537:, where it has been determined that there are (currently) 376,274 biographical articles marked as such on their talk pages. To compare, do you have any idea how many articles are in LoPbN? Can you provide a full list on a single page, or at least split the list up into a page for each letter of the alphabet?
923:
proposing to use categories. The problem with categories is that there is no overall listing easily obtainable from the category system, and pipe sorting of names to appear in the correct place in a category is difficult to automate (producing a bottleneck due to the need for humans to do that bit).
941:
You also seem to be missing the point that once this category system has been set up, I will be the first to support the deletion (or maybe just the blanking and redirecting) of the unmaintainable LoPbN pages, though before any deletion, the links pointing at LoPbN pages would have to be examined.
518:
Let's forget the protection, suspension, intimations of wheelwarring and whatnot, and keep discussing things. There are several technical solutions I have seen in this discussion that I don't think have been suggested previously, or were even possible before. Can we concentrate on discussing those
502:
I am not going to respond at length to this line of argument, and I caution against being so defensive and plead for greater introspection. I did, as well, expect greater efforts toward clear and lucid expression. It's regretful to see that few if any lessons appear to have been drawn.
577:
Ah, thanks for the response. I'm afraid I've just ranted on the MfD closer's talk page about your comment there. Apologies for that. I'd love to try and implement the fairly detailed plan I proposed on the MfD page. Would you have time to comment on that in detail? I'll copy it below.
474:. (Or, for that matter, if it was not addressed to me, i am offended on behalf of any admin who was perceived as needing to be warned off from turning the suspension attempt into a wheelwar, that it was thrown out in inflammatory fashion on the page, rather than something like
748:
This additional point has been added to make clear that I don't want to keep the existing pages, but they should only be blanked and redirected, keeping the history available for people who want to carry on transferring information (to disambiguation pages, for example).
462:
the inability of suspension to affect the outcome (unless by avoiding, as i had hoped to, risk exhaustion of any participants before resolution, which i should think would be a laudable goal, no matter which outcome the exhaustion would benefit),
980:. That is what I eventually envisage replacing LoPbN. Click on the links and look at the underlying code to see what I mean. Any actual lists needed can be generated from the category and kept elsewhere (eg. disambiguation pages, and so forth).
356:
Since my request for a list of all the articles listed on the pages proposed for deletion has been ignored, I would like time to produce such a list myself. This will involve laboriously clicking on an URL designed to edit each link at
834:, and I understand the reasoning behind that. I would actually call them biographical articles, but maybe others disagree. Another consideration is the disambiguation pages. Should they be accessible from such an index, or not?
361:, and then copying the content of that page to a file for further analysis. I suspect there is a better way to do this, and would plead for someone to do this the easy way, or at least give me time to do it the hard way.
810:
That one is easy, at least. Articles about an entire family are not biography articles, whether the family is Fry, Arbuthnot, or the
Hatfields and McCoys. Only articles for specific individuals count in this regard.
547:
Perhaps we could use a bot to catify the list? I believe that a full list on a single page (or even 1/26th of such a list) would be too long for practical editing. We get that "this page is long" warning for a reason.
449:
I'm very pleased that an uninvolved admin has intervened, and would have seriously considered requesting that via AN had time allowed me to make respond to discussion of the need for such a request.
815:
612:
459:
the insignificance of a delay to the outcome -- look up the word "suspend" -- in deleting what has been here long enuf that its history can no longer be traced back to its creation,
414:, I would certainly leave it open throughout the weekend, although, this may not stop another admin from closing the debate beforehand. But, no "suspension," one way or the other.
331:
I think that the discussion period should be extended at least by the amount of time the page was protected. I assume this is an uncontroversial suggestion. Are we agreed? —
977:
741:
703:
341:
It's only been a day; xfDs do not have an absolute fixed time limit anyway (I close many a day early/later than the guideline suggests), so it dosen't make a difference.
838:
788:; the advantage to this option is that it would be completely "self-maintaining" - once an article was tagged with the category, the list would self-generate.
533:). Do you think that is a first step towards a system that incorporates part of what has been built up here? I would also like to point out the discussion
466:
what i think is my four-year record as admin, marred if at all by good-faith errors whose only effect was that i learned from them to avoid repetitions,
180:. Here's a question for you. Do we have a list of articles on people who's names begin with X. The sort of things you would find under X in, say, the
530:
17:
797:
And then have an index page for the 26 categories. That would be easier than having a three-letter largeCategoryTOC. What about cases like
150:
Give him time, and I'm sure he will explain. I have a pretty good idea what he is arguing here, but will leave Jerzy to explain himself.
964:
399:
358:
425:
Struck out. Now I definitely am not going to be the one to close this debate, nor will I participate in it in at all, for that matter.
740:(8) Tidy up the links to existing LoPbN pages, and then blank the existing pages and redirect to a compact index page in the style of
181:
984:
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biographical articles in it, then the LoPbN index could simply be replaced by that. It is trivial to produce an equivalent of
446:
I simply didn't have the time, nor do i have the time now to do more than be politely by acknowledging the day's events.
234:
is one of the pages that would be deleted if this MfD goes though. Simple functionality would be lost. At least can we
692:
674:
657:
643:(this is a 10MB file that is too large to be uploaded as a wiki-page), and ensure that any LoPbN articles lacking
876:
720:
685:
590:
534:
523:
231:
713:(6) Initiate and maintain processes to ensure correct pipe-sorting or DEFAULTSORTing of biographical articles.
452:
I didn't notice who used the expression "wheelwarring", and i think i'll try do avoid doing so. In light of
402:? I know it is less than 26*26, but say 10 seconds for each one? I couldn't do it before the weekend though.
798:
925:
812:
707:
32:
332:
789:
828:
664:
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637:
716:(7) Browse the new category using the index provided by the newly-designed three-letter version of
891:
549:
267:
You assumed incorrectly (I was aware in the most peripheral sense only); I'm here just to ensure
485:
But, again today, i have not choice but to stop editing, without saying all i would like to.
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185:
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40:
159:
I don't see how I'm not giving him time, but I, however, have no idea, none whatsoever.
176:
He probably means that categories are very badly pipe-sorted, and so are useless as an
589:
Also, in case people have missed it, there is a very relevant discussion going on at
471:
268:
205:
Thanks, that's nominally comprehensible. In answer to your question: I have no idea.
633:(2) Compare the LoPbN list with the list of approx 380,000 articles transcluding
488:
134:
36:
890:
Here's a comment: why not use categories? That's what they're there for, no?
726:, and use this new functionality to improve Knowledge's disambiguation pages.
504:
426:
415:
390:
372:
342:
272:
206:
160:
141:
238:
the functionality before deleting? (Hence my question below about lists).
628:(1a) Preserve the annotations for possible use in disambiguation pages.
43:, to supplement a deletion-discussion point i've not yet contributed.
967:
for living people, so why not do it for all biographical articles?
670:
on their talk page, plus an attempt at DEFAULTSORT or pipe-sorting.
856:
Automated DEFAULTSORT or pipe-sorting is difficult in many cases.
625:(1) Turn LoPbN into a single master list, in alphabetical order.
140:
I am unclear as to what the above list and comment pertains to.
784:
One possibility is to create categories for the sections, e.g.
877:
Template talk:WPBiography#Category with all the articles in it
591:
Template talk:WPBiography#Category with all the articles in it
230:
That was a rhetorical question. I assumed you were aware that
774:
The annotations to the LoPbN lists are difficult to transfer.
519:
please? In particular, Jerzy, please have a look at the way
613:
Knowledge:Miscellany for deletion/List of people by name
478:
I presume you are wise enuf not to be about to wheelwar.
956:
702:(5) Access the category using an index similar to this
371:
What do you mean by you would like time? Time is free.
932:
biographical articles (both dead and living people).
744:(the test index links to the Living People category).
862:
How much bot programming and running time is needed?
978:
User:Carcharoth/List of living people compact index
965:Template:List of people by name compact page-index
400:Template:List of people by name compact page-index
359:Template:List of people by name compact page-index
955:For example. Look at this category-based list of
928:is set up? I'm simply proposing to do that for
380:How would I do this if the pages are deleted?
304:OK. That too is nominally comprehensible. :-)
8:
412:If I'm the one who gets to close this debate
681:(5) Design a new (three-letter) version of
859:How much time and volunteer effort needed?
482:on, at worst, talk pages of such admins.)
442:Discussion of suspension of MfD discussion
764:This new system can be easily maintained.
653:on their talk page have that tag added.
957:living people from "Bo" in the 'index'
531:Category:Unassessed biography articles
529:works (you can see it in operation on
18:Knowledge talk:Miscellany for deletion
27:Appendix to the accompanying AfD page
7:
389:How much time are we talking about?
786:Category:Surnames beginning with F
24:
872:Please put general comments here.
824:tagged on their talk pages with
470:i am insulted that i was denied
398:Um. How many links are there at
182:Dictionary of National Biography
959:. If there was a category with
107:Larry Scott (radio personality)
693:Category:Biographical articles
675:Category:Biographical articles
658:Category:Biographical articles
1:
611:Initial proposal copied from
924:Have you looked at the way
1003:
660:tag to all articles with
621:My proposed solution is:
232:List of people by name: X
35:, copied & pasted by
985:22:34, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
972:21:58, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
947:21:58, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
937:21:51, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
915:09:57, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
884:11:04, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
839:11:20, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
816:11:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
806:07:49, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
793:02:18, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
754:22:42, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
735:00:48, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
598:11:03, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
583:10:50, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
573:08:17, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
542:23:27, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
508:03:20, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
496:01:10, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
430:22:16, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
419:14:02, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
407:13:56, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
394:13:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
385:13:53, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
376:13:48, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
366:13:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
346:13:09, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
336:13:06, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
309:14:22, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
276:14:06, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
243:14:01, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
210:13:58, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
189:13:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
164:13:44, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
155:13:42, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
145:11:26, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
656:(3) Use a bot to add a
926:Category:Living people
799:Fry Family (Chocolate)
779:Additional suggestions
730:Please discuss below.
708:Category:Living people
33:Category:Living people
119:Anne Margrethe Larsen
101:Larry Pinto de Faria
456:the reasons i gave,
116:Larry the Cable Guy
269:the flow of debate
178:alphabetical index
65:Alicia de Larrocha
851:Possible problems
699:
617:
604:Proposed solution
327:Discussion period
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976:And here it is:
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867:General comments
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813:Serpent's Choice
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721:largeCategoryTOC
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524:largeCategoryTOC
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352:Request for list
333:The Storm Surfer
74:Gérard Larrousse
68:John Larroquette
62:Salvador Larroca
53:Preston Larrison
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742:this test index
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50:Jorge Larrionda
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5:
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110:Larry Thompson
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95:Larry O'Bannon
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47:Romain Larrieu
28:
25:
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15:
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10:
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6:
4:
3:
2:
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769:Disadvantages
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59:Gaby Larrivée
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34:
31:Excerpt from
26:
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133:Unsigned by
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98:Larry Penley
92:Larry Nesper
83:Larry Larsen
77:Larry Harris
71:Omar Larrosa
56:Tito Larriva
30:
829:WPBiography
820:Well, they
691:for use on
673:(4) Create
665:WPBiography
648:WPBiography
638:WPBiography
128:Bent Larsen
122:Arne Larsen
80:Larry Hirst
982:Carcharoth
969:Carcharoth
944:Carcharoth
934:Carcharoth
881:Carcharoth
836:Carcharoth
803:Carcharoth
759:Advantages
751:Carcharoth
732:Carcharoth
704:test index
698:(see next)
595:Carcharoth
580:Carcharoth
539:Carcharoth
514:Suggestion
404:Carcharoth
382:Carcharoth
363:Carcharoth
306:Carcharoth
240:Carcharoth
186:Carcharoth
152:Carcharoth
135:User:Jerzy
125:Art Larsen
113:Larry West
86:Larry Mark
875:See also
236:replace
919:Um. I
472:WP:AGF
894:: -->
706:(for
552:: -->
489:Jerzy
37:Jerzy
16:<
910:<
568:<
535:here
505:El_C
427:El_C
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343:El_C
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961:all
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491:•
41:t
39:•
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.