353:(again, emphasis mine). I just thought I'd explain why I am !voting 'keep' against the current concensus - it is not a random thing, but something which I have considered carefully, as I do with all my !votes on xfD (not to imply that others don't! I am aware of the fact that most editors who !vote at xfD carefully consider the case before typing). --
687:"Knowledge (XXG) is not a social network like MySpace or Facebook. You may not host your own website, blog, or wiki at Knowledge (XXG). ser pages...may be used only to present information relevant to working on the encyclopedia. ... The focus of user pages should not be social networking, but rather providing a foundation for effective collaboration."
139:: I have contacted the user explaining the situation and asking if he/she consents to the deletion of the pages. This often prevents the need for a deletion discussion. If the user consents then I will delete the pages under the user request CSD criteria and speedy close this debate, otherwise the debate will continue.
660:
Wikipedians have their own user pages, but they may be used only to present information relevant to working on the encyclopedia. If you are looking to make a personal webpage or blog or to post your resume, please make use of one of the many free providers on the
Internet or any hosting included with
786:
I disagree with your argument that there is harm in "a community where individuals police others' workspace over harmless trivialities." Knowledge (XXG) is a community, but it's not a community in the traditional sense where members spend nearly all of their time. If someone wants to social network,
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Barnstars are usually related, directly or tangentially, to the construction of the encyclopedia. They also allow editors to commend other editors for their work. Although some barnstars are irrelevant to the construction of the encyclopedia, most are sufficiently relevant to building a "foundation
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users must avoid creating material in or adding content to their userspace that is used solely for social networking, instead utilizing their userspace to provide "a foundation for effective collaboration." Some userspace content that is borderline social networking is protected by this "foundation
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was 'no concensus', Tezero has made a total of 7 edits to these pages - of which 5 were their creation! I think this clearly falls within the leeway we can give to active editors - it is not distracting Tezero from editing (although the user's edits have fallen off in the last 4 months, they still
690:
I note that Tezero is an active editor who did not register a
Knowledge (XXG) account for the purpose of social networking. However, this policy is clearly applicable to all Knowledge (XXG) users, not just users who have registered accounts solely for the purpose of social networking. Therefore,
531:
No, I think the pages are ineffective at providing a foundation for effective collaboration. But they are even worse at helping the user with his social networking, and so I don't see any "abuse". These pages are just silly distractions, and I advocate a tolerant "each to their own" approach.
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It's my opinion. This is a fine but contentious grey-zone in policy. In previous years, the leeway idea was quite generous, but there is nothing documented on old policy that I can find. Recently (in the last year), many editors have become upset by an alleged large number of non-contributors
270:
has 6,920 edits, of which 6692 are still live, has been editing for 19 months, with just over 70% of their edits in article space (or article talk space), and about 15% of their edits in either user or user talk space. I am inclined to say to leave these pages - the last
812:"quite sure that these pages are not for the purpose of social networking." Well, maybe it's my lack of imagination, but these pages wouldn't complement any social network I am familiar with. I think these pages serve virtually no purpose whatsoever. I think (
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I have a problem with suggestion that pages like this have purpose of social networking. I am quite sure that these pages are not for the purpose of social networking. I see no relevance of mentioning “social networking”. They should not be deleted for that
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If you can explain to me how these pages provide a foundation for effective collaboration then I may reconsider my position. If I thought they did that I would not have supported deletion, however they seem completely unrelated to the goals of the foundation.
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are not only completely irrelevant to the encyclopedia; they furthermore do not and cannot serve any purpose with regards to "providing a foundation for effective collaboration." They might be acceptable on a site designed for such social networking, such as
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After careful weighing of the precedents here, and the nature of the editor, I suggest that the benefit of any doubt be decided in his favor. Where the result scarely two months ago was "no consensus" I would suggest the same result is apropos this time.
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that's what they are. Moreover, I am struggling a bit with your assertion that you are "quite sure that these pages are not for the purpose of social networking." Personally, I am quite sure that's their sole purpose. What other purpose do you think they
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Although userboxes are often not related to the construction of the encyclopedia, they allow editors to get to know other editors better. By learning about other editors' interests, hobbies, views, etc., a "foundation for collaboration" is
505:
My interest is in finding the line that divides "social networking" from "providing a foundation for effective collaboration". I don't find that WP:NOT, in WP:MYSPACE or any other section, speaks directly to this sort of page.
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Nothing to do with our project's goals. We are not a web hosting company, we are an encyclopedia. There are plenty of free wikis out there with a more open scope, the only thing they lack is the high volume of
Knowledge (XXG).
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Although I personally dislike signature pages, they do allow editors to expand their contacts in the
Knowledge (XXG) community by meeting other editors, thus assisting in building a "foundation for collaboration."
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I concede the point that they do no harm. Since these pages are in userspace, that is a valid argument, although I believe an innocuous violation of
Knowledge (XXG) policy is still a violation of Knowledge (XXG)
467:), a section which is relatively new, is slowly gelling into form. It is unclear where consensus lies, between Gig's statement and mine. Unfortunately, very few people are willing to engage in the debate at
1058::Page says "...don't go around telling everyone how to get here. If , I shall have to move this somewhere...." (but you may want to see in context and he may not have considered MfD as a possibility). --
427:(struck due mostly per Triplestop. This particular game lacks novelty or educational value). Consistent contributions buy you moderate leeway in userspace, even if many people don't see the point. --
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I see these pages as worthless, but otherwise inoffensive. I see little harm in keeping them, and I see harm in a community where individuals police others’ workspace over harmless trivialities.
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15kb of "Find the blue link (i.e. the one that doesn't redlink.)" repeated over and over again is nonsense. On the page you mentioned, there is at least some meaning to the text, however vapid.
816:) that the intention was educational, with regard to the functions of the wiki. If you think these pages are here to supplement his social networking, then that is a very good reason to delete.
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No, WP:MYSPACE does not "allow" such pages. A list of NOTs is a very poor way to formulate guidance, and interpreting meaning from the absence of a particular NOT is too screwy. --
760:“may be used only to present information relevant to working on the encyclopedia” does seem to say that games of negligible educational value (related to the project) are not OK. --
335:!vote 'delete' on such a page, personally I think they are a waste of time, and most (but not all) of the ones I've seen are by editors who never contribute to the encyclopedia.
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I agree with you, ASaW, that they apply to all users, from someone who registered today up to and including Jimbo Wales!. However, I would like to remind my fellow editors that
739:
of evidence is on those voting to keep these pages to explain how, exactly, they provide Tezero with a "foundation for effective collaboration." The ball's in your court.
1115:
change of my !vote following the discussion here. Does this mean that we can now expect to have a few dozen of these pages up for deletion within the next few days? --
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Sorry, SmokeyJoe, but I strongly disagree. Knowledge (XXG) policies and guidelines apply to everyone, from newer users to veteran editors, admins, and bureaucrats.
591:
It is a generally accepted standard that editors should attempt to follow, though it is best treated with common sense, and occasional exceptions may apply
1054:. Adding to the above list as it's totally dependent on the other pages. Please revert me if you think I'm wrong, but please also explain your revert.
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as harmless. It takes vastly more effort to have this deletion discussion than what the pages waste. Also per
PhantomSteve's arguments above. •
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Is this something that policy reflects, or is it simply a point of view? (not trying to be a smartass, policies change so often I don't know)
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is policy and is also very clear about this sort of thing. Many essays and guidelines reflect this, but the root is in what we are not.
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playing games and doing myspacey things, and this has lead to sporadic purges against unrelated things and nonsense in userspace.
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If this was an editor who did nothing else but play about with their own user pages, I'd be inclined to say 'delete'. However,
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Page with not encyclopedic value whatsoever. Having contributions does not give one leeway to violate policies such as
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Chillum may not have responded yet, but I'm going to jump in here, as this is a debate that I think is worth having.
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Games, roleplaying sessions, and other things pertaining to "entertainment" rather than "writing an encyclopedia",
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If WP:NOT is very clear about this sort of thing, can you tell me which words apply to these pages, and why? --
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While it is true that they are not described by their creators as "social networking" or "games," I argue that
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a
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per the rational above. The user is an active participant in the project, and is given leeway according to
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a
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as allowing secret page games like this? Are they, in your mind, a foundation for effective collaboration?
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below.
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average 4 a day over that time period - probably because of academic/work or family commitments). --
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Not necessarily, they seem to come in spurts. This is the fifth or sixth one that I've !voted in.
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Contributions don't buy you a license to do nonsense that wouldn't otherwise be allowed.
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they can do so on numerous websites – just not on
Knowledge (XXG). That's the essence of
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particularly if they involve people who are not active participants in the project
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apply to Tezero just as much as they apply to someone who registered yesterday.
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Wikipedia_talk:User_page#WP:UP.23NOT.2F11_aka_WP:UP.23GAMES._.22particularly.22
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975:"Even if it does", can you take a stab at defining the nonsense line? Does
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1103:. The effort is wasted because some people oppose something so obvious. —
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Not
Myspace, and it's a game with nothing to do with the mainspace.
658:
Sorry for the delayed response, I have been traveling. This part: "
299:) 08:57, 20 November 2009 (UTC) (Changing !vote... see below) --
1169:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
916:. Secret pages do not contribute to building the encyclopedia.
955:, and even if it does this nonsense clearly crosses the line.
346:(emphasis mine) - it does not forbid it. Further on, it says
735:, but not on Knowledge (XXG). At this point, I think the
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it was brought here, as a courtesy to an active user.
852:. This pages have nothing to do with Knowledge (XXG).
892:Should not have been nominated again so soon after
593:. Also, for those who haven't read it, there is an
491:Thanks for the response. I am going to stick with
39:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1179:). No further edits should be made to this page.
8:
869:the user should have been asked about these
601:, which may make interesting reading --
181:we went through this two months ago...--
495:on this matter which enjoys consensus.
18:Knowledge (XXG):Miscellany for deletion
663:" I think how it applies is obvious.
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94:Added 23:41, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
44:The result of the discussion was
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722:However, secret pages and other
222:Knowledge (XXG) isn't Myspace.
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1021:I can agree with that. --
696:for collaboration" clause:
794:Finally, do you interpet
1172:Please do not modify it.
676:The question is whether
32:Please do not modify it.
64:User:Tezero/Secret Page
661:your Internet account.
104:Backslash Forwardslash
463:The relevant policy (
226:Décémbér21st2012Fréak
1052:User:Tezero/monobook
1050:secret page is here:
894:the previous request
800:A Stop at Willoughby
741:A Stop at Willoughby
569:A Stop at Willoughby
164:A Stop at Willoughby
154:These pages violate
91:User:Tezero/monobook
979:cross the line? --
712:for collaboration."
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1078:@029, i.e.
914:WP:UP#Games
621:My Contribs
565:WP:UP#GAMES
465:WP:UP#GAMES
373:My Contribs
331:I normally
319:My Contribs
296:My Contribs
268:User:Tezero
266:shows that
160:WP:UP#GAMES
50:Killiondude
1129:Contact Me
1005:Triplestop
959:Triplestop
796:WP:MYSPACE
789:WP:MYSPACE
682:WP:MYSPACE
615:Contact Me
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367:Contact Me
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1023:SmokeyJoe
981:SmokeyJoe
977:this page
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709:Barnstars
701:Userboxes
646:SmokeyJoe
630:Yes, but
587:guideline
534:SmokeyJoe
508:SmokeyJoe
477:SmokeyJoe
429:SmokeyJoe
389:WP:UP#NOT
342:Generally
337:WP:UP#NOT
243:Katerenka
241:per nom.
201:WP:UP#NOT
776:de facto
729:Facebook
205:Specs112
1119:Phantom
1044:Comment
936:Collect
867:comment
783:policy.
754:reason.
733:MySpace
605:Phantom
583:WP:USER
557:Comment
357:Phantom
329:Comment
303:Phantom
280:Phantom
1113:Delete
1105:AlexSm
1101:WP:NOT
1097:Delete
1089:Anakin
1048:actual
953:WP:NOT
949:Delete
918:Cunard
906:Delete
871:before
850:Delete
779:serve?
737:burden
704:built.
678:WP:NOT
632:WP:NOT
493:WP:NOT
406:Delete
239:Delete
220:Delete
197:Delete
179:Delete
152:Delete
121:Delete
46:delete
1157:Novak
1122:Steve
881:talk
854:Nsk92
724:games
608:Steve
595:essay
585:is a
475:. --
469:WT:UP
360:Steve
339:says
333:would
306:Steve
283:Steve
209:Talk!
16:<
1151:Gwen
1099:per
1085:Keep
1063:Thin
1056:Note
1046:The
1027:talk
985:talk
940:talk
931:Keep
922:talk
912:and
908:per
898:Nard
890:Keep
858:talk
825:talk
814:hope
804:talk
766:talk
745:talk
650:talk
599:here
573:talk
563:and
538:talk
512:talk
481:talk
433:talk
424:Keep
414:talk
410:Gigs
397:talk
385:Keep
259:Keep
247:talk
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168:talk
158:and
137:Note
111:talk
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1068:boy
896:. -
876:DGG
731:or
715:c)
707:b)
699:a)
693:all
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