1368:. These kind of No. 17 violations are fairly common since it seems as if almost every editor who edits sports article like this feels there is nothing wrong with using the same non-free sports logo in multiple child article of the same parent. FWIW, It should definitely be removed from the userpage asap. It should also be removed from the child articles, but expect it to be re-added fairly quickly so it might be a good idea to link this discussion in the edit sum and possibly post on the article's talk page explaining why the image should not be used. -
232:. The building pictured is referred to by it's address in the article, but that's about it. Usage seems purely decorative and does not satisfy NFCC#8 in my opinion. Also, the source provided for the image is just to the fraternity's national website so there's no way to verify when it was taken or by whom, and whether it is even the building in question. Is there some other way to verify how old the image is to see whether it is still protected by copyright? -
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1238:) says bascially the same thing. The application of the NFC in this case has nothing to do with the "nationality" of Sirius Canada, so I'm not sure how this is being biased against Canadian companies. The NFC would apply and has been applied to companies/organizations whose parent and child entities are located within the same country, even those located solely within the United States. -
250:, which you can see the people in front are dressed in the same period of clothing as other photos (that are licensed as free) on the Phi Kappa Phi page, and seems to be related to meetings at the start of this organization's history pre 1910. As such, if we can presume that data is correct, this should be out of copyright, but I would get second opinions on that. --
922:, "it is the duty of users seeking to include or retain content to provide a valid rationale; those seeking to remove or delete it are not required to show that one cannot be created." If the image should not be being used per No. 17 of the UUI, then a valid non-free use rationale cannot really be written. Just for reference, I looked
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Regarding this particular image, it doesn't seem to be the one even being used by Sirius
Satellite Radio anymore. Maybe the current logo SSR is using could be used in that article and this older one could be used in the Sirius Canada article. I say "could" because once again usage of non-free content
1512:
Since this is a non-free image used to identify the subject of the article it is placed, shouldn't the image be cropped so that the subject of the article is the main focus of the image? Otherwise, the image seems to distract from its purpose (which is to identify the article's subject), which could
1100:
Regarding the "strictness" of WP:NFC, it clearly says that they were purposely designed to be more strict than US copyright law with respect to the usage of non-free content on
Knowledge (XXG). Any discussion about whether the NFC is too strict or unreasonable should probably take place at that talk
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Unless there is something unique or historical about the building which cannot be expressed by a free image, I also think this usage fails NFCC#1. The building (at least "90 Broad Street") itself is not the subject of any sourced discussion within the article so there are still NFCC#8 issues and the
1233:
says "Company logos may appear in articles on those companies, but note that, if challenged, it is the responsibility of those who wish to include the logo to prove that its use meets
Knowledge (XXG) non-free content criteria." There is also a hatnote for the same section which clearly says "This
467:
I think I have to agree here; we generally require all user-created contributed content to be in CC or PD licensing, and if these are photos that were not published yet, that makes it more difficult. We should encourage the user if they can use a CC license in which case all such issues go away.
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We're not preventing logos of
Canadian companies from being used, only when the Canadian company is a child company of a US company, which does appear to be the case for Sirius Canada. If there was a case of a US company being a child of a Canadian one, and both used the same logo and both were
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requires that the usage of non-free content be minimal, and I don't see how allowing the additional usages in the team articles meets that requirement. Therefore, usage should be allowed in "Football
Federation Islamic Republic of Iran", but removed from all the individual team articles. --
1575:"...although the Coast Guard lists this as a courtesy photo, it was taken by one of his shipmates, on his ship, and even if the bosun told the seamen to 'take five', I personally think a strong argument can be made that they were all 'on duty' -- making this a public domain image."
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The url I provided above was listed in the infobox of Sirius Canada as the company's official website. If it is for a different company, then it probably should be removed. Did Sirius Canada have its own official website which may be used to verify the logo was
835:. The fact that "Sirius Canada never had a separate logo; it just used the same one, and no 'specific to Canada' alternate version ever existed." seems to be convered by No. 17 and still usage is not allowed. Anyway, just interested in other opens here. -
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allowed to have them, then they're unreasonable rules which deserve to be opposed and exploded. If there's a conflict between "NFC policy as currently written" and the principle that companies should be able to have their logo in their infobox, then the
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than any actual law actually governing what is or isn't actually fair use. Sirius Canada was not a subsidiary of the US company, but was a completely separate, independently incorporated company in its own right ā but any rule which makes it
691:, so I readded the image until that discussion could be resolved. If this is PD, then there are no issues other than perhaps adding a section titled "Former logos" and tweaking the caption to include the years of use really left to fix. -
317:, it looks like the building still exists, so maybe we could get someone in South Carolina to snap a pic? It's not exactly a replacement, since it lacks the historical element, but it does provide an image of the building in question.
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to see if an alternative existed. The logo being discussed here does not even seem to be the one being used any more so using it as the primary means of identification no longer seems warranted. The logo used on the
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I was going to change the licensing to PD-logo, but I cannot find a source for the image. The channel's website is no longer online and I cannot find an archived version of it. Is there a way to work around this? -
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Finally, pretty much all of
Knowledge (XXG)'s policies and guidelines have been created with Knowledge (XXG) specifically in mind and not to necessarily reflect the common practice of the outside world, right? -
1408:. The consensus regarding UUI#17 has been consistent in that using such logos in articles about child entities is generally not allowed. The image is currently being used in two individual team articles (
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Aye, but the boat should be included in part as well since it's part of the NFCR. Someone with better knowledge of how these folks operate should clarify whether that image is copyrighted or not, though.
1000:
the same "visual identification of the company's branding" that would apply to any other company on earth, is quite simply a patently unreasonable rule that deserves nothing but unyielding pushback.
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logo at all. If you can figure out some alternative solution which enables the article to contain the logo it used, then by all means go right ahead with it ā but it cannot and will not be left
723:
Oops. Thanks for catching that Jo-Jo. I meant to delete that before I hit "save", but forgot. I originally had option (2) as (1). Anyway, I struck that part out. Sorry for the confusion. -
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PD-USOnly means that it can't be moved to
Commons. Commons accepts images if they are free images in both the US and the country of their origin. If it's US-made then it should be PD-logo.
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section offers advice on applying the non-free content criteria to logos. It does not replace the policy, which is fully applicable to logos." Knowledge (XXG)'s image use policy (
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says that "There is no automatic entitlement to use non-free content in an article or elsewhere on
Knowledge (XXG)." Why is Sirius Canada an exception to the requirements of
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As for the matter of the "current" logo, what you're missing is that Sirius Canada and SiriusXM Canada aren't the same thing. In exactly the same way as the US versions of
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573:- the page it was used on is now redirected to another article that uses a different non-free picture. Does this one meet the TOO and thus eligible for deletion under F5?
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Knowledge (XXG):Files for discussion/2016 February 17#File:Heriberto
Hernandez standing next to the 13 foot whaler he was manning when he was mortally wounded in 1968.jpg
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Note: The USCG listed this as a "courtesy photo" in a surfeit of caution, or inappropriate courtesy. As I noted in the description:
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Agree on both counts. In addition, it only has nfurs for three articles, but it is being used in nine so it also has problems with
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It's okay to not have to crop for this. But the caption needs to be clear who it is in the photo (I assume he is front left). --
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might be too simple to be covered by copyright. If they are, then I believe they could be used instead of the non-free logo. -
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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of the predecessor companies ever used when they were separate companies. The old Sirius logo is the only correct one on
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fact the that building seems to still be standing is just another reason why this particular usage does not comply with
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File:Heriberto
Hernandez standing next to the 13 foot whaler he was manning when he was mortally wounded in 1968.jpg
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I see little difference between the version today and this, so I would agree NFCC#1 fails on this image. --
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These four images seemingly belong to the owner, who released them here non-free. As such, they may fail
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I uploaded this image, and I am surprised that I wasn't given a heads-up that it was under discussion.
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separate and specific nfur for each usage, something which has not been done in my opinion. Moreover,
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It has not been demonstrated that this usage is considered to be an exception to No. 17 of
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separately notable, then we'd not use the logo on the US page for the same reasons here. --
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Looks like it doesn't meet our non-free criteria. Removed from article. Non-admin close.
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used by any entity that was incorporated as Sirius Canada ā it's the logo of a separate
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It's definitely PD-USonly at minimum. (and arguably worldwide since XM is US-owned). --
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File:Antonio and Lydia Villegas and family at Manila Airport headed to USA in 1971.jpg
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Knowledge (XXG):Files for discussion/2016 February 15#File:Rhondda Cynon Taff arms.png
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Sirius Satellite Radio isn't "using" a different logo than this either; it's also a
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to be; if they create a patently unfair situation where the Canadian companies are
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
1390:. Image is still being used in the two team articles for which it has nfurs. -
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is not guaranteed and it must be supported by a valid non-free use rationale.
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companies are eligible to have their logos in their infoboxes while others
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since, in my opinion, its non-free usage clearly failed (and still fails)
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binds Knowledge (XXG) content, but is a rule Knowledge (XXG) made up for
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requires that those wishing to use or retain a non-free image provide a
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Knowledge (XXG):Files for discussion/2016 February 17#File:Sirius.svg
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I commented out the image from the sandbox it was being used in per
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company that was the subject of the article under discussion here.
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be allowed to contain a logo ā it is absolutely, uncondtionally
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I did try to trace this image back but didn't get farther than
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tags since we have no evidence that this logo ever was used.
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logo in its infobox at all just because it happened to
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companies in Canada as well ā which merged into a new
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potentially violate some sort of fair use rationale.
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File:Football Federation Islamic Republic of Iran.png
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Is the "latter principle" you are referring to above
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logo in their infobox at all while the American ones
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the US companies did. So the "current" logo would be
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Image is used as primary means of identification in
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1493:) 15:13, 17 February 2016 (UTC)
1322:) 15:49, 17 February 2016 (UTC)
1231:WP:LOGO#Uploading non-free logos
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548:) 13:27, 17 February 2016ā (UTC)
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392:Images delete. Non-admin close.
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1481:Relisted at
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782:Relisted at
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673:Caricia (XM)
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532:āĀ Preceding
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37:
1366:WP:NFCC#10c
1188:permanently
1177:predecessor
882:permanently
876:containing
870:prohibiting
36:This is an
1406:WP:NFC#UUI
1343:WP:NFC#UUI
1190:unable to
1179:companies.
1143:logo than
970:impossible
957:inherently
884:unable to
823:WP:NFC#UUI
394:Oiyarbepsy
319:Oiyarbepsy
203:Oiyarbepsy
154:Oiyarbepsy
100:Oiyarbepsy
76:ArchiveĀ 73
70:ArchiveĀ 72
65:ArchiveĀ 71
60:ArchiveĀ 70
1518:Steel1943
1443:Marchjuly
1438:WP:NFCC#3
1392:Marchjuly
1384:WP:NFCC#9
1370:Marchjuly
1347:WP:NFCC#9
1313:Steel1943
1240:Marchjuly
1161:XM Canada
1141:different
1129:successor
1111:Marchjuly
1068:successor
1060:incorrect
1048:XM Canada
1005:extremely
986:agreement
943:Marchjuly
837:Marchjuly
828:this edit
740:Marchjuly
725:Marchjuly
693:Marchjuly
681:WP:NFCC#8
656:trademark
624:trademark
614:PD-USonly
358:Marchjuly
295:Marchjuly
234:Marchjuly
1578:Geo Swan
1430:WP:NFCCE
1388:WP:NFCCE
1184:designed
1036:SiriusXM
990:prevents
965:stricter
939:this one
937:, [ or
920:WP:NFCCE
912:WP:NFCCP
872:it from
546:contribs
534:unsigned
1487:Stefan2
1351:Stefan2
1227:WP:LOGO
1213:Bearcat
1209:matters
1125:defunct
1084:Bearcat
1080:defunct
1017:nothing
998:exactly
898:Bearcat
833:Bearcat
788:Stefan2
689:WP:WPRS
646:PD-logo
538:Stefan2
354:WP:NFCC
148:Now at
94:Now at
39:archive
1211:more.
1205:latter
1145:either
1072:merger
1032:merged
1013:aren't
961:itself
916:WP:NFC
677:WP:NFG
641:; (2)
450:NFCC#8
446:NFCC#4
1434:valid
1426:WP:F6
1194:have
1133:after
1097:used?
1064:never
1056:after
1040:third
1038:as a
982:share
976:have
888:have
356:. --
313:From
302:Masem
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1582:talk
1556:ASEM
1540:talk
1525:talk
1491:talk
1485:. --
1447:talk
1412:and
1396:talk
1374:talk
1355:talk
1320:talk
1257:ASEM
1244:talk
1217:talk
1192:ever
1167:and
1159:and
1151:and
1115:talk
1088:talk
1046:and
1026:and
1009:some
994:ever
974:ever
947:talk
902:talk
886:ever
874:ever
862:ever
854:must
841:talk
817:and
792:talk
786:. --
744:talk
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711:talk
697:talk
679:and
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579:talk
542:talk
524:fact
472:ASEM
458:talk
452:. --
398:talk
362:talk
336:ASEM
323:talk
277:talk
269:here
254:ASEM
238:talk
207:talk
158:talk
104:talk
1200:are
1196:any
1173:any
1137:new
1076:not
978:any
929:.ca
925:www
894:all
890:any
878:any
866:any
864:be
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