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voice--even when well-deserved and almost universally held. The work-around in article space is to attribute the judgement, i.e., " is listed as a hate group by ". (It appears that the
Canadian Anti-Hate Network is an SPLC-equivalent for Canada, but I don't know if they publish a formal hate-group list.) I don't see this sort of attribution as FALSEBALANCE, since it doesn't involve "...but maybe some other people might disagree". The problems here are that (a) the format of a navigation template doesn't allow for attribution. (b)
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because if "hate" is an unfair moral judgement then that implies you can interpret discrimination and ideologies such as Nazism as loving or neutral. People can dance around these beliefs and say what is hateful is just a subjective call, but "hate group" is (at least in my view, if you want to call it that) an objective label, so if the issue is with the use of "hate" then the template should be moved, not deleted.
502:— Perhaps you would prefer the template be named "Hate groups and the ultra-right in Canada"? The title "Hate in Canada" is definitely vague and unhelpful in conveying what the categorisation is. The categorisation of course, is that the listed organisations are hate groups. I also do not understand the argument that there is a distinction between labeling the
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First of all the scope of this template has to be made explicit to be "Hate groups in Canada" the title is a bit confusing but I understand it as that is the intended scope. Calling a group a hate group has to be properly sourced and looking at three random articles in this navbox none mentioned hate
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Of course, like any normal person, I agree 100% that the
Canadian Nazi Party is both evil and hateful. But I would not want its article to state "The Canadian Nazi Party is an evil and hateful group", because I am generally opposed to putting moral judgements of persons or groups in Knowledge (XXG)'s
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Party evil is fair, but "hateful" is too opinionated. If an organisation openly calls for or promotes the discrimination of another group or person because of their race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation, etc. they are by definition a hate group. This kind of conclusion isn't far-fetched,
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says "The subject of the template should be mentioned in every article", but most of the linked groups are not called hate groups in their own articles. (c) Suppose that I wanted to make the case for adding another item, say, the
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Describing a person or a group as neo-Nazi is a statement of fact; calling them hateful is a moral judgment. It's OR to lump groups with "xenophobic ideologies in one form or another" together in one "hate" template.
879:. These templates have very defined scopes. One is about the nine muses, one is a super template stretching over a page. I feel readers will suffer from removing the small and well-defined template. --
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possible to attribute links in a template with a noincluded reflist, but it's a bit complicated and not really necessary, assuming this template doesn't include and isn't used on BLPs (which require
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per nom. While the destination is large, it already has the same links. If it is deemed to large, then the solution is splitting the template, not having duplicate smaller copies. I also see that
560:. Would it be necessary for me to provide a source saying "This is a hate group"? Or could I just argue "Its ideology means it's a hate group by definition"? That's a clear avenue for OR. Cheers,
506:"evil" or "hate". What determines whether a value judgement about a group or person is POV/OR or neutral? Perhaps I misunderstand, but my interpretation is that calling a group like the Canadian
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I had originally proposed moving this template to a different title, but it became clear to me during the move discussion that it would be better to delete or completely rework it. It includes a
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per
Molandfreak. I appreciate gnu's view that "hate" can be a moral judgement, which is true, however all of the groups, incidents, and topics included in the template are described
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listing of "bad groups"; it used to also contain a list of "bad people" ("proponents of hate"), and is currently transcluded on a number of BLPs. I have no doubt that, e.g, the
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While admittedly the destination template is large, as such is there any clear reason for standalone template with this content?
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as hate groups/crimes/etc, or the groups are described by RS as subscribing to ideologies which RS describe as hateful.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's
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is an evil organization, but listing it in a "Hate" template is POV and OR. Cheers,
588:. If all enteries are properly sourced in article I'm fine with this being kept. ‑‑
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is another template that has most (all?) of these links, and a page like
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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933:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
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862:has all 3 templates. --
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46:: -->
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16:<
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