Talk:2019 India–Pakistan border skirmishes/Archive 2

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GCs and India-Pakistan. Don't have any off the top of my head but I read some, all of which state unequivocally that Pakistan breached int'l law by letting Varthaman be videoed. Re the non-signature: it does not matter whether they consider it binding. Customary international law is binding on all states whether or not they accept it unless they mount conscientious objection, i.e. they vocally and consistently reject the purported rule. I take your point on India-POV, and will guard against it, though I would caution against what seems to be a very high expectation of evidence. I can't quite see how photographs of pilots taking off or returning would have helped; surely these are evidence of the planes taking flight and not of an airstrike mission, but who are we expecting to have taken photographs inside Pakistan? I imagine that the fighter jets were trying hard

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not recognized by one of them." Surely this means that the capture of Varthaman is covered. Even if not, the fact that 174 states have ratified the Additional Protocols is strong evidence that they have crystallised into rules of customary international law, which are binding regardless unless there has been conscientious objection by either country. And India's delayed return of Pakistani POWs in 1971 cannot be used as justification to say that "without delay after the cessation of active hostilities" means that 1 year is a legally acceptable timeframe. It would only be useful if you want to contrast the two, i.e. Pakistan returned Varthaman within 3 days, whereas Indian forces returned Pakistani POWs 1 year after XYZ in 1971. But even this, as I hope you agree, does not merit being placed in the lead section.

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locations, bring out Google maps and then attempt to figure out how far Jaba village is from Attar Sheesha. It is actually 5.5 km, not 5). Besides, a recent Reuters report says, "A sign which had been up earlier in the week identifying the madrassa’s affiliation to Jaish-e Mohammad had been removed by Thursday and soldiers prevented reporters from gaining access. But it was possible to see the structure from the back. It appeared intact, like the trees surrounding it, with no sign of any damage of the kind seen near the bomb craters. Western diplomats in Islamabad also said they did not believe the Indian air force hit a militant camp. “There was no militant training camp there. It hasn’t been there for a few years – they moved it. It’s common knowledge amongst our intelligence,” said one of them." See

5849:

Labs in the US have their own satellites with hi-res cameras. See the Australian institute's assessment of a few days ago. Not sure if original GCs apply to undeclared wars; its a gray area from what I know. But since India and Pakistan did not sign the protocols, they will hardly consider the protocols-in-disguise to be binding. What happened on Feb 26 is a story for which there is almost no real proof. It is important not to represent it to be unequivocally about real events. That is the India-POV I was concerned about, and still am. There is no evidence, for example, that Mirage 2000s were used. No pictures of pilots taking off, or returning, let alone in flight over Pakistan. The

2719:

asked to them as to where the fuselage of the aircraft is and what has happened to the pilots? As we have already said, there are eye-witness accounts and electronic evidence that Pakistan deployed F-16 aircraft and that one F-16 was shot down by Wing Commander Abhinandan. Evidence of the use of AMRAAM Missile, which can only be deployed on the F-16 with Pakistan, has also been shown to the media. Pakistan should explain why it continues to deny that its F-16 aircraft has been shot down? We have asked the United States to also examine whether the use of F16 against India is in accordance with the terms and conditions of sale.

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the Pakistani government. In keeping with the Indian spin, the air strike on Balakot is being reported as being announced by the Indians, when in fact the Pakistanis announced it first, the capture of the Indian pilot is finessed into oblivion by giving more significance to a Pakistani statement that two pilots had been captured, and its later revision. Very little is said about the Pakistani counter attack, the downing of the Indian pilot, or the return of the pilot. Here, in contrast, is the reporting in the New York Times (dates and times: US; ASIA-PACIFIC refers to hard news, in contrast to OPINION):

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pictures of the planes. Eg. camera footage of the dashboard showing some unmistakable identification of the Mirage, showing GPS, altimeter, speedometer, date, time, starting in Indian territory and turning around near Balakot and returning. Not that hard. (iii) Did Western sources too carry the GC bit? The Indian government and media did of course, frenetically boning up en mass. What about internal conflicts? Neither India nor Pakistan care about GCs there. If GCs 1949 subsume the later protocols,

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in 2004, according to a 'top manager' of the training camp in Mansehra, all the major militant organisations had begun renovating and reactivating facilities. The manager explained, "Our transport fleet is back, electricity has been restored, and the communications system is in place." According to the Pakistani researchers, the JeM facility in Balakot is "the largest military training centre of JeM, directly under the supervision of Masood Azhar and run by Qari Shah Mansur."

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view of it can't be ignored. His status as PoW was not determined and he was seen as illegal intruder. Even his early release was not an obligation as the states are only obliged to release PoWs after the cessation of hostilities. So I request the editors here to mention the application of Geneva Convention on Indian pilot in 'Military events' section under the heading 'Retaliatory airstrikes, capture and release of pilot' in neutral way, not one sidedly. (

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against acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity." It is irrelevant in the lead paragraphs that Pakistan considered it a gesture of goodwill (they may well have), because Article 118 of the Geneva Convention (III) states that "Prisoners of war shall be released and repatriated without delay after the cessation of active hostilities," so Pakistan was under an international legal duty to do so anyway.

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rather than AJK), then I think the line should be amended to reflect that. Perhaps "The first airstrike was conducted by India in the early morning hours of February 26 in the vicinity of the town of Balakot in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa province in Pakistan. This is approximately 5 miles inside Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, and the deepest that Indian armed forces have entered into undisputed Pakistani territory since the

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Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing. The Indian government has accused Pakistan of providing Jaish-e-Mohammed state support, and promised retaliation against Pakistan following the attack". This would lead nicely into why the response was airstrikes in Pakistani territory, without implying that the accusation is correct.

5688:, rather than to declare their justifications factual. I suggest that we have a line reading "India has justified its airstrikes as a pre-emptive, non-military strike against JeM terrorists, and Pakistan has justified their airstrikes as retaliation to India's airstrikes, and self-defensive." The complexities of the language they used can be discussed elsewhere. 4930:

that random trees in Pakistan were bombed. Pakistan said what it said. But we are not obliged to repeat it in the lead. By the way, the NYT article that you cited didn't say that this was the Balakot in KPK. Rather, it mentioned a Balakot close to the "disputed border". Obviously, I am not recommending that this should be put into the lead. --

5313: 1478: 1413: 574: 5637:." This sounds important enough to feature in the lead section. I am hesitant to use the word "sovereign" because both India and Pakistan claim territorial sovereignty over the entirety of the Kashmir region, and to use your earlier words, this would make WP complicit in the Indian claim that AJK is not sovereign Pakistani territory. 5241:. It is not even clear which madrasa they are talking about, 1 km away, or 150 meters away.) In the sentence about Balakot, the citation I used was to an article in the Washington Post, not the NY Times. "Close to" is typically not used with reference to a general region. We cannot really say "a town in India close to China." 5156:

terrorists and their handlers. The chargesheeet says that the two witnesses helped NIA in recognizing the voices of Masood Azhar and Rauf Asghar in relevant audio clips.Both Mogul and Maulviya knew the voices well as they used to frequently listen to their speeches during their own training at the Balakot training camp in Pakistan.

5349:"The Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing; Pakistan's government condemned the attack. Nearly two weeks later, on 26 and 27 February, airstrikes were conducted by India and Pakistan against targets in each other's territory, or in regions under each other's control."' 3575:

Pakistan Army chief and “encouraging him” to release Indian pilot. There may be many other dealings such as IMF loan support OR Afghanistan peace support OR FATF support etc. Pakistan FM also gave statement that US-Pakistan relationship will reach new high in tackling FATF, Afghanistan peace process etc.

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I have some commitments coming up so I probably will not have time to make any changes, as I expected I would. This discussion is moving towards disagreement on niche points. If you believe that everything in there is essential, then that's fine. Thanks for engaging. Just a general note that the lead

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Despite the sabre rattling in the Indian media, India had been bending over backwards to say that theirs was not retaliatory (let alone revenge), only preemptive to head off the new threat they had information about. Pakistan was clear that theirs was retaliatory. The language in the lead is pretty

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have announced it in the manner they did. The photographs are a claim; they could have been taken anywhere. It is quite forgivable that India does not have photographs of enemy territory - their fighter jets were occupied with fighting and they don't have access to the area they claim to have bombed.

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The phrases "the first to announce the airstrike" and "purported photographs of which they posted on social media" seem hardly worthy of special mention. What does it matter which side announced it first? Photographs are also merely evidence, and in this case are even disputed. I think it should just

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India was in the wrong side of US and Pakistan was enjoying friendship of US from 1950s till 1990s, but Pakistan and it's public's uneasiness with US in last two decades, gave India an opening and now India finds itself with US and Pakistan in the other side. Pakistan is in deep friendship with China

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We don't report narratives of Pakistani politicians from Indian sources. AFAIR, Sayed's quote was picked out of context. As much as it was extraordinarily bad phrasing, (if you listen in entirety rather than the trimmed video) he was referring to Pakistan's response in the entire standoff. Completely

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belong here. I did a rough count and was able to spot at-least 10 high profile politicians (CMs, national-party-chiefs et al) who has commented something or the other about the strike and has been covered by at least 3-4 reliable sources on each occasion, at first glances. Do we mention all these? Do

873:

As per my knowledge, Pakistan has never claimed that the wreckage of the second Indian aircraft fell in its territory. Neither has it said that it used F-16s in the air battle. Further, the Dawn article you link to captions the image as "wreckage of an Indian aircraft", and doesn't claim for it to be

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is not sovereign in the way Khyber Pakhtunkwa province is. It has some connection with an eventual plebiscite ... some conditions were perhaps drafted so in early UNSC resolutiions for all of Kashmir (which India may have violated by making J&K a state). (ii) I meant photographic evidence, not

5869:

I'll keep an eye out for your comments, thanks. Just a couple of quick responses, so you can address these in your reply. Why does "nominally self-governing" mean that it is not sovereign Pakistani territory? I take your point on the hi-res images. I am happy to search for academic commentary on the

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which extend the conventions to international- and internal armed conflicts. If India had, it would have been under much grater scrutiny in Kashmir itself. Were this war, there is nothing in GC that says that a POW be returned in three days. India took over a year to return Pakistani POWs in 1971

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I think it is unwise to give so much credence to India's claims, considering that they had been threatening a response to the Pulwama attacks for two weeks leading up to the airstrikes. We know that in international diplomacy, countries posture for various strategic and legal reasons. This is to say

5632:

Yes, but if the point is just to establish that India crossed into Pakistani territory, surely this is established by the line that airstrikes were conducted in each other's territory. Or if the point is that it, for the first time, crossed into undisputed Pakistani territory (i.e. 5 miles into KPK,

5340:

I'm reading this version for the first time, and my impression is that readability being seriously affected by the admirable attempts to maintain neutrality. Almost every potentially contentious line reflects both the perspectives of the Indian and Pakistani government, even in instances where their

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The students, in the usual 40-day long training sessions, were taught extensive handling of pistols, AK-47s, LMG, rocket launchers, UBGL and grenades, besides lessons on the Quran, Hadith and physical training. The stairs of this camp were painted with flags of US, UK and Israel to develop a certain

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According to the chargesheet, NIA's six witnesses include a man from Pakistan- occupied Kashmir (POK). Abdul Rahman Mogul, a resident of Polas village of PoK's Poonch district, and Mohammad Sadiq Maulviya from Ghalotiakalan in Sialkot have been used as witnesses to identify the conversations between

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The alert further said, “A new training facility has also been constructed by JeM at Balakot. The JeM is also planning to carry out terror strikes in India including suicide attacks in major cities. For this purpose, real time reconnaissance of the cities is being carried out by the sleeper cells of

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I see Reuters actually confirming the fact that this is a Jaish facility, but it has been claimed that, on the day of the bombing, it had ceased to be one. Anyway, my purpose is not so much to prove that this is in fact a Jaish militant camp, but just to remove the slant in your version that implied

4664:

I have quickly taken a look at this page and the daughter pages and can't help feeling that the narratives runs closer to what has been reported in the Indian media, or spun by the Indian government, than to what has been reported in the international media, let alone the Pakistani media, or spun by

3229:

At the end skirmishes, India had bombed Pakistan territory crossing International border & Line of Control and bombing Jaish-e-Mohammed training center inside Pakistani territory. Pakistan also accepted that India has bombed in Balakot in KP, Pakistan. Pakistan sent some bombs to Indian Kashmir,

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Whoever (Yoonadue) wrote the above must know that pilots wear flags and shields of PAF on either arm. It is nearly impossible to mistake a PAF pilot as an IAF pilot. Secondly, the language and accent of people from two countries is different. See credible articles below. Lastly, PAF did not use F-16

1643:

There's much talk about application of Geneva Convention on release of captured Indian pilot Abhinanadan by Indians but the fact is that Geneva Convention can't be applied on him as there was no declared war between India Pakistan. Even if Indian views in this regard are taken in account, Pakistan's

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Will avoid, thanks. These are just examples, and I'm only suggesting minor reworking. If the general sentiment is that I'm off my rocker, then I'll desist. Also, I suppose "deep" is relative (I assume you meant "Pakistan" and not "Kashmir"), but the idea is that if you have to cross an entire state

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So, as far as I can tell, the targeted camp is very much operational. But the JeM keeps its options open for moving things around depending on circumstances. I have seen another source, post-airstrikes, which said that the militants gathered at the Balakot camp after the Pulwama attack, in order to

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Recently, even after international pressure, two JeM camps, Batrasi and Syed Ahmed Shaheed in Mansehra and Balakot respectively, are once again operational, and as many as 7,000 'students' were enrolled at the Balakot camp in 2000 alone. Although some of the camps in Mansehra were briefly abandoned

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Clearly the commentator would not get a job as a photo interpreter, the videos could have been taken at any time and could be anything. So they dont prove anything apart from the commentator hasnt a clue what he is looking at. Reflections or artefacts are not parachutes for one. I wouldnt waste any

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it does matter, stop wasting our time if you cannot find a reliable source for your claim. And it is not as simple as screwing the missile to the plane. The integration with on board radar needs to happen and this won't be allowed to work without the manufacturers support. The amraam site lists the

2710:

Please also refer Point 6 in this statement quoted below, basically summarizes why Pak cannot accept the downing of its jet, because it will open another can of worms. But if US does have a proper mechanism in place to check the F16s (as claimed here), eventually it will be known if PAF lost one of

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is not sovereign Pakistani territory, only nominally self-governing, administered by Pakistan, in contrast to J&K, which India considers a state (though not recognized so by the UN or the major powers, with the exception of Russia). The satellite images were not leaked. Outfits such as Planet

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I'm a little lost. This is international armed conflict, and surely the Geneva Conventions apply to that? Art 2 of GC III states that "the present Convention shall apply to ... any other armed conflict which may arise between two or more of the High Contracting Parties, even if the state of war is

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During his address, he also took names of scores of JeM terrorists killed in J&K during 2017-18. It was here that Abdul Rauf announced to avenge the killing of Talha Rasheed, who was killed by security forces in an encounter in Pulwama in November 2017, on the scale which would be larger than

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Rana & Mir is an RS as far as I am concerned. It has been cited in plenty of scholarly sources. But it is from 2004 and supposedly western diplomats in Pakistan think the site is defunct for several years (despite the fact that the sign was taken down only on "Thursday"). Here are some sources

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India’s responses after Uri and Pulwama and going public with them has lowered the threshold for military reaction. In fact, whichever political configuration comes to power in the forthcoming elections, not responding militarily in the face of provocation may not be an option. Crisis trajectories

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have a place in the lead section. i.e. "India claimed that the airstrike was directed against a terrorist training camp, and caused the deaths of a large number of terrorists. However, satellite images leaked to Western mainstream media outlets appear to support Pakistan's claim that Indian bombs

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Not mentioning the Pakistani's government's reaction, and right away, makes WP complicit in the hackneyed Indian implication that the Pakistani government had a hand in it. The Pakistani government condemned it, long long before Indians promised any retaliation. The initial Indian reactions were

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Videos of the pilot, his face swollen from injuries allegedly sustained by beatings from a Pakistani crowd before capture, were posted on social media, but later removed after Indian protests. The following day Pakistan announced its intention to return the pilot to India in what it claimed was a

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The Balakot camp, in the Manserah district, is run by Jaish-e-Mohammed, and has previous links with extremist UK Muslims, including Shahzad Tanweer, one of the 7/7 bombers. The reasons why Rauf, who is said to have been a conduit for al-Qa'ida in the "liquid bomb" plot, remains free to mix with a

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Sorry, did not see this earlier. I went ahead and edited the lead, hopefully making it more readable and neutral. NY Times might or might not be neutral, but the position of the Delhi bureau chief is one of the prized postings of American journalism, attracting the best and the brightest, many

2718:

The statement by our Indian Air Force is in the public domain. Only one aircraft was lost by us. If, as Pakistan claims, they have a video recording of the downing of a second Indian aircraft, why have they not shown it to the international media even after more than one week? Questions should be

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The Pakistani military claim of hitting down two Indian Air Force fighter jets was proved wrong by American experts who said such a large part of AMRAAM missile(it can be fired only by an F-16) debris can be obtained only when it has missed its target. This observation has been reported by Indian

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This is a very generous line indeed, to the point of being misleading. Ignoring both Indian and Pakistani perspectives, posting video of the captured soldier is a clear breach of Article 13, Geneva Convention (III), which states that prisoners of war "must at all times be protected, particularly

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Of course it is important; otherwise why would the NY Times, the Guardian, the Washington Post be mentioning it. There is no guarantee that the Indians would have even announced it in the manner they did had the Pakistanis not announced it first. The photographs are important, for, to date, the

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I don't think it is Knowledge (XXG)'s job to chronicle everyone's opinion, but just to present information in an encyclopaedic style for a layperson to understand better. India and Pakistan's opinions are important, of course, but should be evaluated separately. For instance, there are important

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I would consider anybody connected to the Indian military to not be neutral on the subject, pretty sure Australians are not involved. A lot of of stuff he says is in the "I know better they must be wrong" category without actually providing any evidence. Suggest it can be ignored and no need to

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affirmed twice that it has downed an F-16, but the current version article doesn't even mention this official Indian claim. It simply says that "IAF sources" have claimed so and ANI has reported so, which is clear misrepresentation of facts. I am not asking to write conclusively that an F-16 was

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It doesn't matter whether or not the United States "allowed" it, the missiles in question are under the control of the Pakistani government, they have physical possession of them and its entirely feasible that they would equip whatever jets they have on hand with them. The Egyptian and Romanian

4904:

The Pakistani military first reported the airstrikes. They posted pictures of uprooted fir trees and bomb craters. The Indians said they had hit a terrorist camps. We stated both without ourselves taking any sides. I'm afraid we can't do OR, use a 2004 book, of dubious value, of imprecise

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Wait. Did you read the article? It reads: "Some news reports confirm that the F-16 shot down was a B Model, a two-seater, as two parachutes were observed after the plane was hit. The pilot and co-pilot bailed out over Pakistani territory, the reports said. The B-model, like the A, is the least

3574:

I think you are still naive to how geo-politics happens in the world. No one will publicly say, I had pressure from US. US will never say, I put pressure on Pakistan. They will say "We encouraged", etc. wordings. Please see the Economic times article, where Centom chief says, he talked to the

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This is how those smart bombs work. This video is from the French Rafale team, which is independent. India has claimed that it has used same bomb. So, bombs hitting target are not based on human skill. Bombs find their target themselves using the chip inside them, by comparing the terrain and

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statements/assertions which are attributed to unknown sources or are by people not intimately involved with the affair. If we are adding Ahluwalia; we need to add Amit Shah. Pending that we need to add about Sidhus' challenging the count. And, this will go on. It's the route to a giant mess.

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The Indian Intelligence establishment has issued an alert to various security agencies pointing out that JeM has opened new offices and training centres in the provinces of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Punjab and Balakot town in Pakistan and is reviving its offices and network in the Kohat and Hazara

1950:

QEDK I have reverted your restoration of cherry picked quote added by Bless sins as a Good faith revert, This is blatant cherry picking of a quote to make a point. this is not an official statement and neither is he the defence minister, hundreds of Indian politicians have made thousands of

5605:. You can certainly change it to: "The Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing. The Indian government has accused Pakistan of providing Jaish-e-Mohammed state support. The Pakistani government condemned the attack and denied any involvement." 5455:. You can certainly change it to: "The Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing. The Indian government has accused Pakistan of providing Jaish-e-Mohammed state support. The Pakistani government condemned the attack and denied any involvement." 5354:

That the Pakistani government condemned the attack is relevant of course, but not at this particular juncture. "Pakistan-based" does not automatically mean "Pakistan-sponsored", and there is no need to defend against that here. It would be far better if, for example, the line read: "The

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Incidentally, the audacious support by the Pakistani state agencies to its affiliate terror group comes months after a Joint Investigation Team visited India to probe the Pathankot airbase attack case in which the JeM was the key player right from the strategy to execution of the jehadi

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that the airstrikes may have in reality been retaliatory, but that it was decided that the official position should be different for strategic reasons. This is important of course, but there is a great deal of complexity to their choice of language. I think it is better to phrase it as

2636:" has to say on this: Can an old MiG-21 aircraft destroy a more modern F-16? Yes, in fact an Indian pilot flying a version of the MiG-21 called Bison allegedly shot down a Pakistani F-16 using a Russian R-73 Vympel air to air missile, known as a high off bore-sight air-to-air weapon. 5021:, Oxford University Press, 2011. p.131.) Balakot is also the site of the battle between the Islamist Syed Ahmad Barelvi forces and the Sikhs, which took place in 1831. Syed Ahmad Barelvi died in the battle and has ever since influenced the coming generations of Jihadis in the region. 1121:- I am suggesting to keep the article as is. Claims of both sides need to be mentioned, until proven wrong by independent sources. If you read the section pertaining to the jets being shot down, you can clearly see that both PoVs are mentioned - so its already a "two way street". - 5414:

I would love to hear the opinions of other editors before I make any changes. If I don't receive any, of course, I will just proceed to improve the article as it appears best to me. I am of course assuming good faith all the way and ask my fellow editors to do the same. Thanks!

5097:“We don’t have training camp in Bahawalpur. We hold congregations there. We keep shifting our training camps. If there is a ban (to hold camps there) we organise our training camps somewhere else. Till two days back, our markaz (centre) was in Balakot. Now it may be elsewhere.” 5061:

On Pakistani soil alone, JEM operated at least four major military training camps located in Balakot, Muzzaffarabad, Hajeera, and Mansehra.... Allegedly, according to JEM internal records, as many as 7,000 "students" were enrolled at JEM's Balakot camp in the year 2000

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There are a myriad of possibilities, a AMRAAM could have been fitted to a Pakistani JF-17. None of the sources provided state why the AMRAAM could only be launched from an F-16. AMRAAM's are routinely employed on a myriad of other aircraft other than F-16's, such as

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Feb. 27. ASIA PACIFIC. Imran Khan Says Pakistan Will Release Indian Pilot, Seizing Publicity in Showdown. From the start, Pakistan has pushed its propaganda more effectively than India. But India says no gesture can be taken seriously until Pakistan cracks down on

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muted. ("I strongly condemn this dastardly attack. The sacrifices of our brave security personnel shall not go in vain,” Mr. Modi said on Twitter. Other officials were more emphatic that there would be a price to pay and that a response was in the making." See

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1052:- There is considerable ambiguity regarding the second crashed jet. Wait for an independent source to confirm the claims of either India or Pak. Meanwhile, we can use the statements of both sides until then; which is how things currently are in the article. - 4394:

A film taken of the twin ejection of the Pak F-16 is available. The two ejections are clearly audible. The language used is a mix of Hindi and Urdu and it is evident that the bystanders and the cameraman say "TWO" parachutes. They are both visible as is the

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I only read the article linked above, and it appears to be only referring to Pulwama attack. Did Pakistan media not cover this statement? If they did, I guess we can possibly add it in the aftermath of Pulwama attack article. Definitely not on this article.

4901:"This madrassa has been set .up on very difficult terrain. There is a village called Attar Sheesha on the road from Mansehra to Balakot. At a distance of five kilometres from this village there is a dirt track on the left that leads up to the mountains." 1612:

The crash sites of two jets are completely different, but having IAF roundels, thus ensuring the facts. I hope this clears the confusion and can be included in the page. Knowledge (XXG) should not have any capacity for emotional subjective misinformation.

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Feb. 25. ASIA PACIFIC. After India’s Strike on Pakistan, Both Sides Leave Room for De-escalation. Amid the escalation of hostilities over an attack in Kashmir, the leadership of each country seemed to give itself a way out of pushing the conflict into

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There's no policy that bars wikipedia from including the statements of a junior minister. If it contradicts another statement, then both deserve mention. I pointed out above that the content in question is covered by Indian, Pakistani and International

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Feb. 28. ASIA PACIFIC. Deadly Shelling Erupts in Kashmir Between India and Pakistan After Pilot Is Freed. Several civilians died in intense shelling as the region remained jittery even though tensions between the nuclear-armed neighbors had subsided

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I hope you can now appreciate the clarification of the conflicting reports. It is clear that 2 planes came down. PAF says both were IAF jets. IAF says one was IAF Mig21 and the other was PAF F16. This has to be included accordingly into the article.

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I'm leaving aside my opinion on the merit of the Indian claim. This version is fine. Without the Indian government's perspective, it is unclear why they chose to respond with airstrikes. I hope you can see what I mean - without it, readability is

2064:

we then proceed to Pakistan to find out about the statements of their politicians of the top tier (who have been un-doubtably covered by their media) and mention them? Further, do we proceed in the same manner about Pakistan's retaliatory strikes?

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Both airstrikes were "retaliatory" - one for the Pulwama attack, and the other for the initial airstrikes. To use the word "retaliatory" for both is not worthwhile, to use them for one is disingenuous, and so I would suggest using them for none.

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Indians have produced no evidence, photographic or other, for the existence of their airstrike. Without the Pakistani evidence, or the later Western satellite evidence, largely confirming the Pakistani version, we'd have no evidence of any sort.

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5597:"The Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing. The Indian government has accused Pakistan of providing Jaish-e-Mohammed state support, and promised retaliation against Pakistan following the attack". 5486:

5447:"The Pakistan-based militant group Jaish-e-Mohammed claimed responsibility for the bombing. The Indian government has accused Pakistan of providing Jaish-e-Mohammed state support, and promised retaliation against Pakistan following the attack". 1151:- NDTV source is speculative. Please refrain from adding it to the article unless confirmed by neutral/independent sources. The same Northern Light infantrymen can be seen guarding the Mig-21 crash site, in the same terrain on this BBC source. 2541: 5377:

Pakistan's military, the first to announce the airstrike on February 26 morning, described the Indian planes as dropping their payload in an uninhabited wooded hilltop area near Balakot, purported photographs of which they posted on social

4765:(Pulitzer) and the current, Jeffrey Gettleman (Pulitzer). Having had some dealing with the newspaper, I can say without hesitation their standards of vetting a story are extremely high, probably the most rigorous of any newspaper anywhere. 2005:

statements, but notable ones. It is not your call to determine whose assertions are superior or inferior — the goal is to remain unbiased and that includes putting contradictory statements; "route to a giant mess" is not a valid argument.

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JeM, sometime in mid-2018, organised an ‘Azmat-e-Quran’ conference at JeM's training centre ‘Markaz-o-Madrassa Taleem ul Quran’ also addressed as ‘Markaz Syed Ahmad Shaheed’, at Balakot Road of Jabba, in Mansehra district, KPK, Pakistan.

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And I would oppose inclusion of that (as I have said, more then once) we do not need to list every claim and counter claim). But I can see a difference between a manned submarine invading national waters (with all that implies) and a few

2087:

Stop taking things so personally, I was replying to both of you (and the OWNERship point was definitely for DBX). And I think it's ironic that you will cherry-pick the policy and not give any weightage to the ones on the very same page.

5103:

Khalid didn’t assign a number to volume of training camps run by the JeM. “It depends on requirement. (We hold camps) sometimes in tribal areas and sometimes here (in Muazaffarabad). We have this system running from 2001 and it will

3944:

Pakistan was avoiding US and was becoming close to China at the cost of US reservations. This conflict made Pakistan to realise the importance of US relationship. When Imran Khan became PM, he had a twitter war with President Trump.

4676:

Feb. 26. ASIA PACIFIC. Pakistani Military Says It Downed Two Indian Warplanes, Capturing Pilot. Hostilities grow with a second day of airstrikes and the first planes downed. Other countries call for the nuclear-armed rivals to show

5360:

The first airstrike was conducted by India in the early morning hours of February 26 in the vicinity of the town of Balakot in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa province in Pakistan, just inside the province's boundary with Pakistan-administered

5628:

Of course it is noteworthy. Indians have not entered sovereign Pakistani territory (in contrast to the disputed region of Pakistani administered Kashmir) since 1971. They penetrated five miles into sovereign Pakistani territory.

2114:

Pray enlighten me about mine cherry-picking the sub-policy from the same page. If you do believe that the second paragraph in my above reply (or some variant of it) is the way to proceed; please journey but after a RFC. Thanks,

3559:

I might be missing it, but I do not see where either of those say the Pakistanis released to pilot due to US pressure (well the dawn link does not appear to be uploading, so I cannot verify what it says). Could you provide the

2461:

India violated the Line of Control and also the International Border and bombed regions inside Pakistan. No major country came up with a statement condemning the attack and supported India by their silent approval of the same.

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March 2. SUNDAY REVIEW. OPINION. The Young Suicide Bomber Who Brought India and Pakistan to the Brink of War. Both countries share responsibility for reducing Kashmir to a ruin and destroying generations of lives. By Basharat

2988:

airforces have been alleged in the past to have fitted AIM-9 Sidewinders to MiG-21 airframes. Its entirely possible that the Pakistani aiforce could have fitten an AIM-120 to a JF-17 or even a J-7, without American approval.

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The fact that they found a missile fired from an F-16 doesnt mean it was attached to an F-16, as you quote "missed its target" clearly indicates a lone missile. The F-16 could have fired a missile then flown home for tea.

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celebrate the attack itself as well as to escape potential Indian strikes in the Pakistan-administered Kashmir. So, even if it had been inactive for a while, it might have been reactivated just before the air strikes. --

4599:

I have one video which is split into 2 parts. One shows an ac getting shot down; the other, taken from the same spot by the same cameraman shows another ac getting shot. Can somebody verify them please? I am unable to do

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Pakistani airspace closure has been extended yet again We do have a section that talks about it. But not sure how to appropriately cover this major news. Pakistan keeps extending the airspace closure on an almost "daily

5472:

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Article wrongly says that Indian government told that it was a retaliatory strike. But, India told in official briefing that it was a preemptive strike for a possible terror strike. See the official Indian communique.

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Further proof of no PAF F-16 shot down, no PAF pilot missing/lynched in Nawshehra. In fact, the fabricated story started circulating on social media (originating from India), and without any credible source to back it.

5665:

were dropped on an uninhabited area of Balakot." I would not quote either Indian or Pakistani mainstream media because plenty of effort has been expended elsewhere to show that both were reporting the news selectively.

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rage and hatred in the students. Situated on the banks of the river Kunhar at a distance of nearly 18 miles from Mansehra, the location was an added advantage, as it was a forested belt away from civilian population.

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SPICE 2000 bombs just go inside the building using small opening and create shockwaves to kill everyone inside instantly, no major damage to the nearby buildings. Please add the details from the below references. Ref:

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implications for the language they used to justify their strikes. India used curious language: "non-military pre-emptive strikes" - when such a justification is not yet accepted for use of force in international law.

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The list of references says that Ref 4 is either missing or empty. That is not so. The link shows that with the header: US advisor Bolton promises India support after Kashmir attack dated Sat, Feb 16 2019 is indeed

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Pakistan has not allowed any news agency to the madrasa, which India claims it has hit in the airstrike. Why? We cannot independently verify without news agencies are allowed to go to the site, which is on the hill

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The term Indian administrated Kashmir along with Pakistani administrated Kashmir are accepted neutral terms for the two areas under de facto control by the two countries. We are not here to make either side happy.

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I like how you assumed it was a "manned" submarine, let alone everything else that is wrong about that footage. Can we have someone else comment on these threads please? I think your stance is pretty clear here.

5619:

This is a Pakistani claim. India claims that it crossed deep into Pakistan. A simple Google Maps search shows Balakot in Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa, which the Indian Air Force would have to have crossed the entirety of

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agree with your assertion. My point was Pak has been denying that (1) PAF had used F16 and (2) its F16 was downed. The missile remains Debunks (1) and not (2). A conclusive proof for (2) is yet to be released.

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to enter. In any case, it would only be a noteworthy line if Indian jets actually did cross deep into Pakistan, because that is out of the norm. If not, it is hardly worth mentioning. I would delete this line.

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killed but Indian claim needs mention. Lets reach the consensus that this Indian official claim needs to be mentioned in the article's sub-section titled "Retaliatory airstrikes, capture and release of pilot".

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if you are suggesting to wait for other sources, shouldn't we also remove PAF'S claim of 2 Indian jets that is in contradiction to IAF claims. Its a two way street. Either both claims need a mention or none.

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would, in a dispute involving India and Pakistan, consider a newspaper article written by a former defense analyst of the Indian Army, with no scholarly publications, as a reliable and neutral counter to a

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February 25, 2019. ASIA PACIFIC. Indian Jets Strike in Pakistan in Revenge for Kashmir Attack. Pakistan’s military said aircraft from India had dropped bombs. But it was unclear what, if anything, was hit.

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Both India and Pakistan lost one fighter planes each, India losing Mig-21(which was supposed to retire this year or next), where as Pakistan losing F-16(the most modern fighter it has in it's inventory).

142:

The term Indian administrated kashmir doesn't exists as Jammu and kashmir is an integral part of india. Whole world and even the U.N has accpeted it. So using of such word hurt the sentiments of Indian.

3886: 833:. Pakistani media had been calling this pic as the wreckage of the Second IAF plane, while reports in India from IAF sources have confirmed that this is the F16 plane that was shot down by IAF planes. 5655:

I don't mean that it is completely unworthy of attention, but that it is not noteworthy enough to be in the lead section. It is based on conjecture. There is equally no evidence that the Indians would

2165:

The statement is significant, even if it comes from a junior minister, because it has been widely covered in reliable sources. There plenty of Indian newspapers which have covered it; Pakistani sources

5287:

Thanks, "boundary" is better than "border" in this context. I am not sure why you want to say "residents of Balakot", but something like "residents of neighbouring village" would be more accurate. --

5094:

The militant revealed that the JeM holds terror training camps in Balakot, a town in Mansehra district of Pakistan’s lawless Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa province that is known to be major base of the outfit.

2614:"UPDATE: Following publication of this article, Pakistan has disputed the events described." So the source acknowledged the claim is disputed. This is the whole problem, no independent verification. 799:

doesn't appear to mention any buildings damaged. In fact, other sources refer to "mud houses" being damaged, but no evidence to damaged buildings being reported by local villagers is in the source.

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fighters. Just because the AMRAAM's in Pakistan's inventory were sold with the intent that they be used on F-16's doesn't mean that Pakistan has fitted them to other aircraft in their inventory.

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Though Indian fighter jets crossed International Border(IB) and LOC (pseudo border), and dropped bombs inside Pakistan, no country came up with an official statement condemning Indian action.

4522:

Certainly there would be neutrality issues here, but with attribution (and assuming that "just another" colonel is deemed notable enough to not fail undue) we could mention this "rebuttal".

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capable and least modernized of the Pakistani F-16 fleet." Further down, the article reads, "While it seems the case that the Indian pilot was able to kill an older model F-16..."Thanks,

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This was the same PM's government, who publicly gave statement in twitter against US and thus isolating himself from world community, as most of the countries are US allies or friends.

3054:

as a matter of fact I have provided reliable source above that says there is no plane other than F16 in PAF that can fire AMRAAM. you seem to disagree but you have no reliable source --

1242:

Hi, I am adding a video refrence of India Today where the anchor is insisting that part is of F16 whereas the technical analyst is telling him, no it not the F16 part as it's a MIG21.

5723:

The point of all this is that I found it difficult to get through the lead section when I read it, and an unreadable or difficult-to-read article is unproductive for anyone involved.

3338:

https://www.republicworld.com/india-news/general-news/spice-2000-here-is-all-you-need-to-know-about-the-super-precision-missile-system-used-in-the-iaf-strike-on-pakistans-terror-bases

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Irrelevant, it is still a contested claim do not reject contested claims because they make sense to us (that is OR). It does not matter what an Indian officer says, it is not proof.

624:

Whatever happens, the recovered piece of the AIM-120C-5 is strong evidence that Pakistani F-16s tangled with Indian jets for the first time in the air battle over Jammu and Kashmir.

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I haven't seen this mentioned on the talk page or anything so i thought i'd bring it up - someone has copied the entirety of the wikipedia page Nudity into the top of this article

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FATF warning of Blacklisting, IMF loan negotiation not making any headway and US support to India during the conflict, made Pakistan to realise the importance of US relationship.

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As for Reuters, they did not say that the Jaish facility was a training camp for adult men looking for salvation in heaven's well watered gardens, but a children's madrasa. (see

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After that, in briefing of Indian Ministry of External Affairs dated 8th March 2019, Indian officer Raveesh Kumar re-affirmed that Wing Commander Abhinandan shot down an F-16. (

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Pakistan needs a new strategy to deal with the new normal of India’s strategic calculus: conventionally attack at will and justify the act of aggression as a preemptive action.

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March 2. OPINION. The India-Pakistan Conflict Was a Parade of Lies. The internet contributed to the culture of mendacity in a fight between nuclear neighbors. By Farhad Manjoo

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Future Indian PM will be forced to take action against Islamic militants, such as JeM, HuM, LeT inside Pakistan as this action by India has changed security paradigm forever.

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American experts, who were shown the debris from the Indian side, have confirmed that remains in such quantity could only have come from a missile that had missed its target.

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For the record, Pakistan continues to deny one of its F-16s was shot down. But denials notwithstanding, the evidence seems increasingly compelling against Pakistan’s denial.

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And when those US experts come forward and publicly support it fine, until then it is still only a claim made by an involved party. And use and loss are not the same thing.

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without crossing Line of Control (not International border). Pakistan officially does not consider Indian part of Kashmir to be part of India, as seen in Pakistan's maps.

3314:

Bombs used are smart and intelligent bombs, kill everyone inside a building but does not create any damage to the near by buildings. Used for urban and targeted warfare.

2398:

Pakistan has not allowed any media houses or the local people to visit the Islamic seminary, which India claims to have targeted using the roof piercing precision bombs.

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opinions aren't important. I am happy to make edits, but I thought it might be better to post here, so that I can resolve any potential conflicts before making changes.

5080:

JeM has three very well established training centres in Balakot, Bhimber and Bhawalpur. These centres are run from local mosques that have other infrastructure in place.

2533:

Firstly, in Indian Army, Air Force & Navy's Joint Breifing dated 28th Feb 2019, IAF senior officer Mr Kapoor re-affirmed that the aircraft they downed was an F-16. (

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The person in question has a credible military service record since 1982, and specialises in satellites imagery. You could at least mention his argument against ASIP.

2465:

Pakistan had been isolated internationally and it had no support from any major countries such as P5(UNSC permanent members) or G8(Top 8 powerful economies) countries.

5271:

I've fixed the ambiguity, added more sources, and made the statements more neutral. As the events are recent, we need more descriptive prose, than interpretative.

3954:

and no major country in the world want to show itself with a block which is considered anti-US and pro-China. This is also isolating Pakistan in the world diplomacy.

3200:

no need to drag admins into something that we can fix among ourselves. Please propose your version here in the form of change X to Y and we can discuss and add it--

2692:

I will add that the above sources seem pretty ambivalent about the claim, saying it might be true...but has been denied (and, in essence, we have no way of knowing).

420:

I added the one about the SU-30 shooting down a drone, as any sort of air to air engagement, even between a manned aircraft and a drone, is a rather rare occurrence.

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The IAF jet that fell in Azad Jammu & Kashmir (Pakistani side) (see pictures of soldiers in uniforms with Pak Army flag and IAF roundel on the crashed jet):

3098:

has claimed that an F-16 was downed. This is not some unofficial news report attributed to unnamed officials. I haven't yet seen an answer to that question. --

1924:

There is no policy that states that statements cannot be included because it's "inferior". It's notable and well-sourced and thus, is suitable for inclusion. --

4680:

Feb. 27. OPINION. Hashtags for War Between India and Pakistan. Social media has been taken over by warmongers in the nuclear-armed neighbors. By Fatima Bhutto

1901:

If that statement contradicts another statement then both can be presented neutrally. But the statement of a minister is significant enough to merit inclusion.

5257:

I am ok with the present text as it stands. I have also reinstated "just inside the border" phrase, which sounds strange to me, but apparently is in use. --

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https://www.firstpost.com/india/pilot-of-downed-pakistan-air-force-f-16-shahaz-ud-din-lynched-by-nowshera-mob-that-mistook-him-for-indian-airman-6180091.html

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not everything that is covered in newspaper can have its own article or can be added into an existing article. I have explained why It has been removed. --

1461:

The article states that an Indian Su-30 shot down a Pakistani UAV. This is incorrect - India does not operate Su-30s, but the Su-30MKI, an advanced variant

3040:

You don't have reliable sources for you assertions either, there is no reliable source available that states that a JF-17 can't be equipped with a AIM-120.

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Feb. 27. ASIA PACIFIC. India-Pakistan Crisis: Why They Keep Fighting Over Kashmir. A simple guide to the roots of the conflict and what could happen next.

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lat/long co-ordinates with the map which has been fed into it. Either it hits the target OR falls without exploding. So, bombs should have hit the target.

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Col. Vinayak Bhat (RETD) of the Indian Army has given some counterarguments at to why the ASPI’s analysis is flawed, and based on illogical assumptions.

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Pak media showing fake image of mig-21. The picture they showing was 2016 crash of mig21 in kolkata india media proof it by plane number.what a laugh?

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says "The closest structure to the newly impacted craters is a lone house belonging to 60-year-old Nooran Shah, the sole casualty". The reuters article

5110: 793:

DBigXray reverted an edit of mine and in which he changed "resulting in damage to a lone house" to "resulting in damage to a building". But the source

4722:

NYT's coverage is not the best benchmark for neutrality:-( I will take a re-look, though for there have been abundant amount of Indian POV pushing.

2589:

Please see the independent source covering the downing of F16 in Detail. If anyone needs access to the entire article behind paywall, I can email.--

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US put pressure on Pakistan to release Indian Pilot, which helped in de-escalation of tension. As India was ready to escalate to the next level.

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I already posted two sources when i added it to the article, unlike other instances, the Pakistani government has not refuted this claim it seems.

5660:

The satellite evidence, which I understand are unverified and were leaked to the Western media, is the closest thing to objective evidence, and

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https://www.news18.com/news/india/no-country-has-spoken-in-our-favour-after-indian-air-strike-says-former-pakistan-ambassador-to-us-2049729.html

2659:

Any idea where this evidence of a downed F-16 is, apart from rhetoric nobody has provided anything that proves an F-16 has come down somewhere.

2530:

Its worth mentioning that not only ANI reported that an F-16 was downed by IAF, but India re-affirmed twice officially that it downed an F-16.

1604:

The IAF jet that fell in Indian occupied Jammu & Kashmir (see the last picture with people standing close to another jet with IAF roundel):

726:

Strong evidence does not mean is. Nor does it mean it is a contemporary wreckage. Maybe reword it to say " strong evidence that Pakistani F-16".

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https://www.abplive.in/world-news/us-gives-pakistan-ultimatum-to-dismantle-terror-groups-qureshi-assures-to-deal-firmly-with-terrorists-939076

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Please see sources as proof. The IAF has been unable to provide substantial proof of downing a PAF F-16. Pakistan has provided proof of both.

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https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/world-opinion-tilted-towards-india-in-its-spat-over-terror-from-pakistan/articleshow/68174911.cms

3956:

Now, Pakistan wants to enhance relationship with US, because of US role in the conflict resolution and threat of blacklisting by the FATF.

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It might be that the section in the article needs to be simplified rather than reporting each daily movement of the expected opening date.

763:

The use of the term "strong" is POV. If it is used, it should be clearly attributed as to who believes this constitutes "strong" evidence.

261:

Why doesn't this article mention the fact that three Pakistani drones have been shot down in Indian airspace, since the Indian airstrike:

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Its down to those who wish to include it to make better arguments. A d again I ask why this needs to be included, what does it tell us?

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Well, there is a "trivial", unconfirmed Pakistani claim about a submarine that is deemed notable enough to be included in the article.

5162: 4367: 4077: 1863: 1539: 270: 4883:], seen this already. But I am not sure it should be added, as it is not (as far as I can tell) confirmed.09:43, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4733: 4547: 3773: 3094:

But all this discussion seems to have gone off on a tangent. The original question raised was why are we omitting the fact that the

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So add all of it. How is removing a sourced statement from MoS justified by not including Amit Shah's statement? This is borderline

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in retaliatory action against India, providing proof after proof. Whereas, IAF has been unable to provide any proof for downed jet.

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These two events are worth mentioning in the article's sub-section titled "Retaliatory airstrikes, capture and release of pilot". -

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In fact, there is a possibility that the IAF shot down its own MiG-17 helicopter (that went down the same day as other IAF jets).

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No worries, and thank you for your comments. Happy to engage as long as it's reasoned, detached and will improve the article :)

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KP: No worries, not off your rocker at all. I have to run now. I'll answer in more detail in the evening, but a few points:

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The Scientific Revolution: The Essential Readings. (Blackwell Essential Readings in History.) 320 pp. Oxford: Blackwell, 2003.

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Express media house(website link is attached) and Indian Air Force too claims it lost only one MiG-21 in the aerial dogfight.

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who is not even a minister in India. Why should the article have statements by random journalists but not actual ministers?

2964:

please provide reliable source for your assertion. US would never allow fitting its top notch missile on a Chinese jet. --

5560:, Sorry I didn't realize you are a new reader; otherwise I would have been less pithy in my explanations. Best regards, 4853: 4008:

https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/donald-trump-imran-khan-twitter-war-pakistan-usa-osama-bin-laden-1392167-2018-11-20

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https://indianexpress.com/article/india/pakistan-f-16s-launched-two-amraams-one-missed-target-other-hit-mig-21-5614615/

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For grammar and to remove its misleading nature, this sentence should be changed to (or something along the lines of):

539:"Indian Air Force later presented wreckage of AIM-120; an air-to-air missile, capable to be launched only from F-16s." 3748: 3711: 1196:

In a recent press briefing by Indian military officers, they claimed that that Mig-21 Bison shot down an F-16 of PAF (

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I'm trying to link a PDF of his CV to NIAS Banglore, which includes his service record, but can't publish my reply.

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Saeed, Luqman; Syed, Shabib Haider (2016). "Insights into Selected Features of Pakistan's Most Wanted Terrorists".

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Reuters and other media teams could not visit location India claimed to have bombed, after trying more than 3 times

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The end of diffidence: India has moved from restrained to robust deterrence of terror. Can it sustain this shift?

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Pakistan President statement mentions three Pakistani soldiers were killed on LoC not two as previously reported

2205:

I recall there was a discussion and you responded to it, but there was no clear opposition to this so I added it.

1845:

https://www.dawn.com/news/1467971/foreign-journalists-find-holes-in-indian-narrative-on-f-16-usage-balakot-strike

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they dont need to comment if they agree. Pretty sure they would come out of the woodwork if a bun fight started.

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Jihadi group with continuing links to British Muslims is shrouded in the realpolitik of espionage and terrorism.

4043:

https://www.theweek.in/news/india/2019/02/16/america-supports-india-s-right-to-self-defence--us-nsa-bolton.html

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First Violation of Pakistani Airspace Since 1971 War: 3 Reasons Why This Strike is Bigger and Bolder Than 2016

2829:, Pak denies that F16 were used at all, but India has already put evidence on record that nails that lie. See 2457:

Pakistan had no support and Indian action of air strike inside Pakistan was supported with intelligent silence

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Links to showcase it was not the revenge attack, but a pre-emptive strike to avoid a possible terrorist attack

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Knowledge (XXG):Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#2019_Balakot_Air_Strikes_Page_Defaced_:_Not_able_to_edit

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https://theprint.in/defence/australian-researchers-pick-imaginary-holes-in-iaf-strikes-on-balakot/213970/amp/

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Everything You Need to Know About The SPICE-2000 Smart Bombs Used by The IAF in Balakot Strikes: Watch Video

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Yeah, I think its worth mentioning that PAF lost its pilot named Shahaz ud din in the standoff on 27 Feb. -

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to the extent that you're using your own logic to defy policy. Just so we're clear, we're not mentioning

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https://www.dawn.com/news/1466347/2-indian-aircraft-violating-pakistani-airspace-shot-down-pilot-arrested

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especially Protocol II (which India and Pakistan did not sign) then both are in violation big time. see

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would-be executive editors and Pulitzer prize winners, among which, off the top of my head, I can count

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Sorry but unless we have a source saying it was operation at the time of the attack we cannot infer it.

4913: 4857: 4830: 4766: 4702: 4507: 2408:

10 ambulances" used to ferry casualties from a madrasa run by Masood Azhar, the Jaish-e-Muhammad chief.

1733: 1875: 1743:"Sources said American experts" - yeah, the first sentence indicates this is unreliable already. Plus 1646:

https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/437668-geneva-convention-experts-differ-over-immunity-to-indian-pilot

1620: 1608:

http://www.radio.gov.pk/27-02-2019/indian-fighter-jet-crashes-in-occupied-kashmir-budgam-2-pilots-dead

5961: 5930: 5875: 5817: 5766: 5730: 5555: 5418: 4870: 4612: 4568: 4453: 4387: 4343: 3904: 3900: 3882:

Crossing the Rubicon: IAF air strikes in Pakistan mark a paradigm shift in India’s strategic calculus

3624: 3620: 3545: 3541: 3505: 3501: 3435: 3431: 3383: 3379: 3347: 3343: 3275: 3271: 2495: 2491: 2425: 2421: 2378: 2374: 2305: 2301: 2270: 2252: 2210: 2181: 2147: 1906: 1375: 1230: 1129: 1060: 882: 804: 797: 768: 148: 144: 5238: 3973:

https://www.thedailystar.net/opinion/open-dialogue/news/imran-khan-and-his-twitter-war-trump-1664347

3921: 3263:

Pakistan’s ‘nuclear blackmail ended’: What security experts are saying about IAF’s Balakot airstrike

3081:

All the sources I have seen, including those that believed that Pakistan used JF-17s, admitted that

2191:

There was a discussion about adding this, no consensus was reached so it should not have been added.

379: 5292: 5262: 5194: 4935: 3787: 3703: 3203: 3103: 3057: 3017: 2967: 2940: 2912: 2840: 2784: 2592: 2289:

Indian government officially maintained it was pre-emptive strike and never it was a revenge attack

2226: 1954: 1919: 1804: 1486: 1462: 1389: 1349: 1332: 1298: 1264: 1213: 1191: 1146: 1116: 1082: 1047: 1023: 868: 844: 743: 632: 582: 441: 183: 101: 4422:

A 1999 video is unlikely to support a claim from 2019 and clearly doesnt have any F-16s in sight.

4368:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/16/us-advisor-bolton-promises-india-support-after-kashmir-attack.html

4078:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/16/us-advisor-bolton-promises-india-support-after-kashmir-attack.html

3322: 2036: 1864:

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/rest-of-world/2019/03/02/falcon-vs-bison-verifying-a-mig-21-wreck/

1729: 1540:

https://www.deccanherald.com/national/north-and-central/pak-f-16-pilot-was-lynched-his-721140.html

3187: 2936: 2552: 1569: 4321: 2577:

Exclusive: Inside the aerial dogfight that took nuclear-armed Pakistan and India to brink of war

1998: 1590:

https://news.sky.com/story/pakistan-shoots-down-two-indian-warplanes-and-captures-pilot-11649515

4829:

Please add Mi-17 V5 Chopper to the list of Indian casualty--reasoning = Friendly fire. Thanks.

3328:

Three ways India confirmed that the hits on Balakot were successful - shared for the first time

2394:

Pakistan has not allowed Media and local people to visit the Islamic seminary targeted by India

5831: 5786: 5785:

Walls of text are never a good idea, a few points, Mansehra District is not "DEEP IN Kashmir".

5220: 5205: 5048: 5004: 4951: 4641: 4523: 4325: 4295: 4260: 4225: 4190: 4155: 4120: 4085: 4050: 4015: 3980: 3925: 3808: 3722: 3654: 3589: 3561: 3521: 3451: 3407: 3358: 3292: 3247: 3157: 3117: 2863: 2822: 2809: 2693: 2615: 2582: 2563: 2511: 2442: 2335: 2321: 2192: 1762: 1672: 727: 697:"India Shows Proof U.S. Made F-16s And AIM-120 Missiles Were Used By Pakistan In Aerial Brawl" 603: 399: 375: 342: 313: 4471: 3472:

Pakistan was not given any deal or Pakistan did not get anything for returning Indian Pilot.

2763:"Dogfight over Pakistan's 'use and loss of F-16' lands US in awkward spot - Times of India ►" 1894:

Statement from Ahluwalia the Indian minister of state (inferior than cabinet) for Electronics

4996: 4750: 4627: 4580: 4423: 3041: 2989: 2961: 2948: 2905: 2892: 2826: 2660: 1752: 1655: 1508: 1286:

This is a paragraph from the official statement of the Ministry of External Affairs India.

562: 476: 462: 435: 421: 383: 242: 160: 123: 1854:

https://www.newslaundry.com/2019/03/05/why-claims-about-the-paf-pilots-lynching-dont-add-up

1206: 5017:

Outfits such as JeM have training camps located in Balakot town, Mansehra. (Khaled Ahmed,

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But, almost all the countries are friends of US. US supported India during the conflict

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Depends on the size of the state. At its closest it is only about 65 miles from India.

3832: 3585: 2366:

BJP to its leaders: Keep restraint, project Balakot as pre-emptive strike, not revenge

90:

March 09 Official Statement by the Indian MEA Spokesperson on India Pakistan Situation

3197: 3183: 2586: 2548: 2262: 1565: 1219: 1204: 1197: 953:"Pakistan says no F-16 aircraft used, dismisses report of their fighter jet crashing" 826: 3706:

but I think it can be considered here too since this statement was made afterwards.

1835:

https://www.geo.tv/latest/229966-pakistan-used-a-jf-17-in-dogfight-with-india-report

5898: 5845: 5100:

Indian intelligence agencies confirmed that the JeM has a regular camp in Balakot.

4758: 2944: 2675: 2643: 5000: 3743:

Right,it must include her. The statement is very important and must include here.

3588:. I take it from the above that no, these RS do not say the US pressured Pakistan. 374:

I am sure that some of the 100 page watchers would comment if they disagreed with

5042: 1859:

https://www.asiatimes.com/2019/03/article/no-proof-india-shot-down-pakistan-f-16/

1594: 5019:

Sectarian War: Pakistan’s Sunni-Shiite Violence and its Links to the Middle East

4762: 1748: 558: 46:

If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the

1167: 4602: 4411: 3327: 2633: 2334:

OK I think we can say India has said this, but RS have said it was in revenge.

1530:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10158397550900031&id=520145030

5007: 2172: 5966:

I have rewritten parts of the lead, taking some of your input into account.

2477:

How did the international community react to India's Air strikes on Balakot?

2090: 2057:

Every random politicians' claiming some or the other stuff about the strikes

2032: 2008: 1926: 3877:

Between India and Pakistan, Can 'Negative Peace' Serve as a Strategic Good?

3853:

Between India and Pakistan, Can 'Negative Peace' Serve as a Strategic Good?

3534:

Dawn is Pakistani news paper and Retuters is from US, what else you want?

1526:

Was there a PAF F16 pilot named Shahaz-Ud-Din who was lynched in Nawshera?

2403:

Reuters - No access to Pakistan religious school that India says it bombed

1951:

statements on the airstrike, are you suggesting we go down that route ? --

1840:

https://www.dawn.com/news/1467526/jf-17-not-f-16-used-in-air-combat-report

1218:, please update the Indian claims by using the official sources listed by 928:"2 Indian aircraft violating Pakistani airspace shot down; pilot arrested" 555:

The F-16 is the only aircraft in the Pakistan military that uses AIM-120s.

3307:

SPICE 2000 bombs do not destroy the buildings like in old Iraq war photos

4253:

https://www.orfonline.org/expert-speak/pakistan-china-new-america-48305/

3479:

Tensions with India have cooled off, US is to be thanked for it: Qureshi

2831:

Pakistan F-16s launched two AMRAAMs, one missed target, other hit MiG-21

2751:

Statement by the Spokesperson on India Pakistan Situation March 09, 2019

1259:

Statement by the Spokesperson on India Pakistan Situation March 09, 2019

95:

Statement by the Spokesperson on India Pakistan Situation March 09, 2019

4288:

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1934816/1-us-ties-pakistan-now-good-trump/

3849:

are therefore tied to the political cost of inaction or action thereof.

3478: 3466:

US forced Indian Pilot release, with Pakistan getting nothing in return

2361:

The Balakot Strikes: Analysing India’s “Non-Military Preemptive Action”

2142:

claiming consensus here to not even have the statement at that article.

1507:

Also note we are still waiting for a reliable source that it happened.

1323:

The top into paragraph and side table is correct content. Rest is from

275: 2039:. He is a MoS of a dept. which is not any linked with defense affairs. 5686:

the way in which these countries have chosen to justify their strikes

3489:

India, Pakistan threatened to unleash missiles at each other: sources

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much the language in the major Western English-language newspapers.

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US played key role in release of Wing Commander Abhinandan Varthaman

2526:

India re-affirmed twice that F-16 downed: This needs to be mentioned

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much the language in the major Western English-language newspapers.

5163:

Importance of Balakot & Why India Was Strategic In Targeting It

4490:

Catholic Physics: Jesuit Natural Philosophy in Early Modern Germany

5087:

Pak militants attacked Pathankot airbase, Jaish operative tells HT

977:"Did not want to retaliate at the cost of regional peace: DG ISPR" 740:

Fair enough. added the wording as you suggested above. regards. --

5073:

EXCLUSIVE: How Jaish-e-Mohammad is funding terrorists in J&K

1579:

Both downed planes were IAF jets, one MiG-21 Bison, one Su-30MKI

1257:

No, this will need better wording or sources. Please also refer

5027:

Terror plots and conspiracy theories: the hunt for Rashid Rauf

4792: 3156:

We do "India also claimed to have shot down a Pakistani F-16".

1690: 1424: 1203:

missile as a proof of F-16 jets involved in the PAF's strike (

502: 25: 2413:

Media Teams Prevented Access to Airstrike Site Multiple Times

2139:

instead. But DBigXray removed the statement from that article

818:(This information is subjective and must not be considered.) 5702:

But this is not war, and India and Pakistan have not signed

5511:

But this is not war, and India and Pakistan have not signed

3225:

Who had upper hand at the end and Shift in security paradigm

2069:

Also, I need not learn any lesson about ownership from you.

618:

List_of_active_Pakistan_Air_Force_aircraft#Current_aircraft

4789:

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 March 2019

1898:

DBigXray removed a statement by India's Minister of State.

1639:

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 12 March 2019

1421:

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 11 March 2019

499:

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 10 March 2019

5401:

gesture of goodwill, thereafter returning him on March 1.

3520:

Again I am not sure the only RS here supports your claim.

122:

But still zero evidence that an F-16 was downed or lost.

904:"Pakistan shoots down two Indian fighter jets: Military" 3091:. So, it is unreasonable for us to speculate otherwise. 2356:

The Balakot statement: Establishing a responsible India

2140: 1899: 5044:

Terrorism Documents of International and Local Control

3838:

More Indian attacks on Pakistan expected going forward

602:

Has it been proven by independent expert this is true?

2035:, you need an alphabet soup of policies, right? Read 1319:

Vandalism: The article is showing content from Nudity

312:

Its too trivial, it only an unconfirmed Indian claim?

5138:

ISI, IM (Indian Mujahideen) and JeM terrorists.”...

4856:

that support the change you want to be made. Thanks.

4561:

https://www.orfonline.org/contributors/vinayak-bhat/

4448:

This should be added as counter to the ASPI claims.

2261:

Also the article currently contains the opinions of

5929:section makes for difficult reading. Best regards. 5586:

Kolrabi Pickle's reply to Fowler&fowler's reply

3940:

US benefited immensely from India-Pakistan conflict

3833:

https://www.ptv.com.pk/ptvWorld/engNewsDetail/22013

1747:has basically no chance of being a neutral source. 98:

Some interesting points on the downed F16 plane. --

4470:Please suggest what Knowledge (XXG) guideline for 814:Wreckage of PAF F16 called out as second IAF Plane 3892:Balakot—Pakistan’s strategic 9/11? – Jan Achakzai 3867:Balakot—Pakistan’s strategic 9/11? – Jan Achakzai 398:Because no one has said it was unmanned, and AGF. 138:This page is showing Indian administrated kashmir 3692:Pulwama terror attack was Pakistan's finest hour 5168: 5153: 5131: 5116: 5092: 5078: 5059: 5032: 5015: 3687:To be considered for inclusion in the article: 3182:Please do the necessary edits in this regard. - 2089: 2007: 1925: 839:Wreckage Of Downed Pak F-16 Fighter Seen In PoK 4970:that have talked about it in the last decade: 3694:: Pakistani Senator Mushahid Hussain Sayed - ( 1595:https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47393454 378:comments and conclusions. Under the spirit of 5175:JeM’s avenging the killing of Afzal Guru.... 5148:FBI helped India crack FB chats of terrorists 5047:, Oxford University Press, USA, pp. 468–469, 3139:What I am emphasising over is that India has 3085:F-16s can be fitted with AIM-120. See, e.g., 2716: 1288: 622: 549:Indian Air Force later presented wreckage of 175:Pakistani airspace closure extended yet again 8: 5436:Fowler&fowler's reply to Kohlrabi Pickle 4660:India-POV pushing on this and daughter pages 4487:lead authored by Marcus Hellyer, author of 3762:unmerited unless foreign media picks it up. 217:"Pakistan closes its airspace till March 11" 5111:Masood’s Masterstroke: The Afzal Guru Squad 4603:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28zkCei4kbI 4412:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ti_xPBoC8hY 1168:"Jet downing raises India-Pakistan tension" 5581: 5431: 4973: 3894: 3702:I have also left this on the talk page of 3614: 3535: 3495: 3425: 3265: 3258:National Security: The New in ‘New Normal’ 2485: 2415: 2368: 2295: 1869: 1649: 1648:) Usama Ahmad 09:08, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 1614: 1544: 290: 18:Talk:2019 India–Pakistan border skirmishes 3311:Please add below content to the article. 2483:Advantage India, after Balakot air strike 1974:I concur with DBX. We are not mentioning 5389:The second airstrike, a retaliatory one, 2135:WBG, you seem to hint at adding this to 874:related to the second jet in any way. - 5150:, The Times of India, 20 December 2016. 5067:(This could be old information though.) 4809:India–Pakistan border skirmishes (2019) 4404: 4360: 3964: 2732: 1159: 895: 695:Trevithick, Joseph (28 February 2019). 662: 208: 4745:(in the 50s), later executive editor; 4304: 4293: 4269: 4258: 4234: 4223: 4199: 4188: 4164: 4153: 4129: 4118: 4094: 4083: 4059: 4048: 4024: 4013: 3989: 3978: 2834: 565:) 03:33, Sunday, March 10, 2019 (UTC) 44:Do not edit the contents of this page. 5853:article makes that cardinal error. 5041:Lovelace Jr. Esq, Douglas C. (2009), 5029:, The Independent, 27 September 2008. 4492:, University of Notradame Press, 2005 4485:Australian Strategic Policy Institute 7: 4536:Nope. Pretty much what F&F sez. 4438:Counterargument to the ASPI analysis 1687:Edit on India-Pakistan 2019 standoff 1199:). They also presented the cover of 5126:Eye to India, Pak reinvigorates JeM 5089:, Hindustan Times, 14 January 2016. 3291:Not sure the RS support this claim. 5816:to get to Mansehra, it qualifies. 2631:Also see what the Hong Kong based 1671:Again we need independent sources. 24: 4504:Google Scholar Citation Index: 45 4496:Google Scholar Citation Index: 66 4183:https://www.dawn.com/news/1467986 2562:What do non involved sources say? 5311: 4989:Terrorism and Political Violence 4844: 4796: 2579:, The Telegraph UK, 2 March 2019 1775: 1694: 1476: 1428: 1411: 1382:edit: ah, someone else just did 572: 553:AIM-120, an air-to-air missile. 506: 461:Do you have a reliable source ? 29: 5907:UN report on Human Rights 2018. 5799:Guilty as charged, and noted. 5113:, Pune Mirror, 16 January 2016. 5075:, India Today, 18 January 2016. 5897:(i) In Pakistani governance, 5165:, The Quint, 27 February 2019. 3420:Here is the reliable source - 2168:(including a government source 2051:; where all these stuff shall 1761:Yep have to sat all a bit ORY. 1: 5001:10.1080/09546553.2016.1142442 1233:15:11, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1132:12:49, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1098:12:34, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1063:12:30, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1039:12:25, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1009:12:20, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 885:12:05, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 860:11:42, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 434:I agree with the addition by 5128:, The Pioneer, 19 June 2016. 3781:User:Winged Blades of Godric 3357:How about an independent RS? 1707:2019 India–Pakistan standoff 1441:2019 India–Pakistan standoff 519:2019 India–Pakistan standoff 4823:to reactivate your request. 4811:has been answered. Set the 3683:Reference for consideration 3378:What is the meaning of RS? 2171:) and international sources 1721:to reactivate your request. 1709:has been answered. Set the 1522:PAF F16 Pilot Shahaz-Ud-Din 1455:to reactivate your request. 1443:has been answered. Set the 533:to reactivate your request. 521:has been answered. Set the 438:. It deserves a mention. -- 6000: 5635:Indo-Pakistani War of 1971 5331:16:35, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5297:14:07, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5283:13:29, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5267:12:57, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5253:12:15, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5214:11:02, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 5199:10:49, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4978:sources in the last decade 4960:09:44, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4940:07:48, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4924:00:20, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4878:09:28, 31 March 2019 (UTC) 4839:20:43, 30 March 2019 (UTC) 4777:21:26, 30 March 2019 (UTC) 4736:16:37, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4713:04:14, 27 March 2019 (UTC) 4650:08:32, 30 March 2019 (UTC) 4636:17:09, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4617:16:55, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4589:13:43, 30 March 2019 (UTC) 4573:19:10, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4550:16:33, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4532:13:14, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4518:13:09, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4458:10:13, 29 March 2019 (UTC) 4432:18:31, 26 March 2019 (UTC) 4392:15:35, 26 March 2019 (UTC) 4348:11:09, 26 March 2019 (UTC) 4334:11:50, 23 March 2019 (UTC) 3934:16:55, 22 March 2019 (UTC) 3913:16:47, 22 March 2019 (UTC) 3817:08:41, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3803:05:56, 18 March 2019 (UTC) 3776:04:18, 18 March 2019 (UTC) 3753:11:06, 17 March 2019 (UTC) 3731:09:40, 17 March 2019 (UTC) 3716:01:06, 17 March 2019 (UTC) 3696:16 March 2019, India Today 3663:08:02, 21 March 2019 (UTC) 3633:20:33, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3598:08:02, 21 March 2019 (UTC) 3570:16:09, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3554:14:06, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3530:08:52, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3514:03:44, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3460:15:19, 21 March 2019 (UTC) 3444:12:49, 21 March 2019 (UTC) 3416:16:10, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3388:14:04, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3367:08:57, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3352:04:00, 18 March 2019 (UTC) 3323:SPICE-2000 - How it works? 3301:08:45, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3284:04:15, 20 March 2019 (UTC) 3219:17:25, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 3192:17:07, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 3166:20:28, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 3126:11:37, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 3108:21:41, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 3073:20:06, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 3050:19:31, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 3033:18:45, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 3014:plane that can fire it. -- 2998:18:34, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2983:08:52, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2957:13:35, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2928:17:52, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2901:17:16, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2872:17:18, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2856:17:10, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2818:17:01, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2800:16:56, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2702:16:35, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2686:14:12, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2669:16:24, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2654:14:25, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2624:12:54, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2608:12:50, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2572:10:49, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2557:02:51, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2520:11:36, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 2504:08:30, 16 March 2019 (UTC) 2451:13:40, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2434:15:26, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2387:15:12, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2344:13:42, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2330:17:26, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2314:17:24, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2275:23:34, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2257:23:32, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2242:08:48, 15 March 2019 (UTC) 2215:17:27, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2201:10:59, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 2186:17:27, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2152:17:17, 14 March 2019 (UTC) 2129:15:15, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 2110:15:03, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 2083:14:48, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 2028:14:37, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1993:11:18, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1970:04:54, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1946:19:40, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 1911:17:09, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 1888:20:23, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1681:10:50, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 1633:20:23, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1574:02:37, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 1559:22:27, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 1517:18:13, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1502:05:41, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1471:05:08, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1409: 1405:15:50, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1380:04:16, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1365:05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1337:04:13, 11 March 2019 (UTC) 1314:08:59, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 809:17:07, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 789:"Lone house" vs "building" 773:16:50, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 759:08:55, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 736:08:45, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 671:"Raytheon: AMRAAM Missile" 648:08:06, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 612:08:00, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 598:03:56, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 567:03:33, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 485:20:21, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 471:10:02, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 457:04:52, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 430:04:47, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 251:10:23, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 199:08:01, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 169:10:36, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 132:10:39, 10 March 2019 (UTC) 5978:10:02, 4 April 2019 (UTC) 5955:14:44, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 5939:14:28, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 5921:23:30, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5884:19:01, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5865:10:54, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5840:10:42, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5826:10:27, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5811:10:22, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5795:10:12, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5775:10:06, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5739:10:06, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 5572:20:56, 1 April 2019 (UTC) 5535:20:46, 1 April 2019 (UTC) 5427:17:24, 1 April 2019 (UTC) 5336:Neutrality vs readability 5012:(p.&;72, footnote 26) 4640:Why youtube is not an RS. 4626:more time looking at it. 3243:Pakistan Hugely embrassed 1826:PAF F16 Pilot False Story 1820:15:45, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 1771:13:10, 7 March 2019 (UTC) 1757:07:37, 7 March 2019 (UTC) 1738:06:52, 7 March 2019 (UTC) 1280:15:48, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 1252:20:02, 5 March 2019 (UTC) 408:12:53, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 392:13:24, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 366:12:39, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 351:12:29, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 336:12:17, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 322:12:14, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 305:12:11, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 153:22:29, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 117:15:50, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 5943:Thanks for your input. 2219:Knowledge (XXG) is not 1797:edit extended-protected 285:Sri Ganganagar district 5851:2019 Balakot airstrike 5708:Additional Protocol II 5622:Azad Jammu and Kashmir 5517:Additional Protocol II 5466:Azad Jammu and Kashmir 5369:Azad Jammu and Kashmir 5181: 5158: 5144: 5121: 5106: 5082: 5064: 5037: 5023: 3580:No, I just understand 2721: 2137:2019 Balakot airstrike 2048:2019 Balakot airstrike 1293: 831:Newspaper Dawn Article 825:Please take a look at 626: 274:4 March, outskirts of 5704:Additional Protocol I 5513:Additional Protocol I 4579:mention the Colonel. 3842:From the reference - 2320:A link would be nice. 2176:have also covered it. 257:Paki drones shot down 42:of past discussions. 5874:to be photographed. 4890:Google Maps Research 1787:for this alteration 957:www.businesstoday.in 4749:(EE and Pulitzer), 4498:), and editor of 3704:2019 Pulwama attack 2941:Panavia Tornado ADV 1783:please establish a 1342:being Discussed at 981:The Express Tribune 5225:Exactly my point. 2937:Saab JAS 39 Gripen 2767:The Times of India 5969:Fowler&fowler 5946:Fowler&fowler 5912:Fowler&fowler 5856:Fowler&fowler 5802:Fowler&fowler 5761:Fowler&fowler 5748: 5747: 5563:Fowler&fowler 5544: 5543: 5526:Fowler&fowler 5322:Fowler&fowler 5274:Fowler&fowler 5244:Fowler&fowler 5185: 5184: 5161:Aditya Raj Kaul, 5124:Rakesh K. Singh, 5053:978-0-19-538307-2 4915:Fowler&fowler 4875: 4827: 4826: 4768:Fowler&fowler 4704:Fowler&fowler 4595:Help: Check Video 4509:Fowler&fowler 4506:) Best regards, 4303:Missing or empty 4268:Missing or empty 4233:Missing or empty 4198:Missing or empty 4163:Missing or empty 4128:Missing or empty 4093:Missing or empty 4058:Missing or empty 4023:Missing or empty 3988:Missing or empty 3915: 3899:comment added by 3745:Indiamerijaan2001 3708:DiplomatTesterMan 3635: 3619:comment added by 3556: 3540:comment added by 3516: 3500:comment added by 3446: 3430:comment added by 3286: 3270:comment added by 3096:Indian government 2506: 2490:comment added by 2436: 2420:comment added by 2389: 2373:comment added by 2316: 2300:comment added by 1890: 1874:comment added by 1725: 1724: 1667: 1654:comment added by 1635: 1619:comment added by 1561: 1549:comment added by 1459: 1458: 1001:Indiamerijaan2001 908:www.aljazeera.com 829:in the Pakistani 537: 536: 307: 295:comment added by 87: 86: 54: 53: 48:current talk page 5991: 5975: 5970: 5965: 5952: 5947: 5918: 5913: 5862: 5857: 5808: 5803: 5764: 5582: 5569: 5564: 5559: 5532: 5527: 5432: 5328: 5323: 5319: 5315: 5314: 5280: 5275: 5250: 5245: 5232: 5224: 5056: 5011: 4974: 4921: 4916: 4900: 4873: 4869: 4866: 4854:reliable sources 4848: 4847: 4818: 4814: 4800: 4799: 4793: 4774: 4769: 4751:Sydney Schanberg 4731: 4726: 4710: 4705: 4545: 4540: 4515: 4510: 4469: 4414: 4409: 4370: 4365: 4313: 4312: 4306: 4301: 4299: 4291: 4284: 4278: 4277: 4271: 4266: 4264: 4256: 4249: 4243: 4242: 4236: 4231: 4229: 4221: 4214: 4208: 4207: 4201: 4196: 4194: 4186: 4179: 4173: 4172: 4166: 4161: 4159: 4151: 4144: 4138: 4137: 4131: 4126: 4124: 4116: 4109: 4103: 4102: 4096: 4091: 4089: 4081: 4074: 4068: 4067: 4061: 4056: 4054: 4046: 4039: 4033: 4032: 4026: 4021: 4019: 4011: 4004: 3998: 3997: 3991: 3986: 3984: 3976: 3969: 3800: 3797: 3791: 3771: 3766: 3216: 3213: 3207: 3070: 3067: 3061: 3030: 3027: 3021: 2980: 2977: 2971: 2925: 2922: 2916: 2853: 2850: 2844: 2797: 2794: 2788: 2771: 2770: 2759: 2753: 2748: 2742: 2737: 2682: 2679: 2650: 2647: 2605: 2602: 2596: 2239: 2236: 2230: 2124: 2119: 2108: 2105: 2099: 2093: 2078: 2073: 2046:main article is 2026: 2023: 2017: 2011: 1988: 1983: 1967: 1964: 1958: 1944: 1941: 1935: 1929: 1923: 1817: 1814: 1808: 1800: 1779: 1778: 1716: 1712: 1698: 1697: 1691: 1499: 1496: 1490: 1480: 1479: 1450: 1446: 1432: 1431: 1425: 1415: 1414: 1402: 1399: 1393: 1362: 1359: 1353: 1311: 1308: 1302: 1277: 1274: 1268: 1228: 1217: 1195: 1179: 1178: 1176: 1175: 1164: 1150: 1127: 1120: 1095: 1092: 1086: 1058: 1051: 1036: 1033: 1027: 992: 991: 989: 988: 973: 967: 966: 964: 963: 949: 943: 942: 940: 939: 924: 918: 917: 915: 914: 900: 880: 872: 857: 854: 848: 756: 753: 747: 712: 711: 709: 707: 692: 686: 685: 683: 681: 675:www.raytheon.com 667: 645: 642: 636: 595: 592: 586: 576: 575: 528: 524: 510: 509: 503: 454: 451: 445: 233: 232: 230: 228: 213: 196: 193: 187: 114: 111: 105: 68: 56: 55: 33: 32: 26: 5999: 5998: 5994: 5993: 5992: 5990: 5989: 5988: 5973: 5968: 5962:Kohlrabi Pickle 5959: 5950: 5945: 5931:Kohlrabi Pickle 5916: 5911: 5876:Kohlrabi Pickle 5860: 5855: 5818:Kohlrabi Pickle 5806: 5801: 5767:Kohlrabi Pickle 5758: 5749: 5731:Kohlrabi Pickle 5648:be a footnote. 5603:NY Times report 5587: 5567: 5562: 5556:Kohlrabi Pickle 5553: 5545: 5530: 5525: 5482:be a footnote. 5453:NY Times report 5437: 5419:Kohlrabi Pickle 5384:be a footnote. 5344:Some examples: 5338: 5326: 5321: 5312: 5310: 5278: 5273: 5248: 5243: 5226: 5218: 5186: 5109:Brijesh Singh, 5054: 5040: 4986: 4979: 4950:What do RS say? 4919: 4914: 4894: 4892: 4871: 4864: 4852:please provide 4845: 4816: 4812: 4797: 4791: 4772: 4767: 4747:Joseph Lelyveld 4743:A. M. Rosenthal 4727: 4724: 4708: 4703: 4662: 4597: 4541: 4538: 4513: 4508: 4463: 4440: 4419: 4418: 4417: 4410: 4406: 4380: 4375: 4374: 4373: 4366: 4362: 4318: 4317: 4316: 4302: 4292: 4286: 4285: 4281: 4267: 4257: 4251: 4250: 4246: 4232: 4222: 4216: 4215: 4211: 4197: 4187: 4181: 4180: 4176: 4162: 4152: 4146: 4145: 4141: 4127: 4117: 4111: 4110: 4106: 4092: 4082: 4076: 4075: 4071: 4057: 4047: 4041: 4040: 4036: 4022: 4012: 4006: 4005: 4001: 3987: 3977: 3971: 3970: 3966: 3942: 3840: 3795: 3789: 3786: 3767: 3764: 3685: 3468: 3309: 3227: 3211: 3205: 3202: 3065: 3059: 3056: 3025: 3019: 3016: 2975: 2969: 2966: 2920: 2914: 2911: 2848: 2842: 2839: 2792: 2786: 2783: 2776: 2775: 2774: 2761: 2760: 2756: 2749: 2745: 2738: 2734: 2680: 2677: 2648: 2645: 2600: 2594: 2591: 2528: 2459: 2396: 2291: 2234: 2228: 2225: 2120: 2117: 2103: 2097: 2091: 2074: 2071: 2021: 2015: 2009: 1984: 1981: 1962: 1956: 1953: 1939: 1933: 1927: 1917: 1896: 1828: 1812: 1806: 1803: 1794: 1776: 1714: 1710: 1695: 1689: 1641: 1581: 1524: 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5718: 5717: 5716: 5693: 5692: 5691: 5690: 5689: 5670: 5669: 5668: 5667: 5666: 5642: 5641: 5640: 5639: 5638: 5614: 5613: 5612: 5611: 5610: 5589: 5588: 5585: 5580: 5579: 5578: 5577: 5576: 5575: 5574: 5542: 5541: 5540: 5539: 5538: 5537: 5523:Best regards, 5521: 5502: 5501: 5500: 5489: 5488: 5487: 5476: 5475: 5474: 5458: 5457: 5456: 5439: 5438: 5435: 5430: 5404: 5403: 5392: 5391: 5381: 5380: 5364: 5363: 5352: 5351: 5337: 5334: 5308: 5307: 5306: 5305: 5304: 5303: 5302: 5301: 5300: 5299: 5183: 5182: 5167: 5166: 5152: 5151: 5130: 5129: 5115: 5114: 5091: 5090: 5085:Rajesh Ahuna, 5077: 5076: 5069: 5068: 5058: 5057: 5052: 5031: 5030: 5014: 5013: 4981: 4980: 4977: 4972: 4967: 4966: 4965: 4964: 4963: 4962: 4943: 4942: 4912:Best regards, 4891: 4888: 4887: 4886: 4885: 4884: 4825: 4824: 4801: 4790: 4787: 4786: 4785: 4784: 4783: 4782: 4781: 4780: 4779: 4755:Serge Schmeman 4700: 4699: 4696: 4692: 4688: 4684: 4681: 4678: 4674: 4670: 4661: 4658: 4657: 4656: 4655: 4654: 4653: 4652: 4620: 4619: 4601: 4596: 4593: 4592: 4591: 4557: 4556: 4555: 4554: 4553: 4552: 4481:Special Report 4439: 4436: 4435: 4434: 4416: 4415: 4403: 4402: 4398: 4397: 4396: 4379: 4376: 4372: 4371: 4359: 4358: 4354: 4353: 4352: 4315: 4314: 4279: 4244: 4209: 4174: 4139: 4104: 4069: 4034: 3999: 3963: 3962: 3958: 3955: 3952: 3950: 3948: 3946: 3941: 3938: 3937: 3936: 3917: 3916: 3889: 3884: 3879: 3869: 3864: 3856: 3855: 3843: 3839: 3836: 3826: 3825: 3824: 3823: 3822: 3821: 3820: 3819: 3759: 3758: 3757: 3756: 3755: 3734: 3733: 3700: 3699: 3684: 3681: 3680: 3679: 3678: 3677: 3676: 3675: 3674: 3673: 3672: 3671: 3670: 3669: 3668: 3667: 3666: 3665: 3611: 3610: 3609: 3608: 3607: 3606: 3605: 3604: 3603: 3602: 3601: 3600: 3492: 3491: 3486: 3481: 3473: 3471: 3467: 3464: 3463: 3462: 3421: 3400: 3399: 3398: 3397: 3376: 3375: 3374: 3373: 3341: 3340: 3335: 3330: 3325: 3308: 3305: 3304: 3303: 3288: 3287: 3260: 3255: 3250: 3248:Which Balakot? 3245: 3237: 3236: 3234: 3231: 3226: 3223: 3222: 3221: 3177: 3176: 3175: 3174: 3173: 3172: 3171: 3170: 3169: 3168: 3137: 3136: 3135: 3134: 3133: 3132: 3131: 3130: 3129: 3128: 3111: 3110: 3092: 3076: 3075: 3011: 3010: 3009: 3008: 3007: 3006: 3005: 3004: 3003: 3002: 3001: 3000: 2932: 2931: 2930: 2881: 2880: 2879: 2878: 2877: 2876: 2875: 2874: 2859: 2858: 2803: 2802: 2773: 2772: 2754: 2743: 2731: 2730: 2726: 2725: 2724: 2723: 2722: 2713: 2712: 2705: 2704: 2690: 2689: 2688: 2629: 2628: 2627: 2626: 2611: 2610: 2580: 2527: 2524: 2523: 2522: 2479: 2473: 2466: 2458: 2455: 2454: 2453: 2438: 2437: 2410: 2405: 2395: 2392: 2391: 2390: 2363: 2358: 2352: 2351: 2350: 2349: 2346: 2290: 2287: 2286: 2285: 2284: 2283: 2282: 2281: 2280: 2279: 2278: 2277: 2163: 2162: 2161: 2160: 2159: 2158: 2157: 2156: 2155: 2154: 2133: 2132: 2131: 2067: 2065: 2055:can be added. 2042: 2040: 1972: 1895: 1892: 1827: 1824: 1823: 1822: 1773: 1759: 1745:Indian Express 1723: 1722: 1699: 1688: 1685: 1684: 1683: 1640: 1637: 1580: 1577: 1551:69.181.193.136 1523: 1520: 1505: 1504: 1463:Sterling Saini 1457: 1456: 1433: 1422: 1419: 1410: 1408: 1407: 1368: 1367: 1320: 1317: 1284: 1283: 1282: 1240: 1239: 1238: 1237: 1236: 1235: 1181: 1180: 1158: 1157: 1153: 1142: 1141: 1140: 1139: 1138: 1137: 1136: 1135: 1134: 1105: 1104: 1103: 1102: 1101: 1100: 1068: 1067: 1066: 1065: 1042: 1041: 994: 993: 968: 944: 919: 894: 893: 889: 888: 887: 863: 862: 815: 812: 790: 787: 786: 785: 784: 783: 782: 781: 780: 779: 778: 777: 776: 775: 714: 713: 687: 661: 660: 656: 655: 654: 653: 652: 651: 650: 627: 620: 535: 534: 511: 500: 497: 496: 495: 494: 493: 492: 491: 490: 489: 488: 487: 418: 417: 416: 415: 414: 413: 412: 411: 410: 396: 395: 394: 358:117.198.113.99 328:117.198.113.99 309: 308: 297:117.198.113.99 281: 272: 267:Kutch district 258: 255: 254: 253: 235: 234: 223:. 9 March 2019 207: 206: 202: 176: 173: 172: 171: 139: 136: 135: 134: 97: 91: 88: 85: 84: 79: 74: 69: 62: 52: 51: 34: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 5996: 5979: 5976: 5971: 5963: 5958: 5957: 5956: 5953: 5948: 5942: 5941: 5940: 5936: 5932: 5927: 5926: 5925: 5924: 5923: 5922: 5919: 5914: 5908: 5903: 5900: 5885: 5881: 5877: 5873: 5868: 5867: 5866: 5863: 5858: 5852: 5847: 5843: 5842: 5841: 5837: 5833: 5829: 5828: 5827: 5823: 5819: 5814: 5812: 5809: 5804: 5798: 5797: 5796: 5792: 5788: 5784: 5776: 5772: 5768: 5762: 5757: 5756: 5755: 5754: 5753: 5752: 5751: 5750: 5740: 5736: 5732: 5728: 5727: 5726: 5725: 5724: 5713: 5712: 5709: 5705: 5701: 5700: 5694: 5687: 5682: 5681: 5678: 5677: 5671: 5663: 5658: 5654: 5653: 5650: 5649: 5643: 5636: 5631: 5630: 5627: 5626: 5623: 5615: 5607: 5606: 5604: 5599: 5598: 5593: 5592: 5591: 5590: 5584: 5583: 5573: 5570: 5565: 5557: 5551: 5550: 5549: 5548: 5547: 5546: 5536: 5533: 5528: 5522: 5518: 5514: 5510: 5509: 5503: 5497: 5496: 5490: 5484: 5483: 5477: 5471: 5470: 5467: 5459: 5454: 5449: 5448: 5443: 5442: 5441: 5440: 5434: 5433: 5429: 5428: 5424: 5420: 5416: 5412: 5408: 5402: 5398: 5397: 5396: 5390: 5387: 5386: 5385: 5379: 5375: 5374: 5373: 5370: 5362: 5358: 5357: 5356: 5350: 5347: 5346: 5345: 5342: 5335: 5333: 5332: 5329: 5324: 5318: 5298: 5294: 5290: 5286: 5285: 5284: 5281: 5276: 5270: 5269: 5268: 5264: 5260: 5256: 5255: 5254: 5251: 5246: 5240: 5236: 5230: 5222: 5217: 5216: 5215: 5211: 5207: 5203: 5202: 5201: 5200: 5196: 5192: 5180: 5176: 5172: 5164: 5160: 5159: 5157: 5149: 5146: 5145: 5143: 5139: 5135: 5127: 5123: 5122: 5120: 5112: 5108: 5107: 5105: 5101: 5098: 5095: 5088: 5084: 5083: 5081: 5074: 5071: 5070: 5066: 5065: 5063: 5055: 5050: 5046: 5045: 5039: 5038: 5036: 5028: 5025: 5024: 5022: 5020: 5009: 5006: 5002: 4998: 4994: 4990: 4985: 4984: 4983: 4982: 4976: 4975: 4971: 4961: 4957: 4953: 4949: 4948: 4947: 4946: 4945: 4944: 4941: 4937: 4933: 4928: 4927: 4926: 4925: 4922: 4917: 4910: 4908: 4902: 4898: 4889: 4882: 4881: 4880: 4879: 4876: 4874: 4868: 4867: 4859: 4855: 4851: 4843: 4842: 4841: 4840: 4836: 4832: 4822: 4819:parameter to 4810: 4806: 4802: 4795: 4794: 4788: 4778: 4775: 4770: 4764: 4760: 4756: 4752: 4748: 4744: 4739: 4738: 4737: 4734: 4732: 4730: 4721: 4720: 4719: 4718: 4717: 4716: 4715: 4714: 4711: 4706: 4697: 4693: 4691:considerably. 4689: 4685: 4682: 4679: 4675: 4671: 4668: 4667: 4666: 4659: 4651: 4647: 4643: 4639: 4638: 4637: 4633: 4629: 4624: 4623: 4622: 4621: 4618: 4614: 4610: 4607: 4606: 4605: 4604: 4594: 4590: 4586: 4582: 4577: 4576: 4575: 4574: 4570: 4566: 4562: 4551: 4548: 4546: 4544: 4535: 4534: 4533: 4529: 4525: 4521: 4520: 4519: 4516: 4511: 4505: 4501: 4497: 4493: 4491: 4486: 4482: 4477: 4473: 4467: 4462: 4461: 4460: 4459: 4455: 4451: 4446: 4445: 4437: 4433: 4429: 4425: 4421: 4420: 4413: 4408: 4405: 4401: 4393: 4389: 4385: 4382: 4381: 4378:F-16 ejection 4377: 4369: 4364: 4361: 4357: 4349: 4345: 4341: 4338: 4337: 4336: 4335: 4331: 4327: 4323: 4310: 4297: 4289: 4283: 4280: 4275: 4262: 4254: 4248: 4245: 4240: 4227: 4219: 4213: 4210: 4205: 4192: 4184: 4178: 4175: 4170: 4157: 4149: 4143: 4140: 4135: 4122: 4114: 4108: 4105: 4100: 4087: 4079: 4073: 4070: 4065: 4052: 4044: 4038: 4035: 4030: 4017: 4009: 4003: 4000: 3995: 3982: 3974: 3968: 3965: 3961: 3957: 3939: 3935: 3931: 3927: 3923: 3919: 3918: 3914: 3910: 3906: 3902: 3898: 3893: 3890: 3888: 3885: 3883: 3880: 3878: 3875: 3874: 3873: 3870: 3868: 3862: 3857: 3854: 3850: 3844: 3837: 3835: 3834: 3829: 3818: 3814: 3810: 3806: 3805: 3804: 3801: 3799: 3792: 3782: 3779: 3778: 3777: 3774: 3772: 3770: 3760: 3754: 3750: 3746: 3742: 3741: 3740: 3739: 3738: 3737: 3736: 3735: 3732: 3728: 3724: 3720: 3719: 3718: 3717: 3713: 3709: 3705: 3697: 3693: 3690: 3689: 3688: 3682: 3664: 3660: 3656: 3652: 3651: 3650: 3649: 3648: 3647: 3646: 3645: 3644: 3643: 3642: 3641: 3640: 3639: 3638: 3637: 3636: 3634: 3630: 3626: 3622: 3618: 3599: 3595: 3591: 3587: 3583: 3579: 3578: 3577: 3576: 3573: 3572: 3571: 3567: 3563: 3558: 3557: 3555: 3551: 3547: 3543: 3539: 3533: 3532: 3531: 3527: 3523: 3519: 3518: 3517: 3515: 3511: 3507: 3503: 3499: 3490: 3487: 3485: 3482: 3480: 3477: 3476: 3475: 3465: 3461: 3457: 3453: 3449: 3448: 3447: 3445: 3441: 3437: 3433: 3429: 3424: 3418: 3417: 3413: 3409: 3405: 3394: 3393: 3392: 3391: 3390: 3389: 3385: 3381: 3370: 3369: 3368: 3364: 3360: 3356: 3355: 3354: 3353: 3349: 3345: 3339: 3336: 3334: 3331: 3329: 3326: 3324: 3321: 3320: 3319: 3315: 3312: 3306: 3302: 3298: 3294: 3290: 3289: 3285: 3281: 3277: 3273: 3269: 3264: 3261: 3259: 3256: 3254: 3251: 3249: 3246: 3244: 3241: 3240: 3239: 3224: 3220: 3217: 3215: 3208: 3199: 3198:User:Yoonadue 3196: 3195: 3194: 3193: 3189: 3185: 3180: 3167: 3163: 3159: 3155: 3154: 3153: 3152: 3151: 3150: 3149: 3148: 3147: 3146: 3145: 3142: 3127: 3123: 3119: 3115: 3114: 3113: 3112: 3109: 3105: 3101: 3097: 3093: 3090: 3087: 3084: 3080: 3079: 3078: 3077: 3074: 3071: 3069: 3062: 3053: 3052: 3051: 3047: 3043: 3039: 3038: 3037: 3036: 3035: 3034: 3031: 3029: 3022: 2999: 2995: 2991: 2986: 2985: 2984: 2981: 2979: 2972: 2963: 2960: 2959: 2958: 2954: 2950: 2946: 2942: 2938: 2933: 2929: 2926: 2924: 2917: 2907: 2904: 2903: 2902: 2898: 2894: 2889: 2888: 2887: 2886: 2885: 2884: 2883: 2882: 2873: 2869: 2865: 2861: 2860: 2857: 2854: 2852: 2845: 2836: 2832: 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2258: 2254: 2250: 2245: 2244: 2243: 2240: 2238: 2231: 2222: 2218: 2217: 2216: 2212: 2208: 2204: 2203: 2202: 2198: 2194: 2190: 2189: 2188: 2187: 2183: 2179: 2175: 2173: 2170: 2167: 2153: 2149: 2145: 2141: 2138: 2134: 2130: 2127: 2125: 2123: 2113: 2112: 2111: 2106: 2100: 2094: 2086: 2085: 2084: 2081: 2079: 2077: 2068: 2066: 2062: 2058: 2054: 2050: 2049: 2043: 2041: 2038: 2034: 2031: 2030: 2029: 2024: 2018: 2012: 2004: 2000: 1996: 1995: 1994: 1991: 1989: 1987: 1977: 1973: 1971: 1968: 1966: 1959: 1949: 1948: 1947: 1942: 1936: 1930: 1921: 1915: 1914: 1913: 1912: 1908: 1904: 1900: 1893: 1891: 1889: 1885: 1881: 1877: 1873: 1866: 1865: 1861: 1860: 1856: 1855: 1851: 1847: 1846: 1842: 1841: 1837: 1836: 1832: 1825: 1821: 1818: 1816: 1809: 1798: 1792: 1791: 1786: 1782: 1774: 1772: 1768: 1764: 1760: 1758: 1754: 1750: 1746: 1742: 1741: 1740: 1739: 1735: 1731: 1720: 1717:parameter to 1708: 1704: 1700: 1693: 1692: 1686: 1682: 1678: 1674: 1670: 1669: 1668: 1665: 1661: 1657: 1653: 1647: 1638: 1636: 1634: 1630: 1626: 1622: 1618: 1610: 1609: 1605: 1602: 1601: 1597: 1596: 1592: 1591: 1587: 1584: 1578: 1576: 1575: 1571: 1567: 1562: 1560: 1556: 1552: 1548: 1542: 1541: 1537: 1536: 1532: 1531: 1527: 1521: 1519: 1518: 1514: 1510: 1503: 1500: 1498: 1491: 1483: 1475: 1474: 1473: 1472: 1468: 1464: 1454: 1451:parameter to 1442: 1438: 1434: 1427: 1426: 1420: 1406: 1403: 1401: 1394: 1386:Now fixed. -- 1385: 1384: 1383: 1381: 1377: 1373: 1366: 1363: 1361: 1354: 1345: 1341: 1340: 1339: 1338: 1334: 1330: 1326: 1318: 1316: 1315: 1312: 1310: 1303: 1292: 1287: 1281: 1278: 1276: 1269: 1260: 1256: 1255: 1254: 1253: 1249: 1245: 1244:Rashid PicKro 1234: 1231: 1229: 1227: 1221: 1215: 1210: 1209: 1207: 1205: 1202: 1198: 1193: 1188: 1187: 1186: 1185: 1169: 1163: 1160: 1156: 1152: 1148: 1133: 1130: 1128: 1126: 1118: 1113: 1112: 1111: 1110: 1109: 1108: 1107: 1106: 1099: 1096: 1094: 1087: 1077: 1074: 1073: 1072: 1071: 1070: 1069: 1064: 1061: 1059: 1057: 1049: 1044: 1043: 1040: 1037: 1035: 1028: 1018: 1015: 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