00, 7 November 2018 (UTC) 696:17:14, 7 November 2018 (UTC) 675:20:14, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 639:17:35, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 610:14:05, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 593:09:06, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 574:07:01, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 469:06:13, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 436:23:06, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 413:22:27, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 375:03:10, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 357:02:59, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 342:05:11, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 314:03:10, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 295:02:22, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 278:02:13, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 253:09:10, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 231:23:59, 5 November 2018 (UTC) 212:20:30, 5 November 2018 (UTC) 185:05:51, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 164:02:22, 6 November 2018 (UTC) 149:15:41, 5 November 2018 (UTC) 70:23:58, 7 November 2018 (UTC) 124:and User talk:Larry Sanger. 793: 117:Improper use of sandbox; 84:User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox 76:User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox 763:Please do not modify it. 32:Please do not modify it. 459:not a soapbox applies. 127:Also see discussion at 510:the anthropocenic era. 385:User talk:Jimbo Wales 507:encyclopedic summary 490:WP:Original research 663: 661: 393:User:Mervyn Emrys 784: 693: 688: 673: 636: 634:Let's discuss it 421:is quite clear: 379:It is true that 270: 113: 112: 60: 34: 792: 791: 787: 786: 785: 783: 782: 781: 777: 771:deletion review 689: 684: 672: 659: 632: 405:Robert McClenon 334:Robert McClenon 268: 204:Robert McClenon 86: 82: 79: 58: 41:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 790: 788: 779: 776: 775: 758: 744: 743: 742: 737: 729: 728: 722: 721: 720: 719: 699: 698: 677: 666: 641: 612: 595: 577: 576: 545: 544: 532:WP:POV pushing 522: 521: 512: 511: 471: 453: 452: 451: 450: 449: 448: 447: 446: 445: 444: 443: 442: 441: 440: 439: 438: 381:User:Guy Macon 281: 280: 260: 259: 258: 257: 256: 255: 215: 214: 197: 190: 189: 188: 187: 167: 166: 115: 114: 78: 73: 46: 45: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 789: 780: 774: 772: 768: 764: 759: 757: 753: 749: 745: 741: 738: 736: 733: 732: 731: 730: 727: 724: 723: 718: 714: 710: 706: 703: 702: 701: 700: 697: 694: 692: 687: 681: 678: 676: 671: 670: 664: 657: 653: 652:WP:NOTWEBHOST 649: 645: 642: 640: 637: 635: 630: 629: 624: 620: 616: 613: 611: 607: 603: 599: 596: 594: 590: 586: 585:Beyond My Ken 582: 579: 578: 575: 572: 571: 569: 568: 565: 562: 559: 552: 547: 546: 541: 537: 533: 528: 524: 523: 519: 514: 513: 508: 503: 499: 495: 491: 486: 485:WP:NOTWEBHOST 482: 478: 476: 472: 470: 466: 462: 458: 455: 454: 437: 433: 429: 424: 420: 416: 415: 414: 410: 406: 402: 398: 394: 390: 386: 382: 378: 377: 376: 372: 368: 364: 360: 359: 358: 354: 350: 345: 344: 343: 339: 335: 331: 327: 323: 319: 318: 317: 316: 315: 311: 307: 303: 298: 297: 296: 292: 288: 283: 282: 279: 275: 271: 265: 262: 261: 254: 250: 246: 245:Beyond My Ken 242: 238: 237:WP:HARASSMENT 234: 233: 232: 228: 224: 219: 218: 217: 216: 213: 209: 205: 201: 198: 195: 192: 191: 186: 182: 178: 174: 171: 170: 169: 168: 165: 161: 157: 153: 152: 151: 150: 146: 142: 138: 134: 130: 126: 123: 120: 110: 106: 102: 98: 94: 90: 85: 81: 80: 77: 74: 72: 71: 68: 67: 66: 61: 55: 51: 44: 42: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 778: 762: 760: 725: 690: 685: 679: 668: 643: 633: 627: 614: 602:Slatersteven 597: 580: 566: 563: 560: 557: 555: 526: 518:WP:SYNTHESIS 506: 494:WP:Synthesis 473: 456: 422: 349:Mervyn Emrys 287:Mervyn Emrys 263: 223:Mervyn Emrys 199: 193: 156:Mervyn Emrys 136: 132: 116: 64: 63: 49: 47: 31: 28: 543:generally). 540:WP:POVFORKS 498:WP:NOTESSAY 269:CoolSkittle 648:WP:SOAPBOX 481:WP:SOAPBOX 389:soapboxing 363:WP:SOAPBOX 119:WP:SOAPBOX 767:talk page 748:Guy Macon 709:Guy Macon 536:WP:WEIGHT 461:Legacypac 428:Guy Macon 367:Guy Macon 306:Guy Macon 177:Guy Macon 141:Guy Macon 37:talk page 769:or in a 726:Related: 551:WP:TRUTH 39:or in a 502:WP:NPOV 475:WP:SNOW 202:this. 194:Comment 97:history 54:WP:SNOW 705:Reddit 680:Delete 644:Delete 628:Cullen 615:Delete 598:Delete 581:Delete 500:, and 477:Delete 457:Delete 401:WP:ANI 397:WP:ANI 330:WP:ANI 326:WP:ANI 322:WP:ANI 302:WP:CIR 285:visit. 264:Delete 241:WP:ANI 200:Delete 59:Jayron 50:DELETE 686:Davey 656:WP:OR 139:). -- 105:watch 101:links 16:< 752:talk 713:talk 691:2010 662:Kinu 606:talk 589:talk 527:many 483:and 465:talk 432:talk 409:talk 371:talk 365:. -- 353:talk 338:talk 310:talk 291:talk 274:talk 249:talk 227:talk 208:talk 181:talk 160:talk 145:talk 135:and 109:logs 93:talk 89:edit 52:per 403:. 391:by 754:) 746:-- 715:) 654:, 650:, 646:. 608:) 591:) 496:, 492:, 479:- 467:) 434:) 411:) 373:) 355:) 340:) 312:) 293:) 276:) 251:) 229:) 210:) 183:) 175:-- 162:) 147:) 107:| 103:| 99:| 95:| 91:| 65:32 750:( 711:( 669:c 665:/ 604:( 587:( 567:w 564:o 561:n 558:S 463:( 430:( 407:( 369:( 351:( 336:( 308:( 289:( 272:( 247:( 225:( 206:( 179:( 158:( 143:( 131:( 111:) 87:(

Index

Knowledge (XXG):Miscellany for deletion
talk page
deletion review
WP:SNOW
Jayron
32
23:58, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox
User:Mervyn Emrys/sandbox
edit
talk
history
links
watch
logs
WP:SOAPBOX


User talk:Mervyn Emrys#November 2018
Guy Macon
talk
15:41, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Mervyn Emrys
talk
02:22, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Guy Macon
talk
05:51, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Robert McClenon

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