818:
Injuries, 4/23/04" 6 "Christopher Diaz - CT Scan of the
Orbital Bones and Traumatic Injuries, 4/23/04" 7 "Christopher Diaz - MRI of the Brain and Traumatic Injuries, 4/29/04" 8 "Christopher Diaz - MR Venogram of the Right Sigmoid Sinus Thrombosis 4/30/04" 9 "Marie Dorlean - Bimalleolar Fracture Dislocation of the Right Ankle with Subsequent Repair" 10 "Ernest Earle - Post-Accident Condition, 11/15/07" 11 "Ibett Gonzalez - Fracture of Right Radius and Surgical Repair" 12 "Ibett Gonzalez - Right Ankle Instability and Surgical Stabilization, 11/29/06" 13 "Liam Granquist - Release of Left Shoulder Internal Rotation Contracture, 11/21/08 (Part 1)" 14 "Liam Granquist - Release of Left Shoulder Internal Rotation Contracture, 11/21/08(Part 2)" 15 "Theresa Gresh - Normal vs. Pelvic Injuries, 1/27/04" 16 "Theresa Gresh - Arthroscopic Repair of Left Shoulder Injuries, 1/18/07 (Part 1)" 17 "Theresa Gresh - Open Repair of Left Shoulder Injuries, 1/18/07 (Part 2)" 18 "Theresa Gresh - Left Wrist Injuries and Surgical Repairs (Part 1), 1/18/07) 19 "Theresa Gresh - Left Wrist Injuries and Surgical Repairs (Part 2), 1/18/07) 20 "Amy Hutchinson - Surgical Shortening of Right Ulna" 21 "Kristen Jennings - Left Tibia Injury and Repair, 10/3/06" 22 "Kristen Jennings - Normal Anatomy vs. Valgus Deformity, 10/09/08" 23 "Larry Jones - C4-5 Cervical Disk Bulge and Surgical Repair" 24 "Larry Jones - C4-5 Anterior Cervical Diskectomy and Fusion, 8/20/08" 25 "David Juchniewicz - Right Wrist Surgery, 12/19/00" 26 "David Juchniewicz - Open Reduction of Right Wrist Fracture and Skin Grafting, 12/22/00" -- 27 "David Juchniewicz - Condition of Right Wrist, 4/33/01 and Removal of Pins" 28 "David Juchniewicz - Left Iliac Crest Bone Graft Applied to Right Radius Defect, 10/22/01" 29 "David Juchniewicz - Tenolysis of Flexor Muscles and Tendons from Skin Graft, 6/14/04" 30 "James Kazawic - Posterior Lumbar Fusion at L5-S 1, Performed on 1/2/07" 31 "Suzanne Keyes - Left Distal Fibula Fracture and Repair" 32 "Gary Licht - Proper vs. Actual Condition of the Cervical Spine" 33 "Gary Licht - C4-7 Posterior Cervical Fusion, 12/13/00" 34 "Bruce Mantel - Right Subtalar Fusion and Achilles Tenotomy, 5/17/07" 35 "Bruce Mantel - Left Subtalar Fusion with Ostectomy of Calcaneus, 11/1/07" 36 "Phyllis Massaro-Burke - Right Shoulder Arthroscopic Exam and Surgery, 11/17/03" 37 "Benjamin McIntosh - Left Leg Laceration and Fractures, 4/25/06" 38 "Benjamin McIntosh - Surgical Repairs of Left Leg Fractures" 39 "Florence McLafferty - Extent and Spread of Cancer at Time of Hysterectomy, 8/2/04" 40 "Donna Mulvaney - Left Hip Fracture Deformity and Surgical Repair" 41 "Donna Mulvaney - Open Reduction Internal Fixation of Left Hip Fracture 8/9/06" 42 "Michael Nimaroff - Mechanical Ventilation 2/10/02-2/11/02" 43 "Michael Nimaroff - Primary Pulmonary Arrest Culminating in Cardiac Arrest: Phase 1 - 2/11/02" 44 "Michael Nimaroff - Primary Pulmonary Arrest Culminating in Cardiac Arrest: Phase 2 -- 2/11/02" 45 "Michael Nimaroff - Primary Pulmonary Arrest Culminating in Cardiac Arrest: Phase 3 -- 2/11/02" 46 "Michael Nimaroff - Primary Pulmonary Arrest Culminating in Cardiac Arrest and Anoxic Brain Damage: Post CODE- 2/11/02" 47 "Gregory Patti - Surgical Repair of the Left Radial Shaft Fracture, Performed on 8/6/06" 48 "Binay Roy - 6/28/05 - 7/25/05" 49 "Ramon Ruiz - Open Reduction Internal Fixation of Right Pilon Fracture, 12/15/05" 50 "Ramon Ruiz - Right Post-Traumatic Ankle Arthritis and Fusion, 8/28/07" 51 "Christopher Ryan - Left Calcaneus Fracture and Surgical Repair" -- 52 "Ruth Sales - Proposed Posterior Lumbar Decompression and Fusion" 53 "Kalliope Sarrinikolaou - Fracture of the Right Fifth Metacarpal" 54 "Kalliope Sarrinikolaou - MRI of the Cervical Spine, 2/6/08" 55 "William Schilbe - Condition After Industrial Accident, 6/17/03" 56 "William Schilbe - Post-Operative Conditions" 57 "Jeffrey Thelen - Post-Accident Cervical Spine" 58 "Frederick Thorpe - Trauma to Thoracic Spine and Surgical Repair" 59 "Frederick Thorpe - Posterior Thoracic Fusion from T7- 11, 8/11/06" 60 "Debra Ulrich - Injury to the Left Radius, 9/23/06" 61 "Debra Ulrich - Surgical Repairs to the Left Radius (Date of Surgery: 3/7/07)" 62 "Normal Anatomy of the Cervical Spine" 63 "Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy of the Left Hand and Wrist".
647:, medical animation, and interactive media", then I don't see any reason why we should consider them to be any different from any other stock photo agency, except that this one also takes information from attorneys and turns it into presentations, timelines, and the like. (They will also do website design for you, but judging from the number of deadlinks and SQL errors on their website, they're not very good at it). The fact that people make complex graphical presentations that include some medical diagnostic images (in their case, for money apparently paid mostly by personal injury attorneys) doesn't tell you anything at all about the medical diagnostic images that might be included in such presentations.
651:
from 2/9/05 - 2/18/05" don't tell you if any medical diagnostic images are included, much less if those medical diagnostic images were created by the person claiming the copyright, rather than any images being incorporated into a larger, copyrightable presentation. The word "X-ray" doesn't appear anywhere in that record, and the artist filed a claim as being "2-d artwork".
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numbers for X-ray images, which seems to contradict the idea that the copyright office doesn't consider such images as copyrightable in the first place. See for example VAu001014144 ("Anatomical
Justice, LLC - Unpublished Works, October through December 2008") which is listed as having the following contents:
932:
Stefan you were involved in the RfC were the community on
Commons came out against your position. Continuing to nominate images for deletion for which there is consensus that there is not an issue is disruptive and may get you blocked. I will post this on your talk page as well just to make sure that
832:
There is also, for example, TX0000680375, which has the title "Computed tomography of the brain : atlas of normal anatomy / G. Salamon , Y. P. Huang , in cooperation with J. M. Corbaz, G. Lecaque, G. Nagy ... ; with 226 figures in 359 separate ill." I understand that this book also contains lots of
779:
So the problem for claiming copyright on a diagnostic image is, if the technician gets no choice about any of the elements that would make a regular photograph be copyrightable, then where is the creative element that makes it copyrightable, rather than a mere routine collection of information (like
862:
It also might be worth noting that user Stefan2 appears to have a personal grudge against medical images on
Knowledge (XXG) or Commons, using any justification to promote the deletion of such images. This behavior is disruptive to building an encyclopedia, and furthermore the justification given by
817:
1 "James Allen - Left
Bimalleolar Fractures with Surgical Repair" 2 "Thomas Cillo - Right Knee After PCL Reconstruction, 2/19/08" 3 "Brandon Deger - Evacuation of Epidural Hematoma, 6/22/06" 4 "Joyce DeMarco - Conditions from 2/9/05 - 2/18/05" 5 "Christopher Diaz - CT Scan of the Head and Traumatic
775:
With an X-ray, the physician chooses the subject, the regulations dictate the lighting and exposure, the exact time that you push the button is irrelevant (choosing when to "photograph" a person's bones is nothing like choosing when to photograph an ocean wave or the expression on a person's face),
650:
Or, to be more blunt, you actually have no idea if this art business is claiming copyright on medical diagnostic images (images that it would be illegal for them to make, unless the artist just happened to also be licensed as a rad technician), because descriptions like "Joyce DeMarco - Conditions
771:
What makes a typical photograph copyrightable is not merely that it exists on paper (so do phone books, and they aren't), but that the photographer has made choices about how to represent the image. With a regular photograph, even with a simple snapshot, the photographer chooses the subject, the
806:
claims that "The
Copyright Office takes the position that X-rays are not copyrightable because they are mechanical" but the page does not provide any evidence that the Copyright Office takes the position that X-rays are mechanical. In fact, the Copyright Office has issued multiple registration
670:
suggest that some of the images are medical images. Also, the registration suggests that all of the examples are copyrighted according to the copyright office. See also for example VAu001095217 which includes images such as "Carrie
Jefferson - Left Lateral Knee X-Ray: 5/30/06".
914:
I have not claimed that all X-rays are copyrightable. I have only claimed that there is no evidence that this isn't copyrightable. Also, on most days I have not even looked at medical images, so I am not sure what you mean with "continu daily with this behavior".
665:
Some of the images may be highly artistic and not diagnostic images, but I note examples such as "Kalliope
Sarrinikolaou - MRI of the Cervical Spine, 2/6/08" and "Christopher Diaz - CT Scan of the Orbital Bones and Traumatic Injuries, 4/23/04" which
772:
lighting, the angle, the exposure, the timing, and so forth, before pressing the button on the camera. All of those choices add up to a "creative element". The existence of a creative element is what makes it possible to claim copyright in a work.
828:
Doesn't this mean that the copyright office thinks that all of the 63 listed images are copyrightable? The
Copyright Office is supposed to reject registrations of images below the threshold of originality, so I assume that all of them are
548:
removed the tag stating that "it is in the public domain as taken in the USA, not copyrightable". However, the user didn't provide any evidence that this statement is true, and it seems to contradict current practice of the
981:
The uploader credits the image to Dr. Leon Chen but according to the uploader's user page, the uploader is called
Matthew Winther. If you upload copyrighted images created by someone else, you need OTRS permission – see
713:
Diagnostic X-rays are not any old picture taken with a camera or X-ray machine. They are technical images produced by exceedingly strict guidelines with no room for creativity. Article from the University of Michigan
891:
Per James' comments above, "all x-rays are copyrightable and should be removed from wikipedia and commons" is totally without basis and against consensus, yet Stefan2 is allowed to continue daily with this behavior.
783:
NB that my description here is for routine medical diagnostic images. It does not apply to things like X-ray artwork, which use the same equipment but allow the operator to make most of these creative choices.
419:
Publication in 1964 doesn't guarantee that it is in the public domain. The website doesn't have the entire magazine, so it is not possible for me to check whether the magazine contains a copyright notice or not.
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a phone book)? ("Mechanical" in this sense seems to mean something more like "routine" or "robot-like" than like "using a machine". If it were "using a machine", then all photographs would be ineligible.)
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Hm. I overlooked that. What about VAu001014144 below? The descriptions sound very similar to this kind of image. The descriptions sound very similar to this image. Also, many of the images at
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determined about copyright status. There are good points on both sides of the discussion. Further discussion should potentially include WMF legal team or other expert copyright opinion. --
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The uploader also states that the image is in the public domain. Can we please just not be so rigid and apply some thought occasionally instead of systematically deleting things.
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text, and the Copyright Office might not have considered the artistic merits of all of the illustrations if the text is copyrightable (which is the usual situation for a book). --
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33:
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VAu000017176: "X-ray depiction of human hand with index finger protruding upward."—X-ray artwork registered by X-Ray Art, Inc.; title of the artwork is "Salute".
599:
VAu000017174: "X-ray depiction of human hands bound by handcuffs."—X-ray artwork registered by X-Ray Art, Inc.; title of the artwork is "Call My Lawyer".
379:
It's highly possible that this was published in 1910, though I have been unable to confirm this. Does anyone have access to "Miss Lilian Bland Flies",
963:. Stefan2 provides no evidence to counter the uploader's declaration that the originator, Dr Leon Chen, released the picture into the public domain.
607:
Exactly zero of these are medical diagnostic images. These are all deliberately created works of fine art that happen to use X-rays as the medium.
695:
It would seem to me that an x-ray machine is just another form of camera - not sure why it would be treated any differently than any other camera.
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VAu000017175: "X-ray depiction of human head with thumb in mouth."—X-ray artwork registered by X-Ray Art, Inc.; title of the artwork is "Orafix".
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VAu000017688: "X-ray view of human head & shoulders."—X-ray artwork registered by X-Ray Art, Inc.; title of the artwork is "Skin Deep".
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The original reason for deleting this image was that it was missing information which had been attached to Hscafter.
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x-rays are copyrightable. Unfortunately, there is no evidence that this specific x-ray is sufficiently simple.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the images's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a
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before it was uploaded to Knowledge (XXG). The other site uses a low-resolution crop, though. --
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Part of this information was "Dr. Leon Chen has released this picture into the public domain."
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published loads of images of Bland. It's possible that this was published at the same time. —
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You can remove it. It was me who uploaded the Blackrock one to supersede it too. Thank you.
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It therefore seems sensible to assume that the information on Hscafter applies to Hscbefore.
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It is probable that some x-rays are in the public domain, but USCO practice indicates that
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365:. Perhaps you might want to script a Google Image Search into your posting procedures?
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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The following discussion is an archived inquiry of the possible unfree file below.
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VAu000017176: "X-ray depiction of human hand with index finger protruding upward."
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demands evidence of pre-1964 publication. Such evidence is currently not present.
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Unclear permission per OTRS volunteer. We have another image of this person at
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It took me approximately 5 seconds to confirm that the image in question was
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The US copyright office takes the position that they are not copyrightable
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625:(the copyright holder to VAu001014144) look comparable to this image. --
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Orphaned publicity photo, unclear if uploader is the copyright holder.
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The source is from 2010. Evidence of pre-1923 publication missing.
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VAu000017174: "X-ray depiction of human hands bound by handcuffs."
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VAu000017175: "X-ray depiction of human head with thumb in mouth."
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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and the physician has almost always chosen the exact angle, too.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
639:
Given that it's a website that sells "Stock and Custom Medical
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http://cool.conservation-us.org/byorg/lc/etextw/sess6.html
643:, Medical Illustrations from our vast database of medical
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VAu000017688: "X-ray view of human head & shoulders."
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1580:). No further edits should be made to this section.
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1065:). No further edits should be made to this section.
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Let's describe those just a little more completely:
1730:). No further edits should be made to this page.
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866:If we look at the practical facts of this case:
863:Stefan2 often has zero basis in the real world.
453:). No further edits should be made to this page.
214:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1701:http://board.ostfc.de/thread.php?threadid=6786
1528:Claimed as both self-published and fair use.
401:Okay, that doesn't have any images. However,
8:
1683:No evidence uploader is copyright holder.
953:) (if I write on your page reply on mine)
755:) (if I write on your page reply on mine)
870:The image is clearly a pair with Hscafter
879:The image was uploaded at the same time
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18:Knowledge (XXG):Possibly unfree files
7:
1503:File:Dana.on.Bicycle.ireland1970.JPG
1407:File:Dana.on.Bicycle.ireland1970.JPG
1350:File:Dambisa Moyo 2013 BlackRock.jpg
1585:The result of the discussion was:
1430:The result of the discussion was:
1246:The result of the discussion was:
1186:http://www.evinthayer.com/reviews/
1070:The result of the discussion was:
484:The result of the discussion was:
245:The result of the discussion was:
80:The result of the discussion was:
24:
623:http://www.anatomicaljustice.com/
732:with majority community support
551:United States Copyright Office
1:
1713:01:08, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
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146:03:04, 5 March 2014 (UTC)
1723:Please do not modify it.
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1234:Please do not modify it.
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876:It is the same uploader
536:This was tagged with {{
383:, 10 September 1910? —
873:It is the same patient
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933:you are aware of it.
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222:File:Lilian Bland.jpg
153:File:Polio victim.JPG
57:File:Polio victim.JPG
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729:We have a RfC here
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1374:86.145.248.117
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829:copyrightable.
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78:
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15:
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1597:
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1445:
1442:
1437:
1434:; deleted by
1433:
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1400:
1398:
1393:
1387:
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1074:; deleted by
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1033:
1027:
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724:Thus we have
723:
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712:
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700:
694:
693:
682:
678:
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84:; deleted by
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63:
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58:
55:
50:
40:
35:
28:
19:
1722:
1719:
1696:
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1546:
1543:
1531:
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1473:
1467:
1461:
1455:
1449:
1443:
1431:
1429:
1417:
1414:
1391:
1388:
1368:— Preceding
1365:
1355:
1299:
1293:
1287:
1281:
1275:
1269:
1263:
1247:
1245:
1233:
1230:
1207:
1204:
1181:
1171:
1119:
1113:
1107:
1101:
1095:
1089:
1083:
1071:
1069:
1057:
1054:
1031:
1028:
1011:
1003:
966:
960:
936:
931:
903:
895:
865:
861:
786:WhatamIdoing
738:
735:
709:Few things:
708:
698:
667:
653:WhatamIdoing
644:
640:
609:WhatamIdoing
570:
568:
490:
489:
486:No Consensus
485:
483:
471:
468:
445:
442:
402:
380:
294:
288:
282:
276:
270:
264:
258:
246:
244:
232:
229:
206:
203:
129:
123:
117:
111:
105:
99:
93:
81:
79:
67:
64:
1614:protections
1459:protections
1279:protections
1184:Copyvio of
1099:protections
546:User:Jmh649
407:Crisco 1492
385:Crisco 1492
274:protections
109:protections
51:November 20
39:November 21
34:November 19
1626:page moves
1471:page moves
1291:page moves
1111:page moves
984:WP:CONSENT
286:page moves
121:page moves
1643:AnomieBOT
1620:deletions
1488:AnomieBOT
1465:deletions
1308:AnomieBOT
1285:deletions
1256:Ronhjones
1128:AnomieBOT
1105:deletions
937:Doc James
802:The page
739:Doc James
538:subst:npd
303:AnomieBOT
280:deletions
138:AnomieBOT
115:deletions
1699:Used at
1602:contribs
1447:contribs
1370:unsigned
1267:contribs
1087:contribs
947:contribs
749:contribs
262:contribs
97:contribs
1705:Stefan2
1670:history
1515:history
1335:history
1190:Stefan2
1155:history
988:Stefan2
917:Stefan2
835:Stefan2
673:Stefan2
627:Stefan2
575:Stefan2
523:history
422:Stefan2
345:Stefan2
330:history
189:Stefan2
165:history
1697:Delete
1662:delete
1632:rights
1608:blocks
1591:TLSuda
1587:Delete
1507:delete
1477:rights
1453:blocks
1436:TLSuda
1432:Delete
1327:delete
1297:rights
1273:blocks
1248:Delete
1182:Delete
1147:delete
1117:rights
1093:blocks
1076:TLSuda
1072:Delete
1004:Lesion
896:Lesion
540:}} by
515:delete
493:TLSuda
403:Flight
381:Flight
322:delete
292:rights
268:blocks
251:TLSuda
247:Delete
157:delete
127:rights
103:blocks
86:TLSuda
82:Delete
1687:Kelly
1532:Kelly
1356:Kelly
1172:Kelly
951:email
766:Kelly
753:email
699:Kelly
42:: -->
16:<
1709:talk
1674:logs
1666:talk
1596:talk
1519:logs
1511:talk
1441:talk
1378:talk
1339:logs
1331:talk
1261:talk
1194:talk
1159:logs
1151:talk
1081:talk
1012:talk
992:talk
986:. --
961:Keep
943:talk
921:talk
904:talk
839:talk
790:talk
745:talk
677:talk
657:talk
631:talk
613:talk
579:talk
571:some
544:but
527:logs
519:talk
500:talk
426:talk
411:talk
389:talk
371:talk
349:talk
334:logs
326:talk
256:talk
193:talk
169:logs
161:talk
91:talk
31:<
1638:RfA
1483:RfA
1303:RfA
1254:by
1252:F11
1123:RfA
967:Axl
764:Hi
645:art
641:Art
298:RfA
133:RfA
1711:)
1672:|
1668:|
1664:|
1517:|
1513:|
1509:|
1380:)
1352:.
1337:|
1333:|
1329:|
1196:)
1188:--
1157:|
1153:|
1149:|
1016:)
994:)
949:·
945:·
923:)
915:--
908:)
841:)
821:”
814:“
792:)
751:·
747:·
679:)
671:--
668:do
659:)
633:)
615:)
581:)
525:|
521:|
517:|
502:)
428:)
420:--
413:)
391:)
373:)
351:)
332:|
328:|
324:|
195:)
185:}}
179:{{
167:|
163:|
159:|
1707:(
1678:.
1676:)
1660:(
1647:⚡
1640:)
1635:·
1629:·
1623:·
1617:·
1611:·
1605:·
1599:·
1594:(
1523:.
1521:)
1505:(
1492:⚡
1485:)
1480:·
1474:·
1468:·
1462:·
1456:·
1450:·
1444:·
1439:(
1376:(
1343:.
1341:)
1325:(
1312:⚡
1305:)
1300:·
1294:·
1288:·
1282:·
1276:·
1270:·
1264:·
1259:(
1192:(
1163:.
1161:)
1145:(
1132:⚡
1125:)
1120:·
1114:·
1108:·
1102:·
1096:·
1090:·
1084:·
1079:(
1008:(
990:(
972:¤
941:(
919:(
900:(
837:(
788:(
768:,
743:(
675:(
655:(
629:(
611:(
577:(
531:.
529:)
513:(
498:(
424:(
409:(
387:(
369:(
347:(
338:.
336:)
320:(
307:⚡
300:)
295:·
289:·
283:·
277:·
271:·
265:·
259:·
254:(
191:(
173:.
171:)
155:(
142:⚡
135:)
130:·
124:·
118:·
112:·
106:·
100:·
94:·
89:(
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.