121:"United States painter" gets a paltry 603 google hits, most of which seem to be Knowledge mirrors (alas, this awkward and obtuse phrase shows up in some article text). There is obviously no such linguistic usage, nor should we invent one. "United States" is not in any way an adjective. Or look at it this way: would anyone, regardless of what part of the world you live in, expect someone to say "Hi, I'm a United States"? or "Hi, I'm a U.S."? when they introduce themselves? Yeah, they could say "Hi, I'm from the U.S.", but if they want to use the simple noun form, or an adjective, no one would say anything but "I'm an American" or "I'm American." Even though "U.S." may have some currency as an adjective, 1) it primarily refers to the government, 2) its usage is definitely minor compared to "American", and 3) it simply doesn't work for people ("No, I'm not Canadian, I'm U.S.")
543:
Olympics. I know the terms "United States foo" sounds odd, I offered an alternative on the philanthropists Cfr "Philanthropists of the United States". Of course no one really liked the wording, but it is far better than a grammatically incorrect version. I have not yet performed any extra external research on the topic, this is just from personal experience, and the guidelines set out of the security personell (sp) during the 1996 Olympics. Athletes from Canada and Mexico made a formal protest about people referring to United States
Olympians as American Olympians, such that both the Olympic committee and the military, made it policy for the rest of the event, to refer to them as United States Olympians. Ever since then, I have tried to refrain from using American, and simply state; "I am from the US". I believe to be both fair and uniform, we should follow the "<thing: -->
1116:. I also think it's a blind alley, since if we start categorising by nation we run into horrible things with countries which change their names, especially the United Kingdom where it is far easier to categorise by nationality, which has been constantly British since the union of the two crowns, rather than by country name, which has changed over the years. How would one then categorise the British monarchy? Would it be categorised in parts, with the monarchy of Great Britain, and then the monarchy of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and then the monarchy of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, without then igniting the already bubbling arguments about whether it is also the monarchy of Canada and so on.
1188:
if we are striving for correctness, why are you ignoring all the sources cited above and failing to cite any sources to back up your own argument? If there is any POV, then surely the POV is on the side of those that reject
American because it has numerous meanings. I have yet to see anyone apply the same to British, which not only means a citizen of the UK but also an inhabitant of the British Isles, thus including Irish citizens. We also don't use Britisher, which is used to describe the British in N. America, because we respect the terms that a country uses to describe itself when determining which word to use. Are we really going to be renaming
1217:"American" means "of the U.S." in the English language (and in cognates in many others) the whole world over. What the U.S. and its people use wouldn't matter if no one else followed it. But they do. I can't think of better evidence of non-U.S. English media usage than the BBC, and the widespread term "American football" (used in many, many languages, not just English) really clinches it. Unless someone would like to argue that non-Americans, when they hear "American football", think it just means soccer played in North and South America, or think Brazilians and Cubans are equally likely to be playing the non-"soccer" variant of football.
988:
under this category, rather than wonder if the articles listed under
American is North, South, Central, I just suggest we use the proper name and cut loose commonly used slang, which has come to be the norm. As for actual proof, the problem with media relating to titles, is most friendly govts and media outlets have referred to PC titles, as even used common literal terminology, so there isn't going to be much in finding someone actually using the full proper name, but it's still the proper name reguardless. Mainly for any reference sake, we use the full appropriate name of something, rather than a short or even commonly used one.
1289:
and the United States are similar and equivalent sorts of polical organizations. That historcally speaking the
American states (like New York, Pennsylvania, Virginia, etc.) did not last long as independent soverign nations may be true, but they were and the US government still has soverignty that is derived from the states, not the other way around. In this sense I consider Texas to be equal with France or Israel, not an inferior subordinate political organization. And yes Texas has its own military force and would likely be considered a nuclear power if it weren't for the fact that it is just one of several states in the USA.
1095:"U.S." is the second best term to use. However, I'm still because all the arguments I've seen are based on hypothetical confusion and irrelevant offense, which actual widespread international usage of "American" to mean "U.S." belie. While there are undoubtedly occasions in which people have used "American" to mean "of the Americas," this is such a minor usage that the presumption is that it means "of the U.S." If, after substantially more people join in this discussion, the consensus is against "American", I can live with "U.S.," if only to prevent really inane alternatives from being adopted.
456:
the USA passport proclaims an "American
Citizen". This information should be obtainable in all but the most obscure cases such as when a new country is formed. Then there's the question of what to do with the full "United States of America" designation...there are other United Stateses after all (isn't Mexico actually The United Mexican States?). So, I'd suggest going with the exact form, no matter how lengthy, that's in the back of the passport. There's no question of accuracy, usage, NPOV, geographical confusion or anything. -
31:
910:
what
American is. We far too often defer to commonly used slang words as accepted usage globally, what American in true context means is, United States American, to abbreviate it just for our sake of efficiency and comfort would not change the fact of what it really means, so why label it otherwise in any context? To address some of the concerns of "Judges of the United States", we quite simply add "by state", however pointless it
239:
naming conventions, the adjectival categories are going to be continually recreated by those who don't know about the change. Two, your solution is the one that entails the most work at this point because it involves changing over nearly all of the people by nationality categories and subcategories. Quite a lot of work even for a bot, and too much work compared to the insignificance of the problems.
758:
you perceive as
American hegemony. Both admirable motivations (particularly with the current corrupt U.S. government), but totally misguided when it comes to the simple fact of our language. Do you honestly believe that if any English speaker says "The president of the U.S. spoke on TV last night," that there will be great uncertainty as to who they're talking about? ("
1293:
your cause. Also remember that while a large number of people may post on here with this discussion, it doesn't necessarily represent the "majority" opinion, even here on
Knowledge. I wouldn't have even found this page if I hadn't found it on the Village Pump, and I hardly ever even read that. I was trying to find discussion about some other point at the time.
890:(as in spoken word). For a meager example, if you were to look in the Yellow Pages, for say "discount store", "super store", "general store", etc, whatever term you commonly refer to it as, you may not find them as they have been put in pre-defined category chosen by the consensus or publisher, generally "department stores" We all have a common way that we
1277:. If my country is America, I therefore am an American. It is pretty simple in that context, but there are many people, particularly those who live in other countries in both North and South America to resent this use of the term. A similar issue comes up with the term "Colombia", but rarely do people object to the use of the word
1285:
a politcal revolution and a new communist government put in instead, it would be called the "People's
Republic of America" or some other similar term. Or try on "Kingdom of America" or "American Empire". "Kingdom of the United States", I guess, could be somewhat reasonable, but not really correct in usage.
1284:
I will be the first to admit that the use of the name
America is in part a hold-over from the colonization of North America by England, and in part the "Manifest Destiny" attitude that prevailed in the 19th Century within the USA. Still, by what other name would you call this country? If there were
1187:
The problem is, it is just as much systematic bias the other way, in that the large number of wikipedians who do not live in the USA reject the term that the United States government uses about its own citizens. What other country would Knowledge disregard the naming conventions of in this way? And
757:
this discussion has been, because you're either trying to turn a definition into a sign of cultural oppression, or just totally ignoring real world linguistic usage to invent a possibility of ambiguity, in what I can only understand as a politically motivated attempt to be "fair" or to undermine what
523:
Doesn't an American passport give the nationality on the page with the photograph. Mine lists me as a British Citizen, hence the term British should be used to define people and things said to be of the UK. Since the U.S. Department of State refers to American citizens, I would assume that would be
479:
American passports just say the name of the country. They don't give an adjectival or simple noun form (as British passports do, apparently). But this is irrelevant anyway because the issue is what the proper term is in the language, as real people use it, and what gov't bureaucrats happened to use
1085:
means "of the US". So basically, we're not making ANYTHING up by using United States. People use it all the time to refer to, the United States. And nothing else. People use American to refer to "of the United States", but they also use it to refer to other things. Seriously, I'm not seeing how
460:
23:53, 18 July 2005 (UTC) And, if someone has multiple nationality it still works: it even avoids fights over which cat they should go in: they just go in all of them. It also washes away things like the Northern Irish question. Their passports (I think) proclaim them British, so we wouldn't have to
455:
Alright, how about something like this: we just use whatever the nationality in question means you have as your nationality in the back of your passport? I presume USA passports say (guessing) "Citizen of the United States of America", and mine says "British Citizen". I think it deeply unlikely that
307:
to the use of "American" to refer to someone from the U.S. Please, anyone who wants to comment here, do more than just express an unelaborated opinion without support—that isn't accomplishing anything, and you're simply repeating opinions that have already been addressed in greater substance. This
124:
I've never seen anyone who has disagreed that this convention is binding or pervasive actually offer any evidence supporting that "American" does not overwhelmingly and dominantly mean "of the United States", or that there are other comparatively prominent and correct alternatives. Please let's fix
113:
lack uniformity, with it split between "United States", "U.S.", and "American", though most use the latter. I just wanted to make sure that this discussion got wider exposure, because based on past experience on the CfD page, I think the misplaced good intentions of a few have prevented a permanent
1292:
I find that this whole discussion about trying to change the terms of categories from "American painters" to "Painters from the United States" to be more politically charged than trying to accomplish any useful task here on Knowledge. If this is politically charged and motivated, then please state
1288:
There are political reasons for using the term "United States", just as there is for "European Union". Perhaps more so. "United States" is in part a reference to the governments of America, and a political desire to encourage federal governments around the world. In this sense the European Union
1201:
As to systematic bias in the real world, in the real world, the name of the country is technically America, in the same way that the Repiblic of Brazil is the country of Brazil and so on and so forth. So I question the validity of the systematic bias argument used against the term American. If it
834:
I think "President of the United States" is pretty natural. So is "Supreme Court of the United States". Conventions can be changed. As for how much work it will cause, we have bots for that who wouldn't complain one bit. As for American Judges, you can either preface Judges of the United States
238:
That's one solution that is certainly preferable to ignoring a real convention in favor of a make-believe one, but it has a few drawbacks. One, the natural tendency in English is to label people by the adjectival form, and so absent those few obscure countries that don't have well known or obvious
117:
The simple fact is that in all forms of English (not to mention through cognates in many other languages), "American" is the only term for referring to someone or something that is of the United States. This is regardless of the fact that this linguistic appropriation of an adjective that may have
909:
being in the United States of America, understand it as just that. However, if I were to take a printed book to, say Canada, and reference anything other than them as American, although to me it may be understood, they are Americans as well, and are now being decluded just from my point of view of
811:
I was actually responding to Splash, up above. Sorry, the order gets a little confusing. As to why we can't just use thing of country, perhaps most importantly, it's not natural to do that with people in the English language—the convention is to use the adjectival form. And it's the option with
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that "American" has the same widespread usage as "European" does as a continental reference (which seems to be what people are implying, though without showing evidence of this), or that absent "North", "South", "Central", or "Latin", that people will not presume it means of the U.S. (and I don't
252:
There is a guideline against abbreviations in titles, so "U.S." would fall short of that (however, it seems many people disagree with said guideline so maybe it needs further discussion). Since we're an encyclopedia, we should not use the word 'American' to refer to the country known as the United
941:
So you're stating that Canadians commonly use and understand "American" to mean "of the continents of North and South America," and will not use it or understand it to mean "of the United States." Some quick googling suggests that's not the case; though "U.S." is also used, "American" is clearly
857:
I think the most acceptable substitute is to use "U.S." It's actually an adjective, and though it has some governmental connotation, it's not as strong as "of the United States." I'm still opposed to this, however, because there is a more proper term to use that has dominant usage worldwide and
844:
Once again, your examples are titles of governmental offices/agencies. "Jerry Lewis is an American celebrity" is natural. "Jerry Lewis is a celebrity of the United States" is not, and seems to imply something other than just his nationality; is he a government spokesperson? Or only a celebrity
1119:
I find this seems to boil down to the fact that people do not want to use American to describe the nationality of those people and objects of the USA. However, surely common usage and the manual of style trump that. If The US government uses the term American to describe the nationality of its
987:
Actually no I wasn't statiing it unequivically, just as a reference to another continental American group. Although we can cite resources on word usage, my main point is the actual country name is United States of America, so without any doubt, I could find listings for peoples, objects, etc...
914:
seem, it solves the problem of defining the category as Federal judges. I am not sure if we have moved on or began to address American ethnicities yet (African American, Chinese American, Italian Americans, etc.), so I will only put in the phrase "PC (politically correct)" to be used in further
1017:
And one final point...it's not merely your POV that they're not Americans if they don't call themselves American either (which they don't, just North Americans), and they call you American in a reference to your U.S. citizenship (which they do). That's not POV. That's the fact of the English
816:
for all countries just to avoid using "American" for one. That's not a good reason. And perhaps least important, but nonetheless an issue, it could result in ambiguous connotations because normally "U.S." or "United States" are used instead of "American" to associate people with the federal
542:
In my personal experience, dealing with peoples from North and South Americas, most of them were quite offended by United States citizens referring to them selves as Americans and decluding the rest of the peoples from the same continents. Mainly during large international events such as the
210:
I seem to recall seeing a lot of discussion a few months back that proposed changing adjectival forms (e.g. Fooish Thingies) of category names to use genitive prepositional phrases (e.g. Thingies of Fooland). My recollection is that that this had general support for two reasons: the correct
1311:
as it stands currently, and it is the correct useage of the term, both from an official policy statement from the Government of the United States of America, and from common usage of its citizens. This isn't the first time I've had to fight this idea, and I'm sure it won't be the last.
583:
Even if "American" is decided against, I see no need to be wordy. I think abbreviations would be acceptable here. I believe "U.S." and "USA" are very widely known, "U.S." or "US" are often used in articles, and they are probably more widely known than many other abbreviations used in
973:
by a prominent Canadian politician speaking to Canadian press. Do you have proof to the contrary? Everyone keeps on claiming confusion in other countries, yet no one has explained how this confusion can really exist when so many non-American media outlets use "American."
854:"Conventions can be changed." It's not our place to change them, any more than it is our place to change accepted fact based on original research or POV advocacy. We take the language as we find it. It would be POV of us to ignore conventions and create our own.
664:
1. Just for clarification, when I said the most-closely related article, I didn't mean the article for the country in general. I meant the article that was closest to the specific topic of the category, which would often be a list. I mean items such as those in
527:
I also think that the common usage is the best and clearest policy here. It's also worth noting that if citizens of the US refer to themselves as American, then Knowledge should use the term when describing things or people of the US as per usage of English.
358:
If no one of the opposite opinion presents any evidence beyond unelaborated conclusory statements, we should just consider this matter resolved. Or perhaps we should take a vote on whether "African Americans" are really called "United States black people."
1135:
was created precisely to prevent that. Just because the majority of Wikipedians live in the USA doesn't mean that the meaning of any term as used in the USA should trump that term's meaning worldwide. We strive for correctness, after all, not for POV.
1212:
The big problem here is that the Wikipedians who are rejecting the term that the U.S. uses for its own citizens do not reflect actual rejection of that term outside of Knowledge. "American" almost always means "of the U.S." and (more importantly?)
1031:
I agree that we coined the phrase, and I can not prove that I have personally witnessed the dislike of the usage from some peoples. Btw, I actually have Candadian friends that refer to them selves as American, and others that despise the title.
168:, which mostly use that form. Even were that not the case, the "prevailing phrasing" should be changed if it is incorrect (that's what bots are for, after all). The actual (and proper) convention in category naming of people is to apply the
579:
I believe it is WP convention to use the most common name. Is there any evidence that "American" is not most common, or that "United States" as an adjective is anywhere close to common, or that "foo of Country" is more common that "adjective
835:
with an intro, or make two categories, Federal judges and State judges. This isn't as big of a deal as you're making it out to be. Seriously, I respect your point of view on this matter, but this in my mind is a pretty good compromise. --
575:
I expect that any uses of "United States" as an adjective are relatively few. Does anyone know of any non-WP style guide or writing guide that supports this? That is, mainly something used by people who write for a living or the general
281:"In fact"? I'm getting rather frustrated and continually surprised by these absolute and incorrect statements from people otherwise reasonable. First, this isn't about referring to the country, it's about referring to things/people
1531:", "pop", which none are the actual real name, and "Coke" would definately not be accepted as a title, as it is proper to an actual brand. So using any common/slang words, no matter how well known, are not good reasons for a title.
1234:
means "of the U.S." But "almost always" isn't "always". You asked before if someone would be confused at the phrase, "President of the U.S.". No, the answer is no. So I ask again, what is the problem with (thing) of (country)?
1378:
True, but "most common name" shouldn't be mistaken for using what is just a convenience in speech/writing. The country's name is the United States of America (even if the WP article doesn't think so). I mean, we couldn't call the
643:
4. U.S. is America-centric, there are other United Stateses, one of them called the United Mexican States for example. Again, geo-political accuracy is not an irrelevance. So if we go against "American" I'd prefer to see USA (or
1300:. However, I find it slightly offensive to be called a "Norte Americano" (North American) as though Canada and Mexico don't count as countries either. I am not here to change the world, however, but the usage of the term
1488:'s request for evidence, but I doubt it will come to much. It appears that the strongest feelings are against "United States" and "American", and I am unsure that anyone who already has an opinion will be persuaded.
572:
Another option is to follow the format of the title of the most-closely related article. Why should categories have different standards than article (other than those that are inherently dependent on form)?
894:
things, but they are often referenced by a very specific category. I may refer to it as a "super market" and would probably find it referenced under "grocery stores". The point is, although in every day
211:
adjectival form of a place is not always obvious; and adjectival forms for places tend to be vaguer and more ambiguous. I can't find any proof of overarching consensus, and I certainly can't find it in
495:
That a word may have some alternate meanings does not justify use of an alternative when there is an overwhelmingly dominant usage that is the presumption absent contextual clues to the contrary.
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is common usage, is officially sanctioned and internationally recognised amongst English speaking countries, where is the problem in utilising the term in the english language Knowledge?
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Whilst we're at it, then, could we standardise British and UK into British, since British is the term used to describe the nationality of citizens of the UK, as per the British passport.
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usage as an adjective (outside of the obtuse usages found on this site—google doesn't lie on this point). Second, "American" does not "in fact" refer to the entire continent except in
647:
5. I agree. This particular one though, does need settling as there seems to a CfD at least every other day related to the broader principle (i.e. countries other than than the USA). -
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where I live. Also, I expect that the convention of using the most common name is to avoid disagreements about other issues. Often, using the most common name would settle the issue.
484:
of English language usage to back up your position? I've presented plenty. Most of the arguments I've seen are irrelevant too, because these are the underlying points as I see them:
1336:
We're not there yet. Wait until those advocating against "American" present evidence on their side. Until then, the discussion isn't complete enough to move on to an alternative.
270:
However, what is the term used to define a citizen of the US? Isn't it American? Therefore, isn't it correct usage when describing somebody's nationality if they are of the USA?
1120:
citizens, and the people themselves do, then we should reflect that term. Any confusion can quickly be ameliorated by the paragraph which describes the contents of the category.
845:
within the U.S.? "Robert Rauschenberg is an American artist." Natural. "Robert Rauschenberg is an artist of the United States." Is he getting government pay and has a title?
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I think the intention of the prevailing phrasing is to give possession of the person to the country. We'd have to rename a vast quantity of categories if this were changed... -
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we go with U.S., I see no reason not to go with U.S.A. — it's the proper name. Clamours for evidence aren't needed here, I can point you to any encyclopedia you like.
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usage, when not qualified by a modifier such as "North", "South", or "Latin". Note the qualification Britannica makes of what "Latin American literature" consists of,
1527:
Not necessarily i know plenty of people who refer to vacuum's as Hoovers, but you point being that just about every one I know also uses variations of "Coke", "
1081:
Ok, so you've giving evidence that some media outlets use American. You've also given evidence that they use "United States". You've also said that American
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Who may be offended by the convention is irrelevant, and "equitable" alternatives are irrelevant until they actually manage to change common usage (think of "
231:. This policy, if followed more widely, would bring us to "Painters of the United States" or "Painters of the United States of America" to avoid ambiguity.
762:? Really?") Mexico is not known by "U.S." in the English language. Mexico is not known by "United States" in the English language. Only one country is
778:
accuracy. I've given you evidence for that, both of usage and academic definition. Gimme some evidence to the contrary other than unfounded concerns.
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Having lived for substantial amounts of time in a country outside of the USA (it was Brazil), I do appreciate the complaints to the use of the term
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That's a good point. As it's been pointed out, "United States" is not an adjective. Don't let congress know about that, though. I'm sure the
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of the United States" (or "... of the U.S.") - using this phrasing avoids the entire issue of whether or not it may be used as an adjective.
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It would be POV to disregard clear linguistic custom to placate socio-political interests. It is not POV to simply follow linguistic custom.
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otherwise belong to two continents may be politically incorrect. The fact is that it's simply the way that it is. That's the convention.
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I believe this is a false argument, since categorising by nationality is categorising by nation, the term nationality literally meaning
1281:. A term that is sometimes applied to citizens of the USA is USAian, which is a term I find particularly offensive and inappropriate.
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strongly implies that all of its contents are federal judges, which is not the case, and something that "American" does not connote.
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I disagree with that argument. Just because systemic bias is present in the real world, doesn't mean we should have it in Knowledge.
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What we want a linguistic convention to be is irrelevant, no matter if we think our way is better, more clear, more descriptive, etc.
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mean Mexico). And only "American" is the term by which the people of the United States (and I don't mean Mexico) are known by.
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Tangentially, I think that sometimes standardization is carried too far. And I'm going to break up this discussion by date.
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necessarily refer to all the Americas unless qualified. I'm not arguing against it on this grounds, but it is true, as
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article is more important than yours" at times, but I guess that's pretty easy to squash. EDIT: For some crazy reason,
1587:
Yes, this does seem like a good compromise way to go. Should we use "of" or "from"? Residence, or birth/citizenship? -
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this, or at least discuss it with relevance to our policies and actual terminology, not socio-political motivations.
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would need to change also. Because common usage is "American". So, why can't we use (thing) of (country) again? --
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Remember we're talking about category names here. They need to be as concise as possible while still being clear.
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We take the language as we find it. Whatever things are most commonly called is what they should be called by us.
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not only sounds dumb, but it's unduly cumbersome. If we really want to be obsessed with "proper names," then
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Alternatives that have no comparatively prevalent actual usage in the language are not viable alternatives.
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2. and 3. You are probably right on these points. But there is a question of geographic accuracy (which,
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despite unfounded assertions to the contrary, clear meaning absent contextual signs to the contrary.
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isn't a poll—we're trying to clarify and substantiate what the actual real world outside of Knowledge
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in the English language certainly can and should refer to citizens of The United States of America.
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And only the people of one country are known as "Americans" in the English language. Once again,
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Should we move this discussion to a separate page? (If so, I'll save my reasoning for there.)
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And, declaring this to be "sides" is most confrontational. Can't we just discuss it a bit? -
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language, however unjust it may be that the U.S. successfully appropriated that adjective.
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I think we have to look at this more of an encyclopedic reference point of view and not a
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Confused by the seperation of discussion so starting a reply in 20 July for uniformity.
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If we do abbreviate, "U.S. foo" follows WP convention of using the most common name.
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Maybe we can get a consensus with compromise by abbreviating, such as in "U.S. foo"?
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your argument is holding much weight. Why are you so opposed to the compromises? --
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I guess their editors are just ignorant about proper terminology? Third, there is
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of the nationality, because that's what the English language uses. We don't have
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the greatest amount of work; we'd be changing over the entire category scheme of
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would be miffed to hear they need to change their letterhead. And I suppose the
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You've seen the comments below, but on your final point. Personally, I think it
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
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by those terms in the English language. That's all that matters on this issue.
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I'd agree to a seperate page. I can't find any mention of abbreviations at
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The same is also apparently true of English-language Israeli media outlets,
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without a shadow of a doubt. It would, I suspect lead to fights over "no,
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Agreed that we need a clear consensus on this. I recently tried ot have
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I'd go with "of" because it allows for consistency with e.g. ] (economy
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Category:The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland people
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The prevailing phrasing is actually "American ____": see the entries in
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And is there any indication of actual confusion about "United States"?
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discussions, please ask me to comment when we move on to that topic.
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in a particular context doesn't determine that. Do you actually have
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328:. It is not the short US or United States. As someone pointed out,
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Not what we want to use or think better than what is actually used.
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points out, it can be used easier with non biographical articles.
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And is there any indication of actual confusion about "American"?
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and proper solution to the lack of category naming consistency.
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I suppose the CIA World Factbook got its terminology wrong too.
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Sorry, I just saw your response to thing of country above. --
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used by Canadian media outlets to refer to the United States.
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is already widely used to describe people from the USA. Try
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Knowledge:Categories for deletion/Category:Political parties
1436:. Why on earth the article for that country is instead at
383:" "agreed", etc. We need a clear consensus to name them
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States, since in fact it refers to the entire continent.
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Maybe we can reach a compromise by using "<thing: -->
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As an American, I consider the name of my country to be
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In short, if I have to vote, I would say keep the term
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Where is the guideline against abbreviations in titles?
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379:, to which the response was "Oh no let's rename it to
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United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
1440:, I simply don't know. It's not the proper name.
445:here, in which case the common usage should apply?
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Category:Union of Soviet Socialist Republics people
749:"U.S. is America-centric"??? That's like saying "
229:Knowledge:Categories for deletion/Log/2005 June 12
300:in contrast to unqualified "American literature."
221:Knowledge:Categories for deletion/Log/2005 May 14
192:are in the minority and should also be changed.
1265:The use of the terms "America" and "American"
215:, but I did find some relevant discussion in
8:
800:why can't we use (thing) of (country) again?
1406:Category:Federal Republic of Germany people
461:have that debate or similar ones, either. -
1410:Category:Bundesrepublik Deutschland people
285:the country, for which "United States" is
1518:Ok, so that was a UK-centric example... -
1345:Doesn't mean we can't discuss it though.
701:List of former members of the U.S. Senate
1398:Category:United States of America people
667:Category:Lists of people by nationality
508:"...not a spelling we're going to use).
1414:Category:Росси́йская Федера́ция people
721:United States House of Representatives
381:category:United States philanthropists
217:Knowledge talk:Categories for deletion
166:Category:American people by occupation
44:Do not edit the contents of this page.
1600:country doesn't sound good does it).
802:Or were you not responding to me? --
683:List of Australian Opposition Leaders
93:<begin copy from Village Pump: -->
7:
823:Category:Judges of the United States
469:</end copy from Village Pump: -->
407:My preference, in descending order:
673:. A few more specific examples are:
632:, is not an irrelevancy): American
109:. Currently, the subcategories of
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24:
1505:-- that name is more common than
377:category:American philanthropists
107:Knowledge:Categories for deletion
821:, for example, when turned into
312:in actual real world language.
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174:Category:The Netherlands people
99:Category:United States painters
1430:Category:United Kingdom people
1230:I'd be with you if "American"
814:Category:People by nationality
727:President of the United States
441:. However, are we covered by
190:Category:People by nationality
136:Alternative words for American
1:
373:category:U.S. philanthropists
18:Knowledge talk:Category names
1420:. Oh, and we wouldn't have
1322:Compromise with abbreviation
1275:The United States of America
439:Knowledge:Naming conventions
213:Knowledge:Naming conventions
1620:I see no need to be wordy.
1583:07:44, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
1127:13:57, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
689:List of U.S. televangelists
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267:11:23, July 18, 2005 (UTC)
235:05:36:17, 2005-07-18 (UTC)
151:21:07, July 17, 2005 (UTC)
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1614:14:17, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
1564:Compromise with word order
1209:15:02, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
1190:Category:American football
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1150:14:34, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
798:Ok, but you didn't answer
535:10:35, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
278:13:41, July 18, 2005 (UTC)
103:Category:American painters
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1630:Agree with <thing: -->
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695:List of African Americans
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425:Foo of the United States
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349:19:30, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
320:17:42, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
244:05:58, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
197:21:56, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
188:. The nonconformists in
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143:16:56, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
130:16:50, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
1459:United States of America
819:Category:American judges
671:Category:Geography lists
619:United States of America
603:United States of America
443:Knowledge:Naming dispute
326:United States of America
324:The correct name is the
111:Category:American people
101:for merging/renaming to
1461:should not redirect to
1422:Category:British people
1418:Category:Russian people
1404:should be replaced by
1402:Category:German people
1108:Country vs nationality
971:this significant usage
640:'s example points out.
385:category:American foos
186:Category:Soviet people
781:Are you confused by "
305:no viable alternative
182:Category:Dutch people
42:of past discussions.
715:United States Senate
598:Just some comments:
771:gimme some evidence
601:1. That would give
544:of <country: -->
1426:Category:UK people
1408:, or even better,
621:is a redirect to
88:From Village Pump
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346:Vegaswikian
36:This is an
1457:. Much as
783:California
180:, we have
1279:Colombian
1114:of nation
134:See also
80:Archive 5
72:Archive 3
67:Archive 2
61:Archive 1
1622:Maurreen
1511:Maurreen
1490:Maurreen
1428:or even
1383:article
1328:Maurreen
1309:American
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1250:Kbdank71
1237:Kbdank71
1157:Maurreen
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837:Kbdank71
804:Kbdank71
739:Kbdank71
731:and the
704:Maurreen
644:U.S.A.).
589:Maurreen
482:evidence
427:Maurreen
413:U.S. foo
330:American
295:minority
289:and has
287:improper
1507:Hoovers
1486:Postdlf
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976:Postdlf
897:literal
879:20 July
860:Postdlf
847:Postdlf
827:Postdlf
791:Postdlf
630:Postdlf
625:. Why??
576:public?
513:Postdlf
474:19 July
416:USA foo
361:Postdlf
317:Postdlf
241:Postdlf
205:18 July
194:Postdlf
140:Postdlf
127:Postdlf
39:archive
1640:adiant
1635:. As
1605:adiant
1589:Splash
1574:adiant
1520:Splash
1501:About
1471:Splash
1453:be at
1451:should
1389:Splash
1364:Splash
1355:Splash
1232:always
1204:Hiding
1171:adiant
1141:adiant
1133:WP:CSB
1122:Hiding
903:, but
776:That's
755:absurd
649:Splash
611:Monaco
530:Hiding
463:Splash
458:Splash
447:Hiding
336:. Or
272:Hiding
258:adiant
227:, and
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