1308:, which says to use the terms that English-language sources use (which is not the same as using English throughout an article). English-language sources overwhelmingly use certain Spanish terms as proper nouns, therefore we should keep them in Spanish, and use English terms where the English sources use English. E.g. "After winning a historic Triplete (the Champions League trophy, the Liga title and the Copa del Rey crown) in the 2008-09 season, it was hard to believe that the 2009-10 campaign could be much better for Barcelona centre-back Carles Puyol."
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The
Catalans have all the right to be recognized as such, besides this universal right recognized by the United Nations the Catalans we are part of nationality legally recognized in our statute of autonomy and in the Spanish Constitution. Therefore we have absolutely all the right to be recognized as
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Catalanonia is not a separate country, but as a nation (by law, see the
Autonomous Statute of Catalonia) many people from Catalonia consider themselves as Catalan when asked about their nationality. That is the reason I change it. I could agree about the Catalan/Spanish term as well in order to avoid
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The opening to this article reads, "Carles Puyol i
Saforcada (born April 13, 1978 in La Pobla de Segur, Catalonia, Spain) is a Spanish/Catalan footballer who is the current team captain of FC Barcelona." I'm going to edit the "Spanish/Catalan" part to read simply "Spanish". Is there any objection to
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The nationality of Puyol is spanish and catalan, not only spanish because
Catalonia by law as a nationality. Catalonia Statute of autonomy, Preamble: "... In reflection of the feelings and the wishes of the citizens of Catalonia, the Parliament of Catalonia has defined Catalonia as a nation by an
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In
English we do not say Spanish League or Spanish Cup or even Spanish Super Cup. But we call them La Liga, Copa del Rey, and Supercopa de Espana. Also when watching a football game from Spain in the English language commentators, on Sky Sports, ESPN, BBC, ITV, FSC, Gol TV, etc..., refer to these
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Puyol is a proud
Catalan, even when he plays in national ie Spanish uniforms. He doesn't view himself as Spanish I think, which makes it all the more integrative and hetrogen, something we ought to be encouraging in this global village we live in. Knowledge cannot decide to tag people according to
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So what is the problem with "Catalan
Spanish"? Puyol's citizenship is Spanish, this is undeniable. Also, he is Catalan and he has proudly demonstrated he feels so (as in the 2010 final when he waved a Catalan flag all around the stadium). Knowledge uses consistenly similar expressions like Italian
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Catalonia is a nationality not a region, this is recognized in the statute of autonomy of
Catalonia and is recognized in the Spanish Constitution. The Catalans we are nationally Catalans because we belong to a nationality officially recognized (Catalonia) and we are Spanish because we belong to a
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Article 2 The
Constitution is based on the indissoluble unity of the Spanish nation, the common and indivisible country of all Spaniards; it recognises and guarantees the right to autonomy of the nationalities and regions of which it is composed, and the solidarity amongst them all.
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All articles corresponding to
Catalans should be so, not for being a whim but why Catalonia is officially a nationality recognized by its statute of autonomy and the Spanish constitution and, therefore, the nationality of the Catalans is Spanish and Catalan, not only Spanish.
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There is a slow-moving edit war going on between using Spanish terms (La Liga, Copa del Rey) and English translations of those terms (Spanish League, Spanish Cup). For Knowledge's conventions on the issue of when to use an original language and when to use English, see
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I do not say that the Catalans are not Spanish, for the moment we are officially Spanish (except the Catalans in France, which are French). I say that our nationality is Catalan (Besides being Spanish) because that recognize the laws, Catalunya by law is a nationality.
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Agreed. Spaniards of Catalonian, Basque or other region may disagree, but I think that the nationality is from Spain, as that is the country recognized by the UN. The Autonomous Region they are from could be named in the text but not as main nationality IMO. --
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link now in the external links section, I've updated the infobox. If in need of changing, please site a source in this talk page thread, to secure reputable sources. I've taken the liberty of removing the template for better visibility, but left the note as is.
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Against simple facts (eg Catalonia is not a nation state)? Neither it is Scotland but the Scots appear as Scots in articles dedicated to Scottish people. Furthermore, in the case of Catalonia, Catalonia as I told you is recognized as a nationality by law.
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I tend to add a full geographic description of a footballer (being the case of my field of edit)'s city/place of birth, for precisely that, more geographic detail/accuracy, nothing to do with longings of independence or separatist agendas.
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Article 1 1. States shall protect the existence and the national or ethnic, cultural, religious and linguistic identity of minorities within their respective territories and shall encourage conditions for the promotion of that identity.
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You could check out the ca.wikipedia.org page for this. As you can see, it does matter for some people, and unless you've got some mad desire just to "have something changed", I suggest you just leave the Catalan part there.
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Further the Declaration on the Rights of Persons Belonging to National or Ethnic, Religious and Linguistic Minorities Adopted by the United Nation General Assembly (resolution 47/135 of 18 December 1992), says:
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Caps and goal figures in the article likely contain European cup/Domestic cup data in addition to Domestic League data (this is very certain based on this user's previous edits containing similar information
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do these two players, one who is a founder of the club, a relationship. or does anyone know if his parents named him carles to make it look similar? or is puyol-pujol a common surname in Catalonia-Spain?
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and some others) is not separatism, what would be separatism would be to write, as i have seen, that "Carles Puyol is a CATALAN footballer", in that case i agree with those who say that's 200% wrong.
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Although you have to think about Puyol's feeling and many catalan's feeling, because call Puyol as a "Spanish football player" it's absolutely wrong for many of them (because I'm catalan myself xD).
845:, a very proud Catalan, is not listed as "Spanish/Catalan" and I think that as Catalonia is not a separate country, it shouldn't be listed as a nationality. I welcome discussion of this, of course.
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is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Knowledge policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
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is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Knowledge policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
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1250:." Puyol's name uses "i" instead of "y" which seems to be an indication that it is a Catalan name. Is there any strong reason to believe that his name is Spanish rather than Catalan?
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1360:. And Spain won the world cup. So, it should be included in honours. Please add FIFA World Cup 2010 in honours with the silver medal in 2000 Olympics (which is already there).
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such and that our identity and nationality not remains hidden behind the only name of "Spanish" (remember that not all Catalans are Spanish, in France there is also Catalans)
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Someone needs to change it ASAP, it's horrible and it'd be better if it'd be a pic of him in his club\nation uniform and\or in a football match.
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in the brief note of the edition Mattythewhite says: This is against consensus and simple facts (eg Catalonia is not a nation state)
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In 99,9999999999999999999% of the English footballers that geographic detail is presented just like that (i.e. X player was born in
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https://web.archive.org/web/20101207071527/http://www.fifa.com:80/worldcup/archive/southafrica2010/players/player=177914/index.html
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ample majority. The Spanish Constitution, in its second Article, recognises the national reality of Catalonia as a nationality..."
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convenient short terms. He is Catalan and he plays with his Spanish friends for Spain. Nothing more.. But also nothing less.
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In the article dedicated to Antoni GaudĂ is fulfilled what the law prescribes and his nationality is Spanish Catalan:
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Against consensus? see you the article about Antoni Gaudi... What consensus? there Gaudi appears as Spanish Catalan.
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Mattythewhite follow reversing without regard to reasons and without answering anything here or in your users page
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https://web.archive.org/web/20101021072657/http://www.totalbarca.com:80/2010/news/picture-of-the-day-celebrations/
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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https://web.archive.org/web/20130607200407/http://www.fcbarcelona.com:80/football/first-team/staff/players/puyol
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Last reverses are for no reason and without reading the arguments here or in the users page of Mattythewhite.
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The note at the top of this article currently says that "Carles Puyol" is a Spanish name. Our article
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this as he no longer plays for the Catalan national side and does play for the Spanish national side.
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is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under
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competitions by their correct names. Therefore I ask you keep my revision of the honours section.
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http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/archive/southafrica2010/players/player%3D177914/index.html
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Ok Mattythewhite, because you do not read the arguments here or in your users page???
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http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/archive/southafrica2010/players/player=177914/index.html
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For all these reasons well documented and justified I proceed to revert the edition
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The link directs to the official webpage of Congress of Deputies of Spain
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http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Alfmaster#Footballers.27_European_goals
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http://web.gencat.cat/en/generalitat/estatut/estatut2006/preambul/
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http://www.congreso.es/constitucion/ficheros/c78/cons_ingl.pdf
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from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Fair use rationale for Image:Carles Puyol 18apr2007.jpg
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1692:Legofan2006
1484:Sourcecheck
1092:Be Quiet AL
920:—Preceding
876:—Preceding
781:—Preceding
1708:Categories
1676:Report bug
1554:Report bug
1028:ADDENDA 2
882:Homespider
675:Rupert1904
1659:this tool
1652:this tool
1537:this tool
1530:this tool
1427:dead link
1403:dead link
1324:Sheffield
1252:Clayoquot
975:ADDENDA
161:Biography
101:Biography
40:libellous
1665:Cheers.—
1543:Cheers.—
1260:contribs
1154:fair use
1138:fair use
1071:unsigned
1051:unsigned
956:contribs
944:unsigned
922:unsigned
890:contribs
878:unsigned
783:unsigned
779:. caps
777:fair use
761:fair use
732:Yonatanh
423:Olympics
414:Olympics
370:Olympics
294:Football
235:Football
1577:my edit
1470:checked
1431:tag to
1407:tag to
1389:my edit
1274:Pallars
1209:Pallars
843:Oleguer
717:Poulsen
668:Honours
663:Honours
644:on the
608:Catalan
555:on the
450:on the
321:on the
72:B-class
1478:failed
1423:Added
1399:Added
847:Isaiah
702:Palffy
78:scale.
1278:pujol
1270:Puyol
1213:pujol
1205:Puyol
858:Alexf
528:Spain
519:Spain
475:Spain
240:Spain
1696:talk
1474:true
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636:Low
547:Mid
442:Low
313:Mid
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